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DL To Fly LGA-ORD And LGA-DFW With E170  
User currently offlineFlyPNS1 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 6733 posts, RR: 24
Posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 10583 times:

http://biz.yahoo.com/pz/060123/92704.html

I can't say I ever saw these routes coming. Looks like DL really wants to focus more on business traffic. At least they were smart enough not to use CRJ's for these routes.

I wonder where all the slots are coming from? Cancelling other routes?

97 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineDAL767400ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 10550 times:

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Thread starter):
I wonder where all the slots are coming from? Cancelling other routes?

Don't quote me on any exact routes, but DL has reduced frequencies in a few markets, like CVG, or dropped some like MHT. Also, MAy 1st is still a few months away, so there could still be some upcomming reductions.
Although, with a total of 8 daily roundtrips, DL might have actually gotten some additional slots. Regardless, this is great news, especially given the choice of E70s, instead of the planes one would normally expect from DL on such routes, namely CRJs (ORD) and CR7s (DFW).


User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8913 posts, RR: 12
Reply 2, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 10543 times:

Don't know if this is showing up in other browsers, but I keep seeing Γƒβ€šΓ‚ throughout the PR...

Quoting Press Release:

NEW YORK, Jan. 23, 2006 (PRIMEZONE) -- Delta Air Lines' customers in New York will be able to fly non-stop between the cityΓƒβ€šΓ‚'s preferred airport at LaGuardia and more of the cityΓƒβ€šΓ‚'s top business destinations with the addition of new daily flights to Chicago-OΓƒβ€šΓ‚'Hare and Dallas/Fort Worth this spring. Beginning April 3, Delta will introduce five daily flights between LaGuardia and Chicago-OΓƒβ€šΓ‚'Hare International Airport, and two daily flights between LaGuardia and Dallas/Fort Worth International Airport, with a third Dallas flight beginning May 1.

Just found that to be a little ironic, given that the principle competition on these routes will be AA.

Jeff


User currently offlineLawnDart From United States of America, joined May 2005, 975 posts, RR: 3
Reply 3, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 10543 times:

Anyone else getting this "error" when you link to the Yahoo story:

Delta Air Lines' customers in New York will be able to fly non-stop between the cityΓƒβ€šΓ‚'s preferred airport at LaGuardia and more of the cityΓƒβ€šΓ‚'s top business destinations with the addition of new daily flights to Chicago-OΓƒβ€šΓ‚'Hare and Dallas/Fort Worth this spring. Beginning April 3, Delta will introduce five daily flights between LaGuardia and Chicago-OΓƒβ€šΓ‚'Hare International

"Error" or intentional...hmm...


User currently offlineLawnDart From United States of America, joined May 2005, 975 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 10537 times:

Quoting DeltAirlines (Reply 2):
Don't know if this is showing up in other browsers, but I keep seeing Γƒβ€šΓ‚ throughout the PR...

Okay, so it's not just me...


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 33289 posts, RR: 71
Reply 5, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 10522 times:

Interesting. They announced MIA last month and now DFW and ORD...


a.
User currently offlineDAL767400ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 10520 times:

Quoting LawnDart (Reply 3):
Anyone else getting this "error" when you link to the Yahoo story:



Quoting DeltAirlines (Reply 2):
Don't know if this is showing up in other browsers, but I keep seeing Γƒβ€šΓ‚ throughout the PR...

Probably subliminal messages planted by the AA people at Primezone  Silly .


User currently offlineTango-Bravo From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 3806 posts, RR: 29
Reply 7, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 10428 times:

Looks like what goes around comes around. It's obviously the U.S. legacy mentality in action, wherein decisions concerning new domestic service are motivated first and foremost by retaliation for a 'wrong' committed by an airline who has trangressed "the law of the legacies" which is "thou shalt not start service between our hub and any city other than one of your hubs."

Does anyone imagine for a nanosecond that DL would have even considered LGA-ORD/DFW/MIA non-stops if AA had not violated "the law of the legacies" by starting LGA-ATL? And to add further to the seriousness of their "transgression," AA even put mainline MD-80 equipment on LGA-ATL-LGA.


User currently offlineMrSTL From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 468 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 10378 times:

It would be really interesting if Delta, after emerging from bankruptcy with much lower costs, would start to slowly build a hub in DFW and compete against an AA with higher costs. The next two years should be fun to watch from a retaliation standpoint among the legacies.

User currently offlineAlitalia744 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 4764 posts, RR: 44
Reply 9, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 10334 times:

Everyone should have seen this coming.

To put it in laymens terms, AA has pissed off the fat lady from the south. She's now screaming and gathering her troups for war. AA should have expected this given they went into Atlanta...

Not sure how successful these will be, altho DL does have a very high concentration of business travellers in the NYC region. I for one will be flying DL for my business trips to the Chicago area given I now have a non-stop option (then again, I went through CVG before as I'm a loyal guy)..

Hope it works out.



Some see lines, others see between the lines.
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 33289 posts, RR: 71
Reply 10, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 10316 times:

I wonder if/how AA will retaliate for this.


a.
User currently offlineRwSEA From Netherlands, joined Jan 2005, 3135 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 10289 times:

I would actually have expected to see a DFW-JFK first in order to connect to DL's bank of flights to Europe, but these flights appear to be targeted solely towards domestic business travel on these two important O&D markets.

Good luck to DL on these routes - it's going to be interesting to see what happens. Obviously they are much more dominant in NYC than in the other two markets, although there still may be some DL loyal fliers in DFW that will pick DL over AA.

This is really going to piss off AA, but too bad for them. Their service sucks, the M80's are getting old and they have the worst FA's in the US, in my opinion. That airline really needs to learn how to treat its customers. DL flying new planes with smiling faces might actually have a chance.


User currently offlineWorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 10257 times:

DL and AA have sparred for years... this is more about DL rounding out its list of NYC destinations as it is retaliation for AA's foray into ATLLGA. Remember, DL is now on the verge of being the 2nd largest US airline to Latin America and is moving quickly to close the NYC gaps it had w/ AA... Yes, AA has moved into traditional DL markets but DL has done the same thing. Strong competition is good for everyone..... these routes will do just fine for DL.

Notice also that the ORD flights will operate from the Marine Air Terminal - a more exclusive terminal to what AA or UA passengers face - complete with a higher level of amenities in the terminal

[Edited 2006-01-23 20:18:20]

User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11983 posts, RR: 62
Reply 13, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 10146 times:

Quoting RwSEA (Reply 11):
Obviously they are much more dominant in NYC than in the other two markets, although there still may be some DL loyal fliers in DFW that will pick DL over AA.

Delta still has loyal FFs in the DFW area, but the number has dramatically dwindled in recent years, with the continual drawn-down in service to virtually nothing, the shift to RJs, etc. Most DFW-area FFs I know have all but given up and shifted flying to AA or Southwest, as most have gotten sick of connecting in ATL, CVG or SLC to fly just about anywhere.

Quoting RwSEA (Reply 11):
This is really going to piss off AA, but too bad for them. Their service sucks, the M80's are getting old and they have the worst FA's in the US, in my opinion.

A mere annoyance, but piss AA off? Hardly. Delta will be flying three daily flights with 70-seat jets DFW-LGA, up against AA's 14 daily MD80/737 flights, and will have 5 daily flights with 70-seat jets ORD-LGA, up against AA's 19 daily MD80s. I don't think AA is too worried.

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 12):
Remember, DL is now on the verge of being the 2nd largest US airline to Latin America

Delta today is about one quarter of the size of AA in Latin America. Again, I don't think AA is too worried.

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 12):
Notice also that the ORD flights will operate from the Marine Air Terminal - a more exclusive terminal to what AA or UA passengers face - complete with a higher level of amenities in the terminal

I think the fact that AA will be offering nearly quadruple the number of flights as Delta, on much larger airplanes, with flights departing every hour and sometimes more than once per hour, should more than make up for any exclusivity business customers might feel by flying Delta LGA-ORD.


User currently onlineCoronado990 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 1614 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 10122 times:

I'm guessing this is a shot across JetBlue's bow as I think ORD and DFW will be two of the next ten B6 airports this year. Plus B6 may return to ATL but this time from JFK, BOS and IAD.

[Edited 2006-01-23 20:51:45]


Uncle SAN at your service!
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 23308 posts, RR: 20
Reply 15, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 10072 times:

Quoting Commavia (Reply 13):
I think the fact that AA will be offering nearly quadruple the number of flights as Delta, on much larger airplanes, with flights departing every hour and sometimes more than once per hour, should more than make up for any exclusivity business customers might feel by flying Delta LGA-ORD.

UA offers similar advantages. I've always been under the impression that UA captures more of the high-yield ORD originating traffic than does AA, and the LGA route is no exception-- especially as UA offers Business1 on this route. DL is contending with a lot of frequency, fliers loyal to AA and UA, and superior service on UA (E+, meals in first, newspapers in the morning), DL is going to have a hard time at ORD.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11983 posts, RR: 62
Reply 16, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 10044 times:

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 15):
UA offers similar advantages.

No doubt about it, yes they do.

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 15):
I've always been under the impression that UA captures more of the high-yield ORD originating traffic than does AA, and the LGA route is no exception

I would disagree with you. While on most routes out of ORD, UA does maintain a relative market share/yield premium over AA, LGA is, from my perspective, the one exception. The reason? AA's relative market strength. UA is stronger than AA at ORD, but not by much, as AA is a very strong and viable competitor with a huge marketing and business presence in the Chicagoland area. However, in the New York metro area, UA's presence is non-existent compared with AA, which is the second-largest airline in the New York metro area. AA has more flights, more seats, and more premium seats from ORD to LGA than UA.


User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 23308 posts, RR: 20
Reply 17, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 10032 times:

Quoting Commavia (Reply 16):
While on most routes out of ORD, UA does maintain a relative market share/yield premium over AA, LGA is, from my perspective, the one exception. The reason? AA's relative market strength. UA is stronger than AA at ORD, but not by much, as AA is a very strong and viable competitor with a huge marketing and business presence in the Chicagoland area. However, in the New York metro area, UA's presence is non-existent compared with AA, which is the second-largest airline in the New York metro area. AA has more flights, more seats, and more premium seats from ORD to LGA than UA.

I guess I was thinking in terms of ORD-originating traffic. Looking at NYC at the same time (as I should have done), I would agree with you.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineTornado82 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 10022 times:

Quoting Commavia (Reply 13):
ORD-LGA, up against AA's 19 daily MD80s. I don't think AA is too worried.

And we wonder why ORD/LGA are so overcrowded. At airports where schedules are mere suggestions that are never adhered to anyways, there's no call for 19x anything, unless they were widebodies because of that much pax demand like some of the intra-Asia shuttle services.

How about maybe 12x 738 instead of 19x MD80... because that 19x frequency doesn't mean jack crap when LGA is on a 2 hr ground stop botching up the schedules anyways, or *gasp* like DL to ATL has been, some widebodies.


User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11983 posts, RR: 62
Reply 19, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 10006 times:

Quoting Tornado82 (Reply 18):
At airports where schedules are mere suggestions that are never adhered to anyways, there's no call for 19x anything

"No call" except the call of consumer demand. When business travelers (who constitute a higher proportion of the traffic on a route like ORD-LGA than on the average domestic U.S. route today) demand frequency, and the flexibility to show up for an earlier flight if their meeting ends early, or go home a bit later if their meeting runs long, then frequency is what airlines give them.


User currently offlineJFKLGANYC From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 3630 posts, RR: 6
Reply 20, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 10003 times:

Don't be fooled, this is a direct shot at AA.

"against AA's 14 daily MD80/737 flights, and will have 5 daily flights with 70-seat jets ORD-LGA, up against AA's 19 daily MD80s. I don't think AA is too worried."

Your damn right they're worried. DL has a VERY loyal following in NYC. 5 flights a day on mainline (not regional) jets, with regional airline costs, and less seats to fill then AA means that DL has an easier time making money on this route then AA.

DFW is just a token presence to annoy AA. But don't discount DLs effect on the LGA route. This is MAJOR.

PJ


User currently offlineXkorpyoh From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 821 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 9916 times:

i remember back in the days where AA had almost no presence at MIA and they dared to launch flights NYC-MIA with about 3 flights a day or so.
Back then that was PA and EA territory (and air florida?). And look at AA now wiht the LGA-MIA monopoly and all those frequencies to all NYC airports.

DL starts with a few flights with a lower risk E70 and if it works, i am sure they will increase frequency to all 3 airports (DFW,ORD,MIA)


User currently offlineTornado82 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 9854 times:

Quoting Commavia (Reply 19):
demand frequency, and the flexibility to show up for an earlier flight if their meeting ends early, or go home a bit later if their meeting runs long, then frequency is what airlines give them.

And again I reiterate... the flight schedules are often destroyed by ATC/WX anyways. If you promise a guy a 4pm flight and he doesn't take off till 5:40, meanwhile the 3pm flight took off at 4:45 and the 2pm flight took off at 3:55... what good did all that frequency do?

Anyone have the on-time ratings of those 19 flights? I'd be willing to bet that by 5pm it's sub-50%. That's not doing the biz pax a service.


User currently offlineJamake1 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1023 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 9845 times:

That's it Delta...Continue dumping capacity into N. American markets as has been your pattern since entering Chapter 11. My sense is that Delta has no real strategy on where to put its assets to stem its losses in N. America. They've dumped Song capacity onto AA/UA strongholds in the Boston-LAX/SFO markets and JFK-LAX/SFO markets and now LGA-ORD. I hope they get clobbered!


United's B747-400. "She's a a cruel lover."
User currently offlineWorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 9817 times:

DL is not out to overtake AA or UA in the NYC-CHI or -DFW markets or to Latin America for that matter; it simply wants to be able to have a presence to its NYC customers who need to travel to those destinations. It's a good move and a good use of resources and has a good potential to make money - probably better than AA and UA since DL will be using contract carriers with much cheaper aircraft to operate. And yes, if DL is successful, it very well could regauge these and other NYC flights to mainline. And yes, this is undoubtedly somewhat B6 defensive; notice that DL added SAT and AUS from JFK using the E170 just months before B6 did it w/ the E190. DL obviously acquired the E170s specifically to be able to develop long and thin routes and those that compete against other legacies.

Jamake,
So what do you call AA's addition of flights from Love Field to Missouri or from LGA to ATL? By your definition I'd call it dumping capacity, esp. since a number of those flights use RJs.... the same "ATC clogging RJs" that duplicate the US and DL Shuttles in and out of LGA. Like or not, there are no "territories" owned by any one airline and every other airline is free to expand where it sees the potential to make money.


25 Panamair : What have you been smoking? Dumping capacity? Do you realize that domestic capacity has been decreasing every month since they entered Ch.11? Domesti
26 DAL767400ER : Dumping capacity into domestic markets? Where have you been in the last months?!? Delta is reducing domestic capacity by 30 percent. They are connect
27 Jamake1 : Let me rephrase it for you: DUMPING capacity in already SATURATED markets. JFK-westcoast...Saturated. BOS-westcoast...Saturated. CHI-NYC...Saturated.
28 Alitalia744 : And AA dumping flights into LGA-BOS and LGA-ATL isn't dumping capacity into already saturated markets? Come on already....
29 DAL767400ER : Again, with that logic, what is AA's business in starting LGA-ATL? What is AA's business in starting their 'own' Shuttle on LGA-BOS/DCA? All those ma
30 DeltaMIA : There is no saturation when you carry more passengers than any other airline, have more FF's than any other airline and have more medallion/elite wit
31 Cubsrule : ...and he is exactly the flier, at least in Chicago, in the back pocket of AA and UA.
32 KC135TopBoom : Great news, DL is slowly coming back to DFW.
33 Jamake1 : There is nothing wrong with my attitude. I find Delta's recent actions to be irresponsible in light of the fact that there is over-capacity in the ma
34 Delta4eva : And not unlike what B6 has been doing since they began business....NE-Florida markets....and not unlike what SW has been doing for years....it's call
35 Alitalia744 : So did you find AA's actions irresponsible when they launched LGA-ATL? Just trying to understand how exactly that glass house of yours is made...
36 FlyPNS1 : The difference is that the LCC's have usually made money as they have grown. It's not capacity dumping if you are making money on the route. I'm not
37 Ckfred : What people forget is that AA ran DL off the ORD-DFW route. Years ago, DL used to have 6 or 7 round trips, while AA had 12 or so. Then, AA cranked up
38 PIA777 : DL use to fly widebodies into ORD, whatever happend to that? I have seen 767s there. They also use to fly the 757. PIA777
39 Post contains images OttoPylit : Wow, seems like the only thing getting clobbered is Jamake1. He can't argue AA's attempt at ATL-LGA, so he fends back with plastic wine glasses in fir
40 WorldTraveler : Problem is that B6 is expected to post a loss for the 4th quarter and then some. So, has all of that capacity they are "dumping" irresponsible. I sure
41 ContinentalEWR : Delta's re-entry into the LGA-DFW market, and adding a smattering of ORD routes is exactly a good example for why this airline is in Chapter 11 and wh
42 WorldTraveler : So why does AA offer less than six flights from ATL-LGA against DL's hourlies? I guess your theory just got shot to you know where, Continental EWR. A
43 Delta4eva : How does this have nothing to do w/ DL offering more choices to its customer base? DL has made it clear that they are increasing their presence in NY
44 Post contains images Alitalia744 : ContinentalEWR - it has a lot to do with DL and it's customer base in NYC. It also has a lot to do with increasing DL's presence in the NYC market (t
45 Post contains images Incitatus : Make ATL-LGA hourly service...? You answerd your own question. DL is not a major player in the NYC market. Big players in the NY market are Continent
46 Delta4eva : Hate to break it to you....but DL is a huge player in the NYC market....they have about the same, if not more market share than AA, and I'd definitly
47 Ckfred : DL pretty much dropped widebody service into ORD after September 11th. Although my in-laws flew into ORD from ATL a few months ago on a 767-300. DL c
48 Post contains images SESGDL : Oh get real! What a ridiculous post. Yes, B6 is a major player with service to huge business centers like LGB, PBI, and SLC. B6 doesn't even offer se
49 PIA777 : When I first moved down to ATL from Chicago I flew in on a 757 (11/01) and there was also a 767 parked next to me. I wish they still flew the 767 int
50 Post contains images OttoPylit : Are you out of your mind!? DL has service to dozens of cities nonstop from JFK and LGA. And DL commands more market share than American, so I have no
51 Jfklganyc : "You answerd your own question. DL is not a major player in the NYC market. Big players in the NY market are Continental, Jet Blue and American." What
52 Incitatus : From NY, if it's not Boston, DC or some obscure European city, it's not on Delta. Now DL offers one flight a day to Miami. Wow. Very big deal. A "ser
53 Tornado82 : Huh? Have you not noticed the loads and loads of Comair CRJ's going everywhere from LGA. Sure it might not be Delta mainline metal, but those people
54 DATAMINER : This market has an average fare of $192 each way. 26 cents per mile yield. 2800+ daily passengers. The fact of the matter is this is one of the last m
55 Post contains links Tornado82 : Portland, ME Comair Inc. 542 06:35 AM Arrived Washington, DC Comair Inc. 618 06:58 AM Arrived Richmond, VA Comair Inc. 259 07:18 AM Arrived Charleston
56 SESGDL : I have to be blunt, you're an idiot. DL offers service from NYC to SDF, BNA, BHM, RDU, GSO, RIC, ORF, CAE, JAX, FLL, MIA, PBI, ORD, BOS, DCA, BWI, LA
57 Post contains images DL787932ER : Owned.
58 DATAMINER : No small advantage. The who's who of NYC business travel the Delta Shuttle. The Marine Air Terminal is the easiest accessible terminal by far. It tak
59 DATAMINER : And Delta would only encourage AA not to worry. After all AA's CASM cuts have stalled, WN is building up MDW, Jetblue entering MIA, Delta expanding i
60 DATAMINER : Get a grip. Delta has a mainline adjusted non-fuel CASM lower than Jetblue and going lower. With sub 6 cent CASM you go where you want to, when you w
61 Commavia : Well, actually, when fuel is taken out of the equation, AA's CASM continues to decline, by 2.8% YOY in 4Q05, and by 2.0% YOY in full-year 2006. Fuel
62 DATAMINER : Up my man. Up 2.8% Don't make me cut and paste.
63 SHUPirate1 : Wouldn't that be US Airways?
64 MAH4546 : Funny you point out SDF...Delta will no longer serve Louisville from New York City after 2 February 2006.
65 Cubsrule : In the past few years, a lot of the 757 and 767 flying to ORD has had to do with m/x. DL does overnight m/x at ORD, which was why the last flight in
66 PIA777 : Thanks for the info and HELL YEAH THE CUBS RULE!!! PIA777
67 Panamair : Fell out of my chair on this one here...One of the most ignorant and laughable lines in a.net history! Apparently, Paris, Rome, Moscow, Frankfurt, an
68 Commavia : Excuse me, you are correct, AA's non-fuel CASM did, indeed, increase 2.8% YOY in Q4. Nontheless, CASM did decline for the year.
69 Incitatus : At least I don't live in the middle of nowhere. Have you ever been to NY? Go to the Port Authority webpage. In total traffic (JFK+LGA+EWR) Delta is a
70 JFKLGANYC : " If I had no credibility you'd have ignored my statement." If you think 4 terminals, with 44 gates, at two airports, one of which DL is the largest c
71 LawnDart : MIA, one of the most expensive airports in the U.S....people (PA and TW) used to think that JFK was the be all and end all of U.S. to Europe travel,
72 SHUPirate1 : Problem is, you just killed your own argument. There is probably as much, if not more demand for Latin American flights from the Miami-Fort Lauderdal
73 WorldTraveler : DL is the larger of the two real carriers in the NE Shuttle markets; Pan Am was before and DL has maintained it. DL has one JFKMIA flight today and is
74 Tornado82 : I'd have to say Pittsburgh from an airport design standpoint... but ATL wins on the basis of its location/market over Pittsburgh.
75 LawnDart : Don't ever make a definitive statement using the word "probably". You just killed your counter argument... I won't argue the fact that MIA is the num
76 David : I don't believe anybody has mentioned that it has only been a couple of years, I believe, since AA started LGA-BOS and LGA-DCA flights in direct compe
77 SESGDL : The premium route from NYC to London is JFK-LHR. With DL not having permission to operate to LHR, DL simply can't compete with carriers who do from J
78 Commavia : Two totally different things -- comparing apples to lawn furniture. The reason JFK lost its prominence as a connecting hub (it still hasn't lost its
79 SESGDL : While many speculate about MIA having more O&D to Latin America than the rest of the country, that is simply wrong. To say that one metropolitan area
80 Panamair : From the Port Authority web page: Total passengers from all 3 NY area airports - 12 months ending October 2005 including Mainline, commuters, etc: 1.
81 Alitalia744 : Seriously now, why even argue with these people. BTW i was just calculating myself, glad I can stop (only reached March). lol
82 Commavia : Not at all. What I said was that the growth that has occured in approximately the last 10-15 years in flying from ATL and IAH to Latin America has be
83 Cubsrule : Certainly factually true, but it's only half the story. AA is miles ahead in both Chicago and Dallas-Fort Worth.
84 MAH4546 : Depeding on the market, AA's average O&D on their MIA-LatAm flight range from 40% or so to as high as 70%. Most of AA's MIA international flights, ou
85 WorldTraveler : MAH is correct.... most Latin destinations from MIA carry approx 50% connecting passengers; those statistics are derived from segment data reported to
86 LawnDart : Not at all...as businesses spread further out from the major metropolitan gateways (JFK included), new routes opened up, bypassing the major gateway.
87 SESGDL : That's not out of the realm of possibility. However, DL will likely not serve MIA/FLL to London without LHR slots. DL has stated that if it received
88 WorldTraveler : FLL's runway and customs facilities are not ideal for int'l flights. DL is more likely to expand from MCO to Latin America and Europe than FLL, in my
89 TinPusher007 : True, but moreover...I posed this same question to the authors of DL's company newsletter when I worked as a ramp rat for them as it seemed inexplica
90 MAH4546 : You mean these successful services: US: FLL-PTY, FLL-SAL, FLL-SJO, FLL-GUA AA: FLL-CCS, FLL-SDQ AM: FLL-MEX All of the above lasted less than a year,
91 Aer : Well this one was in fact successfull, US just changed it, most flights were always full.
92 LawnDart : DL actually had plans to add MCO service to Central America about 1991-92. They even loaded them into the reservation system...lack of demand forced
93 MAH4546 : Orlando attracts a lot of wealthy South American tourists, but the yield just isn't there. Yes, I know, and it is like comparing apples and oranges.
94 Post contains images LawnDart : I'm not completely ignunt, if that's what you're implying...and I'll try not to bore you with the level of personal knowledge I have on the matter, b
95 MAH4546 : A much larger immigration area is already desperately needed. FLL immigration, especially in the afternoon, is horrendous. I don't even want to think
96 LawnDart : Whereas clearing customs in MIA is a breeze... Slightly more stable than the San Andreas fault... But, previously you said: Well, what is it??? Are w
97 MAH4546 : It is exactly what I said...a compromise. Those plans will not solve any long-term issues, and are essentially worthless. And the poor are just as en
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