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When Will EgyptAir Get Rid Of Their 737-500's?  
User currently offlineRichM From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2004, 798 posts, RR: 7
Posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 4580 times:

I was just wondering, when do you *think* EgyptAir will get rid of their 737-500's? On their website, it states that their A300's (manufactured during same year as their 737-500's) will be removed during February this year. As EgyptAir's 737-500's are fairly dated, and lack onboard entertainment systems such as PTV's and in-flight radio, I was just wondering if anyone had any idea when EgyptAir would be likely to get rid of them? + When they do get rid of them, what do you think will happen to them? And what are they likely to replace them with?

http://www.egyptair.com.eg/docs/inside/fleet.htm

Thanks.  Smile

14 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineBennett123 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 7610 posts, RR: 3
Reply 1, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 4566 times:

IMO you are making a fundamental mistake here.

You assume that because they are selling the A300-600 that they will also retire the B737-500.

However, the A300 is operated on different routes and are being converted for FedEx. I do not think that they would be retiring them yet if re sale was not an available option.

I think that an update to the IFE is possible, however given that most are used on shorthaul often with little or no competition, this is by no means inevitable.

Given that MS seem to be opting for Airbus on it's shorthaul routes, I suspect that the eventual replacement will be A319/A320.


User currently offlineRichM From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2004, 798 posts, RR: 7
Reply 2, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 4543 times:

Quoting Bennett123 (Reply 1):
You assume that because they are selling the A300-600 that they will also retire the B737-500

Nowhere did I state that I thought EgyptAir planned on withdrawing their 737-500's just because they are removing their A300's from their fleet. I simply pointed out that their A300's of the same age were being removed from the fleet in due course. I am not the one making assumptions here, I was just stating facts and asking questions.

Thanks for the reply anyway.


User currently offlineMD90fan From Bahamas, joined Jul 2005, 2931 posts, RR: 7
Reply 3, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 4518 times:

What routes are the 735's on? TLV? are they still almost all white operated by Air Sinai?


http://www.devanwells.blogspot.com/
User currently offlineBennett123 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 7610 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 4480 times:

RichM

On their website, it states that their A300's (manufactured during same year as their 737-500's) will be removed during February this year

My understanding was that you were making a link, sorry if that assumption was incorrect,

Copied from the thread about UA 735

Actually, on hops less than app 1.5 hour, the old Boeing uses less fuel due to it much lower OEW. Even if the engines are less efficient, the less weight causes the engines to burn less fuel on short trips

An example of this is that BU did not want 736 from SK as a replacemet for the 735, they were simply less efficient for the typical mission profile.


MD90fan

CAI LXR
ABS ASW

I am sure that there are other routes.


User currently offlineBennett123 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 7610 posts, RR: 3
Reply 5, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 4479 times:

The quote was from Mikkel777

Actually, within its range profile (About 1500-1600nm and less) the 737Classic is more efficient than either the 737NG or the A32S. In fact, this is a major reason that WN used the 733 on MSY-LAX as opposed to the 73G (except when 10/28 was closed)

There was another from N1120A

Actually, within its range profile (About 1500-1600nm and less) the 737Classic is more efficient than either the 737NG or the A32S. In fact, this is a major reason that WN used the 733 on MSY-LAX as opposed to the 73G (except when 10/28 was closed)


User currently offlineHorus From Egypt, joined Feb 2004, 5230 posts, RR: 59
Reply 6, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 4396 times:

Quoting RichM (Thread starter):
I was just wondering, when do you *think* EgyptAir will get rid of their 737-500's?

The decision to retire the B735s has been put on hold several times. Back in 1999/2000 the airline ordered 5 A318s to replace the 5 B735s (one was lost in TUN in 2002) but the problem with the P&W engine meant this ordered was changed to the larger A320, which in turn was used to expand rather than renew the fleet.

Several MS pilots I have spoken to have expressed their dislike of the B735 as they are getting on in terms of age however they all agree that there is no current aircraft that can economically replace the Baby Boeing. The A320s (which the airline has 12 of) and the B738 (which the airline has on order) represent an extra 50% in capacity compared to the B735 so are not realistic replacements. Also the A318s/B736s are too heavy despite offering a similar seat capacity. Like Air New Zealand's dilemma with the B733, MS cannot find a good enough replacement with low fuel burn.

The most likely scenerio is that MS's subsidiary, Air Cairo, will take over the former's entire domestic network within a few year (which is where the B735s are mainly deployed) using a fleet of turbo props which would allow a high frequency, comfortable service on the domestic trunk routes (MS did lease 6 ATR-42s back in 2003 to test the feasability of such actions).

I for one will surely miss MS's B735s and hope to see them in the air for much longer. Yes they are old, but they are sturdy aircraft and look great in MS's c/s.

Quoting Bennett123 (Reply 1):
However, the A300 is operated on different routes and are being converted for FedEx. I do not think that they would be retiring them yet if re sale was not an available option.

The AB6 replacement had been on the cards since 2000 but 9/11 and lack of financing put the order for the A332 on fold for 3 years. As for the converted AB6s they are destined for both Egyptair Cargo and FedEx. Irish operator Aer Lucht originally planned to take 3 but that airline folded before the first aircraft was delivered.

It's also important to bear in mind that the AB6 were operating on lucrative routes to the Middle East and Europe offering inferior onboard services, so it was paramount to find a replacement...in this case the A332s.

Quoting Bennett123 (Reply 1):
I think that an update to the IFE is possible, however given that most are used on shorthaul often with little or no competition, this is by no means inevitable.

Agreed

Quoting Bennett123 (Reply 1):
Given that MS seem to be opting for Airbus on it's shorthaul routes, I suspect that the eventual replacement will be A319/A320

You seem to forget MS have 12 B738s on order.

Quoting MD90fan (Reply 3):
What routes are the 735's on? TLV? are they still almost all white operated by Air Sinai?

Egyptair operate 4 B735s including the one operated by subsidiary, Air Sinai:
SU-GBH 04/1991 (blue tail and engines)
SU-GBJ 11/1991 (full MS c/s)
SU-GBL 05/1992 (full MS c/s)
SU-GBK 05/1992 (blue tail and engines) Air Sinai aircraft

The B735s mainly fly domestic routes as well as to DAM, ALP and sometimes ATH and IST.

Air Sinai fly CAI-TLV on a twice weekly basis and a 1x weekly SSH-TLV flight. When not flying to TLV the aircraft is used on MS's own route network.


Horus



EGYPT: A 7,000 Year Old Civilisation
User currently offlineGARPD From UK - Scotland, joined Aug 2005, 2659 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 4391 times:

Quoting Bennett123 (Reply 1):
Given that MS seem to be opting for Airbus on it's shorthaul routes, I suspect that the eventual replacement will be A319/A320.

EgyptAir have a history of preffering a mixed fleet. And I think they have 738's on order.

EDIT: Ah, Horus beat me to it with that info...

[Edited 2006-01-25 23:13:43]


arpdesign.wordpress.com
User currently offlineBennett123 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 7610 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 4371 times:

Sorry, I missed out on the B737-800 order.

That clearly puts a new slant on my comments.


User currently offlineWesternA318 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 5674 posts, RR: 24
Reply 9, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 4339 times:

Now why does every nrowbody operator have to hve IFE again?


Check out my blog at fl310travel.blogspot.com!
User currently offlineETStar From Canada, joined Jan 2004, 2103 posts, RR: 7
Reply 10, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 4332 times:

Quoting WesternA318 (Reply 9):
Now why does every nrowbody operator have to hve IFE again?

Thank you! Unless that bloody narrow body is used on a long trip such as Kenya Airways' 73Ws trekking all the way to West Africa, why would we really need IFE's on short hauls? This just tells me that people are so addicted to the rays of light that come from these lil' gadgets, and have no way of keeping themselves entertained (no pun intended)! Try reading. Try having a conversation with the totally unknown person sitting next to you. You might learn something new, and broaden your horizons.

And those rays are bad for your eyes, eat more carrots.


User currently offlineHorus From Egypt, joined Feb 2004, 5230 posts, RR: 59
Reply 11, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 4270 times:

WesternA318, ETStar I completely agree with your sentiments but with today's fiercely competitve market passengers tend to have high expectations. Just look at AC or B6 who have installed PTVs on their Embraer RJs. I personally don't see the need for such an enhanced entertainment system on narrowbodies operating short haul flights as it's costly and not truely beneficial.

Horus



EGYPT: A 7,000 Year Old Civilisation
User currently offlineMD90fan From Bahamas, joined Jul 2005, 2931 posts, RR: 7
Reply 12, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 4196 times:

What routes will the 738 go on?


http://www.devanwells.blogspot.com/
User currently offlineViasa From Switzerland, joined Jun 2005, 1880 posts, RR: 6
Reply 13, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 4151 times:

A year ago (or more...) Aerolineas Argentinas sign a deal with MS to take over the B735. But about a month later AR sign also a deal with CZ.

So the MS/AR-contract was cancelled.

The first two former CZ B737-500 are now in service with AR and seven will be go to Argentina shortly.

After that MS search for a new operator for her B735s and found that in Canada with Canjet Airlines. But untill today no MS B735 was delivered to this airline.

I'm not sure if this deal is still around or if is canncelled...


User currently offlineHorus From Egypt, joined Feb 2004, 5230 posts, RR: 59
Reply 14, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 4126 times:

Quoting MD90fan (Reply 12):
What routes will the 738 go on?

They've been earmarked for European and Middle Eastern services. Expect to hear more information this summer.

Quoting Viasa (Reply 13):
I'm not sure if this deal is still around or if is canncelled...

Viasa, in all honesty I heard unsubstantiated rumours regarding the MS/AR deal but it's the first time I've heard of a Canjet agreement. I doubt MS will get rid of their B735s until they start receiving the B738s and Air Cairo receive their A320s. Having said that a deal with Canjet (an all B735 operator) would make sense for both airlines.

Horus



EGYPT: A 7,000 Year Old Civilisation
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