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The 787-3 - Will It Succeed?  
User currently online1337Delta764 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6431 posts, RR: 2
Posted (8 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 4009 times:

I don't mean to create this as a poll, but as a discussion.

So far, the 787-3 only has orders from two airlines: ANA and JAL. Both are Japanese airlines. I have heard from some users that the 787-3 won't sell outside of Japan. What are your thoughts?

I personally think that the 787-3 may end up being the least successful member of the 787 family, but may still perhaps get some orders from airlines who are not from Japan.

American Airlines - The 787-3 may perhaps work well as an A300 replacement.

Delta Air Lines - The 787-3 would be a perfect addition to Delta's fleet, replacing the domestic 767-200s and 767-300s (non-ER). On these routes, the range of the 787-8 is not needed. The 787-3 can also fit into more domestic gates than the 787-8, thanks to its shorter wingspan. Delta could order the 787-8 for transatlantic flights, but the 787-3 is more suitable for the domestic 767-200/300 destinations.


The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
11 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineFriendlySkies From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 4105 posts, RR: 5
Reply 1, posted (8 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 3952 times:

It's already sold 50 frames, and since most of it's development costs are covered by the full 787 program, one could say that it has already succeeded.

User currently offlineWAH64D From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2005, 966 posts, RR: 13
Reply 2, posted (8 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 3942 times:

It will be a huge success with orders by the bucketload. I think a lot of operators of the larger type will order the B783 later down the line.


I AM the No-spotalotacus.
User currently offlineHiJazzey From Saudi Arabia, joined Sep 2005, 864 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (8 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 3899 times:

On the contrary, I think it will be successful. It has the market to itself. It is the only A300 replacement. If you want to haul a decent amount of cargo with your pax on short to medium haul, efficiently, it's the only game in town.

I expect it to gain some orders this year. For one I think SV will purchase a few. They're expected to announce a major overhaul of their widebody fleet in the summer.


User currently offlineAmirs From Israel, joined Dec 2003, 1333 posts, RR: 4
Reply 4, posted (8 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 3843 times:

I would expect LY to order them, they would be great for LHR, CDG, BOM and JNB flights

User currently offlineCentrair From Japan, joined Jan 2005, 3598 posts, RR: 20
Reply 5, posted (8 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 3496 times:

Totally. Though the 737 and A320 are being used in markets that used to be served by A300s and older 767s, there are still some markets that need a larger size. That is where 787-3 comes in. AA, DL, UA, Chinese carriers, and many that have already ordered the 787-8/9.

Personally I feel that if the Big U.S. Legacies can pull out of their hellhole, they will order many of these.



Yes...I am not a KIX fan. Let's Japanese Aviation!
User currently offlineOryx From Germany, joined Nov 2005, 126 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (8 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 3393 times:

Quoting FriendlySkies (Reply 1):
most of it's development costs are covered by the full 787 program

It would be interesting to know just how much. Doesn't the -3 have a different wing than the other two? Also when it has a different skin thickness you have to redo the entire proof of stability (I can't find the british expression for "Festigkeitsnachweis").


User currently offlineAtmx2000 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 4576 posts, RR: 38
Reply 7, posted (8 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 3215 times:

Quoting WAH64D (Reply 2):
It will be a huge success with orders by the bucketload. I think a lot of operators of the larger type will order the B783 later down the line.



Quoting Centrair (Reply 5):
Totally. Though the 737 and A320 are being used in markets that used to be served by A300s and older 767s, there are still some markets that need a larger size. That is where 787-3 comes in. AA, DL, UA, Chinese carriers, and many that have already ordered the 787-8/9.

The trick is that you have to be able to sustain reasonably high loads at a reasonably high frequency to ensure maximal utilization of the aircraft, otherwise competitors flying smaller planes will end up with lower costs when they fly their smaller aircraft frequently with high loads. Japanese airlines in their lower competition, high population density home market can more readily sustain widebodies on domestic routes than US airlines can.



ConcordeBoy is a twin supremacist!! He supports quadicide!!
User currently offlineDIA From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 3273 posts, RR: 28
Reply 8, posted (8 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 3177 times:

Japan is the only purchaser of the 744D...and Boeing made money with very few made. Same thing for the 783 (although more will be made than the 744D). 783s outside Japan? Not very likely, but you may have a couple here or there around the world -- remember, it is an ever-changing market out there; sometimes unpredictable.

Now, in terms of the 783 as an A300 replacement...I'll speak generally here...

The original 762 and 772 (non-ER versions) came out, sold, then were killed by market changes and better models. Many ailrines now like to stick with one a/c type that can be interchanged with different routes the airline flies. UA flies their 772ERs through DEN to ORD, SFO, LAX, etc. Why? They don't need too. They could use their 772s (non ERs) to do this. They do this because of ease of route flexibility with respective a/c. W/O going into too much detail...this has seemed to become more popular these days. Now, the 783s in Japan probably won't be leaving domestic airspace...so the 783 would make sense here...no possibility of having them fly abroad.



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User currently offlineBoeing7E7 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (8 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 3139 times:

Quoting Centrair (Reply 5):
Personally I feel that if the Big U.S. Legacies can pull out of their hellhole, they will order many of these.

Loads of them. At least 250 would be viable in the US alone.


User currently onlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30537 posts, RR: 84
Reply 10, posted (8 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 3024 times:
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I believe it will be quite successful with domestic carriers like CO, DL, AA, and UA who fly 762s, 763s, and 764s domestically.

CO has already chosen the 787-8(?), so the 787-3 seems to be a given for them to replace their domestic 762/763/764 fleet.

Same with NW when it comes time to replace the 742s and DC-10s to Hawai'i.

AA will most assuredly pick the 787, based on their current fleet (777/767/757/737).

The lack of an equivalent A350 model will probably push UA into the 787 camp, even though they operate A319s and A320s.

And chances are other airlines flying DC-10/MD-11 and 742s on "short-haul" (sub-3000nm) runs will look to the 787-3 because of the lack of a comparible A350.

So Boeing should see hundreds of orders for the model over the next two decades.


User currently offlineDsa From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (8 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 2811 times:

The 783 will be a success it wud be a perfect option for many american airlines and many others. The size is just right and is a godsend for the domestic market.

DSA>>>


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