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Inaugural UA/AA Flights To LHR  
User currently offlineZChannel From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 188 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 9 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 4153 times:

Does anyone remember what US gateways UA and AA flew to LHR when they took over the routes from Pan Am and TWA, respectively? What aircraft were used? Thanks for the responses!


Edited for stupid grammar mistakes

[Edited 2006-02-01 04:21:45]


ZChannel: Member FDIC
12 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineLuv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12123 posts, RR: 49
Reply 1, posted (8 years 9 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 4137 times:
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Well UA got the Pan Am gateways except for DTW and also MIA I believe, though I could be wrong about MIA. AA received the TWA gateways.


You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineZChannel From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 188 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (8 years 9 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 4123 times:

Quoting Luv2fly (Reply 1):
Well UA got the Pan Am gateways except for DTW and also MIA I believe, though I could be wrong about MIA. AA received the TWA gateways.

Are those gateways much different from what the two airlines fly today (other than what I assuming were the old standbys like ORD, JFK, LAX, etc.)?



ZChannel: Member FDIC
User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11753 posts, RR: 62
Reply 3, posted (8 years 9 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 4102 times:

Quoting ZChannel (Thread starter):
Does anyone remember what US gateways UA and AA flew to LHR when they took over the routes from Pan Am and TWA, respectively?

When AA bought the TWA routes to Heathrow in 1991, they launched their own service in July 1991 from Boston, Chicago, Miami, New York, and Newark, with Los Angeles starting a few months later, IIRC.

Quoting ZChannel (Thread starter):
What aircraft were used?

At least for AA, I believe -- IINM -- it was a mix of DC10s and 767s, with 767s being heavily predominant.


User currently offlineZChannel From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 188 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (8 years 9 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 4093 times:

Quoting Commavia (Reply 3):
At least for AA, I believe -- IINM -- it was a mix of DC10s and 767s, with 767s being heavily predominant.

Is it safe to assume that since LHR would have been the gem of AA's network at the time, the 767 was the carrier's flagship plane?



ZChannel: Member FDIC
User currently offlineLuv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12123 posts, RR: 49
Reply 5, posted (8 years 9 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 4088 times:
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There are even some photos of the AA 747sp in LHR, also the A300 is in the photo data base photo taken in LHR as well.


You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineUnited1 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 6046 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (8 years 9 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 4072 times:

UA initially flew from SEA, LAX, SFO, IAD, JFK/EWR, and MIA (MIA route authority was returned to PA after about 6 months although now out of LGW). ORD was added much later and was never flown by PA. PA retained service to LGW from DTW and MIA till the authority was sold to DL as part of the JFK/FRA hub sale.

AA started flying LAX, BOS, JFK/EWR, ORD, MIA. AA also flew PHL-LHR at one time (1994 I think).



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User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11753 posts, RR: 62
Reply 7, posted (8 years 9 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 4033 times:

Quoting Luv2fly (Reply 5):
There are even some photos of the AA 747sp in LHR, also the A300 is in the photo data base photo taken in LHR as well.

The 747SP was not operational at Heathrow when flights launched in July 1991, IINM. It was added later, and only on the JFK-Heathrow route alone. The A300 did not enter the Heathrow market, IIRC, until the 1993-1994 range, and even until they left around 2002-2003, they were only in very limited use there (BOS/EWR/JFK-Heathrow only).


User currently offlineCkfred From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 5276 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (8 years 9 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 3896 times:

Actually, AA bought the ORD-LHR route authority separately from the authority from the other gateways.

I believe didn't takeover flying ORD-LHR, until it started flying the other routes, because the bi-lateral agreement didn't permit AA to fly into LHR solely from ORD.

As an aside, TW was required to keep the STL-LGW route, because of its hub at STL. I also recall TW being forced to sell the PHL-London route to US, because AA didn't have a large operation at PHL, and thus, little connecting traffic.


User currently offlineStevenUhl777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (8 years 9 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 3876 times:

Quoting United1 (Reply 6):
ORD was added much later

Right...and one of the conditions UA had to agree to was that they couldn't operate a 747 on the route for a number of years afterward. They eventually operated it with either a 742 or 744 for a while, but they realized it was better to operate it with 772's and 763's.

I believe UA also had BOS from the start, but along with EWR, that slot and authority was sold in a silent bid, which BA won.

Many of the flight numbers are still the same... #930/931 for the SFO flights, for example. The SEA flight (which I flew in June '91) was #934 to LHR, and I believe #933 coming back.


User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26626 posts, RR: 75
Reply 10, posted (8 years 9 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 3863 times:

Quoting ZChannel (Reply 4):
Is it safe to assume that since LHR would have been the gem of AA's network at the time, the 767 was the carrier's flagship plane?

Yes, you are correct.



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User currently offlineLTU932 From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 13864 posts, RR: 50
Reply 11, posted (8 years 9 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 3858 times:

Quoting Commavia (Reply 7):
The A300 did not enter the Heathrow market, IIRC, until the 1993-1994 range, and even until they left around 2002-2003, they were only in very limited use there (BOS/EWR/JFK-Heathrow only).

Weren't the A300s used as a kind of stopgap while MD-11s were being phased out and 777s introduced? Because nonetheless, it is strange to see an AA A300 hop across the pond to such a high capacity destination as LHR.

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BTW, just one question: did they make the distance to LHR yearround nonstop or did they require fuelstops on the westbound, especially in the winter?


User currently offlineUAL777UK From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2005, 3356 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (8 years 9 months 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 3814 times:

Quoting StevenUhl777 (Reply 9):
I believe UA also had BOS from the start, but along with EWR, that slot and authority was sold in a silent bid, which BA won.

Nope BOS was not at the start, it was something like mid 90's, flight 998/999 flown by 763. It only lasted a few years (not sure of exact dates) but know that it only kept going that long because of cargo.


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