Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
NW Pilots To Strike!?  
User currently offlineUAL777UK From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2005, 3356 posts, RR: 1
Posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 8403 times:

Are these guys for real....Will they really strike, surely if they did it would be suicide for NW.

Whose got some insight here?

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/060203/dcf034.html?.v=33

90 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineFlyDreamliner From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 2759 posts, RR: 15
Reply 1, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 8399 times:

First off, Steenland - and the rest of the people running NW honestly believe the solution to their financial woes is to get rid of union labor in their airline. They are playing the dangerous game of trying to shove unilateral, management dictated work/pay/benefit conditions down pilots throats, assuming they'd rather swallow it than chance losing the job.

The pilot's union will most definately strike. NW has abused their employees for a long time, and recently it's just been rediculous.



"Let the world change you, and you can change the world"
User currently offlineUAL777UK From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2005, 3356 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 8374 times:

Quoting FlyDreamliner (Reply 1):
The pilot's union will most definately strike. NW has abused their employees for a long time, and recently it's just been rediculous.

I hear many bad things about the mangement at NW..........come to think of it I hear bad things about a lot of airline management in the US but saying that, do the pilots really think striking will solve the problem or are you saying they will see NW collapse rather than get further screwed?


User currently offlineWhataboutme From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 173 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 8353 times:

I do think this would be the end of NW, but I also think the management wants them to strike. Management has their millions of dollars in their bank accounts, so why would they care if this airline fails or not. Maybe they have a few thousand outsource pilots waiting to take to the sky if the NW pilots walk.

User currently offlineFlyingHippo From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 684 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 8321 times:

I hope the pilots go on strike, and see NW be history...

I'd hate to see the employees of NW lose their jobs that's not in an Union...

It's time for some of the worst US legacy carriers be history, let the better run airlines rule the sky.


User currently offlineJrlander From United States of America, joined Aug 1999, 1105 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 8295 times:

Oh come on! I think NW's executives care more about the success of the airline than that. If they didn't, they could just leave!

NW has had a history of very rough labor/management relationships. To blame the situation on one side or another is really not painting an accurate picture.

If the pilots do strike, I do think that it will be the end of NWA. I think the pilots know this, too. This is just posturing.


User currently offlineAA737-823 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 5814 posts, RR: 11
Reply 6, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 8266 times:

Better run? Like Alaska and Southwest? Hmmmm.... I am not convinced.

I would prefer to see the poorly run airlines (whether or not that includes NW is surely to be contested by people on both sides) turn around and become well run profit-machines. Like Continental did a few years back.
I would love for all the managers to be stripped of their golden parachutes and thrown out. Then, bring in Gordo or someone like him who can earn the trust of the employees quickly. And turn that sucker around.

I think THAT'S the best option.


User currently offlineDesiguy2447 From United States of America, joined May 2005, 96 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 8131 times:

unions cause so much harm to the American Corporations. In NWA's case if the pilots do strike come Feb 16th if no agreement is reached. I think President Bush will order the pilots back to work, and the president should. The pilots should not be allowed to strike, and destroy NWA and all the other employee's jobs.

User currently offlineUAL777UK From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2005, 3356 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 8087 times:

Quoting Desiguy2447 (Reply 7):
unions cause so much harm to the American Corporations. In NWA's case if the pilots do strike come Feb 16th if no agreement is reached. I think President Bush will order the pilots back to work, and the president should. The pilots should not be allowed to strike, and destroy NWA and all the other employee's jobs.

Do you honestly think so..I would not be so sure...besides NW isn't based in Texas!


User currently offlineJacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 59
Reply 9, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 8068 times:

Quoting Desiguy2447 (Reply 7):
unions cause so much harm to the American Corporations. In NWA's case if the pilots do strike come Feb 16th if no agreement is reached. I think President Bush will order the pilots back to work, and the president should. The pilots should not be allowed to strike, and destroy NWA and all the other employee's jobs.

while I agree to a certain extent about the Union thing...there is no reason for the "lame-duck" president to order the pilots..

there is MORE than enough slack to cover if NW goes chapter 7.....that being said, I hope they make it.. yes 


MyAviation.net photo:
Click here for bigger photo!
Photo © Jacobin777




"Up the Irons!"
User currently offlineCALPilot From United States of America, joined Oct 1999, 998 posts, RR: 13
Reply 10, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 8059 times:

Almost every employee that works for NWA now is going to lose their job. (period)

This management has already pointed out that they intend to outsource ground workers, CSA, Res, and any other position thats not in a Hub airport.


User currently offlineChiGB1973 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 1615 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 8027 times:

Quoting AA737-823 (Reply 6):
, bring in Gordo or someone like him who can earn the trust of the employees quickly

I don't think there are too many like Gordon Bethune? A man in the industry and a good business sense. Maybe they should seek an oil executive.

Quoting Desiguy2447 (Reply 7):
think President Bush will order the pilots back to work, and the president should

He won't get involved, nor should he.

Quoting Desiguy2447 (Reply 7):
The pilots should not be allowed to strike, and destroy NWA and all the other employee's jobs.

What do you suggest? In addition to the 37% pay-cut, take another 37%. Extend their flying hours. Strip them and the flight attendants of their contracts. Outsource it all. Lose the jobs anyway? Your bulldog mouth is overloading your Chihuahua ass. Back up what you say with facts and suggestions.

M


User currently offlineChiGB1973 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 1615 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 8005 times:

Quoting UAL777UK (Reply 8):
Do you honestly think so..I would not be so sure...besides NW isn't based in Texas!

Enron was and he didn't bail them out, so I agree, he won't do anything.

M


User currently offlineMattMSP767 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 118 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 7980 times:

I, personally, am 100% against unions but at the same time I still respect them. Now with that said...I have to side with the pilots here. Yes they are compensated very well but they have given management very generous pay and benefit cuts without putting up too much of a fight. If it is true that management is asking for huge cutbacks and in bad faith, then management will get what they deserve - CH. 7. It's a sad situation for everyone involved especially for the people who work have put so much into the company, financially and personally. I couldnt imagine what it would be like here at MSP if NW suddenly was gone.

User currently offlineTango-Bravo From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 3805 posts, RR: 29
Reply 14, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 7953 times:

Quoting Jrlander (Reply 5):
Oh come on! I think NW's executives care more about the success of the airline than that. If they didn't, they could just leave!

Sure they could... but apparently they see more $$$$$ waiting for them to find a pretense to put in their pockets ...so they don't.


User currently offlineMarshalN From Hong Kong, joined Sep 2005, 1521 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 7909 times:

Well, I think there is a certain breaking point where people tend to say "enough is enough". With NW breaking their MX union and now really shoving some ridiculous amounts of cuts down the pilots throat (not like they haven't taken a big paycut already) it is really in their full rights to strike here. If NW goes away, so be it.

User currently offlineIceTitan447 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 7834 times:

Quoting FlyingHippo (Reply 4):
I'd hate to see the employees of NW lose their jobs that's not in an Union...

They are losing their jobs via NEWCO, they are already go bye,bye. Example, in COS, USair is going to work their flights.


User currently offlineCOERJ145 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1421 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 7782 times:

I side w/the pilots, they have sacrificed enough. Chainsaw Steenland and his gang should take a 37% paycut, not the pilots. If only Anderson was still CEO, NW might still have hope to survive. I think NW will go Ch. 7 if the pilots strike....I at least hope they last through summer 06 because i have an award ticket from BOS-TUS using NW miles.(all the flights are on CO and DL though)

User currently offlineSupa7E7 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 7750 times:

Quoting MattMSP767 (Reply 13):
I, personally, am 100% against unions but at the same time I still respect them. Now with that said...I have to side with the pilots here. Yes they are compensated very well but they have given management very generous pay and benefit cuts without putting up too much of a fight. If it is true that management is asking for huge cutbacks and in bad faith, then management will get what they deserve - CH. 7. It's a sad situation for everyone involved especially for the people who work have put so much into the company, financially and personally. I couldnt imagine what it would be like here at MSP if NW suddenly was gone.

You are just a poseur. If NWA lists a bunch of Pilot jobs in the Star Tribune and gets no resonse, then I agree they are underpaid. Obviously qualified Americans would line up for miles to get these pilot jobs. So by that definition they remain well compensated. And it happens to be the economic definition of overpaid.


User currently offlineFlyDreamliner From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 2759 posts, RR: 15
Reply 19, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 7662 times:

In some businesses, the unions are not helpful. At NW however, they are necessary. The people running NW at the moment are maverick, large risk taking corporate ideologues who aim to remove the issue of union labor, and the total expense of labor from their business model. And to you:

Quoting Desiguy2447 (Reply 7):
unions cause so much harm to the American Corporations. In NWA's case if the pilots do strike come Feb 16th if no agreement is reached. I think President Bush will order the pilots back to work, and the president should. The pilots should not be allowed to strike, and destroy NWA and all the other employee's jobs.

i'm not sure if you get it. the people running the airline are unscroupulous, without the power of thier union, and the power to strike, the employees, pilots, flight attendants, maintanance workers, reservations, everyone, would just be abused by this NW management. In years past, under Anderson and others, NW managements has been atleast fair. The new guard there has been fairly destructive towards the ends of their workers.

NW isn't going to disappear. They might grind to a halt for a little bit, it might hurt their business for a while, but in the long haul, what management is doing now is not a good solution, and ultimately won't work. If NW had followed the lead of AA, UA, and now what DL is doing, they might be in better shape. Those airlines managed to regroup with out sacraficing their employees.



"Let the world change you, and you can change the world"
User currently offlineCIDflyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 2301 posts, RR: 3
Reply 20, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 7610 times:

Quoting MattMSP767 (Reply 13):
I couldnt imagine what it would be like here at MSP if NW suddenly was gone.

I really hope NW makes it, I still have a free ticket to burn. Notwithstanding, I really feel that MSP, and for that matter DTW, would not sit empty too long. I think CO or DL would take over either MSP or DTW as hubs, or maybe even US could buy some of NW's assets at the MSP hub.


User currently offlineIsitsafenow From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 4984 posts, RR: 23
Reply 21, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 7610 times:

My turn....I have been out-of-da-loop for about 15 days...a planet called Florida.

If the pilots walk, NW is out of business. Dougie wants the pilots to take the big cut and fly the yet to be named new RJ's, but will form NEWCO if they do not play ball and outsource most the company.
Now I am NW Gold, I am really having second thoughts about booking and building more miles with them.I am not convinced they will be around the end of the year. NW has said they will liquidated IF they don't get the labor concessions.
Now, I just booked a MCI trip with United. After I read the editorial in the Feb 2 USA TODAY about UAL and their top brass benefits of chapter 11, I almost did not book with them....but ending up taking their flights and price.
I have to book a couple of flights next week for the future and am stumped on who to spend my $$$$$ with. Shall I continue with NW or start a new "romance" with another carrier.
 boxedin  safe



If two people agree on EVERYTHING, then one isn't necessary.
User currently offlineGigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16347 posts, RR: 84
Reply 22, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 7534 times:

Quoting FlyingHippo (Reply 4):
let the better run airlines rule the sky.

The better run airlines have no unions, so I agree.

Quoting AA737-823 (Reply 6):
I would love for all the managers to be stripped of their golden parachutes and thrown out. Then, bring in Gordo or someone like him who can earn the trust of the employees quickly.

If you think Gordon Bethune didn't make MANY millions turning CO around, you
're nuts.

Quoting ChiGB1973 (Reply 12):
Enron was and he didn't bail them out,

The president of the United States is not a god. There was nothing he could do to fix Enron.

Morons that strike when they should be happy to have a job is something he can fix.

N


User currently offlineCO767FA From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 532 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 7518 times:

Quoting Desiguy2447 (Reply 7):
unions cause so much harm to the American Corporations.

It is early in the year, but this gets my vote for "Most Stupid" comment


User currently offlineChiGB1973 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 1615 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 7518 times:

Quoting Gigneil (Reply 22):
The president of the United States is not a god. There was nothing he could do to fix Enron.

Morons that strike when they should be happy to have a job is something he can fix

It wouldn't cost anymore to replace the employees retirement accounts than it will to "fix" NW.

Besides, putting more money in NW will just give them something to waste. They have to go through this to learn how to economically run an airline or lose it all. Sink or swim.

M

[Edited 2006-02-04 01:41:24]

25 MattMSP767 : What are you smoking? If the pilots were to go on strike they would not have time to recruit any other pilots. The airline would be six feet under. G
26 Nwab787techops : They need to suck it up! It's not just NWA thats in the woods or have been. UAL just got out and are going to fly high soon. Just like CO did. Even LC
27 CIDflyer : I felt the same way, I have flown NW eclusively for 8 years, but my next trip is on AA in two weeks. I am so glad I made that choice with talks of a
28 B6FAN : they should go on strike and finish the airline period.
29 HunUtazo : ...they're gonna be merged into amr, after, ...ual is merged into cal.
30 N908AW : Are you insane? It's the other way around. ATA would not have survived without WN.
31 COERJ145 : if any NW merger happens, US/HP would be the best fit. NW in the midwest and US/HP in the west/east. Also, the fleet would complement each other nicel
32 Nwab787techops : Are you insane? It's the other way around. ATA would not have survived without WN. Why do you think put money in ATA? Becouse Southwest was feeling s
33 Gigneil : Seriously, you need to just stop posting. You write random speculation with no argument, no sources, no logic, and no analysis. There is enough bulls
34 Malaysia : Unions can Hurt or Help, but in genenral without Unions, If we never had unions our living condition in the USA probably would be like Thailand today,
35 Indy : I really can't blame this all on management. I think there are 2 sides involved in this mess. Management knows they need to cut costs to survive. But
36 Post contains links PhilSquares : Would you consider WN a "better run" airline? I would. But they have their own unions.. How do you explain that? You obviously don't have a clue as t
37 Post contains images Gigneil : Southwest is an exception... and yes they are better run. Do they even have labor unions in Singapore? N
38 Mariner : I don't think they have the cajones to strike. So far, all the airline labor unions have allowed management to do exactly what they want, with just a
39 FriendlySkies : I fully support the idea behind unions, and believe it should always remain an important part of American business. However, the problem these days is
40 Post contains images PhilSquares : Surprise.....YES! [Edited 2006-02-04 05:13:00]
41 Sfomb67 : So maybe the real question is, if the pilots buckle under to NW management, how much of a bonus will the NW exec's think they deserve when they come o
42 Jano : NW and the pilots just agreed (not too long ago) to have the pilots' defined benefits retirement plan freezed and start a defined contribution plan.
43 GoBoeing : A lot of you folks are talking the talk here but you don't walk the walk, or in this case, fly the line. I am a pilot myself, though not yet for an ai
44 Dw9115 : That would be a good start.
45 Sfomb67 : Just curious how you get to fly in a jump seat when you don't work for NW? Well written, but why on earth would you want to be a pilot for a major ai
46 Aaden : No, there bluffing just like united.
47 Post contains images Gigneil : Haha that is a surprise... I was envisioning a "work or we'll cane you" approach to labor management.
48 LTU932 : This could be possible. Aren't the MX people at NW still striking? Nonetheless, despite that strike, NW is still around. I don't want to be gloomy ab
49 UAL777 : Great idea. Let management bend the pilots over again. They will get no response because if there was a strike, MOST pilots would not scab. They are
50 Lightsaber : There is an alternate here... NWA *can* survive a short strike. How long? I don't know. Perhaps that would be enough to compromise just enough. The u
51 PhilSquares : Just goes to show that surprises lurk around every corner and sometime what appears to be isn't. You'd be surprised just how much power pilot's have
52 Dreamflight767 : Question here but first off... I wish all the employees at NW the best. I hope things turn around for you, we are wishing you the best and I mean no h
53 Jeb94 : I must ask the question. How much of a pay cut is the senior level management team taking? If they are still earning their millions a year then why sh
54 UAL777UK : Not a chance in hell...try the other way around! Hmmm...You think so......two words ..Asian Routes!!!
55 Swissy : [quote=Jeb94,reply=53]I must ask the question. How much of a pay cut is the senior level management team taking? If they are still earning their milli
56 Isitsafenow : Reply 43 was nice and long and most of it opinion of a writer. I don't agree with most of it....but I guess that's my right, dontchathink? Pilots shou
57 Indy : That is probably a poor example. Other than that the post was very good. Very long but very good. Problem is management needs to nut up charge the ap
58 Indy : The reason there were so many bankruptcies is that the price of fuel continues to climb but management won't increase the price of tickets to compens
59 FlyHoss : The NW pilots might chose something other than a traditional strike. They may be able to make their point by targeting certain cities or fleet types;
60 Swissy : [quote=Indy,reply=59]Some airlines were smart and hedged. Others weren't and are looking to labor to make up for their mistakes. Most of these airline
61 RJ777 : We've already lost Indepedence. Do we have to lose Northwest, too?
62 KabAir : I tend to be fairly anti-union and have generally sided with the airlines on this stuff. But I have to say, it's starting to get to the point where I
63 Mir : And American corporations cause so much harm to the American workers. Not all of them, but many. It's a two-way street. NW management has been shovin
64 CO767FA : Why do you think there isn't "...a chance in hell" that UAL will be merged into CO? If this board were around decades ago, I can't help wonder if the
65 Aviationwiz : Would the pilots have to ask to be removed from mediation, and thus wait the 30 days, or are they not in mediation due to the bankruptcy, and it could
66 Post contains images Isitsafenow : Yeah I know about fuel. I have a few trucks in our companies fleet that uses it. If you read my post, my terminalogy was ONE reason, not THE reason.
67 Antoniemey : Yes, he made a fair amount of money... on the other hand, after Sept 11th when the airiline industry looked ready to crash, Gordon was the FIRST to t
68 CO767FA : Gordon did earn high wages and benefits during the up cycle; then he took a fair cut in his last year before retirement. Let's not forget that the ma
69 AirlineAV8tr : My uncle just moved up to the A330 with NW. The pilots are not being treated fairly, nor are the FA's. NW has been openly recruiting FA's from foreign
70 Cubsrule : That's maybe the dumbest thing I have ever heard. In case you were unaware, UA emerged from b/k this week. The stock is doing holding its own. I thin
71 AirlineAV8tr : If UAL was not bailed out by Washington, they would've been belly-up years ago. That's the brutal truth. The fact that they emergered from bankruptcy
72 FlyDeltaJets : The only Union workers in Delta are the pilots
73 Mariner : That's terrific, I'm sure, but he is talking about Northwest, not Delta. I don't know what Delta has to do with this. cheers mariner
74 FlyDeltaJets : I'm just stating that maybe NW is trying to follow in the steps of other carriers.
75 MarshalN : Hmmm? IIRC, UAL was the one major that did NOT get federal backed loans after 9/11.
76 Mariner : Is Delta trying to break their pilots union? I didn't know that. Gosh, I think that could get very ugly, very quickly. cheers mariner
77 AirRyan : I suggest that the two are similar in that the DL pilots set the dates that they did for final negotiation of their contracts so that the NW pilots w
78 Post contains links KarlB737 : Courtesy: WCCO-TV NWA Pilots' Union Ready To Vote On A Strike Video Report: http://www.wcco.com/video/?id=14236@wcco.dayport.com
79 Mariner : Well, you may be right. But it seems to me that both Delta and Northwest are taking very different approaches from United to the Chapter 11, and very
80 Bucky707 : Yes, Delta is very much trying to break the pilots union.
81 UAL777UK : Exactly......Has anybody got any idea what AirlineAV8tr is going on about???
82 Hiflyer : Hats off to the poster that said there is no way 50 plus pilots close to retirement are going to kill their income. Absolutely correct...the lack of j
83 Isitsafenow : Very good. After reading you post three times I must agree and second your emotion..(a little humor there, folks). Well Done! ALSO-------------------
84 NASCARAirforce : Bush won't do anything, since he does NOT care, especially since it isn't a Texas based airline, besides the guy can't string a sentence together, so
85 PhilSquares : I left a "legacy" carrier several years ago, at my own choice before they entered bankruptcy. There are tons of jobs for experienced Captains with ti
86 CO767FA : Oh come on, there is plenty of cash via investors! Maybe that will be the straw that breaks Bush's and congress' back on the trade deficit.
87 Hiflyer : A 55 yr old living in MSP with 2 mortgages and a divorce payment is not normally a canidate for offshore basing and being away from family. Some migh
88 PhilSquares : Think so? In the case of CO, according to their 2005 10K filed on 3/15/2005, there was hardly any equity in the company at all. That has certainly de
89 MarshalN : If it looks like the pilots are going to strike I'm not so sure if there will be any investors willing to dole out the cash. Pilot strike is not the
90 PhilSquares : I disagree. You'd be amazed at the number of pilots who are coming from DL and NW to interview here at SQ. I know some other airlines who are in a si
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Bmibaby Pilots To Strike / BMI Pilots To Vote posted Wed Aug 16 2006 17:26:32 by BMIFlyer
NW Pilots To Give Up More? posted Mon Aug 29 2005 16:44:36 by Isitsafenow
Spanair Pilots To Strike posted Sat Nov 6 2004 00:18:45 by Bullpitt
ANZ Pilots To Strike For 2 Days This Month (July) posted Tue Jul 2 2002 08:51:02 by Singapore_Air
Rumour: Cathay Pacific Pilots To Strike! posted Fri May 4 2001 19:04:59 by Singapore_Air
NW Close To Strike posted Mon Mar 5 2001 09:09:25 by Jiml1126
Delta Pilots To Strike posted Mon Feb 12 2001 23:38:19 by AirT85
SW Pilots To Strike! posted Tue Apr 11 2000 18:39:24 by DEN-HNL
Delta Pilots To Wrap Up Strike Authorization Vote posted Mon Apr 3 2006 23:48:42 by KarlB737
Delta Pilots To Stage 'Practice Strike' posted Fri Mar 24 2006 22:31:54 by Jumbojet