GF-A330 From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2001, 1643 posts, RR: 3 Posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 8384 times:
MUSCAT, Feb 6 (Reuters) - Gulf Air announced on Monday plans to spend $900 million to replace 9 aging Boeing 767s but did not name the aircraft it intended to buy.
James Hogan, chief executive officer of Gulf Air, told reporters the airline would seek a long-term loan to finance the purchase once approved by the airline owners, the governments of Bahrain and Oman.
Gulf Air, which returned to profitability in 2004 after years of losses, carries a debt of about $500 million.
"Our idea is to change the type of aircraft to two within ten years from four now," he said after a board meeting in Muscat, which will become the airline's other hub in March.
Hogan said the Manama-based Gulf Air, which operates a fleet of 34 aircraft, would start placing orders by May. He said the airline also plans to refurbish its fleet but did not give further details.
Abu Dhabi, which launched its own airline in 2004, has announced its intention to withdraw from Gulf Air. Abu Dhabi and other former co-owner Qatar have injected millions of dollars to keep the airline afloat in its red years.
Scbriml From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2003, 11359 posts, RR: 50 Reply 1, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 8311 times:
Gulf Air has a long history, I can remember their VC-10s at Heathrow a long time ago. However, the concept of a pan-Arabian airline seems to have runs its course. I hope they can survive and prosper, but it looks pretty tough for them.
I assume the two types would be A320s plus one type to replace the 767s and eventually also the A330s and A340s. Looks like either the A350 or 787 would fit the bill for the widebodies.
CO7e7 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 2848 posts, RR: 2 Reply 2, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 8255 times:
Quoting Scbriml (Reply 1): I can remember their VC-10s at Heathrow a long time ago
Skibum9 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1229 posts, RR: 0 Reply 3, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 8127 times:
I bet DL is wishing they had some money to tak them off of Gulf's hands. They need more 767ERs for their international expansion and they have experience with these aircraft, having taken some of Gulf's 767s in the past.
Cloud4000 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 639 posts, RR: 0 Reply 5, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 7980 times:
Does this include the aircraft operated by Gulf Traveler too?
Quoting Scbriml (Reply 1): Gulf Air has a long history, I can remember their VC-10s at Heathrow a long time ago. However, the concept of a pan-Arabian airline seems to have runs its course. I hope they can survive and prosper, but it looks pretty tough for them
Qatar is out. Abu Dhabi is out. How soon will Oman Air push Gulf Air out of Muscat?
FCKC From France, joined Nov 2004, 2347 posts, RR: 4 Reply 6, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 7907 times:
Did they say , when they will these new planes to be delivered ?
If it's before 2008 , so they will go A330 , if they can wait for a few years more , another A350/787 battle in sight.
The second type could be A32X , if they wish to stay with a narrow body type in their fleet.
In fact it could be 737NG , if Boeing offers them a very advantageous package , including wide bodies.
But we have heard they were studying regional jets , such as the ERJ170 family.
So their order , could be :
-A330/A320 (or ERJ)
or
-A350/A320 (or ERJ)
or
-787/737NG (or ERJ)
Kaitak744 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 2208 posts, RR: 3 Reply 7, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7876 times:
Dalecary From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 8, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7823 times:
A very good chance for a 350 order IMO. IIRC Hogan was quoted last year(can't remember if it was FI or another publication) as saying there was every chance GF would be supplied by one manufacturer in the future and they would narrow their fleet to 2 types(1 NB and 1 WB). The only Boeing's in the fleet are the 763s and they are going, which could point to advantage Airbus IMO.
I'm sure it is a 787 v 350 battle, and I would be most surprised to see the 330 involved. GF seem to know their place and don't have wild expansion plans of other carriers in the region. Hogan is pretty keen to keep the fleet at around 30-40 total for the near to mid term.
Behramjee From Canada, joined Aug 2003, 4439 posts, RR: 43 Reply 9, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7753 times:
The key point in this article says 9 aircraft to be bought for US $ 900 million which means after all discounts they are spending US $ 100 million per frame for either a B 787 or A 350.
However, it is worth mentioning that the GF CEO of the late 1980s who ordered from Boeing these 9 B 767-300ERs had signed a clause which said that if GF were to ever phase out its B 767s then it could be only sold back to Boeing and no other airline.
Therefore do not be surprised to see a "trade off" deal signed with Boeing where by GF buys B 787s and gets some sort of cash back facility for selling these B 763s back to Boeing hence increasing their discount OR enabling them to squeeze in a few more aircraft into the order i.e 1 or 2.
A similar sort of deal was signed by Boeing and SQ-Singapore Airlines in 1998 where by Boeing bought SQs A 343s in exchange for an order for 20+ B 777s from SQ.
DeltaGuy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 10, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 7665 times:
I always liked their 763ER setup, with the 2L and 2R doors...people at DL will remark that they're a pain to work, but I like actually being able to board a widebody from mid, where FC traffic and therefore coach traffic is cut in half. Should have been standard on all 767's IMHO.
RICARDOAB From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2004, 175 posts, RR: 0 Reply 11, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 7479 times:
Did I read somewhere in one of the forums late last year that GF had struck a deal with Boeing for 737-800's, or was that another middle-eastern airline?
PM From India, joined Feb 2005, 6715 posts, RR: 65 Reply 13, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 7304 times:
Quoting Dalecary (Reply 8): I'm sure it is a 787 v 350 battle, and I would be most surprised to see the 330 involved.
You're probably right but a few years back (pre Hogan?) Gulf actually announced that they were going to standardise on the A330-200 as their principal (only?) widebody aircraft. It never happened. Might it yet?
Another trivial point of interest is that Gulf seem to have suffered from indecision for a while. They had GE-powered 777s on order in the early 1990s and then cancelled them to order RR-powered A330-300s which they then switched to A330-200s (some of which they then leased to TAM).
Bucky707 From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 1028 posts, RR: 4 Reply 16, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 6130 times:
Quoting DeltaGuy (Reply 10): I always liked their 763ER setup, with the 2L and 2R doors...people at DL will remark that they're a pain to work, but I like actually being able to board a widebody from mid, where FC traffic and therefore coach traffic is cut in half. Should have been standard on all 767's IMHO.
Not sure, but I think Delta did pick up a 763ER from Gulf Air back in the late 90s.
Alitalia744 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 4657 posts, RR: 45 Reply 17, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 5826 times:
Quoting Bucky707 (Reply 16): Not sure, but I think Delta did pick up a 763ER from Gulf Air back in the late 90s.
DL has a few (6 I believe) -3P6ERs in the fleet. I always thought it was odd as the FA's referred to them as 767Gulf a/c.
I prefer the 767 with the 2L/R door combo vs. four overwings...
YULWinterSkies From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2107 posts, RR: 6 Reply 18, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 5554 times:
Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 7): Quoting FCKC (Reply 6):A330/A320 (or ERJ)
Name one reason why so? An airline replacing 767s for long term? Its either 787 or A350.
Same reason as Finnair and the 340 and TP with the 330:
Availability.
KC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 11708 posts, RR: 52 Reply 19, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 5554 times:
Well, with 9 B-767-300ERs coming on the market, soon, there could be a lot of airlines interested in them. Sorry, I don't know a lot about GF.
Since DL already took some of these airplanes, I assume they are GE engines (sorry, I cannot open the pictures today, for some reason). I doubt DL can afford to pick up a few more of the GF B-767-300ERs, even though they need them.
But I think TZ can get them. Wasn't TZ looking for 5-6 GE equipped B-767-300ERs to begin replacing the L-1011-500s for their military charters?
I believe North American is also looking for a few more to add to their fleet, also for the military charters.
UA may also want a few additional B-767-300ERs, but I thought they needed P&W engines.
There is also a rumor that AA will drop the former TW B-767-300ERs (GE), also, when the leases are up (along with the former TW B-757-200 {P&W}), as they don't fit well within the AA B-767 fleet. I believe we already know that AC will be getting rid of their B-767-300ERs as their B-787-800s and B-777-200ERs begin arriving.
So, could we see several used B-767-300ERs suddenly become available in the next 4-5 years?
Zamaria From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 82 posts, RR: 0 Reply 20, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 5486 times:
Having flown in Gulf Traveller's B767s a few times in the last few years (from AUH to TRV via MCT), these are really dingy aircraft in desperate need of replacement, or perhaps just a good scrubbing. Anyone know anything about the age and history of these aircraft?
While spending the money to upgrade their aircraft, they might as well spend money to send their crews to finishing school as I routinely encountered rude and downright nasty staff - not only on the India flights, but flights to and from Europe as well.
However, I could always count on free and wildly hilarious in-flight entertainment consisting of some poor soul(s) being berated by members of the Gulf crew for seemingly no reason. One guy, admittedly quite drunk, was threatened with immediate removal from the aircraft by a flight crewmember who was foaming at the mouth. I couldn't help noticing that we were cruising at 37,000 feet above the Arabian Sea at the time.
TristarSteve From Sweden, joined Nov 2005, 3691 posts, RR: 34 Reply 21, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 5433 times:
Quoting Scbriml (Reply 4): think they had more than one. I remember they carried their old BOAC registrations for some time before they were changed to A4O-.
GF operated 5 VC10 in early 1970s, until replaced by the Tristar. They all went to the RAF as tankers
Kappel From Suriname, joined Jul 2005, 3533 posts, RR: 18 Reply 22, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 5166 times:
Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 19): But I think TZ can get them. Wasn't TZ looking for 5-6 GE equipped B-767-300ERs to begin replacing the L-1011-500s for their military charters?
Yes, but they wanted RR powered 763's. Since they couldn't find them (duh) the L1011's went for D-checks.
Quoting Zamaria (Reply 20): Anyone know anything about the age and history of these aircraft?
Airfleets.net shows them being between 16 and 13 years old (from oldest to youngest). However, they only show 4 aircraft. Don't know about the other 5.
ChiGB1973 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 1605 posts, RR: 1 Reply 24, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 4681 times:
Quoting GF-A330 (Thread starter): Our idea is to change the type of aircraft to two within ten years from four now," he said after a board meeting in Muscat, which will become the airline's other hub in March.
I was wondering, A-340 and A-330 or Airbus and Boeing.
Quoting Behramjee (Reply 9): it is worth mentioning that the GF CEO of the late 1980s who ordered from Boeing these 9 B 767-300ERs had signed a clause which said that if GF were to ever phase out its B 767s then it could be only sold back to Boeing and no other airline
I wonder if there was a time clause or something to that effect. I can't really see Boeing's interest 12 to 17 years later, especially if GF decided to go Airbus. Boeing would have these 767s and no new order. Of course, now that is a good deal because of the desire for 763 aircraft. Is there a link or something to the effect?
Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 19): But I think TZ can get them. Wasn't TZ looking for 5-6 GE equipped B-767-300ERs to begin replacing the L-1011-500s for their military charters?
Great, but this is going to be years down the road, not even deciding what will replace them. By that time, WN will have TZ flying to Europe and beyond with 787s. I liked it anyway.
26 Horus: Indeed. This rumour has been circulating since 2000. Hopefully this time they actually act on it. Did you perhaps confuse them with Egyptair who orde
27 Aleksandar: Did someone mentioned that GF will order some 73G to replace A320s?
28 Horus: Here is that topic: Gulf Air: 19x 737 NGs? (by GF-A330 Dec 17 2005 in Civil Aviation) Horus
29 Aleksandar: I knew I've read about it somewhere. Thanks
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