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Cabin Makeover At KLM  
User currently offlineAA B777-200 From Netherlands, joined Mar 2001, 505 posts, RR: 4
Posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 5928 times:

Since KLM is now planning to keep its MD11s until 2015, the company is making some adjustments for the flying ladies in two phases.

First phase has already started. This includes new carpets and installment of video cameras at the cockpit door.
They are also changing the 2-4-3 configuration and the new layout will be 3-3-3!
KLM is removing the last row of the World Business CLass section to put in a few more coach seats and therefore the configuration of the MD11 will change from 31/251 to 24/270.
According to KLM, on the MD11 routes there's more demand for Economy Class seats.

In phase two all Economy seats will be renewed. KLM still has to decide if those are going to include the PVS.
WBC seats will also be replaced and will include the newer Inflight Entertainment System 3000.
Flatscreens will also replace the current overhead monitors.
The second phase should be completed by 2008.

The makeover aside, KLM has also introduced large pictures in the lavatories of some MD11s. They are using 3 themes : flowers, sea and city.
If pax responses are postive, KLM will extend these 'surprising toilets' to the entire widebody fleet.

On the 747-400 KLM has decided to install newer WBC seats. They are also replacing the overhead monitors.
Whether they will also install the PVS on the coach seats (being renewed) is also to be decided this year.

22 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineMauriceB From Netherlands, joined Aug 2004, 2490 posts, RR: 25
Reply 1, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 5888 times:

Would be great, but i doubt all of this. Keeping up the MD-11 in the air untill 2015 is quite a while, and since they will probably be the last Pax carrier wich uses the MD-11 then, it will be expensive to maintain them.



About the PTV's in the Eco seats, i dont think they will install them in the 747-400's, because when they had planned it earlier, there were some weight issues


User currently offlineHB-IWC From Indonesia, joined Sep 2000, 4504 posts, RR: 71
Reply 2, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 5870 times:

I hope they keep the small forward cabin in WBC as it is. The privacy in this 2-row cabin makes it my personal favorite in the entire KLM longhaul fleet. They shoud do away with the horrible 2-3-2 layout in the second C-cabin. The MD11 has always been regarded as the holiday aircraft at KLM, so the reduction in WBC seats makes sense. I guess there will be some route adjustments though for the MD11 fleet, and I doubt that we'll see the MD11 back at DXB after its current stint comes to an end and DXB will once again be served by the T7.

User currently offlineSK601 From Belgium, joined Jun 2005, 976 posts, RR: 4
Reply 3, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 5617 times:

Quoting AA B777-200 (Thread starter):
They are also changing the 2-4-3 configuration and the new layout will be 3-3-3!

OUCH! I really like the 2-4-3 lay-out.

If configuration will change from 31/251 to 24/270, I kind of wonder how m-class will be. If they add 2 rows (3-3-3) than it will be 269.
A WBC of 24 could possibly be 4 rows (2-2-2). This will eliminate the less desired 2-3-2 configuration in business class. It looks like the MD11 will get a kind of B777 interior.

[Edited 2006-02-09 15:42:48]

User currently offlineRootsAir From Costa Rica, joined Feb 2005, 4186 posts, RR: 40
Reply 4, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 5563 times:

I hope this doesn't mean they will keep the MD 11 on the AMS-LIM route...I reserved for October ansd am more than wishing its the 777 they will use !


A man without the knowledge of his past history,culture and origins is like a tree without roots
User currently offlinePersotvik From Norway, joined Nov 1999, 274 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 5549 times:

This is fantastic news Smile Together with Finnair KLM finds real value in this excellent aircraft.

How many passenger MD11's do Martinair operate?

Taken by me at AMS last summer:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y40/Trhgutt/Aircraft%20photos/KLMD112.jpg



Just love flying
User currently offlineTR From UK - England, joined May 2001, 953 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 5516 times:

Quoting Persotvik (Reply 5):
How many passenger MD11's do Martinair operate?

Martinair operated 1 MD-11CF in passerger configuration in the 2005 summer charters. According to rumours however, all of their 7 MD-11s (4 convertible (CF) and 3 full freighters) will be used for cargo in the future. Their two 747-200Cs are also used for cargo only. So only the 3 A320s and 6 767s will be used for passengers.


User currently offlineGlobeTrekker From Netherlands, joined Dec 2003, 851 posts, RR: 14
Reply 7, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 5470 times:

Thanks for the interesting news Robin!

I remember a few years back KLM MD-11's had a 37/260 configuration and since then it has been getting less and less in C-class. I must say that I also loved the 2-4-3 lay-out. Last year I flew AY on their MD-11 and they had a 3-4-3 configuration in Y. It gave you more legroom, but it seemed really cramped in a way.

Any word as to when phase 2 is to commence?

Globe Trekker



The World Is A Book And Those Who Do Not Travel Read Only A Page
User currently offlineA319114 From Netherlands, joined Aug 2004, 541 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 5444 times:

Quoting SK601 (Reply 3):
I really like the 2-4-3 lay-out.

Me too, it's the best of both worlds if you ask me!



Destruction leads to a very rough road but it also breeds creation
User currently offlineDIJKKIJK From France, joined Jul 2003, 1802 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 5395 times:

Quoting GlobeTrekker (Reply 7):
Last year I flew AY on their MD-11 and they had a 3-4-3 configuration in Y. It gave you more legroom, but it seemed really cramped in a way.

3-4-3 in an MD-11! They must be mad! 2-4-3 is bad enough, then again most Italians are of small build  Wink

Quoting AA B777-200 (Thread starter):
Flatscreens will also replace the current overhead monitors.

about time, those monitors are miniscule!

So can someone tell me why PH-KCF is not named anymore? I think she was called 'Annie Romein', but she didn't have her titles last week when I saw her at AMS



Never argue with idiots. They will bring you down to their level, and beat you with experience.
User currently offlineSK601 From Belgium, joined Jun 2005, 976 posts, RR: 4
Reply 10, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 5346 times:

Quoting DIJKKIJK (Reply 9):
I flew AY on



Quoting DIJKKIJK (Reply 9):
then again most Italians are of small build

AY= Finnair


User currently offlineJoost From Netherlands, joined Apr 2005, 3169 posts, RR: 4
Reply 11, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 5259 times:

Doesn't Martinair also have a 3-4-3 configuration in its MD-11s? I flew the type once on AMS-HER, but I was 13 years old at the time. I was already interested in aviation back at the time and I remember I was very impressed, but do not really recall the configuration. We flew back in a 742 - I remember the crew already refered to it as an old bird.

User currently offlineKappel From Suriname, joined Jul 2005, 3533 posts, RR: 17
Reply 12, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 5186 times:

Quoting AA B777-200 (Thread starter):
If pax responses are postive, KLM will extend these 'surprising toilets' to the entire widebody fleet.

Hey Robin, fawaka brada, long time no see. Hey, interesting news about the restrooms, seems like a novel and interesting idea. I really hope they will put PTV's on the 744's, since I fly those the most (yes to PBM). It probably won't be before the summer huh?

Quoting AA B777-200 (Thread starter):
According to KLM, on the MD11 routes there's more demand for Economy Class seats.

This surprises me even more that they don't put these on the PBM routes, which as you told me a while ago needs less WBC seats and more economy. Weren't they supposed to be phased out IN 2012, or STARTING 2012, so that the last MD-11 will leave in 2015?
Tang boeng...



L1011,733,734,73G,738,743,744,752,763,772,77W,DC855,DC863,DC930,DC950,MD11,MD88,306,319,320,321,343,346,ARJ85,CR7,E195
User currently offlineAMSSFO From Netherlands, joined Feb 2005, 952 posts, RR: 10
Reply 13, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 5115 times:

Quoting TR (Reply 6):
Martinair operated 1 MD-11CF in passerger configuration in the 2005 summer charters. According to rumours however, all of their 7 MD-11s (4 convertible (CF) and 3 full freighters) will be used for cargo in the future.

According to another forum they will operate one in pax config again this summer.

Quoting AA B777-200 (Thread starter):
They are also changing the 2-4-3 configuration and the new layout will be 3-3-3!

That' a really bad idea! One of the reasons I choose NW over KL is the 2-4-2 config of NW's A330 compared to the 3-3-3 config of KL's 777 or the 2-4-3 config of KL's MD11. (OK the main reason is 2 inch more pitch on NW A330  Wink)


User currently offlinePRAirbus From Puerto Rico, joined Apr 2005, 1139 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 5021 times:

Great! We'll see MD11s for a while! They look awesome in KLM's new livery. Nice and comfortable airplane...too bad there aren't that many around.

User currently offlineAA B777-200 From Netherlands, joined Mar 2001, 505 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (8 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 4829 times:

Kappel,
Mind your words! Last Tuesday there was an incident with an all pax 747-400 at Schiphol (PH-BFN) while being towed and therefore that aircraft went into maintenance for 2 months!
Since KLM operates only 5 all pax versions of the 744 it is looking at options to rebook some pax or change aircrafts on specific routes.... PBM pax on PY, or have NW operate the daily AMS-YYZ-AMS flight. Maybe that MD11 into PBM wouldn't be such a bad idea!
Drop me a note so I can send you those BFN pics.

And yes, they changed the phase out year from 2012 to 2015, but you never know....

Joost,
Yes Martinair's MD11s also have a 3-4-3 layout. Isn't fair, huh?! Is the same as EK operating 3-4-3 on its 777 in coach!

Ryan,
Phase two should commence in 2007 and be finishes in 2008.

Braulio,
If you're lucky, as stated in another thread, that nonstop 777 into Lima might be starting by the end of October. I'll keep my fingers crossed for you!

Robin


User currently offlineVunz From Netherlands, joined Jun 2001, 360 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (8 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 4803 times:

What happened to the City of Nairobi?

User currently offlineAA B777-200 From Netherlands, joined Mar 2001, 505 posts, RR: 4
Reply 17, posted (8 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 4743 times:

BFN : accident while being towed, damage in fuselage!

User currently offlineHB-IWC From Indonesia, joined Sep 2000, 4504 posts, RR: 71
Reply 18, posted (8 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 4719 times:

Quoting AA B777-200 (Reply 17):
BFN : accident while being towed, damage in fuselage!

So that's why yesterdays' AMS-PEK has been canceled and AMS-SIN has been delayed for 17 hours? What are the repercussions for the operation in the upcoming 2 months? With a subfleet of 5 B744s, this incident is bound to cause some major irregularities.


User currently offlineHotje From Netherlands, joined Jul 2004, 115 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (8 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 4609 times:

Just saw the damage, it's pretty major. About a 4*1m hole in the botom of the fuselage. It looked pretty severe to a non expert that I am.

User currently offlineVunz From Netherlands, joined Jun 2001, 360 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (8 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 4589 times:

Does anyone have any pictures?

User currently offlineUpperDeck79 From Finland, joined Feb 2005, 1139 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (8 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 4570 times:

Quoting GlobeTrekker (Reply 7):
AY on their MD-11 and they had a 3-4-3 configuration in Y

One third of the Y cabin is 3-4-2, two thirds 3-4-3.

With the cheapest booking classes, you cannot have pre-assigned seat in the 3-4-2 cabin before you check in for the flight. But at check-in, all Y booking classes can be seated also in that section (excluding tour groups, though, I believe).



AY and ANA rock!
User currently offlineKappel From Suriname, joined Jul 2005, 3533 posts, RR: 17
Reply 22, posted (8 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 4374 times:

Quoting AA B777-200 (Reply 15):
And yes, they changed the phase out year from 2012 to 2015, but you never know....

WOW... with Finnair about to replace (at least some of) their MD-11's with a343's, and Thai also retiring theirs, KLM may perhaps be the last pax MD11 opertator in 2015, or when they finish replacing them in what..2017? Any idea why they pushed the date back another 3 years? Waiting for the a350?  biggrin 
Or of course the 787-10, but that would make little sense since they operate a new fleet of 772's. Or perhaps they saw that to replace them in 2012 they would have to order this year and were not up to it?



L1011,733,734,73G,738,743,744,752,763,772,77W,DC855,DC863,DC930,DC950,MD11,MD88,306,319,320,321,343,346,ARJ85,CR7,E195
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