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Does Re-starting An Airline Ever Work?  
User currently offlineJmc757 From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2000, 1298 posts, RR: 7
Posted (14 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 2330 times:

Does re-starting an airline ever work? In my opinion it does not.
Lets take a look:

Laker - Once a GIANT, then they had problems and disappeared. In 1996 (not many people know this), Freddie Laker restarted, flying DC10s from Manchester (and maybe Gatwick) to America. In 1997 this airline went bust !
DID NOT WORK

Branniff - look how many times he has restarted! Did not work!

PanAm - A household name! Went bust, now they are revived, but a crappy little airline with a few old knackered 727's, come on, not really 'succesful'!

Caledonian - British caledonian got into trouble. BA bought them and merged them with british Airtours and called it caledonian Airways (not BCal)This was used them as their Charter operation. they then sold them. caledonian were a crappy little charter airline with an AWFUL reputation. Now they are JMC.

I could go on for ever, so does it work??? Are there any examples of it working ? what are your views?

11 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineGoingboeing From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4875 posts, RR: 16
Reply 1, posted (14 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 2287 times:

For all intents and purposes, Continental "restarted", and is working quite well. No, they didn't go out of business, but they did file bankruptcy a few times and finally got the leadership they needed to turn things around.

User currently offlineLHMark From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 7255 posts, RR: 46
Reply 2, posted (14 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 2279 times:

Pan Am isn't what the old PA was, but they're still flying- and profitably. I guess that's a form of success. It doesn't happen overnight.

I agree that it's near impossible to restart an airline and have it match its former glory. We'll see how much weight the Pan Am name actually carries.



"Sympathy is something that shouldn't be bestowed on the Yankees. Apparently it angers them." - Bob Feller
User currently offlineRyanair From United Kingdom, joined Jul 1999, 654 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (14 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 2262 times:

It can work, as was said Continential while continually trading, was in fact relaunched when the origional was shut down. Frontier was relaunched and has been very successful. National was relaunched and is already making money. Even Ryanair was relaunched in 1991 after the origional was shut. The jury is out on Pan Am, but they are backed by railroad owning oil barrons.

Laker shot himself in the foot by promising the earth in terms of service and due to unavailable planes delivering huge delays and charter confiq. Tristars. If they'd have been less ambitious with their start up timetable they'd still be around, again it was that particular managements fault, not the fact it was a relaunch as such. Caledonian was only a rebranding of British Airtours (Nothing to do with Airtours) who has always been a crappy little company.

I think with so many start ups failing it's not unsurprising so many relaunches go bust, but I see no evidence so suggest there's anything more or less than that going on, especially as some do succeed.


User currently offlinePenguinflies From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 988 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (14 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 2241 times:

Don't forget National and Frontier, two revived names that have had success.

User currently offlineCedarjet From United Kingdom, joined May 1999, 8093 posts, RR: 54
Reply 5, posted (14 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 2236 times:

National and Frontier bear no relation to the original airlines, they're just good names that were purchased by start-ups from the receivers.

I agree, if an airline goes bust it's usually cos they were disliked and a NAME CHANGE (a la ValuJet / Air Tran) is a better move. Pan Am 2 I think suffered because of the perceptions by the public of the original PA.

There are other re-starts that have been successful - World Airways all but shut down, but came back and has found a profitable niche with freight and ACMI passenger wet-lease charters (ACMI - Aircraft Crew Maintenance Insurance).



fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
User currently offlineWhippy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (14 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 2232 times:

How about Midway?

User currently offlineOozabooza From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (14 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 2228 times:

Isn't Air Tran a restart of Value Jet, or am I thinking of another airline?

User currently offlineLH423 From Canada, joined Jul 1999, 6501 posts, RR: 54
Reply 8, posted (14 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 2230 times:

I think Cedarjet said it perfectly, only he specifically pointed at two airlines: Frontier and National. He said that those are airlines that bear no relation to the original. Well infact 9 out of 10 don't have any relation with the original. Does anyone think PanAm has anything to do with the Juan Trippe PanAm. No! The new PanAm is owned by Guilford Transportation, a railway contractor from Billrica, MA. The older PanAm was started by a man whose name I forget at the moment, Martin Shrugg (I think). Oh well. He passed on less than a year after his PanAm collapsed of a brain haemorrhage.

Anyways, someone mentioned Midway. The original Midway was based in Chicago and flew a decrepit fleet of 737s, DC-9s, and MD-80's. The new Midway is based in Raleigh, NC, and has a modern fleet of CRJ's, F100's and. 737-700's.

So my point is, most of these "reincarnations" have no direct links with the original airlines. Most of the time the name is owned by the dead airlines creditors, and in the case of National, the sum went into the PanAm retirees fund.

LH423



« On ne voit bien qu'avec le cœur. L'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux » Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
User currently offlinePenguinflies From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 988 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (14 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 2201 times:

PA 2 and PA 3 are totally different owners than PA ! (as said above). Air Tran and Valujet was a merger, with Valujet purchasing Air Tran and taking the latter's name. (that is how they got a fleet of 50 DC-9 {Valujet} and 10 or so 737-200s {Air Tran}).

Midway was a true restart. After the first one failed. They tried again at MDW, but SW, arrived, and the CEOs saw no chance at survival with that kind of competition. So they downsized from DC-9s/MD-80s to the CRJ and Fokkers and moved to RDU where they had success (yippie!!!)

Just think about the guy who purchased the Branniff name this time (the one who tried to start an all smoking airline). I want to see about his success out there.

Even TransPacific Airlines might be a restart, but only the original airline that has that name is still operating...as Aloha Airlines.

P.S. LH423, I was thinking the same thing.


User currently offlineDesertJets From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 7776 posts, RR: 16
Reply 10, posted (14 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 2198 times:

Interesting sidebar about Frontier... so the myth goes that many displaced former Continental/old Frontier people in Denver now hold key positions at the new Frontier b/c of their knowledge of the Denver market and their experience with Continental and the old Frontier.


Stop drop and roll will not save you in hell. --- seen on a church marque in rural Virginia
User currently offlineAmericanKing From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 81 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (14 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 2202 times:

I think that some "Re-start, and Start-up" Airlines work and do not always work. Like take Legend Airlines, they are a start up and they are beating the crud out of American   :-( I live out by Love Field and I go out to DFW a lot, and take Ozark Airlines they are doing great out of DFW and are hurting the same routes that American and American Eagle fly.

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