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Is Delta Over Doing It With All The New Service?  
User currently offlineNwab787techops From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 219 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 10182 times:

I don't know about you guys ,but to me it looks like Delta may be adding a little too much this year. Oh, I love to see new route for US airlines. To see a US airline is going back to Africa is Great! But, adding service is not cheap. This is not FL, it takes years to get routes like South Africa making money. Delta has not got the money and or the time.

93 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineTpaewr From United States of America, joined May 2001, 452 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 10160 times:

DL has a habit of pulling out of markets just as fast, if they don't pan out. While no doubt some will work, I suspect that a least of a few of these will go the way of the DL's FRA or PDX hubs.

User currently offlineSATX From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 2840 posts, RR: 7
Reply 2, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 10133 times:

"You put your new route in, you take your new route out, you put your new route in and you shake it all about. You do the hokey pokey and you turn yourself around. That's what it's all about."

Anybody else know this song?



Open Season on Consumer Protections is Just Around the Corner...
User currently offlineTpaewr From United States of America, joined May 2001, 452 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 10104 times:

Quoting SATX (Reply 2):
song

Funny you should mention "song"


User currently onlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17550 posts, RR: 46
Reply 4, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 10104 times:

Quoting Nwab787techops (Thread starter):
Is Delta Over Doing It With All The New Service?

Yes.

They're essentially putting all their eggs in one basket (ATL) and as we all know, that never ends well.



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineRwSEA From Netherlands, joined Jan 2005, 3105 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 10038 times:

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 4):
They're essentially putting all their eggs in one basket (ATL) and as we all know, that never ends well.

Not at all. What about all the flights they've added this year from JFK, including the following:

JFK-Kiev
JFK-Budapest
JFK-Manchester
JFK-Dublin/Shannon
JFK-Sao Paulo
JFK-Santo Domingo

While ATL has seen a good deal of expansion, JFK has had quite a bit too. Hardly putting all the eggs in one basket.


User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4405 posts, RR: 6
Reply 6, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 10019 times:
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FORUM MODERATOR

Quoting RwSEA (Reply 5):
While ATL has seen a good deal of expansion, JFK has had quite a bit too. Hardly putting all the eggs in one basket.

SLC has also had a sizeable expansion with dozens of new n/s destinations last year.



Next flights: WN DSM-LAS-PHX, US PHX-SJD.
User currently offlineGokmengs From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 1123 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 10019 times:

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 4):
Yes.

They're essentially putting all their eggs in one basket (ATL) and as we all know, that never ends well.

Ohh yeah, whats CO doing over at EWR?
DL is not putting all its eggs in one basket, they are very strong in JFK. Don't forget CVG either.



Gercekleri Tarih Yazar Tarihide Galatasaray
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32899 posts, RR: 71
Reply 8, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 9957 times:

Opening up new routes to existing stations, like Athens, is a minimal investment. I think this summer will be a big experimental summer for Delta. I doubt all of the routes will return next year. For example, I would not bet on Atlanta-Nice and Atlanta-Venice returning after this summer. Atlanta-Edinburgh bookings were low enough that the start date was pushed back a few weeks to June. The LatAm routes will probably do well, but some of the Caribbean routes to smaller markets, like Kingston and Bridgetown, are bigger risks. I don't expect JFK-GRU to last long either, and Atlanta-Copenhagen will likely suffer during the winter months. Other routes, like JFK-Kiev and Atlanta-Tel Aviv, IMO, show great potential.

This is just my opinion, though.



a.
User currently offlineDAL767400ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 9909 times:

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 4):
They're essentially putting all their eggs in one basket (ATL) and as we all know, that never ends well.

Let's see:
BOS-CUN/NAS/BWI, IAD-CUN, JFK-ACA/PVR/KBP/MAN/DUB/SNN/SJD/CZM/GRU/AUS/SAT/MIA/SDQ/STI/SJU, LAX-RDU/CMH/PVR/MZT/CZM/ACA/ZIH, LGA-ORD/DFW/MSY/MIA, MCO-BMI/MLI/ROC/PHF/ICT/MSY/DFW/OKC/TUL/BTR/MCI, SLC-KOA/LIH/MZT/PVR/MSY/LGB/MIA/YEG/MKE/IND/CMH/RDU/CLE/MEM/BNA/BDL/LGA
CVG-CUN/SJD/MBJ.
Yeah, obviously Delta must be operating everything through Atlanta, and they are overdoing their expansion and they should grow slower on international routes and shrink faster on domestic routes and not reduce capacity at all and drop unprofitable flights, but please not to my own cow pasture of an airport, blablabla. A.net armchair CEO's, you just gotta love them.
Sorry for that, but I had to say it.


User currently offlineCs03 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 413 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 9788 times:
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Delta clearly thinks that a majority of these routes will make money, and using the connection "power" of Atlanta will help them to achieve such. CO is doing well at EWR with International service, so DL figures that they can do the same thing at ATL!

User currently offlineNwab787techops From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 219 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 9749 times:

Quoting Cs03 (Reply 10):
Delta clearly thinks that a majority of these routes will make money, and using the connection "power" of Atlanta will help them to achieve such. CO is doing well at EWR with International service, so DL figures that they can do the same thing at ATL

Most of EWR internation service is not form connections. EWR is in NJ, but it's a NYC airport. Even then it was years for CO to get where they are today.


User currently offlineATLFlyer323 From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 617 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 9698 times:

Quoting Nwab787techops (Reply 11):
Most of EWR internation service is not form connections. EWR is in NJ, but it's a NYC airport. Even then it was years for CO to get where they are today.

And ATL was built in a day? Any expansion where they think they can make a profit is perfectly fine with me. :P

~Brandon



Everyday, the fluffy temptation of wheat!
User currently offlineWorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 9522 times:

There are obviously people that are threatened to see DL expand beyond Florida and western Europe. Unfortunately, DL is smart enough to seize opportunities that are out there and which other carriers are not going after.

AA and CO have both talked about serving Russia but DL has now added a 2nd flight ... and I wouldn't be surprised if more is on the road. DL's new Kiev and Budapest flights only strengthens DL's presence in Eastern Europe ... and I would bet Warsaw is under consideration. CO tried to add service to Nigeria, which could have served as a transit point for S. Africa service but they couldn't make it work.

DL has added service in every region of the world except East Asia and they are vying for Beijing service. DL's international expansion is not only diversified but it is even further diversifying DL's international route system which up to this point has been heavily concentrated on western Europe.

DL is doing exactly what they should be doing. The fact that few other airlines can do much only makes DL's international expansion that much more likely to succeed. As we have seen today, US had to buy used 757s in order to expand it's international network. There are precious few international capable aircraft in the US fleet which are not being used as such outside of DL so DL has the ability to do much more while other airlines have to sit, watch DL grow, and as they wait for new aircraft.


User currently offlinePSA727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 974 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 9510 times:

I could not agree more with the doubts surrounding Delta's Intl expansion.
IMO they are adding too many new destinations in too close of time frame.
Who is going to open up these stations for them? Do they have enough in-
house staff to do this? And do you notice that none of the new US-Europe
routes involves SLC. You would think that they would at least include an
SLC-CDG route to give better connecting options for West Coast travelers,
as well as those wanting to go thoughout Europe, the Middle East, and Africa
via CDG. Let's wait and see what their 2007 timetable has in comparison to
this year's. I bet that about a third to a half of these new routes will be
discontinued by then. I think that this bold expansion is more of an attempt
by DL to acquire more financing while in Ch 11. After all, we always hear in
the business section about airlines shifting their aircraft from less profitable
domestic routes to high-yielding international ones. But no one seems to
calculate that if everyone does that, then there will be massive overcapacity
issues to deal with, which means having to lower fares to gain more of the
market share. Haven't we been there before somewhere?



fly high, pay low...Germanwings!
User currently offlineB4real From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2646 posts, RR: 5
Reply 15, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 9460 times:

Quoting Nwab787techops (Thread starter):
Oh, I love to see new route for US airlines. To see a US airline is going back to Africa is Great! But, adding service is not cheap.

For some of the routes, I agree, but JNB is a low risk service among new stations for DL. They've been selling codeshares for YEARS and have a clue about the decision.

I agree with some of the statements above about ATL-NCE/VCE/CPH for the long-term. I am, however, saddened that CVG, domestically, has really been butchered pretty bad. I hope it doesn't fully go DFW.

But, they're in Ch.11 - they can't just sit still!



B4REAL, spelled like it sounds
User currently offlineAeroflot777 From Russia, joined Mar 2004, 3010 posts, RR: 27
Reply 16, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 9401 times:

I think that JFK-KBP will do very well!! There is great demand for that route.

Aeroflot777


User currently offlineWorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 9376 times:

DL is really opening only about a half dozen new cities. Much of the JFK and ATL transatlantic flying is duplicating what is being flown out of the opposite city, only increasing DL's ground efficiencies at each of the cities. While it is certain that the frequencies will be reduced in the winter, DL will likely serve most of these routes year round.

DL also contracts out most of its ground handling in most of its cities - so they don't have to hire lots of people.

SLC probably has international potential to CDG and LGW but DL is clearly focusing on ATL and JFK where traffic naturally flies over enroute to Europe. NYC is a highly competitive market while ATL is a very solid hub; SLC int'l would be "experimental or developmental" and, despite your assessement, DL has a pretty small amount of developmenal flying in its current plan. DL has flown to Copenhagen and Budapest before.

Remember that DL's costs are now lower than many of its other peers so DL has a better chance of making these routes work than they do. Why do you think CO is having such a fit about DL's expansion but because DL is becoming a fierce competitor with lower costs instead of letting CO expand in EWR at will?


User currently offlineDAL767400ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 9182 times:

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 13):
CO tried to add service to Nigeria, which could have served as a transit point for S. Africa service but they couldn't make it work.

In all fairness to CO, that wasn't their fault but rather that of the governments of the US and Nigeria having a p*ssing match over Virgin Nigeria flying to the US.

Quoting B4real (Reply 15):
I am, however, saddened that CVG, domestically, has really been butchered pretty bad. I hope it doesn't fully go DFW.

Same here. Only connected through CVG thrice, but it was easy to get around, and not as crowded. Not that I have any issues with ATL, but CVG made for a nice change to the usual routine. At least a few international destinations (MBJ, SJD, *SJU*) are being added.

Quoting PSA727 (Reply 14):
And do you notice that none of the new US-Europe
routes involves SLC. You would think that they would at least include an
SLC-CDG route to give better connecting options for West Coast travelers,
as well as those wanting to go thoughout Europe, the Middle East, and Africa
via CDG.

The simple reason is that for now, SLC simply doesn't justify the use of a 200-seat aircraft for a daily flight to Europe, because the deman is just not there. The large cities in the West that have demand to Europe already have their nonstops to Europe, some even on AF to CDG, or it is just as easy for them to connect via ATL, CVG or JFK, which all offer more destinations in Europe than SLC ever could. The smaller markets that fit into neither category simply don't provide enough feed for now to justify a flight. Now, thing can change, like DL adding more destinations, or getting a smaller plane capable of this route *cough*73GER*cough*, but that would just be speculation.

Quoting PSA727 (Reply 14):
Let's wait and see what their 2007 timetable has in comparison to this year's.

Even more international destinations and even more non-ATL point-to-point flights.

Quoting PSA727 (Reply 14):
I bet that about a third to a half of these new routes will be discontinued by then.

How much are you willing to bet?

Quoting PSA727 (Reply 14):
I think that this bold expansion is more of an attempt
by DL to acquire more financing while in Ch 11.

Yeah, right.

Quoting PSA727 (Reply 14):
But no one seems to calculate that if everyone does that, then there will be massive overcapacity issues to deal with,

2 things:
First, not everyone has the capacity available to expand internationally, and second, not everyone is going to fly like places KBP, JNB or UIO. There's a reason why Delta is moving away from traditional destinations to more far-out places.


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32899 posts, RR: 71
Reply 19, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 9182 times:

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 18):
Quoting PSA727 (Reply 14):
I bet that about a third to a half of these new routes will be discontinued by then.

How much are you willing to bet?

Maybe not a third, but it is very safe to assume that 4-5 of them won't last long. My bets are on ATL-EDI/NCE/VCE, JFK-GRU, and maybe ATL-KIN.



a.
User currently offlineDAL767400ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 9142 times:

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 19):
Maybe not a third, but it is very safe to assume that 4-5 of them won't last long. My bets are on ATL-EDI/NCE/VCE, JFK-GRU, and maybe ATL-KIN.

That's a bet I wouldn't doubt  Wink . There will be failures, no doubt for me either, but 1/3 is just too much.


User currently offlinePanamair From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 4914 posts, RR: 25
Reply 21, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 9101 times:
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Quoting PSA727 (Reply 14):
Do they have enough in-
house staff to do this? And do you notice that none of the new US-Europe
routes involves SLC. You would think that they would at least include an
SLC-CDG route to give better connecting options for West Coast travelers,
as well as those wanting to go thoughout Europe, the Middle East, and Africa
via CDG.

As mentioned, many of these flights are to destinations they already serve (MAN, DUB, SNN, ATH, VCE, NCE). New destinations use contract companies for the most part (e.g., TXL has hardly a single DL presence on the ground; everything is handled through a contracting company. Berlin hotels even banded together to provide free hotel accomodations for DL crew during the initial service period. Also, MAA-based FAs are even hired through a third-party contracting company - they don't work directly for DL). The fact that DL is picking certain routes to start and not others (e.g., not starting ATL-IST or as you mentioned, SLC-CDG) shows that of course detailed market and traffic analysis work is being done. DL is not willy-nilly starting random international routes just for the sake of shifting capacity from domestic to international.

That being said, some of these will inevitably not be around after a year or so - most notably as mentioned before ATL-EDI and JFK-GRU. Those two will be tough. The 'big' ones such as TLV and DKR/JNB should be fine (the ATL-TLV advanced bookings are actually quite outstanding) and don't underestimate the potential popularity of a direct flight to Africa from the U.S. (without having to connect through Europe)


User currently offlineNzrich From New Zealand, joined Dec 2005, 1522 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 9070 times:

The only problem i see with Atlanta is for people living outside Nth America ..Where is ATL ??????? and why would i want to go there unless its just a stopover on the way to somewhere else .. Everyone living outside of America knows New York , LAX , SFO ,HNL and to a lesser extent Chicago but ATL I would be very surprised if anyone outside of America could show you where it is on the map let alone give you a reason to go there ...

Sorry im not knocking the place as i have no idea about it im just giving the perspective from someone outside of Nth America , if i had the choice of ATL and the cities i mentioned above i would choose one of the other cities if i had to have a stopover ..

So i would be very unlikely to fly Delta as i would be choosing a carrier that would take me to one of the more well know cities ie LAX and SFO

[Edited 2006-02-10 12:07:29]


"Pride of the pacific"
User currently offlinePanamair From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 4914 posts, RR: 25
Reply 23, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 8981 times:
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Quoting Nzrich (Reply 22):
The only problem i see with Atlanta is for people living outside Nth America ..Where is ATL ??????? and why would i want to go there unless its just a stopover on the way to somewhere else .. Everyone living outside of America knows New York , LAX , SFO ,HNL and to a lesser extent Chicago but ATL I would be very surprised if anyone outside of America could show you where it is on the map let alone give you a reason to go there ...

And foreigners accuse Americans of being ignorant about the rest of the world? Sure, ATL is nowhere near as famous as NYC, LA, SFO or Chicago, but come on, the city is only home to CNN and Coke - two of the world's most recognized brand names, not to mention the fact that ATL hosted the 1996 Summer Olympics!


User currently offlineNighthawk From UK - Scotland, joined Sep 2001, 5157 posts, RR: 33
Reply 24, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 8976 times:

Quoting Panamair (Reply 23):
And foreigners accuse Americans of being ignorant about the rest of the world? Sure, ATL is nowhere near as famous as NYC, LA, SFO or Chicago, but come on, the city is only home to CNN and Coke - two of the world's most recognized brand names, not to mention the fact that ATL hosted the 1996 Summer Olympics!

You hosted the olympics AND have a coke factory? Gee..... I know where im going on holidays  Yeah sure



That'll teach you
25 Panamair : Nobody is asking you to go to ATL on holidays...we're talking about recognition here...I know of many places in the world and where they are on the m
26 UN_B732 : JFK-KBP will have excellent performance, if they can keep bookings good with their high fares - which they should be able to do, if American contracto
27 Dstc47 : Just a reminder that DL with JFK / SNN, DUB is restoring a service that was dropped immediately post 9/11. Have DL the money to advertise all their ne
28 Post contains images Nighthawk : Your post was in response to this: So you responded by telling us that coke is based there and ATL hosted the olympics..
29 FlyDeltaJets : This already exists
30 FlyPNS1 : Because CO doesn't want DL flooding the international market with so many seats that yields plunge and nobody makes money. While CO has added a lot t
31 Nyskymasters : It will all become a mute point on March 1st.
32 Kkfla737 : The flight attendents on the CDG-MAA-CDG runs are excellent! Delta should use that contracting company across the globe!
33 Kkfla737 : I like Delta's strategy. They are playing to their strengths. Consider that American's stratgey across the Atlantic has been for years (going back to
34 Zamaria : My only question about all of this expansion is where are they getting all of the planes for this? If they are using existing planes with the routes (
35 DLPMMM : Why? Is that the day you will quit making ignorant comments and buy a dictionary?
36 Post contains images MaverickM11 : New York has the population to make these flights workable with higher yield local traffic. See above. CVG is shrinking. A lot. Domestic capacity alo
37 Post contains images DAL767400ER : Oh great, another know-it-all . Care to share your wise knowledge with use, oh knowledgable master? Yes, they are. Because some of the factors contri
38 Post contains images PanAm747 : It doesn't matter if the average person knows where Kiev is (most Americans would think it is in a country called "Chicken", probably located next to
39 Lightsaber : Thanks for the input. Information like this is why I read a.net. As others noted, its a city with a large business. I wouldn't post like that about a
40 ScottishLaddie : DL should get advertising here in Scotland if they want to make a good go of it, otherwise there is no hope. CO did LOADS of advertising before the ED
41 Zamaria : Thanks for the information. What factors are you referring to here? -Z
42 Jumbojet : The world DOES NOT revolve around New York folks. For those of you living outside the U.S.A. and for those of you living in the U.S.A. that arent awa
43 MAH4546 : This might explain why Atlanta-Ediniburgh is arguably the poorest performing of their new routes so far. Too early to tell how it will end up, but, a
44 Kkfla737 : Keep in mind JFK isn't fun for connecting or customs. My guess is that most people would rather connect in ATL despite the long walk between gates.
45 OttoPylit : LOL Beautiful. If that isn't the biggest bunch of shit I've ever heard from this guy. No wonder no one listens. Thats probably what they are doing. T
46 Post contains images MaverickM11 : Umm oooook. Doesn't change the fact that there are a lot more NYC passengers than any ohter city in the US, and a higher percentage of them are origi
47 Wjcandee : Uhhhhhh..... Doesn't anyone else think that part of the reason that DL is announcing all this service is that it wants to make a case to its pilots' u
48 Wjcandee : Gee, doesn't this unnecessary personal attack violate the posting rules? I have never understood why the moderators allow you and your pal to routine
49 Zone1 : I'm kind of surprised people think that ATL-NCE is going to fail. Of all the new routes, I would think this is one they really know what the demand is
50 SeeTheWorld : I was actually thinking this very thing. Clearly, international expansion is better for DL than domestic, but the sheer volume and speed with which t
51 OttoPylit : I don't know, but I don't see it pulled. Oh, and the attack wasn't meant to be personal, but it would be very necessary if it were, since your postin
52 WorldTraveler : While pilots should want to fly more international flights since they can accumulate their time faster, I don’t think labor is a factor in these dec
53 SeeTheWorld : True, but part of it may be a strategy that's been in place since bankruptcy, i.e. continuous announcements of international expansion. The key is no
54 DLPMMM : 1. The plan has nothing to do with the pilots and their flying preferences. 2. Delta is presently shrinking not growing. The rate of increase in inte
55 FlyPNS1 : I always know I'm right when I get this type of immature reply from you. You have no ability to counter. You have to remember that people aren't allo
56 Jetdeltamsy : You are absolutely correct. This rapid expansion is a desperate attempt to grab more revenue per mile. It may pay off, it may not.
57 Wjcandee : I should have been clearer as to what I meant by "appeals to the pilots". I didn't mean it as simply as that they would prefer to be International Dr
58 Jumbojet : Which is why you have 5 major domestic airlines with significant operations in or around the NYC area. Delta owns the South East. The NYC metropolis
59 ScottishLaddie : That's just the market they need to go for from EDI, pax who are connecting via other hubs just now.
60 LipeGIG : Neither I. JFK-GRU will be probably a bad performing route. Varig is nowadays cancelling some daily light flights and Tam loads are really low. Felip
61 BlrBird : Does anyone know why are they moving JFK-CDG-BOM to ATL-CDG-BOM?
62 Nzrich : Just one thing im not ignorant about America ..I have been in America every week from 99 to 2004 but hey lets be honest i cant be expected to know wh
63 BR942 : Spoke to some DL sales staff at EDI who were returning to LON and asked why the start-up was delayed and they said it was taking longer than expected
64 DAL767400ER : I can see two reasons for that: First, to better connect Indians living in the Southeast USA to India, and second, in the next years, the JFK-BOM mar
65 B4real : SJU was a nice surprise, however, I bet it is gone by Sept! (Again) I agree, however, DL is competing with airlines operating the 777 or 767's with a
66 Jumbojet : Makes sense with all the direct flights now available from JFK to European cities directly now, there is no need to connect in CDG
67 Panamair : JFK-CDG between DL and AF is oversaturated in high summer since AF will have 5 daily flights (as it has been having for the past few summers); it loo
68 B777ER : I am surprised DL did not apply for VIE via either ATL or JFK. No US based carrier flies into VIE. DL wants to be the biggest carrier to Europe so I t
69 Post contains images DAL767400ER : Could very well happen sooner than later. If it happens, it will likely be from ATL as well. Excellent, even less risk of landing on an AF plane to A
70 OttoPylit : And you have no ability to prove anything you say. Prove what you said about DL flooding the market and not being able to make a profit, then I will
71 GeorgiaAME : No one seems to have picked up on the fact that while DL bleeds like a stuck pig on domestic routes, the international routes have been packed to the
72 Mariner : Youy have a link for this? cheers mariner
73 LipeGIG : Also the A332 (Tam) and the 744 (JAL) both with superior First Class and Business Class Product. There are rumors that Varig will drop the daily ligh
74 JFKLGANYC : "The only problem i see with Atlanta is for people living outside Nth America ..Where is ATL ??????? and why would i want to go there unless its just
75 FlyPNS1 : FACT: DL is rapidly pulling widebodies off of the domestic routes and moving them to international. FACT: DL is adding (or trying to add) many p2p ro
76 FLYACYYZ : With the threatened and looming pilots strike, and the potential daily revenue loss (if not ultimate demise of the company), all of their plans of gra
77 NonRevKing : The widebody flights to Florida, where most of those a/c are coming from, were consistantly full. Next... B
78 Panamair : Regarding all this NYC vs. ATL back-and-forth: yes, everyone knows that NYC has a bigger O&D market than ATL; yes, everyone knows that NYC is more wel
79 FlyPNS1 : So what? Does that mean they were profitable? DL's systemwide LF in the past few years has been the highest in DL's history. Yet, we all know DL hasn
80 SESGDL : Same with just about every US airline. Point? Your little vendetta against DL was made clear a long time ago. If you're gonna attack DL then make a s
81 Nzrich : Well then isnt the answer to The airlines of America 1 . If a route is not profitable dump it 2 . If its marginal try to invest in marketing to get it
82 Post contains images Wukka : They're tremendously strong here in CVG. It's almost as though they abuse their presence, though, from an O&D standpoint. Try pricing out some bookin
83 Post contains images OttoPylit : Really? During the weekday, my old stomping grounds of JAX run 763's all day long with 2 Mad Dogs. And of course, FLL, MCO, PBI, TPA, and RSW are all
84 WorldTraveler : just one more reminder that DL is well on its way to having the lowest CASM among the legacy carriers, besting its 17% drop in CASM in the 3rd quarter
85 MAH4546 : They cut 24% of CVG's capacity this past December in one day.
86 Hardiwv : What do you mean by BIG? GRU is bigger than both TLV and JNB. Correct, JFK-GRU will be the toughest for DL, considering that NYC-GRU is linked with T
87 Panamair : I'm not talking about population or market size but rather that the TLV and JNB/DKR flights are HIGH-PROFILE, and relatively "big" within DL's intern
88 Kkfla737 : When Delta first started flying to Europe from ATL in the early 80s and Eastern flew to points in Mexico and Caribbean around the same time it was ve
89 Slider : NCE is a very seasonal and highly erratic (and sporadic) market. That codeshare with AF is a good thing, because it allows NCE traffic without having
90 FlyPNS1 : I never said DL was pulling ALL the widebodies off. So my fact still remains...DL is reducing its domestic widebody presence substantially. Proof is
91 Panamair : Actually, all the codeshares with AF to/from NCE are on DL metal. AF does not fly any transatlantic nonstops to any European destination other than C
92 73G : Not for long. Looking forward, 2 763's, 4 757's, and 2 M88's. Similar reduction in FLL going from 6 763's to 3. I don't believe he said 'all' 763's w
93 Post contains images OttoPylit : Unless you can provide some exact numbers to support your claim, your "fact" is nothing more than a speculative opinion and hardly supportive. Yes, D
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