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Where Is WN Going In The Next 5 To 10 Years?  
User currently offlineNwab787techops From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 219 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 12187 times:

Where is WN going in the next 5 to 10 years? There is no more old Usair to eat, empl pay is going up,gas is going up,and there are new airlines out there like jetblue and other that are better LCC then WN.

Soon, they will loose money and they will ask there emp to give back, then they will loose more money then they will ask for more and more and more. At that time WN will look a little like NW today. Oh, without a "NRT HUB", sorry.
They don't fly out side the us and they only have one A/C.

145 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineNateDAL From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 417 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 12164 times:

Quoting Nwab787techops (Thread starter):
Soon, they will loose money and they will ask there emp to give back, then they will loose more money then they will ask for more and more and more. At that time WN will look a little like NW today.

Not a chance in hell.



Set Love Free
User currently offlineTango-Bravo From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 3806 posts, RR: 29
Reply 2, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 12143 times:

Sounds more like the rant of a member of the "We Hate Southwest Club" than a question soliciting opinions of where Southwest is going in the next 5-10 years as implied by the title topic. End of reply.

User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12173 posts, RR: 51
Reply 3, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 12113 times:

Quoting NateDAL (Reply 1):
Quoting Nwab787techops (Thread starter):
Soon, they will loose money and they will ask there emp to give back, then they will loose more money then they will ask for more and more and more. At that time WN will look a little like NW today.

Not a chance in hell.

I agree.

In 5-10 years, we will see WN switch airplane types, from the B-737NG to the Boeing Y-1, as the launch customer, as well as operating the B-787-800/900 on international routes. WN will be the largest airline in the country, they will absorb TZ, making it their international and military charter division.

WN will be flying unrestricted from DAL, but will relocate the company HQ to PHX. US, F9, and JB will all have gone out of business, and Air Tran will be WN's major competitor in the LCC market.

With US, F9, and JB all gone, WN will expand their flights from DEN, PHX, CLT, and LGA. They will move into airports they traditionally stayed away from, like BOS and SFO.

But, having won the battle over the Wright Amandment (at a huge costs), they will still not operate from DFW, except for the TZ military charters and the international flights TZ flys from there (but not operating at the very expensive Terminal D, these flights will be from Terminal E).


User currently offlineIsitsafenow From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 4984 posts, RR: 23
Reply 4, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 12078 times:

Where is Southwest going in the next 5 to 10 years?
I would say the same way they are...headed for a powerhouse in transportation.
I read today they are to receive 32 new planes in 2006. That improves the old average from a new plane every 3 1/2 weeks to a new plane every every 11 to 12 days. You can do alot with 32 new planes....cities, routes, market share improvement. They will be a surviver...of course I said that about money rich Northwest Airlines in the mid-ninties, too.
safe  slaphappy 



If two people agree on EVERYTHING, then one isn't necessary.
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25570 posts, RR: 86
Reply 5, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 12051 times:
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Quoting Tango-Bravo (Reply 2):
the rant of a member of the "We Hate Southwest Club"

That sounds a tad paranoid. Especially in view of statements like:

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 3):
With US, F9, and JB all gone, WN will expand their flights from DEN, PHX, CLT, and LGA.

Perhaps we don't all want to be assimilated.  Smile

cheers

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineSquirrel83 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 12046 times:

Quoting Nwab787techops (Thread starter):
Where is WN going in the next 5 to 10 years? There is no more old Usair to eat, empl pay is going up,gas is going up,and there are new airlines out there like jetblue and other that are better LCC then WN.

Mexico and Canada . . . ? What are the chances?


User currently offlineNorthwestair From Poland, joined Jul 2001, 648 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 12012 times:

I think that WN is already looking at the Employee Pay, but I believe that they have no defined Pension Plan so that is a huge cost savings for WN. It also seems that their Union has a better head on their shoulders than the other unions at the Legacy Carriers. WN will most likely feel a little bit of pain if fuel starts to rise, but it seems that they did a good job up to this point. I don't see WN going to either Canada or Mexico just because of the added Cost of those flights.


I don't care who you fly just as long as you fly
User currently offlineSonOfACaptain From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1747 posts, RR: 6
Reply 8, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 12004 times:

Quoting Tango-Bravo (Reply 2):
Sounds more like the rant of a member of the "We Hate Southwest Club" than a question soliciting opinions of where Southwest is going in the next 5-10 years as implied by the title topic. End of reply.

These replies sound more like the rant of memebers of the "We Love Southwest Club" who can't even think about anything negative about WN. Like it or not, WN is going to lose money sometime, and it might be sooner than a lot of people expect.

Atleast his examples are some what legit, unlike yours.

Quoting NateDAL (Reply 1):
Not a chance in hell.

Sure, just like there was no chance the 4 of the legacy carriers would be in bankruptcy at the same time. Don't be in denial, WN will lose money sometime.

-SOAC



Non Illegitimi Carborundum
User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 997 posts, RR: 51
Reply 9, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 11980 times:

Quoting Squirrel83 (Reply 6):
Mexico and Canada . . . ? What are the chances?

Iffy... There are growth opportunities in the U.S. that could sustain WN's growth for the next 5-10 years. Remember that WN is still building MDW, rebuilding MSY, and still is growing newer cities like PHL, PIT, and DEN. WN will also continue connecting points within their system.

If anything, WN will be constrained by Boeing's manufacturing capacity in the next 5 years. WN typically maintains conservative, consistant growth around 8% per year. Early 733 will begin hitting retirement age and WN will likely replace them with 73G to keep fleet fuel consumption down. WN will also be an early Y1 adopter when the time comes.

The question of nternational flights will linger for some time. I personally wonder if WN would look at smaller fleet types to exploit more domestic opportunites before going international?

It really comes down to cost/benefit, and WN has pleanty of opportunity left before changing their biz model.

Quoting Nwab787techops (Thread starter):
gas is going up,

WN is sufficently hedged through 2009.

Meanwhile, WN has greatly reduced their non-fuel cost since 2001 via productivy boost and more efficent asset utilization.

WN has also taken steps to reduce fuel consumption: installing AVP Blended Winglets, implementing direct routings, and considering early(er) 733 replacement.

If worse comes to worse and WN will pay market rates just like everyone else. In this regard, they have a tremendous cussion to break their fall: they've been profitable while no one else hasn't with over $2 billion in cash/credit options and $11 billion in market cap. Fuel will not sink WN.

Quoting Isitsafenow (Reply 4):
I would say the same way they are...headed for a powerhouse in transportation.

 checkmark 


User currently offlineSkibum9 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1229 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 11963 times:

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 9):
WN is sufficently hedged through 2009.

Meanwhile, WN has greatly reduced their non-fuel cost since 2001 via productivy boost and more efficent asset utilization.

WN has also taken steps to reduce fuel consumption: installing AVP Blended Winglets, implementing direct routings, and considering early(er) 733 replacement.

If worse comes to worse and WN will pay market rates just like everyone else. In this regard, they have a tremendous cussion to break their fall: they've been profitable while no one else hasn't with over $2 billion in cash/credit options and $11 billion in market cap. Fuel will not sink WN.

Not everyone agrees with your optimistic opinion. The following is a recent quote from Michael Boyd....

"But the real news is Southwest. True, it reported a profit for the last quarter, but it was predicated entirely on the fuel-hedge cost advantage it currently enjoys. Take that away, and the Southwest Model - as it's currently structured, and within the current pricing environment - doesn't make money.

In fact, if Southwest was paying all-up for fuel, as is most of its competitors, it would have lost in the neighborhood of around $90 million last quarter. Worse, its all-up ASM costs would have been well over nine cents. Hardly what would be considered as low cost.

Needless to say, Southwest is well aware of this, and it's a lead-pipe cinch they're moving to fix things. So plan on some very un-Southwest changes in the months ahead. They will also almost certainly loosen up on fare increases - where they can. This was covered a couple weeks ago. (Go There)"

Source: http://www.aviationplanning.com/asrc1.htm



Tailwinds!!!
User currently offlineNateDAL From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 417 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 11963 times:

Quoting SonOfACaptain (Reply 8):

Sure, just like there was no chance the 4 of the legacy carriers would be in bankruptcy at the same time. Don't be in denial, WN will lose money sometime.

Though they haven't posted a loss since 1972, I never said they would never lose money in the future.

I do stand by my statement that there is not a chance in hell that WN will resemble the basketcase that is NW within the next 10 years.



Set Love Free
User currently offlineSteeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 9263 posts, RR: 21
Reply 12, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 11954 times:

Quoting SonOfACaptain (Reply 8):
WN will lose money sometime.

I agree. Even the strongest of companies have to take a hit every now and then. I highly doubt that they will wind up like NW or DL and in bankrupcy.

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 3):
US, F9, and JB will all have gone out of business

Don't be so sure of this either. US is expected to turn a profit this year for the first time in years. One major reason why US experienced a loss this year was because of merger costs when they merged with HP in September. Even with that, the loss was smaller than projected. They have good management now and I think they'll be around for a while.



Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
User currently offlineSSTsomeday From Canada, joined Oct 2006, 1276 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 11939 times:

Quoting Nwab787techops (Thread starter):
Where is WN going in the next 5 to 10 years?



Quoting Squirrel83 (Reply 6):
Mexico and Canada . . . ? What are the chances?

I hope Canada, and sooner than later. I'm tired of paying three times the price of WN on similar distances to fly there (i'm in L.A.). I would accept a slightly more expensive fare, covering the logistical costs of trans-border travel, but the difference in airfare these days is unjustified.

Why does Easyjet, Ryanair and others have no trouble flying the LLC model across borders with LOW airfares?



I come in peace
User currently offlineSonOfACaptain From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1747 posts, RR: 6
Reply 14, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 11939 times:

Quoting NateDAL (Reply 11):
I do stand by my statement that there is not a chance in hell that WN will resemble the basketcase that is NW within the next 10 years.

Oh, well, if that was what you were talking about, then nevermind. No way that is going to happen.

-SOAC



Non Illegitimi Carborundum
User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 997 posts, RR: 51
Reply 15, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 11939 times:

Quoting Skibum9 (Reply 10):
Take that away, and the Southwest Model - as it's currently structured, and within the current pricing environment - doesn't make money.

Very well may be true. But WN is hedged, so speculation as to how WN would fare if they weren't isn't worth a fool.

Quoting Skibum9 (Reply 10):
In fact, if Southwest was paying all-up for fuel, as is most of its competitors, it would have lost in the neighborhood of around $90 million last quarter.

WN still would have lost less than any airline of its size and still have more reserve cash than anyone else. In a nutshell, every quarter WN continues to remain profitable gives them that much more protection from a quarter they post a loss. One or two quarters of loss would be a drop in the pond considering the extent of WN's financial stability.

Mike Boyd and I are on the exact same page, it's just a matter of half-full versus half-empty. In any event, Nwab's mindless speculation is just thick-headed.


User currently offlineSsides From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 4059 posts, RR: 21
Reply 16, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 11939 times:

Quoting Tango-Bravo (Reply 2):
Sounds more like the rant of a member of the "We Hate Southwest Club" than a question soliciting opinions of where Southwest is going in the next 5-10 years as implied by the title topic. End of reply.

Right. And, anyone notice how just about all of the WN-haters here can't spell?



"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25570 posts, RR: 86
Reply 17, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 11911 times:
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Quoting Ssides (Reply 16):
And, anyone notice how just about all of the WN-haters here can't spell?

Oh, that's sweet!

"Fly Southwest for Better Spelling!"

cheers

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineSteeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 9263 posts, RR: 21
Reply 18, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 11871 times:

Quoting Ssides (Reply 16):
Right. And, anyone notice how just about all of the WN-haters here can't spell?

I wonder if this could reflect the validity, or lack thereof, of some of their posts...

Quoting Mariner (Reply 17):
Oh, that's sweet!

"Fly Southwest for Better Spelling!"

Very well stated!  bigthumbsup 



Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
User currently offlineAloha73G From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2369 posts, RR: 4
Reply 19, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 11850 times:

As far as employee pay goes, Southwest can afford to pay their employees ALOT more than anyone else because they get alot more from their employees.

Southwest has about 75 employees per aircraft
JetBlue has about 96 employees per aircraft
American has about 130 employees per aircraft

Basically, Southwest's employees 'produce' alot more than American's, so Southwest can pay their employees alot more than American before they end up in a similar financial situation. Also note that Southwest is famous for finding ways to increase employee productivity and I don't see that ending any time soon.

-Aloha!



Aloha Airlines - The Spirit Moves Us. Gone but NEVER Forgotten. Aloha, A Hui Hou!
User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16892 posts, RR: 51
Reply 20, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 11822 times:

Here's my take:

WN will be in the following Cities in the next 5-10 years.

Atlanta, Minneapolis, and NYC (EWR, LGA or JFK).



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineBoeingBus From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1597 posts, RR: 17
Reply 21, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 11811 times:

Hahaha... WN lose money... I dont think so... They are currently dominate the industry and drove the legacies to bankruptcy... it there any indications that profit will be sacrificed in any way due to increased fuel costs... all they have to do is raise tciket prices a few bucks... I flew WN from PVD to SAN for 225 bucks... and I would be just as happy paying 250.

They are not going to lose money. If anything, the industry as a whole will gain when WN has a fuel like everyone else... 2009 cant come soon enough... Sorry, but this advantage is hurting the aviation industry here in the states.



Airbus or Boeing - it's all good to me!
User currently offlineTbird From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 851 posts, RR: 19
Reply 22, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 11811 times:

Quoting Nwab787techops (Thread starter):
Where is WN going in the next 5 to 10 years? There is no more old Usair to eat, empl pay is going up,gas is going up,and there are new airlines out there like jetblue and other that are better LCC then WN.

Soon, they will loose money and they will ask there emp to give back, then they will loose more money then they will ask for more and more and more. At that time WN will look a little like NW today. Oh, without a "NRT HUB", sorry.
They don't fly out side the us and they only have one A/C.

I have one question for you.... Where are your facts? Have you read forward statements or researched anything that would even remotely backup your facts? Or are you just making up your own hypothesis on empty knowledge? I kind of think your grabbing at air.

WN has reacted time and time again to the shifting market forces that have taken place over the last few years. A stable airline industry will be godsend to WN's business plan and allow them to continue to make huge strides in maintaining a healthy profit.

Also who is to say WN has to remain what they are today? Who would have ever thought they'd ever codeshare with anyone? Well they’re doing it and it’s going very well for both airlines. So well that infact ATA has been using 752s almost every week at LGA to meet the needs of their LGA ops. If WN can bring affordable air travel to international destination like Mexico and Canada through their ATA codeshare or with their own planes then they might just go ahead and do that.

Far to often on this site there are members who predict doom and gloom when an airline decides to change its focus. It’s called business, and to stay ahead of the game you have to be prepared.


User currently offlineNwab787techops From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 219 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 11798 times:

Quoting Aloha73G (Reply 19):
Basically, Southwest's employees 'produce' alot more than American's, so Southwest can pay their employees alot more than American before they end up in a similar financial situation. Also note that Southwest is famous for finding ways to increase employee productivity and I don't see that ending any time soon.

Right,

AMR dosen't feel like finding ways to increase employee productivity.


User currently offlineLehpron From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 7028 posts, RR: 21
Reply 24, posted (8 years 9 months 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 11763 times:

Quoting Nwab787techops (Thread starter):
Where Is WN Going In The Next 5 To 10 Years?

Maybe the same place(s) they have been in the past 5-10 years?  Wink

Quoting Tango-Bravo (Reply 2):
Sounds more like the rant of a member of the "We Hate Southwest Club"

I didn't get that at all. The poster did make assumptions by sayinig:

Quoting Nwab787techops (Thread starter):
Soon, they will loose money

...and didn't ask any questions. While it may have been a rant, I do not think it was a hate thread. If you don't like his/her statements, say so, do not insist you know what the poster's intentions were without asking them.



The meaning of life is curiosity; we were put on this planet to explore opportunities.
25 Post contains links SkyHarborsHome : Know the rumor mill has been going for a while, but this article came out yesterday regarding Phoenix and WN. http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepu...
26 Post contains links SCCutler : Re: Originating post. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_troll === A post as sublimely ridiculous as the thread-starter cannot possibly be tak
27 Usairways85 : Honestly we can speculate all we want, but no one has any idea what will happen with WN or the entire aviation industry in 5-10 years. Just look back
28 Tornado82 : Yeah, right. Umm, you do realize that those hedges are decreasing incrementally from this moment onward to 2009, when they're gone, right? Southwest
29 Post contains images MtnWest1979 : And just for you, your next fare will be $25 higher, thank you.
30 Iowaman : Hahahaha, wow. There hedges aren't going down that quickly, and if I remember correctly profits keep going up. Definitely, they also has installed th
31 AltairF28 : Silly altairF28. When I saw the title of this thread I thought "WN is probably the only airline that wouldn't have at least one smart*** answering thi
32 DfwRevolution : (1) How hedged are their competitors? In terms of relative competition, WN has life by the balls for the next five years (the low end of the given ti
33 Post contains images Texan : Funny, people have been saying that for the past 30 years... Yes, it is likely that sometime in the future they will lose money. When? Not betting on
34 Cjpark : KC you can bet that should WN move its head quarters to Phoenix there will be no more Love for WN at DAL. DAL as a pax airport will finally shut down
35 Tornado82 : Not for the year, a quarterly loss for Q1 2007.
36 Floorrunner : I see the following for Southwest in the next 5-10 years. They will be using the cushion of their fuel hedges to plan for when they expire. They will
37 Iowaman : Well, the ones with the most potential and possibility are probably first for WN: CLT CVG MSP ATL (if something happens to DL/FL) NYC (if they can ge
38 QXatFAT : Where are they in 5-10 years? I would like to see them in LAN, MSP, and MKE. I dont think that they will be in the hole at all. People enjoy flying th
39 Ejmmsu : I believe MEM will be on the very short list if indeed the Wright Ammendment is abolished or relaxed to allow Tennessee. MEM-DAL would probably be the
40 Tornado82 : That's VERY far-fetched... A hop, skip, and jump from PHL, just like ABE.
41 Cloudy : These figures are a bit misleading, since American has some much larger aircraft. Also, some things that are done in-house at some companies are outs
42 EFCar98 : Good idea, as I'm a college student in the Lehigh valley, WN's presence would be much preferrable to those saab 340s I have to fly to take any plane
43 HPRamper : Can't the other airlines get hedging agreements as time goes on? I know US currently does have some hedges in place, though nowhere near as extensive
44 KALB : I find it interesting that the WN nay-sayers invariably write, as did Michael Boyd (posted above), "But the real news is Southwest. True, it reported
45 DfwRevolution : At WN's rate of $35 a barrel? No, no future trader would sell for anything in that range. Airlines can hedge at the current market rate for a long-te
46 SCCutler : See, here's what is interesting. Hedging is no magic pill, it is just a financial play, a bet on the future moves of the prices of energy. Had oil pr
47 Tornado82 : Foresight or not, they would have needed cash on hand to do so. No money, no financing, no hedges. I'd recommend a drive/Beiber bus over to Newark if
48 RedFlyer : They might absorb TZ, but I think they will keep them as a separate entity or at least retain the separate brand. WN will, in order to preserve its o
49 TxAgKuwait : 5 to 10 years isn't as far off in the future as it used to seem. Look at the last 10 yrs of Southwest and predict "more of the same", basically. If oi
50 Tornado82 : You're missing slots, unless you take ATA's. And don't worry, LGA *WILL* still have slots when the dust settles. Well of course, after changing Wrigh
51 Tbird : I still don't see LGA happening for WN, LGA is still plauged with delays that would create huge domino effect in WNs network. Anytime you have wind a
52 TxAgKuwait : Tornado You might not remember back that far, but Southwest's first expansion was to Harlingen. With 4 trips a day. Then Corpus. With 4 trips a day. T
53 Steeler83 : That would be sweet to see commercial air service out of Allegheny County Airport and see WN's birds take off over Century III Mall, but the last tim
54 SkyHarborsHome : I think this would be smart. Especially a daily NS to LAS. May require some updates to Cheyenne but could be done.
55 Tornado82 : That's the point, there's no highway infrastructure up near AGC. 51 and Lebanon Church Rd. are disaster areas on their own, they don't need commercia
56 TxAgKuwait : >>Just because some airline decides it might make more money, or have shorter taxi times by moving to the GA Airport of the Week doesn't mean they sho
57 Ejmmsu : Did you completely disregard the very well thought out, simple, and very true description of the dynamics of Atlanta? I believe Atlanta needs a secon
58 KingGeo3 : Can you imagine the traffic tie ups at the intersection at AGC and Lebanon Chruch Rd. if a scheduled carrier with only a few flights were to start se
59 HPRamper : So does Philly...I've heard Willow Grove thrown around. Cities, metro areas often grow to a certain point where one airport simply won't cut it. It's
60 RedFlyer : Of course not. It makes perfect economic sense to continue to endure the delays waiting behind a line of 20 aircraft.
61 Boeing7E7 : These are laughable: Sorry, but not even in 2020 are these markets going to be large enough.
62 Texan : MEM service will start within 9 months of Wright being repealed. Tennessee's House and Senate delegations are hammering hard to have Wright repealed,
63 Iowaman : Believe it or not for last year, LAS and PHL (no surprise there) ranked worse for on-time departures than LGA.
64 Tornado82 : If even just Airtran's minor operation moved over to AGC the traffic would go nuts, just as it is in that whole area between Thanksgiving and Christm
65 OPNLguy : That's per barrel, not per gallon...
66 Post contains images AirWillie6475 : I know for sure that WN is planning some big growth up through 2010. Hiring about 500 pilots a year every year and receiving large orders of the 737.
67 Post contains images Texan : Wow...big whoops on putting gallon down. Sorry, y'all Texan
68 Post contains images OPNLguy : I'm sure some of our competitors wished we had committed to $35 a gallon Jet-A...
69 United787 : No one answered this question. Maybe it has to do with the EU. I would think WN could add Montreal or Toronto to their route map without having to ch
70 Cslusarc : The only airports I see WN flying to are something like YXX or YHM (if they get new passenger terminals equipt with US PFI stations).
71 DALNeighbor : That is what I'm hearing as well. I was thinking they would definitely add DAL-BNA, but opening MEM against a NW hub is a much bigger commitment. Do
72 Ejmmsu : MEM is very well served at very high fares. The O&D at MEM is very small for a city of its size. It has a lot of untapped potential due to fares. Fli
73 Post contains images StevenUhl777 : They will be merged into CAL and UA. HunUtazo dude
74 TVNWZ : I will take a little more big picture view of WN in the next 5 or 10 years: The company is very well managed. It will stay that way. Fuel hedging, CAS
75 Post contains links LoneStarMike : Last month, there was a good article (lengthy) about Gary Kelly and Southwest and what their general plans were for the next 5 years.January 23, 2006S
76 Texan : DAL-BNA will also be added, but part of the deal with the Tennessee delegation is to initiate service to MEM. If you look at the markets WN has been
77 N702ML : All of this speculation about where WN will expand in the next few years...everywhere from Atlanta to Wilkes-Barre to Cheyenne to Mexico....and that's
78 OPNLguy : Not anytime soon. Kelly said "nyet" to this rumor on Jan. 9th... Not in the near future, IMHO. Maybe in 10 years or so? If they happen, they'll proba
79 Steeler83 : Yeah, I thought about that later after I made that post. Lebanon Church would become a huge "parking lot" if commercial service were to start. PIT re
80 Rottamo : I think that Ryanair in a good example of that. Their CASM is very low and they fly low density routes. It is even lower than WN's CASM. Illustration
81 Simpilicity : Surely they will look at another aircraft type like Jetblue, but perhaps not a smaller aircraft but a larger one such as 787 which they could operate
82 Planemaker : One thing that hasn't been mentioned in this thread is that in 2016 the airline landscape in which WN will operate WILL be quite different. For exampl
83 Simpilicity : Presume the carriers who need it won't get it & those that don't need it will be offered it & turn it down.
84 Boeing7E7 : This is key. While not the prefered mode today, there are more cost effective short haul solutions (Rail/Maglev) between closely spaced (inside 300 m
85 Post contains images Mariner : That's funny, Steven. That's my favorite post in this whole thread. cheers mariner
86 Post contains images StevenUhl777 : Well I'm glad to see at least one person enjoyed the humour in that! I was beginning to think no one knew what I was talking about, or that anything
87 FlyDreamliner : WN has an awesome business model. Will they expand outside their all B737 fleet? I dunno. I foresee them giving assigned seats, like every other airli
88 Tornado82 : They could always get that 73G-ER.
89 Post contains links LoneStarMike : Quoting N702ML (Reply 77):does WN make that much money from a plane that flies MAF-DAL-HOU-CRP-HOU-DAL-AMA-DAL-HOU all day when that plane can be flyi
90 Tornado82 : Seems comparable to this to me, per mile wise... Let's not forget that all the WN routes already have (at least) AA competition on them... while the
91 QXatFAT : I find that an awesome idea. I really think that WN would do good here at FAT. Would not be good for QX though. I can see QX loosing pax because of W
92 SSTsomeday : Quoting SSTsomeday (Reply 13):Why does Easyjet, Ryanair and others have no trouble flying the LLC model across borders with LOW airfares? I'm guessing
93 Iowaman : WN has no reason to get another aircraft type anytime soon. They have more places they could fly to than planes. Same with WN going to Canada or Mexic
94 Steeler83 : I wonder which market they'll go to next...
95 Post contains links Jerion : Phoenix May Make Bid for Southwest HQ http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/060227/southwest_headquarters.html?.v=4
96 Post contains links Tornado82 : Southwest: PHX Lobbying For Headquarters (by DfwRevolution Feb 25 2006 in Civil Aviation) Old news.
97 TxAgKuwait : >>These are laughable: Quoting TxAgKuwait (Reply 49): Cheyenne, WY Quoting TxAgKuwait (Reply 49): Sioux Falls SD Quoting TxAgKuwait (Reply 49): Fargo
98 Post contains images PlanesNTrains : You have to ask yourself: Why in the hell would an ultra-conservative get on a plane called HOOTERS??? That's an interesting airport idea that I have
99 Tornado82 : They're cheap, obviously, lol.
100 Post contains links and images Boeing7E7 : They're going to Phoenix people.... http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/060227/southwest_headquarters.html?.v=4[Edited 2006-02-28 18:51:19]
101 Atrude777 : Interesting, if SWA does move HQ to PHX, will they still push for the W.A to be opened? Alex
102 Boeing7E7 : This is called playing one city off of another for corporate gain.
103 TxAgKuwait : >>This is called playing one city off of another for corporate gain.
104 Post contains images Atrude777 : So everyone grab a pop and pocorn and watch the battle fight begin! I ll put in 3 chips Alex
105 ScottB : One thing which a lot of folks seem to ignore is the fact that labor groups at Southwest's competitors aren't going to be terribly happy with concessi
106 Steeler83 : Cheap, AND a whole lot of fun... That should be the official airline of Glen Quagmire... "giggety"
107 Steeler83 : Don't mind if I do.
108 Tornado82 : They will be unable to add to them... nobody in their right mind is going to write more < $30 fuel hedges to SWA in today's market. If they do, I wou
109 ScottB : Never say never. I don't anticipate crude prices going down significantly either (which is why I assume no more low-priced hedges), but if you had as
110 Tornado82 : That's why it's a gamble, but even if they buy those $50/bbl hedges they'll still have to significantly raise fares to make up for the fuel cost diff
111 ScottB : Which is exactly why they have been raising fares gradually, a dollar or two at a time. But even without the hedges, Southwest would have been at or
112 DIA : 'Sane method of reasoning'? Oh, boy... Watchout, we have a rocket scientist among us... Honestly, you are not the one with the future answers we can
113 Post contains images ExFATboy : An deep and abiding love of owls, obviously...
114 Cjpark : Who knows maybe the City will grow some cajones and tell WN if you leave you lose your airport. Your choice. Choose wisely.
115 TxAgKuwait : >>Who knows maybe the City will grow some cajones and tell WN if you leave you lose your airport. Your choice. Choose wisely.
116 Legacytravel : Any chance of Southwest entering the MKE market? Or is it too close to MDW. Mark in MKE
117 Wnsocal : I think WN opens LGA ....... this year. I know it's a long shot but how knows. This would free up the ATA aircraft to add more Hawaii or Mexico routes
118 Tornado82 : 2 independent cities. No different than PHL/BWI.
119 Steeler83 : Suppose they'll offer PIT service if they'd do that, or would they be unwilling to compete with YX? MCI or STL would probably be sure things if WN go
120 HPRamper : I think part of that question was whether or not MKE was too close to MDW for flights between the two. I personally don't see WN service to MKE in th
121 RedFlyer : Not sure the delays are any better (less) at EWR than LGA. I've flown into both many times over many years and I really can't say one is better than
122 Tornado82 : Only an 8.27 mile and 4 minute difference in PHL-BWI and MDW-MKE. MDW-MKE: Total Est. Time: 1 hour, 48 minutes Total Est. Distance: 94.80 miles PHL-B
123 HPRamper : All about density. Those are incredibly densely populated areas. WN does serve some pairs that are even closer than the ones you mentioned, such as th
124 Steeler83 : I am not sure of any foreign carriers being interested in a codeshare with WN or vise versa. It's still a possibility in the next 5 years or so, I'd
125 Tornado82 : A failing experiment at that. Without MASSIVE infrastructure improvements, they couldn't do much at HEF. Something tells me the NIMBY's wouldn't be t
126 Post contains images HPRamper : WN can handle 5700 feet I dunno, I just decided to throw that out there. Being random.
127 N200WN : Up until recently I was convinced that Southwest would add LGA within the next year or so. Now that ATA has added LGA-HOU I think that WN is content t
128 Wnsocal : You may be correct but my thinking is that ATA had to use the slots when they dropped LGA-IND. If they didn't use them they would have lost them. It
129 Tjwgrr : GRR, MSP & other cities will be even a bigger blip on SWA's radar screen if NWA files Chapter 7 or NWA reduces system capacity enormously.
130 JFKLGANYC : LGA JFK EWR HAHAHA in that order!!
131 Steeler83 : What would be some likely destinations served out of LGA? MDW, LAS, HOU, BUF???
132 Isitsafenow : Herb isn't going to LGA. He stated that a few years back. Southwest has the famous 20 minute turnarounds. Delays on the runway or taxiway at LGA will
133 Tornado82 : Herb's 20 minute turnarounds got shot when they went to PHL. If they take the long lines there, it's not much worse at LGA. ABE is too close to PHL,
134 Isitsafenow : I forgot about White Plains...You may be on to something there, T-82. safe
135 Tornado82 : The biggest negative at HPN is that FL beat them to the punch.
136 Planemaker : It seems that most people on this thread are projecting today's conditions into the future... and I truly think that things will get better looking o
137 Tornado82 : You won't have much consolidation at LGA though... everybody will still want to fly there from every single speck on the map. For any airline that fo
138 Iowaman : Hmmmm, what other city does that sound like that they recently started service to? That's the problem, getting gates. They might be able to get 3 at
139 Tornado82 : Who said scared? Not me. HPN doesn't really have the room to spare though, and FL jumped on the DH vacancy quickly. However, if WN isn't at least a l
140 Planemaker : Like Southwest, perhaps?
141 Iowaman : FL flying to ATL and Florida from HPN is a lot different than going into ATL against FL's largest hub as well as DL. WN keeps expanding at MDW, and w
142 Tornado82 : Perhaps. Although I'd look for US to fight tooth and nail to strengthen their position there, and Comair to throw some cast-off RJ's from CVG as well
143 N200WN : Give it time. It won't be long before Southwest is using those gates to at or near capacity. They didn't spend all that money just to block FL. I don
144 Tornado82 : Have to... US and the others add 45 extra minutes of ground time there too. Not doing it would be scheduling suicide.
145 Post contains images Boeingfanyyz : The only direction I see them giong is up! By the way, does WN get paid for doing the "Airline!" segments? Cheers, Boeingfanyyz
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