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Transatlantic Airship Services  
User currently offlineIsuA380B777 From New Zealand, joined May 2005, 169 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 3012 times:

Hi All

I was doing a research about the trans atlantic airship services during 1920's and 1930's. Does any one know what air lines operate these aviation services? And what were the popular routes?
Thanks in advance

23 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineNorthStarDC4M From Canada, joined Apr 2000, 3075 posts, RR: 36
Reply 1, posted (8 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 2988 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
CHAT OPERATOR

Deutsch LuftHansa/Zeppelin: Frankfurt-Lakehurst NJ, Frankfurt-Sao Paulo
those are the only 2 airship routes that were operated on a scheduled basis trans-atlantic. Only operated a very few years before... well... look up Hindenburg.

No other company operated commerical airship services on a long distance service.



Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
User currently offlineIsuA380B777 From New Zealand, joined May 2005, 169 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (8 years 9 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 2845 times:

Quoting NorthStarDC4M (Reply 1):

Thanks for the info. Any idea about the inflight services?

Thanks


User currently offlineTargowski From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 127 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (8 years 9 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 2834 times:

if its lufthansa then definately no PTVs or AVOD.

User currently offlineStirling From Italy, joined Jun 2004, 3943 posts, RR: 21
Reply 4, posted (8 years 9 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 2828 times:

Quoting IsuA380B777 (Reply 2):
Any idea about the inflight services?

Exquisite.



Delete this User
User currently offlineOlympus69 From Canada, joined Jun 2002, 1737 posts, RR: 7
Reply 5, posted (8 years 9 months 3 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 2787 times:

Quoting IsuA380B777 (Reply 2):
Any idea about the inflight services?

More like an ocean liner than an aircraft - Staterooms, Restaurant, Promenade deck, Smoking room, Bar, Lounge with piano, Showers. This was on the ill-fated Hindenburg which accomodated 50 pasengers.


User currently offlineIsuA380B777 From New Zealand, joined May 2005, 169 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (8 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 2724 times:

Quoting Olympus69 (Reply 5):
More like an ocean liner than an aircraft - Staterooms, Restaurant, Promenade deck, Smoking room, Bar, Lounge with piano, Showers. This was on the ill-fated Hindenburg which accomodated 50 pasengers.

Not bad for a transatlantic air ship for that time.

Quoting Targowski (Reply 3):
if its lufthansa then definately no PTVs or AVOD.

Atleast personal gramerphones or turn tables? lolz.. But they had a piano lounge so I recon it is fine.

Any idea about the fares?


User currently offlineGemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5815 posts, RR: 6
Reply 7, posted (8 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 2688 times:

From the August 1939 Thomas Cook Timetable:

"Zeppelin" Airships
South America:
Frankfort OR Friedrichshafen Dep Wednesday Evening
Pernambuco/Recife Arr Saturday Evening
Rio de Janerio Arr Sunday Evening
Connection by aircraft of Syndicato Condor Ltda from Pernambuco:
Buenors Aries Arr Tuesday
Buenos Aries Dep Tuesday for Pernambuco
Rio Dep Wednesday Evening
Pernambuco/Recife Dep Thursday Evening
Frankfort Arr Monday Evening

North America (Lakehurst)
Suspended until further notice

Gemuser



DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
User currently offlineCOSPN From Northern Mariana Islands, joined Oct 2001, 1652 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (8 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 2682 times:

Skycat comming soon....

Now they have material that can hold its shape (Football Rugbyball)
and be filled with Helium..computer controled land like a hovercraft on the ground without a hundred man ground crew...like Lakehurst..

< http://www.worldskycat.com >


User currently offlineTraveler_7 From Estonia, joined May 2000, 540 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (8 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 2676 times:

Quoting NorthStarDC4M (Reply 1):
No other company operated commerical airship services on a long distance service.

Was there any short distance service?


User currently offlineNorthStarDC4M From Canada, joined Apr 2000, 3075 posts, RR: 36
Reply 10, posted (8 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 2600 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
CHAT OPERATOR

Quoting Traveler_7 (Reply 9):
Was there any short distance service?

There were a few sightseeing operations with rigid airships. The original Zeppelin service comes to mind, back in the 1890s, also there was a french company that flew a couple around france in the 1920s, don't recall the name.



Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
User currently offlineSmokescreen From Canada, joined Jul 2005, 230 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (8 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 2528 times:

Quoting Olympus69 (Reply 5):
More like an ocean liner than an aircraft - Staterooms, Restaurant, Promenade deck, Smoking room, Bar, Lounge with piano, Showers. This was on the ill-fated Hindenburg which accomodated 50 pasengers.

Smoking room!!!! I guess they regretted including that...


User currently offlineTraveler_7 From Estonia, joined May 2000, 540 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (8 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 2513 times:

Quoting Olympus69 (Reply 5):
Smoking room

Are you sure about that?

I remember, some documentary on "Discovery" where one survival said that even a tank-toy which was producing some sort of sparks was confiscated, not to mention lighters and match boxes.


User currently offlineLAXPAX From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 82 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (8 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 2513 times:

Quoting Smokescreen (Reply 11):
Smoking room!!!! I guess they regretted including that...

The designers and line operators knew that it was insanity, but they had to accede to customer demands! As a result, they placed the smoking room behind two sets of doors, and matches and lighters were prohibited. All "lights" were provided by a steward equipped with a non-sparking heating element, IIRC.

One of the reasons the Hindenburg was so huge was that it was designed to be a helium airship. But the USA placed a helium embargo against Germany during the period of prewar tensions; thus, Hindenburg was filled with hydrogen.

BTW, I thought the operator was called the German Zeppelin Transport Co, not specifically Luft Hansa. Can someone clear up the distinction?



"Remember, no matter where you go... there you are." -- Buckaroo Banzai
User currently offlineNorthStarDC4M From Canada, joined Apr 2000, 3075 posts, RR: 36
Reply 14, posted (8 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 2508 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
CHAT OPERATOR

Quoting Smokescreen (Reply 11):
Smoking room!!!! I guess they regretted including that...

i dont see why... it had nothing to do with the Hindenburg, which depending on whos account you want to believe was started by one of the following: Static discharge from the mooring lines, sabotage or a fire in one of the aft engine pods.

The smoking room was actually very well designed on the Hindenburg, and was completly isolated from the gas bags. In fact many of the contents of the smoking room survived the fire of the Hindenburg.

No the smoking room was a design feature that worked on the Hindenburg, unlike the skin stiffner (would later be used as solid rocket fuel), gas type (she was designed for helium, not the highly flamable hydrogen she had to use) and lack of some common things today like insulted structures and failsafes.



Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
User currently offlineSmokescreen From Canada, joined Jul 2005, 230 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (8 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 2486 times:

Quoting NorthStarDC4M (Reply 14):
Quoting Smokescreen (Reply 11):
Smoking room!!!! I guess they regretted including that...


i dont see why... it had nothing to do with the Hindenburg, which depending on whos account you want to believe was started by one of the following: Static discharge from the mooring lines, sabotage or a fire in one of the aft engine pods.

Okay, okay - I was just kidding! You have to admit it's counter-intuitive to have a smoking room in a big tube full of hydrogen, and with the benefit of hindsight kind of funny in a morbid way (with all due respect to those who lost their lives)...


User currently offlineChase From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 1054 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (8 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 2450 times:

Quoting COSPN (Reply 8):
Skycat comming soon

Is this the same company that was planning to do tourist flights around the Bodensee (Lake Constance) 3 or 4 years ago?

Their website could use some updating:
"scheduled to make its maiden flight in 3rd-qtr 2002"
"we plan to take this historic new air vehicle on a grand World Tour in mid-2005"

Otherwise, looks darn cool and I want one!


User currently offlineOlympus69 From Canada, joined Jun 2002, 1737 posts, RR: 7
Reply 17, posted (8 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 2390 times:

Quoting Smokescreen (Reply 15):
Okay, okay - I was just kidding! You have to admit it's counter-intuitive to have a smoking room in a big tube full of hydrogen

Considering that today some people have a hard time going only a few hours without smoking, and that the Hindenburg's average flight time to the USA was 65 hours, it is hardly surprising that they preferred to create a safe smoking environment rather than having passengers sneaking into the toilets for a smoke.


User currently offlineAntskip From Australia, joined Jan 2006, 936 posts, RR: 6
Reply 18, posted (8 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 2345 times:

Quoting Olympus69 (Reply 5):
More like an ocean liner than an aircraft

The Hindenburg was, during its successful year of operation from May 1936 to May 1937, the equivalent of the Concorde (when it was in service): very expensive for its small number of passengers, but so much faster than any alternative method - the ocean liner. Places on the Hindenburg were much prized.

Quoting LAXPAX (Reply 13):
German Zeppelin Transport Co

The various Zeppelins, built by Luftschiffbau Zeppelin, flew from 1909 for Deutsche Luftschiffahrts-AG (DELAG). The much later Hindenburg flew for DZR (Deutsche Zeppelin-Reederei GmbH), set up in 1935 jointly by Luftschiffbau Zeppelin, the German Air Ministry and Deutsche Lufthansa. http://www.crwflags.com/fotw/flags/de$dzr.html.
It has swastikas on each side of both top and bottom tail fins. DZR went bung in 1937 with the destruction of the Hindeburg but started up again in 2001. There is a fine book written from very close-up by the American Harold Dick :"The Golden Age of the Great Passenger Airships: Graf Zeppelin and Hindenburg". (Smithsonian Institution Press, 1986). He flew on most of the Hindenburg's flights, except, by chance, the last.

My late mother snapped this photo of the Hindenburg probably on a test flight on May 4th 1936 in the area of Lake Constance, Switzerland, two days before its maiden flight to Lakehurst, New Jersey. The Hindenburg was out testing its design changes made since its return flight to Rio a month before.


[Edited 2006-03-07 09:54:20]

User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21582 posts, RR: 59
Reply 19, posted (8 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 2332 times:

I stayed at the Hotel Graf Zeppelin in Stuttgart. Nice little hotel.


Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineFlying-Tiger From Germany, joined Aug 1999, 4166 posts, RR: 36
Reply 20, posted (8 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 2311 times:

IMO it could be time for a renaissance of the Zeppelin. Certainly not for scheduled air services as we know it, but more along the lines of what Cunard is doing with the "Queens", a pseudo-scheduled service in a cruise atmosphere.

I think it could be possible to revive the design, but use modern technology i.e. make the spars out of CFK, have the hull done with modern textiles etc to reduce weight, new engines etc. The cabin design is along the lines of the 20/30ties, albeit with modern technology behind it.

What you are basically going to offer is some kind of "luxury cruise through the air", probably combining it with a "real cruise" onboard one of the queens. I.E. from Germany via UK to New York with the Zeppelin, and back with the Queen and vice versa.

During the slow winter period you take the Zeppelin on dedicated cruises, i.e. "Wild Amazonas", the "Great African Plains" etc - all in style of the 20/30ties but with modern comfort.

Now, who is going to give me a couple of large-scale $$$ to try it out??



Flown: A319/320/321,A332/3,A380,AT4,AT7,B732/3/4/5/7/8,B742/4,B762/763,B772,CR2,CR7,ER4,E70,E75,F50/70,M11,L15,S20
User currently offlineTraveler_7 From Estonia, joined May 2000, 540 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (8 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 2261 times:

Quoting Flying-Tiger (Reply 20):
MO it could be time for a renaissance of the Zeppelin.

Do you mean something like this

http://www.aerosml.com/Aeroscraft%20Info.asp

?


User currently offlineLAXPAX From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 82 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (8 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2185 times:

Quoting Antskip (Reply 18):
The various Zeppelins, built by Luftschiffbau Zeppelin, flew from 1909 for Deutsche Luftschiffahrts-AG (DELAG). The much later Hindenburg flew for DZR (Deutsche Zeppelin-Reederei GmbH), set up in 1935 jointly by Luftschiffbau Zeppelin, the German Air Ministry and Deutsche Lufthansa.

Thank you, Antskip. I am envious of anybody who ever witnessed one of these incredible airships.

I work in a building adjacent to LAX. My colleague told me that his grandfather once came here (when the airport was called Mines Field) to see the airship Los Angeles (LZ-126).

My number one aviation (and time travel) fantasy would be to take part in the Graf Zeppelin's first and only round-the-world cruise in 1929.



"Remember, no matter where you go... there you are." -- Buckaroo Banzai
User currently offlineRayChuang From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 8036 posts, RR: 5
Reply 23, posted (8 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 2094 times:

Quoting Flying-Tiger (Reply 20):
IMO it could be time for a renaissance of the Zeppelin. Certainly not for scheduled air services as we know it, but more along the lines of what Cunard is doing with the "Queens", a pseudo-scheduled service in a cruise atmosphere.

It's not as far-fetched as it seems if you read this article:

http://www.popsci.com/popsci/whatsne...39010vgnvcm1000004eecbccdrcrd.html

The reason is simple: with 2006 technology, today's airships can carry several hundred passengers, cruise in the 140-220 km/h speed range, be very safe to fly and could be very useful for things like Caribbean cruises and Mediterranean cruises.  Smile


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