Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
F Class Demand LH On The Rise, Are Others As Well?  
User currently offlineIntothinair From Germany, joined Mar 2005, 392 posts, RR: 2
Posted (8 years 7 months 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 3787 times:

After reading a very interesting article on "Manager" a german magazine about First class, I read some interesting facts. whilst in the 1993s, 11% of all passengers still flew F class, in 1998, about 5% today it is only about 2.5%. However Jan-Jun 2005 compared to 2004, LH showed a 20% increase in F class bookings, and on top of that their next 7 A346 will be equipped with F class again, so they're F class demand seems to be rising again finally. Are other carriers experiencing this too, I know virtually all airlines have cut back on F class seats over the last 10 years, or have completely gotten rid of it, and still are, eg. Air New Zeland, Royal Brunei, so are we seeing a rise in F class demand again for some airlines? or is this just LH? what about other premium carriers, BA, AF, SQ, CX etc.? does anyone have any facts about other airlines, specific numbers? any information would be greatly appreciated.

cheers, Konstantin G.

16 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineLp0815 From Singapore, joined Oct 2005, 219 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (8 years 7 months 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 3751 times:

Could be just a shift of current F-class customers away from other airlines such as AF, BA to LH maybe because of their new F-Class Terminal in FRA.

On the other hand: I understand that LH is a bout to revamp their F-Class and will bring it out with the A-380.
So, will they receive their A 346 after receiving the 380, thus by this also sporting the new F-Class?



Time waits for nobody
User currently onlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 31063 posts, RR: 87
Reply 2, posted (8 years 7 months 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 3551 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

I have heard a number of complaints from those who have flown it concerning how uncomfortable LH's new Business Class seats are to sleep in, so perhaps more folks are choosing First Class (where offered) to get a good night's sleep?

User currently offlineOHLHD From Finland, joined Dec 2004, 3962 posts, RR: 25
Reply 3, posted (8 years 7 months 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 3524 times:

A rise in demand should be closely monitored with the rise of yield!

If a airline offers their First Class Seat at a cheaper fare than 3 years ago, which also comes close to a price of a Business Class seat, it is simply a PR-Number .


User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21534 posts, RR: 59
Reply 4, posted (8 years 7 months 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 3511 times:

Quoting Stitch (Reply 2):
I have heard a number of complaints from those who have flown it concerning how uncomfortable LH's new Business Class seats are to sleep in, so perhaps more folks are choosing First Class (where offered) to get a good night's sleep?

So that's the real strategy behind skybed/spacebed sloped flat garbage? make it so uncomfortable that those with the funds who were 'slumming it' will break down and return to F?

Nobody can ever convince me that a sloped flat bed is more desirable than a true cradle seat (which sinks the butt as it raises the legs to).



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineIntothinair From Germany, joined Mar 2005, 392 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (8 years 7 months 19 hours ago) and read 3373 times:

does anyone have any facts to say that F class demand is rising or still falling?
any answers would be greatly appreciated

cheers, Konstantin G.


User currently offlineLp0815 From Singapore, joined Oct 2005, 219 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (8 years 7 months 19 hours ago) and read 3343 times:

Difficult to get that sort of data as generally IATA would be probably the only institution to have this sort of comparison.
Working for an airline myself, I can tell you about my airline and yes, demand has been rising over the past months, even for the second year straight.

In what way also other airlines see this rise: no idea, sorry.



Time waits for nobody
User currently offlineQantas744ER From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1286 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (8 years 7 months 18 hours ago) and read 3316 times:

Hey, during christmas I was going to New York and Aspen with my dad, with LH from MUC to FRA to DEN to ASE and then on the way back ASE-DEN-LGA-JFK-MUC on the way to the US we had a 4 hours stop over in FRA for our flight to DEN, my father fly`s launghaul every second day for Business, so last year in November he finally got his HON card from LH, giving him acces to the F terminal in FRA. On Our flight to DEN on a A 340-600 there was no F.
But on the flight back from JFK to MUC we sat in F and im telling you it was packed! The Plane was a A330-300 D-AIKC and C wasnt even full! For these next few months the flight to DEN will be operated by a 744 again showing demand for more F on this route.

Cheers Leo



Happiness is V1 in Lagos
User currently offlineIntothinair From Germany, joined Mar 2005, 392 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (8 years 7 months 18 hours ago) and read 3276 times:

Quoting Lp0815 (Reply 6):
Working for an airline myself, I can tell you about my airline and yes, demand has been rising over the past months, even for the second year straight.

Are you reffering to SQ here, or is this classified  Wink

Quoting Qantas744ER (Reply 7):
The Plane was a A330-300 D-AIKC and C wasnt even full! For these next few months the flight to DEN will be operated by a 744 again showing demand for more F on this route.

WOW, we are getting some positive feedback on F class demand here
Any further information would be appreciated

cheers, Konstantin G.


User currently offlineANstar From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2003, 5252 posts, RR: 6
Reply 9, posted (8 years 7 months 17 hours ago) and read 3270 times:

Quoting Intothinair (Reply 5):
does anyone have any facts to say that F class demand is rising or still falling?
any answers would be greatly appreciated

cheers, Konstantin G.

Qantas have also recently reconfigured 2 of their 2 class 747's back into a 3 Class configuration. So I guess thats a small increase in F seats for them also.


User currently offlineLp0815 From Singapore, joined Oct 2005, 219 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (8 years 7 months 16 hours ago) and read 3194 times:

Quoting Intothinair (Reply 8):
Are you reffering to SQ here, or is this classified

not classified: LH



Time waits for nobody
User currently offlineQantas744ER From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1286 posts, RR: 4
Reply 11, posted (8 years 7 months 13 hours ago) and read 3097 times:

I have noticed that many people flying LH in C are pretty pissed off with the Rockwell Collins AVOD same goes for me, since they introduced it, its not fully operational yet, and the 4th patch for the programm is out, and i hope LH will be able to fix their problems, because often the Seats in C dont even work properly, , and 2 weeks ago my dad came from NRT to MUC, the flight was delayed due to a problem with the F and C electronic commands on the plane, the plane was a A340-300.

Cheers leo



Happiness is V1 in Lagos
User currently offlineKnoxibus From France, joined Aug 2007, 260 posts, RR: 23
Reply 12, posted (8 years 7 months 13 hours ago) and read 3081 times:

Just did a return CDG-LAX last week on AFR 777-200ER.

Was upgraded to F on the inbound and we were 5 in a 12 seats zone (note: 2 flights this day, I took the first one).

Hoped to get upgraded on the outbound thanks to my FF status, but even the F class was packed, I would say 11 seats out of 12 were taken. That was on a Thursday!



No matter what anybody tells you, words and ideas can change the world.
User currently offlineAerosol From Germany, joined Oct 2000, 558 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (8 years 7 months 13 hours ago) and read 3081 times:

The problem with First is that hardly anybody pays full price. People do not pay cash and use their miles instead.

User currently offlineCptGermany From Germany, joined Feb 2006, 86 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (8 years 7 months 13 hours ago) and read 3040 times:

Quoting Stitch (Reply 2):
I have heard a number of complaints from those who have flown it concerning how uncomfortable LH's new Business Class seats are to sleep in, so perhaps more folks are choosing First Class (where offered) to get a good night's sleep?

First, the new C class seats are substantially more comfortable than the old C seats. I fly LH C class twice a years between FRA and ATL on A343, and I usually have a good experience. The Rockwell-Collins AVOD system does require some improvements however.

Second, I highly doubt that there is a substantial amount of people who actually buy F instead of C now due to uncomfortable C seats. The price difference between the two classes is substantial.

I have flown F class on LH 744 once two years ago from FRA to MIA and I was impressed by the quality of the food. It is like a gourmet restaurent in the sky. However, the amount of food I thought was inferior to C class...truly gourmet like. I also enjoyed the window in the lavatories.

Finally, is LH the only carrier who has F class on the upper deck of their 744s instead of the nose section like most carriers.


User currently offlineFbgdavidson From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2004, 3712 posts, RR: 28
Reply 15, posted (8 years 7 months 12 hours ago) and read 2984 times:

I think LH are doing well in First because they have genuinely invested a fair amount of cash into the product. Well the FCT anyway  Wink

Quoting Aerosol (Reply 13):
The problem with First is that hardly anybody pays full price. People do not pay cash and use their miles instead.

I think demand is probably dropping on some respects on BA. They often have a promo whereby you pay full J and get a one way upgrade to First.

My last few flights on BA, First has been 14/14, 14/14, 0/14, 0/14, 9/14. Having said that one occassion OLCI showed the F cabin to have five seats empty but then at pushback it was full.

Quoting Qantas744ER (Reply 7):
my father fly`s launghaul every second day for Business

That is unfortunate.



"My first job was selling doors, door to door, that's a tough job innit" - Bill Bailey
User currently offlineIntothinair From Germany, joined Mar 2005, 392 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (8 years 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2863 times:

thanks for all the feedback....any more info would be great!

cheers, Konstantin G.


Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
UK-UAE Traffic On The Rise Again In September posted Wed Oct 14 2009 07:40:34 by Gkirk
Airline Stocks On The Rise! posted Tue Jul 22 2008 15:17:45 by UAL727NE
6/19: UA Stock Up 24%, Most Others As Well posted Thu Jun 19 2008 14:30:08 by Boston92
Small Airports On The Rise posted Sun Jun 11 2006 09:07:30 by QXatFAT
PIT Traffic On The Rise posted Thu Jun 1 2006 23:29:31 by Steeler83
Sun Country On The Rise posted Wed Aug 24 2005 02:51:52 by KarlB737
Where Will Economy Class Be Located On The A380? posted Wed Dec 8 2004 14:27:35 by John
Hubs On The Rise posted Fri May 30 2003 23:06:18 by Doug
Is ROC Finally On The Rise? posted Sat Feb 24 2001 22:15:27 by Ericmetallica
AA738 On The Rise In Miami posted Sun Dec 10 2000 04:36:19 by Doug