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AA DC-10 To Hawaii Breaks Down Twice  
User currently offlineZartan From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 2987 times:

Here's a link to a cnn article about AA DC-10 service to Hawaii.. The same group of passengers has been returned on two consecutive flights because of engine problems on their DC-10s. Man, if I were those passengers, I'd demand a 777 next time...

http://www.cnn.com/2000/US/08/02/troubled.flight.ap/index.html

24 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineIlyushin96M From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 2609 posts, RR: 12
Reply 1, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 2842 times:

Seems more and more engine problems for DC-10s as of late. Any idea on which type it was? DC-10-10, -30, -40 or - ? I guess it really is time for the DC-10 to be retired. Too many mechanical difficulties.

User currently offlineAmerican 767 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 3788 posts, RR: 12
Reply 2, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 3005 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

The DC-10 involved in that incident was either a 10 or a 30, definitely not a 40 because American has never operated any (only Northwest and Japan Airlines do). Yes, it is the end of the DC-10 at American. I beleive that as of November, all flights to Hawaai will be mostly 767's except a 757 from San Jose CA, if I'm not mistaken. Beginning of 2001, American will no longer fly the DC-10. They are almost thirty years old!

Ben Soriano
Brussels Belgium



Ben Soriano
User currently offlineJmc757 From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2000, 1298 posts, RR: 7
Reply 3, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 2793 times:

definitely time to retire DC10. in MArch Airtours International will be the only british airline to operate the type, and their arrangement is 'temporary'.

I think if the general public know how old some of the aircraft they fly on were, then they would never fly!



User currently offlineAdam84 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 1400 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 2787 times:

Actually the last DC-10 flight for AA is the last day of September. Also the engine failures dont say the plane needs to be retired. Engine failures can happen on any plane, If a engine failure occures on a 777 does that mean the plane needs to be retired. I realize the DC-10 is an old plane but an engine failure isnt the aircraft showing its old age.

User currently offlineAmerican 767 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 3788 posts, RR: 12
Reply 5, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 2979 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Ok listen up,
I didn't say than an engine failure was a reason to retire the aircraft, I think that the retirement of the aircraft is schedule when its next D-check is due. I don't think American is doing anymore D-checks on the DC-10's, once it's due to be done then the aircraft is to be phased out for good.
That is what I think.

Ben Soriano
Brussels Belgium



Ben Soriano
User currently offlineAdam84 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 1400 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 2986 times:

American 767, I wasnt directing my post towards you. Sorry for the confusion.

User currently offlineBH346 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 3265 posts, RR: 14
Reply 7, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 2759 times:

The news article won't load. Could somebody tell me where this flight left to go to Hawaii and what day it happened. I really want to know.

BH346



Northwest Airlines - Some People Just Know How to Fly
User currently offlineILUV767 From United States of America, joined May 2000, 3141 posts, RR: 8
Reply 8, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 2748 times:

The flight started out is SFO enroute to Hawaii. And it started 8/1/00.

User currently offlineCannedSpam From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 2738 times:

Actually, the last AA DC-10 flight is not in September, but will most likely be the first week or so of November.

User currently offlineBlink182 From Azerbaijan, joined Oct 1999, 5482 posts, RR: 15
Reply 10, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 2727 times:

about a week ago, i had a late flight from YVR and when we were taxiing to the gate at DFW, we taxied by the maintenece hangar and i saw a DC-10 on what looked like it was getting it's D-check, i could be wrong but i think that is what I saw.
blink182



Give me a break, I created this username when I was a kid...
User currently offlineTEDSKI From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 2714 times:

This incident shows how unreliable the GE CF6 can be sometimes which is why on the 777-200ER American chose the reliable RR Trent 800 series engine.

User currently offlineKKMolokai From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 760 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 2711 times:

Presently American operates 8 DC-10s, exclusively used on the Hawai'i runs.

American is retiring the last of their DC-10s in September. As of October 1st, all Hawai'i bound flights will be operated using 767-300 aircraft, with the exception of 757 service to/from SJC and OGG.

The new Hawaiian Flagship Service 767s will include 30 First Class seats.



We are the people of American Airlines. And we know why you fly.
User currently offlineCannedSpam From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 2680 times:

KKMolokai,

AA's DC-10 will no longer be scheduled for service after about the first week of November so you will still see them in AA's schedule through October. However, during the mid point of October, AA has plans to convert the some (not all) of the DC-10 flying to the 2 class 767-300 you spoke of. The ORD and DFW trips will be exchanged the beginning of November based on the 767-300 conversion lines.


User currently offlineOnTheFly From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 51 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 2662 times:

A funny addendum to this story--well, maybe not so funny.
A big deal was made out of this on local news stations here in San Francisco. Seems any time any aircraft enroute or departing from SFO has any problem at all the local news folks go rabid. Anyway, KCBS, the local all-news station, was interviewing passengers who had been in the air for 5 hours (two nice tours of the eastern Pacific) and at SFO for almost 30 hours. One woman described how she was going to Hawaii to get married, but now, given the craziness with AA (interpreted as a bad omen), she was reconsidering and would likely not fly to Hawaii or get married! No word yet on would-be hubby's reaction.

Marc
SF, CA


User currently offlineCba From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 4531 posts, RR: 3
Reply 15, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 2604 times:

I'm going to miss the DC-10's. Although I have read many complaints about them, I think that they are great planes. But wait, Continental still operates the DC-10. I saw about 3 or 4 in Newark about a month ago, and there are also a few in Houston. I haven't heard of any complaints or accidents on Continental's DC-10's.

User currently offlineKKMolokai From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 760 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 2594 times:

CannedSpam,

From what I've heard, and from what I have personally found in the Sabre computer system, all Hawaii bound flight will be operated using 767-300s beginning October 1st. All 767s to/from the Aloha State will feature the two-class, 30 First Class seating configuration. No where in Sabre will you find a scheduled DC-10 flight as of October 1st.



We are the people of American Airlines. And we know why you fly.
User currently offlineCritter_592 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 279 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 2586 times:

Continental does have it's share of problems with DC-10.....i think 1 or 2 probs this yr.

Every airline probably has a few tweaks with it. It's old!


User currently offlineCOexERJ From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 2579 times:

CO did have major problem this year on it's EWR-BRU flight (CO61, I think) I'm not sure what happened, but they had to make an air-return after losing an engine. A friend of mine who works in Aircraft Records at CO told me that the FAA Blackballed the plane and they were investigating. I know the crew was given a special recognition for getting the plane back in what Gordon Bethune called "A very difficult spot"

User currently offlineCPRjet From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 68 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 2552 times:

Does anyone know what happened on the Continental DC-10 flight to BRU that apparently experienced a major problem?

User currently offlineCannedSpam From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 2555 times:

KKMolokai,

Yes, I know what it says in Sabre, but Sabre is not always correct when it comes to aircraft type this far out in advance. In fact, there is a very specific reason why everything is showing as a 763 instead of a DC-10. Would you prefer to take 80 oversales on a 767 that was sold as a DC-10 or would you prefer to advance sell a DC-10 as a 767 which gives you more flexibilty for conversion step-ups or slippages? What I am telling you is 100% accurate. The west coast DC-10s to HNL will be the first to be phased out followed by DFW and ORD.


User currently offlineAdam84 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 1400 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 2538 times:

Yeah CO still has about 20 or so DC-10-30's still flying, They need to get rid of them as quick as possible though. Im not saying I hate CO or the DC-10, actually I like both. But the way CO has the seats crammed in them, it is like hell sitting in there for 8 hours. It was worse than NW and UA.

User currently offlineEWRSpotter From United States of America, joined Apr 2011, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 2538 times:

Here is the NTSB description of the CO DC-10 incident earlier this year. It's not a pretty sight. Upon landing the ground crew was apparently shocked the the condition of the engines.

From the report: "Examination of the airplane revealed that all three General Electric CF6-50C2 engines were damaged. "

If the engines had sustained any more any more damage the a/c probably would have ended up on the NJ Turnpike. Kudos to the CO crew for their good work.

The 767-400s can't arrive early enough.

-----

NTSB Identification: NYC00FA122

Scheduled 14 CFR 121 operation of CONTINENTAL AIRLINES, INC.
Accident occurred APR-25-00 at NEWARK, NJ
Aircraft: McDonnell Douglas DC10-30, registration: N39081
Injuries: 234 Uninjured.

This is preliminary information, subject to change, and may contain errors. Any errors in this report will be corrected when the final report has been completed.

On April 25, 2000, at 1942 Eastern Daylight Time, a McDonnell-Douglas DC10-30, N39081, operating as Continental Airlines flight 60, was substantially damaged when an uncontained engine event occurred during takeoff from Newark International Airport (EWR), Newark, New Jersey. The 3-man cockpit crew, 11-person cabin crew, and 220 passengers were not injured. Visual meteorological conditions prevailed at the time of the accident. An instrument flight rules flight plan had been filed for the flight, between Newark and Brussels Airport (BRU), Brussels, Belgium. The scheduled passenger flight was conducted under 14 CFR Part 121. The captain stated that he conducted a crew briefing prior to boarding the airplane. Startup and taxi were normal, and during the taxi, the captain again briefed the cockpit crew, and included engine failures and non-reject situations. The airplane lined up on Runway 04L, and the captain applied takeoff power slowly and smoothly. At takeoff decision speed (V1), there was a loud explosion. A white "engine fail" light illuminated in front of the captain, and the number 1 engine N1 decreased by 30 percent. Number 2 and number 3 engines appeared normal. The captain continued the takeoff, and the landing gear was raised. A red, left main landing gear warning light illuminated on the front panel. The airplane turned to a heading of 010, and slowly climbed to 3,000 feet. During the climb, an airframe vibration developed. After level-off, the crew began to troubleshoot the emergency, and found that when the number 3 engine N1 was reduced to about 25 percent, the vibration disappeared. Both the number 1 and the number 3 engines remained at approximately 25 percent N1 for the rest of the flight. Air traffic control provided vectors for a return to Newark. During the return, the crew dumped about 90,000 pounds of fuel. The crew also ran both 1-engine, and 2-engine inoperative checklists, and prepared data cards for both scenarios. The captain flew the ILS glideslope down to a full-stop landing, on Runway 04R. The ACARS recorded the landing at 2016. After the initial stop, the brakes would not release, so the crew shut down the engines on the runway, and the passengers and crew disembarked through the normal deplaning doors. The airplane was later towed to a ramp. According to the captain, the use of crew resource management (CRM) by both the cockpit and cabin crews was a major factor in the successful handling of the emergency. Examination of the airplane revealed that all three General Electric CF6-50C2 engines were damaged. The number 1 (left) engine "low pressure turbine" case was breached in the vicinity of the second stage nozzles, from approximately the 3 o'clock, to the 9 o'clock position. The breach was about the width of the second stage nozzle segments, and all of the segments were missing from the engine. Each segment consisted of six nozzle blades. Nine of the 16 nozzle segments were recovered intact, and additional portions of segments were found, for a total recovery of about 85 percent of the nozzle blades. The majority of nozzle material was found on the departure runway; however, one nozzle segment was found in the left main landing gear wheel well. One of the eight anti-rotation nozzle locks was recovered. The threaded stud from that lock had been sheared from the plate, and the engagement tangs exhibited wear and damage. The first stage low pressure turbine blades had minor trailing edge airfoil damage, and the second stage low pressure turbine blades exhibited circumferential rub marks on the inner platform leading edge, and on the airfoils near the blade root. The number 2 (center) engine exhibited leading edge damage to two fan blades. The number 3 (right) engine had leading edge damage to all fan blades, consisting of tears, rips and material loss. Pieces of fan blade, and material similar to that of the second stage nozzles from the number 1 engine, were found embedded in the engine inlet acoustic panels. The left main landing gear, front inboard tire, was ruptured, and the front outboard tire exhibited tread separation, but remained inflated. Impact marks were noted on the outboard side of the left engine pylon, the left wing outboard flap, the underside of the fuselage, the left main landing gear access door, the left side of the fuselage aft of the left wing, and a right wing panel outboard of the flap actuator housing. The installation of upgraded nozzle locks, per Service Bulletin 721082, was accomplished in 1997.


User currently offlineSurf From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 2490 times:

Okay I am not a techie so I read that report as best I could but would someone PLEASE tell me WHAT THE HELL is up at Continental? How could that plane be so damaged? ALL THREE ENGINES? Are they doing proper maintenence or not??? Man that is kind of scary, isn't it? Jesus why was that plane allowed to be flying? It doesn't sound like that plane was in any shape to be flying before it took off? Someone please explain this situation to me! And *shiver* I hate Creepy-10's.....

User currently offlineBobo2196 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (14 years 1 month 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 2493 times:

I remember reading a book one day about a comparison between the GE CF6 and the Rolls RB211. They stated that the GE engine on the D10 was very sensitive to FOD and one little steel cotter pin sucked into engine no. 2 could cause enough damage to let you see clear through the engine. However, the Rolls on the L1011 could take tons of damage, "it is a common approved practice to dispatch an L1011 with a few broken fan blades". Compare engine related accidents on the D10 and L1011. Remember Souix City? (Which by the way, the airport identifier for Souix City is SUX)!    

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