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Passengers Subdue Man On Cincinnati-Bound Flight  
User currently offlineSkibum9 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1229 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 5808 times:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/wlwt/2006031...;_ylu=X3oDMTA3MXN1bHE0BHNlYwN0bWE-

Passengers on a flight bound for Cincinnati subdued a 48-year-old man who allegedly punched an off-duty crew member.

According to the article, the man started to make bizarre comments, then approached the open cockpit.

Looks like it was Commutair flight 8820. http://flightaware.com/live/flight/UCA8820

Doesn't the Beech 1900 have a secure cockpit door? If so, why was it open?


Tailwinds!!!
23 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineCVG2LGA From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 630 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 5794 times:

When I worked for skyway out of CVG with the 1900's i was amazed the first time i got on it to MKE for training. The flightdeck doors pull together to shut and you can actually see over them. There are mirrors posted above the pilots to where they can see the back of the cabin.
Hope it helps
Tchau
DA-



They don't call em' emergencies anymore. They call em' Patronies.
User currently offlineDALjr From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 24 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 5687 times:

I actually heard this flight once it landed on a scanner, although at the time was unaware of what was happening. The plane turned off the runway, stopped and shut down on the taxiway. Obviously the pilot sounded very frantic, and seemed upset that it took so long for the emergency vehicles to arrive. This being one of our busy times, I was unable to listen for further information although this story may have a few more details http://www.nbc4i.com/news/7892616/detail.html

DALjr


User currently offlineCVG2LGA From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 630 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 5649 times:

anyone know what time it landed in CMH? would like to pull the atc up and listen if its available.
Tchau
DA-



They don't call em' emergencies anymore. They call em' Patronies.
User currently offlineTornado82 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 5643 times:

Quoting Skibum9 (Thread starter):

Doesn't the Beech 1900 have a secure cockpit door? If so, why was it open?

Nope. Just little partition type things, and even those are open on most flights.


User currently offlineDALjr From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 24 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 5625 times:

Quoting CVG2LGA (Reply 3):
anyone know what time it landed in CMH? would like to pull the atc up and listen if its available.

If I remember, it was between 1:30 and 2:00, maybe just a few minutes after 2 if that.

DALjr


User currently offlineGQfluffy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 5588 times:

Quoting Skibum9 (Thread starter):
Doesn't the Beech 1900 have a secure cockpit door? If so, why was it open?

Sure...and they're worthless. Most pilots don't close them because A. They rattle like crazy, B. The crew can then turn around to check on the pax in the cabin if need be, C. They aren't worth the 5 lbs they weigh.

Quoting CVG2LGA (Reply 1):
There are mirrors posted above the pilots to where they can see the back of the cabin.

Of all the B1900s I've been on (cargo and the 1900D's of GQ), I've never once seen these mirrors...


User currently offlineSkyexRamper From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 5404 times:

The mirrors don't really do anything, pilots can't really tell whats going on cause the mirrors suck. Also most of the skyway 1900Ds have newer leather/kevlar curtain door things. But after 9/11 all cockpit doors are shut on skyway flights.

User currently offlineTornado82 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 5298 times:

Great, now this is going to make Commutair start shutting the doors. That was the only good thing about flying a Commutair Beech... getting to watch the cockpit. Always takes one A-hole to ruin it for everyone... this guy should be hung.

User currently offlineGQfluffy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 5289 times:

Quoting Tornado82 (Reply 8):
Great, now this is going to make Commutair start shutting the doors. That was the only good thing about flying a Commutair Beech... getting to watch the cockpit.

Highly doubt it. Like I said before...closing these doors is pointless. Even though being an employee of GQ, several times while flying I've seen people get up and try to walk to the cockpit to do some stupid thing or another. If I'm not the first person to say something...someone else ALWAYS stops them before they get all the way up. I've gotten some pretty interesting responses, but once I pop out the SIDA badge...they sit back down. There's no reason for them to be up there unless they have some kind of medical emergency...


User currently offlineSkibum9 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1229 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 5227 times:

I guess it surprises me that the TSA requires airliners to have secure doors and have in countless times attacked GA because of security issues, but they allow planes, like the Beech 1900s, fly around with basically no security for the cockpit. Seems like it is security issue just waiting to happen.


Tailwinds!!!
User currently offlineGQfluffy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 5058 times:

On aircraft which seat 19 passengers (or less), an airline is not required to fly with a Flight Attendant. So, if the door was closed, who is going to keep an eye on passengers?

User currently offlineCaspian27 From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 381 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 4690 times:

Quoting Skibum9 (Thread starter):
Doesn't the Beech 1900 have a secure cockpit door? If so, why was it open?

Great Lakes 1900's only have a curtain.



Meanwhile, somewhere 35,000 ft above your head...
User currently offlineSkydrol From Canada, joined Oct 2003, 968 posts, RR: 10
Reply 13, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3547 times:

Quoting GQfluffy (Reply 9):
There's no reason for them to be up there unless they have some kind of medical emergency...

Interesting. On AC Jazz flights, after giving pax the safety briefing, the F/O usually states if anyone finds it too hot, too cold, or any other concerns to walk up front and let them know. Only seen this done once. The cabin heat was a little oppressive, and a lady got up and went to the flight deck and shortly afterwards there was reilef from the heat!

Luckily she wasn't 'subdued' or we all would have been well-done before landing!



LD4



∙ ---{--« ∙ ----{--« ∙ --{-« ∙ ---{--« ∙ --{--« ∙ --{-« ∙ ----{--« ∙
User currently offlineQXatFAT From Israel, joined Feb 2006, 2404 posts, RR: 5
Reply 14, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3366 times:

So much for security. I dont like this. I dont care if you guys want to see what the piolts are doing. Secure doors need to be on every plane! It is for everyones safety.


Don't Tread On Me!
User currently offlineContnlEliteCMH From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 1458 posts, RR: 44
Reply 15, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3356 times:

Quoting Skibum9 (Reply 10):
I guess it surprises me that the TSA requires airliners to have secure doors and have in countless times attacked GA because of security issues, but they allow planes, like the Beech 1900s, fly around with basically no security for the cockpit. Seems like it is security issue just waiting to happen.

Except that the 1900 can't do much real damage. I don't want to sound callous to people that may be hurt or killed in such an incident, but crashing a 1900 into a building is a far, far cry from using 767's. For once, this seems like a sensible break in the regs. And as we all know, 9/11 will *never* happen again in the United States. This is just another example of what is already well understood.



Christianity. Islam. Hinduism. Anthropogenic Global Warming. All are matters of faith!
User currently offlineQXatFAT From Israel, joined Feb 2006, 2404 posts, RR: 5
Reply 16, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3323 times:

Quoting ContnlEliteCMH (Reply 15):
And as we all know, 9/11 will *never* happen again in the United States

Yeah dont be to sure about that buddy. I dont really like some of these airports. The TSA are horrible. For example, in DTW, some of the TSA that I have seen scanning things are not even looking at the screen. They just let things go threw while they talk do their buddy off to the side. IAD is one of the good ones I have been at. Same with SFO and OAK.



Don't Tread On Me!
User currently offlineAtrude777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5692 posts, RR: 52
Reply 17, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3298 times:

Yes I ride the Bae Jetstreams 32 quite a bit MWA-STL and I enjoy sitting behind the cockpit and watching them fly the plane, very exciting to watch them. The pilots will turn and talk to me sometimes answering questions or explaining what he was doing. This was on RegionsAir, former Corporate Airlines.

Alex



Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
User currently offlineDL787932ER From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 597 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 2917 times:

Quoting QXatFAT (Reply 16):

The TSA has nothing to do with why a 9/11 event can't and won't ever happen again, at least in the U.S. Passengers realize that in the event of a hijacking, being a sheep won't save their own lives, and will probably result in a lot of deaths on the ground. Terrorists could bring box cutters, machetes, or chainsaws on board, and they'd never make it into the cockpit alive because it'd be them against a whole bunch of po'ed Americans.



F L Y D E L T A J E T S
User currently offlineContnlEliteCMH From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 1458 posts, RR: 44
Reply 19, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2664 times:

Quoting QXatFAT (Reply 16):
Yeah dont be to sure about that buddy. I dont really like some of these airports. The TSA are horrible. For example, in DTW, some of the TSA that I have seen scanning things are not even looking at the screen. They just let things go threw while they talk do their buddy off to the side. IAD is one of the good ones I have been at. Same with SFO and OAK.

My belief that 9/11 can never happen again has nothing to do with the TSA or any other government agency. It has everything to do with my faith in my fellow countrymen. I just don't believe that passengers will sit by and allow planes to be hijacked and flown into buildings. Heck, I'm skeptical they'd ever let anybody get close to the cockpit. Ever.

Would you?



Christianity. Islam. Hinduism. Anthropogenic Global Warming. All are matters of faith!
User currently offlineQXatFAT From Israel, joined Feb 2006, 2404 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2642 times:

Quoting ContnlEliteCMH (Reply 19):
My belief that 9/11 can never happen again has nothing to do with the TSA or any other government agency. It has everything to do with my faith in my fellow countrymen. I just don't believe that passengers will sit by and allow planes to be hijacked and flown into buildings. Heck, I'm skeptical they'd ever let anybody get close to the cockpit. Ever.

Would you?

Well I would agree. My fellow country men are the best defense. But, I believe that something needs to happen before the flight to make it even tougher for things like this to happen. Does it always have to be that every single person, before they fly, must look around at who is boarding the plane, dont take a nap on your flight, keep an eye out, stair at people that are suspisious? Me personaly, I try to sit towords the front of the plane. I feel that I am quite a big guy that can do something when the time is needed. I pray to God Almighty that I will never have to be, nor anyone else, in that situation. But I think that things need to happen in the airport first. I think that the checked luggage is outstanding now. The carry on is a different story. I have no problem waiting another 30 min to a hour to make sure that the flight is safe.

Side question, are the air marshals only on the bigger birds? Do you think that there are some on the CRJ, EMB, Saab?



Don't Tread On Me!
User currently offlineIAirAllie From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 2561 times:

Quoting QXatFAT (Reply 20):
Do you think that there are some on the CRJ, EMB, Saab?

I can't tell you with what frequency but the answer is yes. I have seen airmarshalls on CRJ's and turboprops.


User currently offlineGQfluffy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 2526 times:

Quoting QXatFAT (Reply 14):
I dont care if you guys want to see what the piolts are doing.

It's more vice-versa. With a big, bulky, heavy (remember a 30 lb door on a 1900D means one less checked bag or carry-on) door, you lose cabin space and with no F/A, with that door closed, the PIC or F/O can't see the pax in the cabin. Not necessarily a good thing, don't you think?


User currently offlineSkibum9 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1229 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 2410 times:

Quoting GQfluffy (Reply 22):
It's more vice-versa. With a big, bulky, heavy (remember a 30 lb door on a 1900D means one less checked bag or carry-on) door, you lose cabin space and with no F/A, with that door closed, the PIC or F/O can't see the pax in the cabin. Not necessarily a good thing, don't you think?

Even if the pliot does see something, in a plane that size he (she) would have a very limited time to react to protect the plane. If there is no requirement for a door on a plane that size, then maybe it should be a requirement that all the pilots on a plane that size be FFDOs.



Tailwinds!!!
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