Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
How Can This Be Safe? Photo Of The Day.  
User currently offlineCadet57 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 9085 posts, RR: 31
Posted (8 years 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 29036 times:

This seems incredably dangerous, what if there was on coming traffic or something?



View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Rafael Henrique Carelli - Zaza




Doors open, right hand side, next stop is Springfield.
118 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineB757capt From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 1337 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (8 years 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 29008 times:

The TCAS on that aircraft would deffinatly help. I see this and do this all the time.

Although,..... Most new aircraft come with the removable sun glare guards, especially the boeings.



The views written by this user are in no manner the views of my employer and should not be thought as such.
User currently offlineCCA From Hong Kong, joined Oct 2002, 797 posts, RR: 14
Reply 2, posted (8 years 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 29008 times:

What if you're in cloud?


C152 G115 TB10 CAP10 SR-22 Be76 PA-34 NDN-1T C500 A330-300 A340-300 -600 B747-200F -200SF -400 -400F -400BCF -400ERF -8F
User currently offlineSkibum9 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1229 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (8 years 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 28938 times:

Quoting CCA (Reply 2):
What if you're in cloud?

What does it matter? At that altitude you are on autopilot, and if you were in a cloud you couldn't see anyway.



Tailwinds!!!
User currently offlineMNeo From Bulgaria, joined Mar 2004, 776 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (8 years 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 28911 times:

Quoting CCA (Reply 2):
What if you're in cloud?

I dont think i have seen clouds at FL400



Powered by Maina
User currently offlineLarspl From Netherlands, joined Apr 2002, 473 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (8 years 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 28883 times:

as the picture shows the a/c is on FL400. if there would be traffic, and if this traffic would be a factor.. we have something called TCAS. This system is not to be used as a primairy means of avoiding traffic, but ATC is usually doing a great job. and you don't know if the left window is also covered up.

a pilots first thought about almost everything is: is this safe.
if any person in that cockpit wouldn't be sure of that it would not been covered.



facebook.com/ddaclassicairlines
User currently offline777236ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (8 years 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 28788 times:

Considering the elevated rates of skin cancer for airline pilots, I suggest this is safer than any collision risk.

User currently offlineCadet57 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 9085 posts, RR: 31
Reply 7, posted (8 years 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 28788 times:

Quoting Larspl (Reply 5):
we have something called TCAS

its a computer, computer fail. No better thing then the human eye...

Quoting Larspl (Reply 5):
but ATC is usually doing a great job.

Usually, thats the key word.

This is one of the most unbeleiveable things i've ever seen, how can anyone think that this is safe. Its ludicris



Doors open, right hand side, next stop is Springfield.
User currently offlineCorey07850 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2525 posts, RR: 5
Reply 8, posted (8 years 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 28788 times:

If this was in the US (and probably other countries) they would be in Class A airspace... In class A you're required to be on an instrument flight plan so it doesn't matter if you can see or not. Obviously they wouldn't keep the windows covered when they were descending and approaching to land

User currently offlineCorey07850 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2525 posts, RR: 5
Reply 9, posted (8 years 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 28764 times:

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 7):
This is one of the most unbeleiveable things i've ever seen, how can anyone think that this is safe. Its ludicris

Dude calm down... If you think that is so unbelievable I wonder how you feel about CAT III ILS approaches or autolands, or simply flying through clouds??


User currently offlineJRadier From Netherlands, joined Sep 2004, 4650 posts, RR: 50
Reply 10, posted (8 years 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 28734 times:

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 7):
This is one of the most unbeleiveable things i've ever seen, how can anyone think that this is safe. Its ludicris

being blinded by the sun... and missing other important stuff... now that's safe



For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards, for there you have been and ther
User currently offlineEK413 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 4689 posts, RR: 4
Reply 11, posted (8 years 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 28708 times:

Cadet57

Larspl
we have something called TCAS


its a computer, computer fail. No better thing then the human eye...

Computer's don't make error.....Human's make error.....

EK413



Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
User currently offlineCCA From Hong Kong, joined Oct 2002, 797 posts, RR: 14
Reply 12, posted (8 years 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 28670 times:

Quoting Skibum9 (Reply 3):
What does it matter? At that altitude you are on autopilot, and if you were in a cloud you couldn't see anyway.

Skibum9 that was my point you can't see in cloud either so of course it's safe.



C152 G115 TB10 CAP10 SR-22 Be76 PA-34 NDN-1T C500 A330-300 A340-300 -600 B747-200F -200SF -400 -400F -400BCF -400ERF -8F
User currently offlineBond007 From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 5343 posts, RR: 8
Reply 13, posted (8 years 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 28670 times:

Quoting MNeo (Reply 4):
I dont think i have seen clouds at FL400

Good thunderstorms can easily reach 60,000ft!

Quoting Corey07850 (Reply 8):
so it doesn't matter if you can see or not.



Quoting Skibum9 (Reply 3):
What does it matter?

From the AIM:

"regardless of type of flight plan or whether or not under control of a radar facility, the pilot is responsible to see and avoid other traffic, terrain, or
obstacles. "

Sure, stick ONE (or even two) piece of paper up there, but's that just stupid!

"you can't see in cloud either so of course it's safe." ...He's obviously NOT in clouds is he!

Jimbo

[Edited 2006-03-27 01:51:24]


I'd rather be on the ground wishing I was in the air, than in the air wishing I was on the ground!
User currently offlineAPFPilot1985 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (8 years 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 28643 times:

Quoting Corey07850 (Reply 8):
If this was in the US (and probably other countries) they would be in Class A airspace... In class A you're required to be on an instrument flight plan so it doesn't matter if you can see or not.

Doesn't matter if you are filed or not it is still the pilots ultimate responsibility to see and avoid.


User currently offlineEMBQA From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 9364 posts, RR: 11
Reply 15, posted (8 years 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 28643 times:

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 7):
This is one of the most unbeleiveable things i've ever seen, how can anyone think that this is safe. Its ludicris

So what is your issue..? The fact they used safety cards to stop the suns setting glare..? ..or the fact that no one is sitting in the FO's seat..? Son, you would be shocked if you saw what really goes on behind the closed cockpit door. For one thing, yes there is TCAS and it works great, second there is ATC keeping planes at a safe distance, third.. there is a second pilot looking out the window...now without a strong glare on there right side. Relax and take a deep breath.



"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
User currently offlineDazeflight From Germany, joined Jun 1999, 578 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (8 years 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 28599 times:

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 7):
its a computer, computer fail. No better thing then the human eye...

If you don't trust in computers, I'd recommend you not to use any fairly recent plane for your future "flying" adventures - those are basically flying computers.


User currently offlineBoeingfanyyz From Canada, joined Jul 2005, 991 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (8 years 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 28571 times:

Quoting MNeo (Reply 4):
I dont think i have seen clouds at FL400

I have!

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 7):
This is one of the most unbeleiveable things i've ever seen, how can anyone think that this is safe. Its ludicris

Take a chill pill there for a sec. Although it seems like a threat to the safety of the pax on board, it really is not. It is actually less safe to have the pilots try to face the sun and the glare and risk retinal injury!

Just my $0.02 (CDN)

Cheers,
Boeingfanyyz  airplane 



"If it aint boeing, it aint going!", "Friends are like condoms...they protect you when things get hard!"
User currently offlinePhilb From Ireland, joined May 1999, 2915 posts, RR: 13
Reply 18, posted (8 years 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 28571 times:

Load of nonsense about an everyday problem being solved by an astute crew.

At FL400 visibility as shown is a sight better than at FL180 on an average winter's day in Northern Europe.


User currently offlineCadet57 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 9085 posts, RR: 31
Reply 19, posted (8 years 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 28538 times:

Quoting EK413 (Reply 11):
Computer's don't make error.....Human's make error.....

they dont make errors huh? wow, thats rather narrow minded, I guess your not a windows user.

Quoting EMBQA (Reply 15):
So what is your issue..?

The fact that they are obstructing their view. Wear sunglasses  sarcastic 

Quoting EMBQA (Reply 15):
Son, you would be shocked if you saw what really goes on behind the closed cockpit door.

Well i'll be discovering that this fall when I go to school...



Doors open, right hand side, next stop is Springfield.
User currently offlineAPFPilot1985 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (8 years 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 28512 times:

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 19):
The fact that they are obstructing their view. Wear sunglasses

I'll bet you that the Captain is and that he is able to keep a good view of what is going on outside.

This really is no big deal, done to the extreme? Maybe. A comprise to safety? No.


User currently offlineStealthZ From Australia, joined Feb 2005, 5609 posts, RR: 45
Reply 21, posted (8 years 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 28494 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Cadet57,

Your point is moot.. if the glare was so bad the pilot was prompted to take this action, he/she would not see anything coming at them anyway!!

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 19):
I guess your not a windows user.

It is something of a shame that most people judge all forms of automation by the standards of the piece of junk on their desk!!

C



If your camera sends text messages, that could explain why your photos are rubbish!
User currently offlinePhilb From Ireland, joined May 1999, 2915 posts, RR: 13
Reply 22, posted (8 years 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 28447 times:

Quoting StealthZ (Reply 21):
guess your not a windows user.

Computers do not make errors. They crash, fail to start or refuse to accept inputs but they do not make errors.

Human programmers make errors.

First rule of computing: GIGO - or Garbage In, Garbage Out.

As of today, 60 years of computing and, so far, all the errors have a human source.


User currently offline2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8955 posts, RR: 60
Reply 23, posted (8 years 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 28413 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
HEAD DATABASE EDITOR




Quoting StealthZ (Reply 21):
Your point is moot.. if the glare was so bad the pilot was prompted to take this action, he/she would not see anything coming at them anyway!!

 checkmark   yes 




2H4





Intentionally Left Blank
User currently offlineFutureUALpilot From United States of America, joined May 2000, 2598 posts, RR: 8
Reply 24, posted (8 years 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 28389 times:

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 19):

they dont make errors huh? wow, thats rather narrow minded, I guess your not a windows user.

I would think it is a safe bet to say that Boeing does not use your average computer program on their aircraft, and IF they do, they do not have all of the typical spam, internet cookies, etc. that puts computers at risk.



Life is better when you surf.
25 Rdwelch : See below... Thanks guys. It's not Jimmy Doolittle with a blind flying hood in a Lockheed Vega. The glare would be so bad the FO could get a good sig
26 Post contains images EK413 : Philb StealthZ guess your not a windows user. Computers do not make errors. They crash, fail to start or refuse to accept inputs but they do not make
27 Post contains images FLY2HMO : Exactly    Yup, seen this many times before.    And get a pretty decent sunburn in the meantime... this only applies when in VFR weather, and I k
28 Post contains images Bond007 : LOL, I'll say it again! If they were in clouds then they wouldn't need to cover the windows would they So...they WERE in VFR weather most probably...
29 Post contains images 2H4 : Prediction: 50+ total posts second-guessing the actions of two professional airline pilots with more experience than most of us combined. It would be
30 Rolfen : The visibility problem has been discussed. The only way this could pose a safety problem would be if the sheets get in the way of the pilot when he wa
31 Post contains images Bond007 : Don't bet on that Jimbo
32 Post contains images 2H4 : Right, hence the keyword "most"... 2H4
33 Jrosa : By your post it really seems that you have never been inside a cockpit, to make things clearer - with the plane flying! Relax, this shot was taken in
34 Alias1024 : This is a very common occurance. Safety cards work well, as do some checklists. Newspapers work very well. I've even seen some pilots bring the shades
35 Post contains images FLY2HMO : Depends on how thick the soup is I'm not denying what you said, just filling the gap for something I thought should've been mentioned. Peace
36 FlyMIA : Yea but no plane is going to fly through a thunderstorm cloud at FL400. There are not many heavy clouds at FL400 that would be flown through. Yes the
37 Jm017 : This thread gives me an opportunity to ask what may seem like a really silly question. Do pilots deliberately fly AROUND clouds normally? A while ago
38 Post contains images Bond007 : Yes...even more reason to believe they were in VMC. I was just commenting on the fact that somebody said they hadn't seen clouds at FL400. Fly in Flo
39 KJFK31L : What no one has realized yet is that is aircraft is executing a turn (note the attitude indicator on the co-pilots side). Yes, this is common. Yes IFR
40 Cure : Excuse me, what would you do at FL400 and 450-500kt of speed, with sun burning your eyes, if you clearly SEE an aircraft flying towards you? Do you t
41 Bond007 : Duh, if you see it, YES. Please see my earlier post. Jimbo
42 KJFK31L : The pilots do not do that just because the sun is "blinding them". Glare can be annoying, and does not mean that the sun is shinning directly into th
43 Remcor : You don't really need a sun visor if you're in the middle of a cloud, would you?
44 RiddlePilot215 : 90% of all air traffic is contained in the lower flight levels...usually below 18,000 feet MSL. That other 10% of traffic is moving so damn fast in t
45 Flywithjohn : You'd think that would not only be very unsafe but illegal...
46 Buckfifty : It really is no big deal. On the Airbus, we have sunshades which cover the entire window to block the sun during cruise. Not that much different from
47 APFPilot1985 : No kidding on that front, try getting actual instrument practice here in the Summer.
48 777jaah : I've seen blankets covering the windows. Do i even feel a little bit concerned about that?? Not a bit. I rather have a blanket covering the sun, than
49 Symphonik : Ugh. Just read up on instrument flying, dude. Cadet57, do you know when you train for your instrument rating, you actually wear blinders that complete
50 Lincoln : Or banks, or a modern automobile, or elevators, or a whole lot of hospital equipment... No, computers--when properly constructed--function exactly as
51 Jbmflyer : what are the chances that the flight crew will have the time to react to an oncoming aircraft, at those closeure rates I would suspect it would be ove
52 EMBQA : Just wait till your first IMC flight....!!!
53 Post contains images Xjramper : Come up to the north, try and get actual time during the winter. XJR
54 Matheus : Here in Brazil the airways are in RVSM rules, so if you want to fill a flight plan over FL290 you must have TCAS and at least 2 (or 3?) navigation and
55 Edelag : I don't know if this has already been said, but why exactly would you need to see outside at mid flight, I don't think it concerns security. It concer
56 CRGsFuture : Especially at FL400, there is no need to panic because of TCAS and Class A instrument flight rules.
57 PureKiwi : I don't know why anyone hasn't thought of this yet but wouldn't any approaching aircraft be able to see the other aircraft with a blocked windscreen.
58 HBJZA : The only point here is what the one on the left is doing ! If the F/O is in the toilet at that time he doesn't see the traffic either !!!!!!!!!
59 Bohlman : Not exactly true. All of this occurred under class A airspace. In class A airspace, you must have an instrument rating, flying on an instrument fligh
60 Access-Air : Hey Guys...stoppit already whould you....the simple explanation is..... The Safety cars are being used to block out the sun glaring in so the photogra
61 APFPilot1985 : You are 100% wrong. From the AIM Section 5-5-8 SEE AND AVOID a.Pilot: When Meteorological conditions permit, regardless of type of flight plan or whe
62 SkyHigh777 : Hey guys I just have a quick question....aside from pilots being blinded by the sun, doesn't it also get really hot in the flight deck with the sun be
63 727forever : Actually, winter storm systems in the American Midwest often times will have heavy clouds up through FL400 and occasionally higher. I can recall many
64 Cure : I was simplyfying and being sarcastic. Come on, how many times it happens in one year that a commercial pilot flying at FL400 has to avoid traffic re
65 Philb : The whole premise of this thread is ridiculous as has been pointed out a few times. I have never been a pilot or an aircrwew member but, from 1978-200
66 GTTIB : If you have ever seen the sun glaring directly onto the LCDs/CRTs in a cockpit, then you will know that it is damn near impossible for the pilots resp
67 Rolfen : I airline pilots were to apply "see and avoid" when flying at fl400 towards the sun, - half of the pilots would have to retire prematurely because of
68 Post contains images Bond007 : No, you'd better read up on it dude. It's been quoted many times that "see and avoid" is required whether VFR or IFR. Why is everyone assuming the on
69 CCA : Didn't read all the posts before posting did you? See reply 12.[Edited 2006-03-27 15:07:29]
70 Morvious : Even when I drive my car with a low winter sun light I have troubles seeing other cars around, with or without sunglasses. On FL400 this effect is mu
71 Starlionblue : If the aircraft is at FL400, and something goes wrong in a turn, there's plenty of altitude to fix the problem. And how long does it take to rip off
72 Turnit56N : I really get exasperated at seeing threads like this and the number of people ready to villify and/or question the competency and professionalism of e
73 Philb : Excellent point well made
74 Post contains images 777 : Each professional pilot here on A.net would say exactly the opposite!!!
75 PGV : Yeah...you got that right! Don't know why he asked it as a question when the whole point of this thread was just to spout off his opinion. I've seen
76 Post contains links ManuCH : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instrument_flight_rules At FL400 an airplane is in Class A airspace, like everyone else up there, and therefore under and
77 Jumbojet : Did you ever stop to consider that maybe the sun glare was so strong and intruding that it effected safe flight deck operations for both pilots?
78 Post contains images Cadet57 : How the hell is that an opinion? I asked a question based on how unsafe something looked. It would seem to make sense that as im not a pilot, it woul
79 CRGsFuture : Especially over Alaska during the summer.
80 MTYFREAK : you nailed it mate, I totally agree there, Is nice to get a tan on the beach but not in the cockpit IMHO
81 APFPilot1985 : Again you are 100% wrong. (at least in the US) Why do you continue to spout off stuff that has been shown to be wrong?
82 Post contains images Theredbaron : 100% agree, some peopl eher e have way too much time on their hands! Some guys here think that avoiding an aircraft at cruise speed is a piece of cak
83 ManuCH : IMHO if you are blinded by the sun, meteorological conditions do *not* permit. Or are you able to look outside to spot other airplanes when blinded b
84 Post contains images Starlionblue : "Your eyes can deceive you. Don't trust them" Joking aside, as soon as a pilot does IFR training, he or she is taught that senses can be deceiving. F
85 APFPilot1985 : But that is not what you said, again and again in this thread people have said stuff that is just factually wrong. The wikipedia article also says no
86 Post contains images ManuCH : You're right, I chose the wrong arguments to say what I wanted. Point taken. Didn't want to mess this up further Right... we agree on that part. Prob
87 Flyer732 : It also helps keep the heat out, until you're at altitude flying with the sun in your face and see how hot it can get up there you wouldn't understan
88 Post contains images PPVRA : You guys should be glad pilots are looking out for traffic at their intruments instead of keeping watch out the window. Obviously didn't work for Tita
89 Bazzaldonbond : Your all failing to see the obvious Correct he cant see now but he can see his instruments. With the paper off they both wont see anything cause there
90 Joness0154 : Nope, in VMC conditions, no matter who you are, where you are, how high you are, whether you are under ATC control or not, you are required to see an
91 Pillowtester : Mission critical computer systems tend not to run Microsoft Windows. Well built, custom designed computers and their operatings systems rarely fail.
92 AndesSMF : Right, at that speed between two airplanes approaching, you wouldnt even know what hit you. Thats why you rely on your TCAS and ATS. The see and be s
93 APFPilot1985 : IN my experience that isn't an issue. Most modern LCD's used in applications like this, from GPS's on boats to the G1000 to the panels used in the 73
94 PPVRA : But if the sun light is directly blinding you, the instrument's coating won't do anything for you. Cheers
95 APFPilot1985 : please explain to me, how if you are looking down at an instrument that is below the glareshield the sunlight could be directly blinding you.
96 Post contains links Jbmflyer : Bond007 (Reply 68): Why is everyone assuming the only direction an aircraft is going to come from is directly ahead at 500 kts??? It could just as eas
97 Cadet57 : High horse, ok sure. The computer question was asked because In my part time I am a computer tech and I see computer failures all the time. Yes they
98 Barney Captain : Sun in your eyes = totally blinded. Something blocking that sun = partially blinded. It could be argued that NOT putting those cards up was unsafe.
99 Il75 : If you ask "Is this safe?", people will answer you explaining if it is safe or not. If you ask "how can this be safe?" you are telling you think it is
100 Post contains images Starlionblue : Granted. But saying "ludicrous" in this environment is like walking around naked inside a cage of hungry hyenas I see your point. But computers for a
101 Post contains images Cure : Hey Cadet57! These are typical pilots' answers here. Very synthetic and without many "if" and "when" :
102 Bar032 : I am both an ME/IR CPL holder and a software engineer, and I promise you that the caution/warning systems on modern A/C do the job hell of a lot bett
103 LPLAspotter : I flew jumpseat on the 707 and L1011-500 with TP back in the early 80's and the windsheilds were always covered with newspapers or charts. The heat an
104 Wjv04 : Three Simple letters... I F R
105 Philb : It's about time this thread was locked. The professionals and those of us with jumpseat experience have clearly made the necessary and factual points
106 Post contains images FXramper : CO 772 IAH-NRT, 2000.
107 Post contains images 2H4 : Now now...perhaps there's something to be learned from the view of an armchair.... 2H4
108 Philb : Generally, I'm not in favour of any censorship of opinion or fact and armchair thinking has led tomany benefits for the world but this argument is goi
109 Post contains images LUFTFAHRT : VFR = Visual Flight Rules SVFR = Special VFR IFR = Instument Flight Rules That's save like CAT IIIc.
110 Rolfen : True. During my 4 years as a office IT staff, the overwhelming majority of hardware failures, excluding those caused by a power supply surge or a fab
111 Bond007 : NO. Please show us where it says this. We can argue til the end of the year over the pieces of paper, but facts are facts and some of us have repeate
112 Starlionblue : Hardware failures account for an ever decreasing percentage of server failures. The most common faults are software problems and human error. Dependi
113 Cadet57 : Piss off you jerk oh, ya, i need a time out. BECAUSE I ASKED A QUESTION? shove off. how?
114 David L : Not really. It's more because of comments like this: You don't think the professionals know what they're doing. You've made your point but I don't th
115 Cadet57 : so it's ok for him to insult me?
116 Post contains images David L : He wasn't as blunt! But I was only saying that the "advice" was not offered just because you "asked a question".
117 LPLAspotter : That's standard practice here on airliners.net. Get used to it or get off. LPLAspotter
118 AR385 : You forget brain cancer too, they are the only population group identified as having a more than the usual case of brain tumors, usually, mutiform-gl
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
How Can This Be "in Flight" posted Thu Apr 6 2006 09:34:06 by DLKAPA
Photo Of The Day - LAX posted Tue Jun 28 2005 19:54:53 by Drinkstrolley
Pic Of The Day:Is This Not A Risk For Security? posted Thu Mar 9 2006 08:05:25 by RootsAir
How Old Can You Be To Work In The Cabin? posted Thu Jun 10 2004 20:51:05 by Bofredrik
Photo Of The Guy, Why Did AA Let This Guy Get On? posted Mon Dec 24 2001 09:51:12 by Bobcat
Earliest European Arrival To US Of The Day. posted Fri Nov 10 2006 20:46:20 by FCA787
Easyjet Deals Of The Day posted Wed Oct 18 2006 17:37:08 by Door5Right
Can This Be True- dc-9 sale query posted Mon Aug 7 2006 10:29:51 by Samair
How Will This Be Regulated In Mexico? posted Tue May 2 2006 23:32:49 by Tu154m
How Can This Plane Depart In A Blizzard? posted Wed Apr 26 2006 22:20:44 by Alberchico