Hagic From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 173 posts, RR: 0 Posted (8 years 10 months 4 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 4590 times:
Hello A.net folks,
My girlfriend asks me why airlines don't supply parachutes on-board. I try to give her a good explanation but I wasn't entirely sure of the right answer:
I think the main reasons for not having parachutes onboard are:
- The regular a/c speeds make it impossible for people to jump off safely and slowing the plane down for the evacuation is out of consideration.
- Some or all emergency exits would have to be opened, with the corresponding sudden depressurization affecting all passengers still on the plane.
- The captain would be faced with an extra critical decision in an emergency situation that could affect the already cumbersome decision-making process. I guess pilots never feel/think a plane is completely doomed and that there is always something that can be done to save the plane and the people onboard.
I am sure that I am overlooking some of the obvious reasons. Any comments?
There's only one freedom of the press: That of the survivors - (G. Arciniegas)
ATCme From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 304 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (8 years 10 months 4 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 4579 times:
Hey, I have a great reason airlines don't do that: $$$$$$$$$
Everything costs money, and to maintain all of those parachutes would cost a lot of money. Also, parachutists are highly trained individuals, and to train passengers wouldn't be feasible. It would just be alot easier and cheaper to pay the families of dead passengers a hefty sum of money than put parachutes in for every passenger.
Hope it helps
I'm from the FAA, and I'm here to help. Really. Yes I'm serious, I'm here to help you.
Flyf15 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (8 years 10 months 4 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 4576 times:
In addition to weight, lack of training, etc.... one must also remember that in the vast majority of aircraft accidents, a parachute would do you no good if you even had it. Theres simply no time to get it on and jump out of a stable aircraft. The accident often happens instantly (on landing), uncontrollably (rudder hardover, for example), ... no chance to use a parachute in anything like that.
NAV20 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 9909 posts, RR: 36
Reply 4, posted (8 years 10 months 4 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 4561 times:
Some more reasons (among many others, I'm sure):-
1. Many (most?) people wouldn't have the nerve to use them. I recall that back in the 1960s the British Parachute Regiment found that up to 10% of their (highly-motivated) recruits simply couldn't bring thenmselves to jump out of an aeroplane when the time came.
2. Parachute jumping is inherently dangerous. A proportion of chutes simply don't open in the first place; and on top of that the landing impact can be of the order of that caused by jumping off a ten-foot-high wall.
3. It's difficult to imagine any 'airliner accident' situation in which the passengers woud be safer jumping out instead of staying aboard. I certainly can't think of one. Most accidents are of sudden onset anyway, there wouldn't be time to get everyone to put their harnesses on and then start shouting "Stand up! Hook on..." and all the rest of it.
4. Weight/space/cost/insurance complications. Chutes weigh a lot, they're big, and they require frequent checking and repacking.
"Once you have flown, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards.." - Leonardo da Vinci
Joffie From Australia, joined Mar 2006, 836 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (8 years 10 months 4 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 4553 times:
You have hit the nail on the head.
Nobody will know when the plane will break up. If you want to wear a parachute, and have a chance of survivial if the plane 'blows up' then you might as well wear it during the whole flight.
Quoting Hagic (Thread starter): - The captain would be faced with an extra critical decision in an emergency situation that could affect the already cumbersome decision-making process. I guess pilots never feel/think a plane is completely doomed and that there is always something that can be done to save the plane and the people onboard.
Exactly. There have been lots of cases when an unflyable plane has been brought safely to the ground. UA232, aloha 737-200 back in 1980's, even the A332 that ran out of fuel have landed safely.
Parachuts would be a big waste of money, and many people simply would not have time.
RiddlePilot215 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 318 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (8 years 10 months 4 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 4510 times:
Quoting TinkerBelle (Reply 6): I think it comes down to 3 reasons. Weight, extra weight and un-necessary weight.
Add a 4th extrodinary costs
The damn things have to be packed, and re-packed every xxx amt of days by a certified parachute rigger.
Look up "parachute ops" in the search box, reach pretty much all of Part 105, of the CFAR, the amendments to Parts 61 & 91, and you have a general idea of how crazy it is just to even get ONE jump out of the way.
It landed on an island somewhere cant remember where or how but i was leaking fuel and the silly pilots put it on crossfeed and forgot about it and bingo it become a glider and glided to safety. Was on air crash investigations
StudentFlyer From Australia, joined Sep 2004, 688 posts, RR: 3
Reply 10, posted (8 years 10 months 4 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 4454 times:
Quoting TinkerBelle (Reply 6): Huuh?? What A330? Hope you're not talking about the one that glid on a flight from YYZ coz it didn't run out of fuel.
I thought he was talking about the Air Transat A332... It did run out of fuel due to a leak...
Edit: @ Pilotdude09, it landed in Terceira-Lajes AFB, Azores
Like NAV20 said, ask your girlfriend if she would jump in a case of emergency. She probably will say she would, but in reality, would she really do it? Theoritically, it is easy to say yes to something, but in reality, things easily turn the other way round...
I do agree with your reasoning and also others' as well.
3MilesToWRO From Poland, joined Mar 2006, 281 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (8 years 10 months 4 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 4328 times:
Quoting NAV20 (Reply 4): 3. It's difficult to imagine any 'airliner accident' situation in which the passengers woud be safer jumping out instead of staying aboard. I certainly can't think of one. Most accidents are of sudden onset anyway, there wouldn't be time to get everyone to put their harnesses on and then start shouting "Stand up! Hook on..." and all the rest of it.
Well, this DC-10 that lost all hydraulic due to second engine failure, or 747 without tail control in Japan, those could be the examples more-less adequate. But still this is not enough to make parachute on board reasonable.
Hawker From Australia, joined Aug 2004, 105 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (8 years 10 months 4 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 4275 times:
Assuming there was time to depressurise the aircraft and open the doors, with the configuration of most modern airlines, anyone jumping would stand an excellent chance of either hitting the wing (forward doors) or tail (rear doors).
Oli80 From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2006, 685 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (8 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 4223 times:
Two things I can think of:
The pressure difference at high altitude would be so great that you wouldn't be able to open the door anyway. (and even if you did get out, -60C, little oxygen and one hell of an airspeed would surely spell the end of you)
And secondly, wouldn't it be a huge security risk? Wouldn't it give people the chance to bail out after they planted a bomb, killed someone etc.
Olympus69 From Canada, joined Jun 2002, 1737 posts, RR: 7
Reply 21, posted (8 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 4098 times:
A parachute is a bulky thing, unlike an inflatable life vest, so where would you stow them? Presumably they would have to form part of the seat back so that they could be secured without having to leave your seat. But many charter flights have such a small seat pitch that passengers would have a hard time getting into the aisle wearing a 'chute. That is assuming they managed to get the straps that go round the thighs fastened while seated.
The only passengers who might manage would be those in first class. That means that in practical terms it wouldn't be worth while supplying parachutes for economy class passengers - which would hardly be good for customer relations.
Antoniemey From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 1680 posts, RR: 4
Reply 22, posted (8 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 4034 times:
Quoting StudentFlyer (Reply 10): Like NAV20 said, ask your girlfriend if she would jump in a case of emergency. She probably will say she would, but in reality, would she really do it? Theoritically, it is easy to say yes to something, but in reality, things easily turn the other way round...
Plus, while a crashing plane could be a good motivator to jump out, it would also severely cut down the time available, so by the time someone decided "OK, safer to jump out of the plane than stay in it", WHAM! you've hit the ground and it doens't matter anymore.
Make something Idiot-proof, and the Universe will make a more inept idiot.
Nzrich From New Zealand, joined Dec 2005, 1527 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (8 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 3903 times:
Yes as said before you cant open the aircraft doors inflight due to air pressure ..The few aircraft that you can and you have to be at a certain speed and height the door will only open a little so you still could not get out ..Secondly by the time the pressure is right to open the door a parachute would be useless ...
"Pride of the pacific"
: There was a Popular Mechanics article back in the early 70's that diagramed a passenger ejection system for commercial airliners. It illustrated how
: welcome back TinkerBelle... I'm going diving this summer.....