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Why No Direct Flights From LGW/LHR/MAN To HNL?  
User currently offlineBa757gla From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2006, 760 posts, RR: 2
Posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 11035 times:

could there be charter flights in future?

62 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineJGPH1A From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 11026 times:

Hawaii has huge numbers of high-spending Far East inbound tourists willing to spend top dollar while they're in the state, and doesn't need low-rent UK package tourists roaming Waikiki in packs in search of an Irish pub and vomiting on the feet of the visiting Japanese. Don't look for the tourism authorities to jump for joy at the idea of letting their state going the way of the Dominican Republic or Barbados.

User currently offlineMutu From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2006, 536 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 11026 times:

I believe back in the early 1990's a Uk tour operator (cant remember who) chartered an Orion Air of America B727 classic, route was STN/MAN/SEA/HNL. It made the papers every day due to delays accumulating over the summer programme at one point being 2 days!!

Not sure the demand would be there? There are numerous routing via LAX on scheduled and US law prohibits a european carrier flying LAX/HNL with revenue


User currently offlineSllevin From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 3376 posts, RR: 6
Reply 3, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 11002 times:

It's unlikely... HNL's just not that interesting a destination for Europeans. They have similar options that aren't half a world away.

Steve


User currently offlineMutu From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2006, 536 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 10979 times:

Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 1):
Hawaii has huge numbers of high-spending Far East inbound tourists willing to spend top dollar while they're in the state, and doesn't need low-rent UK package tourists roaming Waikiki in packs in search of an Irish pub and vomiting on the feet of the visiting Japanese. Don't look for the tourism authorities to jump for joy at the idea of letting their state going the way of the Dominican Republic or Barbados.

Pretty offensive stuff actually. If you feel the need to trash other nationalities find another place to do it. When were you last in Barbados? I think you are confused


User currently offlineIFEMaster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 10934 times:

Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 1):
Hawaii has huge numbers of high-spending Far East inbound tourists willing to spend top dollar while they're in the state, and doesn't need low-rent UK package tourists roaming Waikiki in packs in search of an Irish pub and vomiting on the feet of the visiting Japanese. Don't look for the tourism authorities to jump for joy at the idea of letting their state going the way of the Dominican Republic or Barbados.



Quoting Mutu (Reply 4):
Pretty offensive stuff actually. If you feel the need to trash other nationalities find another place to do it. When were you last in Barbados? I think you are confused

As a Brit now living in California, and having spent plenty of time in Hawaii, mostly in and around Honolulu, I have to agree with JGPH1A.

As soon as you start a direct service from the UK, you get the Club 18-30 type charters or packages. Hawaii doesn't need to be turned in another Ibiza or Lanza-grotty or Tenerife. I've been to both Dom Rep and Barbados, in the height of the high season, and I must admit - the behaviour of many British tourists appalled me.

Well said, JGPH1A.


User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11529 posts, RR: 61
Reply 6, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 10927 times:

IINM, UA used to a have a same-flight (though I think different-plane) service LHR-LAX-HNL. Could be wrong. Either way, though, both AA and UA can easily get you from LHR to Hawaii (HNL, OGG, KOA and LIH) with a single stop in LAX.

User currently offlineEGNR From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2004, 508 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 10918 times:

First Choice Airways mentioned Hawaii as a possible destination when they receive their 787s... London Gatwick to Honolulu.

See...
page 4 of this link
page 2 of this link
page 3 of this link

[Edited 2006-04-12 23:59:21]


7late7, A3latey, Sukhoi Superlate... what's going on?
User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26426 posts, RR: 75
Reply 8, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 10800 times:

Quoting Mutu (Reply 2):
I believe back in the early 1990's a Uk tour operator (cant remember who) chartered an Orion Air of America B727 classic, route was STN/MAN/SEA/HNL.

I would really like to see a 727 make MAN-SEA, let alone SEA-HNL

Quoting Mutu (Reply 4):
Pretty offensive stuff actually. If you feel the need to trash other nationalities find another place to do it. When were you last in Barbados? I think you are confused

He is English, he can say it if he wants

Quoting Commavia (Reply 6):
Either way, though, both AA and UA can easily get you from LHR to Hawaii (HNL, OGG, KOA and LIH) with a single stop in LAX.

Yep, or you can fly LGW-HNL/OGG via IAH with CO, LGW-HNL via EWR with CO, LGW-HNL via ATL with DL, etc.

Quoting FlyCaledonian (Reply 8):
Why go to Hawaii to see Yanks with their guts hanging out, stuffing extra extra large big Macs in their mouths and eyeing up the prostitutes on the street corners of the main beach road?

I think you just combined Florida and Las Vegas without actually mentioning Hawai'i  Silly



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineBristolFlyer From United Kingdom, joined May 2004, 2290 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 10793 times:

Quoting IFEMaster (Reply 5):
Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 1):
Hawaii has huge numbers of high-spending Far East inbound tourists willing to spend top dollar while they're in the state, and doesn't need low-rent UK package tourists roaming Waikiki in packs in search of an Irish pub and vomiting on the feet of the visiting Japanese. Don't look for the tourism authorities to jump for joy at the idea of letting their state going the way of the Dominican Republic or Barbados.



Quoting Mutu (Reply 4):
Pretty offensive stuff actually. If you feel the need to trash other nationalities find another place to do it. When were you last in Barbados? I think you are confused

As a Brit now living in California, and having spent plenty of time in Hawaii, mostly in and around Honolulu, I have to agree with JGPH1A.

As soon as you start a direct service from the UK, you get the Club 18-30 type charters or packages. Hawaii doesn't need to be turned in another Ibiza or Lanza-grotty or Tenerife. I've been to both Dom Rep and Barbados, in the height of the high season, and I must admit - the behaviour of many British tourists appalled me.

Well said, JGPH1A.

Yep, I agree as well, as much as it pains me to (I'm proud of my British background). I am ashamed at some of the things that go on in some of those European destinations full of Brits. I know there are plenty of exceptions but there are a big number of Brits who drop all their morals, standards and manners (and pants) just cos they're in another country for a few weeks.

BF



Fortune favours the brave
User currently offlineFlyDreamliner From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 2759 posts, RR: 15
Reply 10, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 10764 times:

Honestly, if I were from Britain, I'm not sure I'd have a good reason to go to Hawaii. Yes, Hawaii is nice, horifically over commericalized, and there are plenty of Americans misbehaving there already. If I were leaving Britain, I'd think maybe about the Canary islands, the Carribbean, Seychelles. Heck, I'm in the US, i can catch a direct to HNL, and its not my first choice beach destination.


"Let the world change you, and you can change the world"
User currently offlineIFEMaster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 10714 times:

Quoting FlyDreamliner (Reply 12):
Honestly, if I were from Britain, I'm not sure I'd have a good reason to go to Hawaii. Yes, Hawaii is nice, horifically over commericalized, and there are plenty of Americans misbehaving there already. If I were leaving Britain, I'd think maybe about the Canary islands, the Carribbean, Seychelles. Heck, I'm in the US, i can catch a direct to HNL, and its not my first choice beach destination.

In all fairness, outside of The Big Island and O'ahu, Hawaii has beauty to rival that of Seychelles. There are plenty of secluded, unspoiled places that feel like a million miles from the throbbing masses of the commercial areas.

Yes, Waikiki is somewhat unpleasant these days, as is a lot of Honolulu, but I travel on a budget, and I've been to places in Hawaii that could be anywhere in the world. I like the lonely, secluded feel when I'm on holiday. I like to feel a million files from anyone else, in the middle of nowhere, and then I can just fully relax. Hawaii can and does offer that. You just have to look harder. And it's all just a 6 hour plane ride from me.

Tell you what, though...Fiji is my next destination, and I've heard it blows Hawaii away.


User currently offlineBigGSFO From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2920 posts, RR: 6
Reply 12, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 10631 times:

The late great Western Airlines used to operate same-plane HNL-ANC-LGW with DC10's in the 80's. I miss that airline.  Smile

User currently offlineTwoLz2Rn From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 450 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 10624 times:

why fly half way across the world when they can fly to Dubai and get the same thing that HNL offers...and cheaper...

User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11529 posts, RR: 61
Reply 14, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 10566 times:

Quoting N1120A (Reply 10):
Yep, or you can fly LGW-HNL/OGG via IAH with CO, LGW-HNL via EWR with CO, LGW-HNL via ATL with DL, etc.

None of those connecting points offer sameday connections westbound, at least not right now.


User currently offlineDagolden1 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 49 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 10529 times:

Quoting FlyCaledonian (Reply 8):



Quoting FlyCaledonian (Reply 8):
Why go to Hawaii to see Yanks with their guts hanging out, stuffing super size big Macs in their mouths and eyeing up the prostitutes on the street corners of the main beach road?

Hope that offends nobody!

Having been to Honolulu a few times the thing that I found the most ironic was the amount of Japanese people there. I'm guessing mostly tourist, but I kinda tripped out when I noticed that.


User currently offlineSLCUT2777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 4050 posts, RR: 11
Reply 16, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 10422 times:

Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 1):
Hawaii has huge numbers of high-spending Far East inbound tourists willing to spend top dollar while they're in the state, and doesn't need low-rent UK package tourists roaming Waikiki in packs in search of an Irish pub and vomiting on the feet of the visiting Japanese. Don't look for the tourism authorities to jump for joy at the idea of letting their state going the way of the Dominican Republic or Barbados.

I highly doubt Hawaii can ever become the cheap tourist mecca for the British that the Dominican Republic or Barbados is. Labor rates for hotels in Hawaii must be 20 times what it is in the DR, and the last I checked none of the hotels/resorts offered the European style of all-inclusive packages that makes the DR so popular amongst the Britt's, the Canucks and other Europeans (including the French!) looking for a warm weather holiday.  laughing   rotfl   rotfl 



DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26426 posts, RR: 75
Reply 17, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 10414 times:

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 18):
the last I checked none of the hotels/resorts offered the European style of all-inclusive packages that makes the DR so popular amongst the Britt's, the Canucks and other Europeans (including the French!) looking for a warm weather holiday.

There are plenty of Air and Car inclusive packages into Hawai'i, though not many that include food as well.



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineSLCUT2777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 4050 posts, RR: 11
Reply 18, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 10376 times:

Quoting N1120A (Reply 19):
There are plenty of Air and Car inclusive packages into Hawai'i, though not many that include food as well.

That is my point! Hawaii is MUCH pricier than the Dominican Republic and even further away than all but the Pacific and much of the Mountain Times zones in the USA. For example, SLC is about 6 hours form SDQ, POP or PUJ in the DR if DL flew there direct. HNL, KOA and OGG are all 7-8 hours from SLC on DL direct flights. Just thought I'd throw in that geographical oddity, pointed out to me by an ex-girlfrined from Canada who went from YYC to POP on a SkyService Signature trip last year.



DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
User currently offlineIrobertson From Canada, joined Apr 2006, 601 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 10373 times:

How far exactly is the direct non-stop route from say Gatwick to Honolulu? Would you have to go over the poles or a direct line over asia? Something tells me that you'd need to have a pretty damn fuel efficient airplane on that route, like a 777ER or something. Hell, LHR to LAX is quite the long haul. Just thinking outloud here...

User currently offlineDL787932ER From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 597 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 10358 times:

Quoting Commavia (Reply 16):

None of those connecting points offer sameday connections westbound, at least not right now.

At least DL has a same day connection via ATL westbound LGW-ATL-HNL; I don't know about the others. It's a different story eastbound as the Hawaii-ATL and ATL-LGW flights are both overnighters, but other airlines may be different. If one were going London-Hawaii, it might even be worth doing the return via HNL-NRT-LGW/LHR, just to say you made it all the way around the world.

In any case, I agree with the above posters that similar beach resort destinations are available much closer to the UK than Hawaii, so Hawaii is much more attractive to American and Japanese tourists than Europeans.



F L Y D E L T A J E T S
User currently offlineSLCUT2777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 4050 posts, RR: 11
Reply 21, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 10342 times:

Quoting Irobertson (Reply 21):
How far exactly is the direct non-stop route from say Gatwick to Honolulu? Would you have to go over the poles or a direct line over Asia? Something tells me that you'd need to have a pretty damn fuel efficient airplane on that route, like a 777ER or something. Hell, LHR to LAX is quite the long haul. Just thinking out-loud here...

My thoughts the same. A pretty long flight over the pole to get from LGW, LHR to HNL direct. It would take at least 14-18 hours in the air to make such a flight. How far is it form Paris (CDG) to Tahiti (PPT)? That has to be a similar haul.



DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11529 posts, RR: 61
Reply 22, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 10329 times:

Quoting DL787932ER (Reply 22):
At least DL has a same day connection via ATL westbound LGW-ATL-HNL

You are correct about that, my mistake. DL offers a same-day connection LGW-ATL-HNL.


User currently offlineSLCUT2777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 4050 posts, RR: 11
Reply 23, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 10321 times:

Quoting DL787932ER (Reply 22):
In any case, I agree with the above posters that similar beach resort destinations are available much closer to the UK than Hawaii, so Hawaii is much more attractive to American and Japanese tourists than Europeans

Especially western North Americans from the 11 western US states and BC and Alberta north of the 49th. For the Canucks I'm amazed that both Signature and SunQuest don't offer much of anything over there. In the case of YVR the Hawaiian Islands are closer than the DR.



DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
User currently offlineORDPIA From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 140 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 10317 times:

Quoting Irobertson (Reply 21):
How far exactly is the direct non-stop route from say Gatwick to Honolulu? Would you have to go over the poles or a direct line over asia? Something tells me that you'd need to have a pretty damn fuel efficient airplane on that route, like a 777ER or something. Hell, LHR to LAX is quite the long haul. Just thinking outloud here...



7237mi quite a long flight indeed



Concorde 146 727 737 73G 742 744 752 753 762 763 772 773 300 319 320 321 343 346 CRJ ERJ ATR ATP CL604 LJ45 LJ60 BD700
25 PanAm747 : Every time that I have been to Hawai'i, I have encountered a few Europeans. It is not a cheap holiday; it is an exotic destination that they have a se
26 Post contains images N1120A : 6311nm, doable with several long haul aircraft. Routing is not quite polar but very northern Well, no, pretty damn fuel efficient airplanes wouldn't
27 BCAL : Initially they used DC10-10s which not only necessitated an en-route fuel stop (which I believe was at ANC) but severely limited the load so the plan
28 Ba757gla : what about a 3 times weekly 767-300 LGW-ANC-HNL?
29 Laxintl : Hate to tell you, however there simply is not much of a market between Europe and Hawaii. The place is simply too far to be competitive. Here are som
30 CHRISBA777ER : The A340-500 could do it. IMHO LHR/LGW - HNL is a route VS would possibly be able to make work for them. The A340-600 should be able to do it without
31 Koruman : The thing is, Hawaii costs as much as French Polynesia but is a squillion times less scenic, sophisticated and romantic. PPT is a good and popular sto
32 Gkirk : If you want to get to Hawaii, it's easy enough to get to. As long as you don't mind stopping in JFK/EWR/ATL/ORD/LAX or SFO
33 Zkpilot : True for most of that except the LHR-LAX-HNL part. The flight was and still is AKL-LAX-LHR-LAX-AKL. NZ used to also operate a AKL-HNL-LAX-HNL-AKL ser
34 Post contains images ANCFlyer : Might be offensive, but it's spot on. Check out the Hilton Hawaiian Village next time you're in Honolulu . . . and check out the long haul 747s at HN
35 MainMAN : It is offensive, but I wouldn't worry about it too much. If he was talking about Faliraki, I'd be inclined to agree, but Barbados and the DR? That's
36 Post contains images RichardPrice : I disagree, its painfully true Brits suck on holiday, thats just the way of it. Infact, a typical saturday night out in the UK will also see many of
37 Pawsleykat : Doesn't that flight go via LAX? My aunt went to Tahiti with AF and that flight stopped over in LAX. JG
38 Highguy76 : Didn't Hawaiian Airlines used to fly a one stop from MAN several years ago? Highguy76
39 Post contains images CHRISBA777ER : They only use A343s - they cannot do CDG-PPT non-stop. All their flights go via JFK or LAX. There was talk of them getting a pair of A345s to do it N
40 StarGoldLHR : Or striking french men with placards moaning about the lack of state aid.
41 StarGoldLHR : Agreed.. name me one successful French colony ?
42 Post contains images Justplanecrazy : You don't know Hawaii.Ive been to Tahiti and Hawaii and they are both very beautiful but there's lots more to see and do in Hawaii,active volcanoes,t
43 Justplanecrazy : Also Hawaii has more visitors in a day than Tahiti has in a year,yet Tahiti is only 3 hours extra flying time away from the w coast of the US.
44 StarGoldLHR : As a brit who used to live in California, I think you used to be one of the 18-30's chavs who pretend your above it by living in California and telli
45 CRGsFuture : Not only more to do, but cheaper. In Tahiti the prices are through the roof, at Hawaii it is a little more reasonable.
46 Seamefly : With a 2nd HNL service leaves so late from SEA (around 5pm), NW's AMS-SEA makes it possible for same day connection too.
47 Ba757gla : how long does it take to fly from LAX/SEA/SFO to HNL?
48 Jfr : Europe to Hawaii is like talking to my Kiwi friends about the Caribbean. Too hard, lah!
49 CXB744 : United stills has direct service, with a plane change, from LHR. UA 934/935 LHR-LAX-HNL. Equipment: B777-200ER (LAX-LHR), B767-300ER (LAX-HNL). I've
50 StarGoldLHR : 12 hours to SFO, about 6 Hours to HNL. Done it many times. There are infinite connections from London to Hawaii.. leading to a combined flying time of
51 Dutchjet : Its really funny and curious as to how often this subject comes up here at a.net - the London-Hawaii connection - I guess its because connecting Londo
52 KYAir : Don't the Germans have some fascination with Hawaii? I remember reading a story several years ago, in the DL inflight magazine coincidentally, about h
53 Laxintl : If it is, certainly not many make the trip. In 2004 of 7 million visitors 1.6% being European, only about 28.000 were German.
54 IFEMaster : I think you don't have a clue what you're talking about with an idiotic comment like that. First, I'm 27, so I fall within that 18-30 age bracket. Se
55 Ua2162 : I'm doing it one stop in June on UA (KOA-SFO-LHR). I have a short layover in SFO (less than three hours.) Pretty easy, I do say so myself. I really do
56 HALFA : On the contrary, Europeans would be flocking here if it weren't such a long trip, and so costly for them. What similar options do they have in Europe
57 Sllevin : Actually, I'm not sure anything to the 777LR and A345 can do it reliably LGW-HNL. Reason being that since there are no midpoint alternates for fuel b
58 Max Q : Well, as far as offensive behaviour on holiday/vacation goes no nation has a monopoly on that. Plenty of LOUD and obnoxious Americans out there enjoyi
59 VV701 : Why No Direct Flights From LGW/LHR/MAN To HNL? One answer for LGW/LHR and indeed STN and LTN is that the Bermuda 2 agreement includes two lists of US
60 N1120A : Tahiti is one. Only via LAX, JFK is stand alone
61 Carduelis : BA used to have regular three times a week 707 services to Honolulu in the Sixties as part of their unique around the world services. The routing was
62 Post contains images Arsenal@LHR : The distance is too great and the cost is too much, same reason why not many Brits go to Fiji, it is far away and expensive for a 10-14 day break. Bes
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