Thowman From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2004, 363 posts, RR: 3 Posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 7459 times:
The northwest stack to LHR is based around the VOR at BNN (Bovingdon). Most of the traffic in the stack is either transatlantic (BA, Virgin, AC, UA, AA, IA...) or UK domestic flights (BA, BD and Aer Lingus, and odd things like the Qantas 744 which appears from time to time, probably doing the leg down from MAN to LHR? I live right underneath the stack, and recently purchased an airband radio to listen to the traffic passing overhead and circling the town I live in.
One thing that has stuck out has been that the pilots US based carriers, namely AA and UA, when conversing with ATC always call it "Bovington" rather than "Bovingdon", in spite of the fact that ATC and all other traffic say "Bovingdon".
Is it named incorrectly on US charts or something?
Thowman From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2004, 363 posts, RR: 3
Reply 5, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 7387 times:
Quoting Cedarjet (Reply 4): thought Qantas stopped that route ages ago? They used to do it with 747s, then it was a dedicated BA 737 from T4, and they also used that Flightline 146 (seen below flying under a QF callsign).
There was definetely one in the stack yesterday morning at about 10am. It could have been moved over to BNN from LAM if that stack was full?
Funnily enough, the VOR is actually sited on a fromer USAF airbase from the WWII era - so they should know how it's spelt . Interesting fact, it was where Glenn Miller's plane that dissappeared took off from.
BDL2DCA From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 314 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 7307 times:
Quoting Thowman (Reply 5): Funnily enough, the VOR is actually sited on a fromer USAF airbase from the WWII era
Can you name any pilots who were in the USAF during WW II and who are now flying for commercial airlines with a FAA pilot's license?
Also, the english phonemes for 'd' and 't' are positionally the same in the mouth. They are both alveolar plosives. The difference is that a 'd' is "voiced" and a 't' is "voiceless." It makes it very easy for imprecise pronunciation.
My linguistics professor in college made a point of teaching the class about the difference by asking a bunch of us to pronounce the words "ladder" and "letter." They should have distinct consonant sounds in the middle, but my lazy nutmegger accent makes "letter" sound like "ledder."
I'd imagine the same thing is going on. American place names mostly end in 'ton,' so I'd imagine the pilots are unused to making the distinction between 'ton' and 'don.' They may not even realize that they are pronouncing it with a clear 't' sound because of the linguistic similarities of the phonemes.
DrExotica From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 176 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 7202 times:
Part of this may stem from the lack of cities in the US that end in "don"; personally, I cannot think of one (other than New London, Conneticut). There are more cities that end in "ton" though (e.g., Wilmington, Canton, Scranton).
Thowman From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2004, 363 posts, RR: 3
Reply 18, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 7022 times:
Quoting IFEMaster (Reply 14): That's inaccurate. Glen Miller's final flight took off from Twinwoods in Bedfordshire.
OK, so I got it a bit wrong. However, he did visit there. The Wikipedia entry for Bovingdon is quite interesting. Seems it was the home to several Film Stars in the USAF, Clark Gable, James Stewart etc.
Antoniemey From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 1773 posts, RR: 4
Reply 21, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 6929 times:
Quoting Noelg (Reply 2): It's the same as getting an American to pronounce "Birmingham" or "Nottingham" - it's always "Bir - ming - HAM" or "Nodding - HAM" Wink
They just don't get it, bless 'em! Smile
That would be because we have our own Birmingham and it is pronounced Birming-ham, rather than "Birming-am."
Quoting DrExotica (Reply 11): Part of this may stem from the lack of cities in the US that end in "don"; personally, I cannot think of one (other than New London, Conneticut). There are more cities that end in "ton" though (e.g., Wilmington, Canton, Scranton).
No major cities ending in "Don", no, but there is a little town in Tennessee called "Huntingdon." Throws me for a loop every time because you just don't see that very often in the US.
Make something Idiot-proof, and the Universe will make a more inept idiot.
Olympus69 From Canada, joined Jun 2002, 1737 posts, RR: 7
Reply 23, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 6733 times:
I think it ill behooves the British to criticize the less linguistically challenged English speakers (Americans and Canadians), when they themselves are quite possibly the world's worst word manglers. A good example is Wuster for Worcester. Another is 'Hants' as an abbreviation for Hampshire. Anyone who doesn't know that Hampshire is itself an abbreviation - for Hamptonshire, is bound to be confused. Also, just because they are too lazy to pronounce the 'H' in Birmingham, that doesn't make it right. I won't even bother to get into the residents of the Manchester area, who don't seem to have heard of the letter 'T'
The British may have invented the English language, but it's a pity they didn't leave it alone after they invented it.
VV701 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 8387 posts, RR: 25
Reply 24, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 6712 times:
Quoting Olympus69 (Reply 23): I think it ill behooves the British to criticize the less linguistically challenged English speakers (Americans and Canadians), when they themselves are quite possibly the world's worst word manglers.
Quite. The correct pronunciation of 'Wrotham' (in Kent) is root-ham while the surname Featherstonehaugh is pronounced fan-sure!
: Quite. The correct pronunciation of 'Wimbledon' is Wimble-Don (not Wimble-Ton), and 'Bovingdon' is pronounced Bov-ing-Don. Blame the right people.
: Worcester, Mass. If you can pronounce it right, 90% chance youre from new england :P
: Sorry, but in 28 years of living in the US and Canada I have never heard WimbleDon called Wimbleton. Maybe you just don't understand north american ac
: I, myself, am still trying to find the F in "Lieutenant."
: Really? My grandfather has a Oklahoma accent and it's definately Wimble-ton, and hell, that's even how I say it. It's difficult to change pronouciati
: They still use it I believe. Japan Airlines radio callsign is Japan Air. Actually, they say it right in England too, where there is also a Worcester.
: My original post wasn't so much about the occasional mispronunciation, but the regular incorrect saying of Bovingdon. I was listening again this morni