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When Will TSA Standardize Their Shoe Screening?  
User currently offlineDeltaGator From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 6341 posts, RR: 13
Posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 3831 times:

I just cleared security here in RDU heading home to ATL and I'm really starting to get annoyed with TSA's lack of standards on screening shoes. On travel days I change into jeans and tennis shoes before leaving the office for comfort and the lack of metal in those shoes. I stepped up to the metal detector and was told that it is "recommended" that I remove my shoes. I asked if I didn't would I get additional screening to which I was told "it's up to you." I left my shoes on and sure enough I got pushed off to the side for the shoe rubdown and bomb sniffer.

Of course I was now a little bit miffed and let my temper show some. I should have just taken my damn shoes off and been done with it. I asked the supervisor why TSA can't do the same thing across the board and he had no answer other than to tell me it was "genetics that made me grumpy." Probably so but why can't they standardize on something? Airport to airport differs and it drives me crazy when trying to make a flight. Either make us take all our shoes off at every airport or don't Enough of this "we recommend" crap!


"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
30 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineLuv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12123 posts, RR: 49
Reply 1, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 3831 times:
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I have to agree as I have the same thing happen to me here in CLE all the time. Other lanes all going through with the shoes on and my lane being made to take them off.


You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlinePanAm747 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 4242 posts, RR: 8
Reply 2, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 3817 times:

Quote:
When will the TSA standardize their shoe screening?

A) When the Dixie Chicks perform at a Bush family BBQ,

B) When Southwest flies the 747-800,

C) When Southern Californians realize they have a looming airport crisis and pull their heads out of their a**es to do something about it, or

D) When religious conservatives/evangelicals of EVERY form of realize that God loves EVERYONE equally.

Did I forget to offend anybody?  flamed 



Pan Am:The World's Most Experienced Airline - P(oor) S(ailor's) A(irline): San Diego's Hometown Airline-Catch Our Smile!
User currently offlineSNATH From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 3247 posts, RR: 22
Reply 3, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 3783 times:

Quoting PanAm747 (Reply 2):

Did I forget to offend anybody?

Well, you could have added some cartoons on your post for extra effect...  Wink

Tony  duck 



Nikon: we don't want more pixels, we want better pixels.
User currently offlineFlyBaby From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 92 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 3776 times:

BWI is the same way. Take your shoes off or it's a strip search.

User currently offlineFXramper From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 7313 posts, RR: 85
Reply 5, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 3776 times:
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Last time I flew a man walked through screening wearing boots and wasn't asked to remove them, but a woman in a business suit, stockings, and heels was asked to remove her shoes for screening. They wanded them and made her sit and wait. She got a run in her stockings walking around without her heels on and was pissed to no ends at TSA for unfair screening in her eyes. I never get the dreaded SSSS mark!  Smile


I miss the old Anet.
User currently offlineUtapao From Thailand, joined Jul 2005, 645 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 3761 times:

Quoting DeltaGator (Thread starter):
why can't they standardize on something?

Just a thought... but if they standardized on not screening shoes, or not having pax removing jackets, or whatever, wouldn't that just enable anyone wishing to bypass security procedures to stash it in their shoes or lining of coats, knowing they're not going to check those?

I agree it's a pain. But I just assume the less I walk though with the better off I am. I do have my days where I zone out and walk though with cell phone clipped on, back up, take it off, then proceed through with a pocketful of change, or pens, etc.  confused 



Sawasdee khrab!
User currently offlineSNATH From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 3247 posts, RR: 22
Reply 7, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 3727 times:

Quoting Utapao (Reply 6):

I believe the complaint are due to the fact that in some places they force you to take your shoes off, and in some others they don't (whether "places" are different airports or different security lines in the same airport).

Sometime ago, I was at BOS (I think...) and someone asked the TSA guy whether he should take his shoes off or not. The answer was "The less you have on you, and the smaller the probability of setting the alarm off, the better." I think this is the only honest answer the TSA guys should give, not "you don't have to take your shoes off... oh, now we have to search you."

I'm now used to this; just buy a pair of shoes you can easily take off and put back on. It makes life much easier...

Tony

[Edited 2006-04-21 21:50:58]


Nikon: we don't want more pixels, we want better pixels.
User currently offlineUAL Bagsmasher From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 2148 posts, RR: 10
Reply 8, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 3680 times:

Did anyone ever think the unpredictability factor might just be an intentional thing? The harder it is to predict screening, the harder it is to sneak something past. I too hate the shoes on/off uncertainty. But if it means stopping some...person....(have to be P.C. these days) from causing harm to a planeload of pax, then I don't have a problem with it.

User currently offlineTheGreatChecko From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 1130 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 3669 times:

Quoting UAL Bagsmasher (Reply 8):
Did anyone ever think the unpredictability factor might just be an intentional thing?

DITTO, thats exactly why its done. It might not be convenient but grin and bear it or buy some really thin soled Addidas, I haven't been asked to take one of those off yet.

GreatChecko



"A pilot's plane she is. She will love you if you deserve it, and try to kill you if you don't...She is the Mighty Q400"
User currently offlineLuv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12123 posts, RR: 49
Reply 10, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 3662 times:
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Quoting TheGreatChecko (Reply 9):
or buy some really thin soled Addidas, I haven't been asked to take one of those off yet.

I have!



You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineSNATH From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 3247 posts, RR: 22
Reply 11, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 3650 times:

Quoting UAL Bagsmasher (Reply 8):
Did anyone ever think the unpredictability factor might just be an intentional thing?

How is the unpredictability of "you might or might not have to take your shoes off" is better than "you have to take your shoes off"?

Tony



Nikon: we don't want more pixels, we want better pixels.
User currently offlineBond007 From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 5432 posts, RR: 8
Reply 12, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 3634 times:

I never did understand why some get so upset over these 'shoe' inconsistencies.

Sure, the TSA is inconsistent, but the bottom line is, is you leave them on then you risk having secondary screening...simple.

Quoting DeltaGator (Thread starter):
I should have just taken my damn shoes off and been done with it.

Yep, you should have.

I fly twice a week, every week, and my sole purpose (no pun intended!), is to get through TSA as soon as possible. That means removing my shoes every time and not worrying about what today's TSA policy is at this airport. It works every time  Smile


Jimbo



I'd rather be on the ground wishing I was in the air, than in the air wishing I was on the ground!
User currently offlineFLY2LIM From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1185 posts, RR: 10
Reply 13, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 3634 times:

Quoting PanAm747 (Reply 2):
A) When the Dixie Chicks perform at a Bush family BBQ,

B) When Southwest flies the 747-800,

C) When Southern Californians realize they have a looming airport crisis and pull their heads out of their a**es to do something about it, or

D) When religious conservatives/evangelicals of EVERY form of realize that God loves EVERYONE equally.

Did I forget to offend anybody?

Classic, just classic!!!!

Quoting DeltaGator (Thread starter):
Of course I was now a little bit miffed and let my temper show some. I should have just taken my damn shoes off and been done with it. I asked the supervisor why TSA can't do the same thing across the board and he had no answer other than to tell me it was "genetics that made me grumpy." Probably so but why can't they standardize on something? Airport to airport differs and it drives me crazy when trying to make a flight. Either make us take all our shoes off at every airport or don't Enough of this "we recommend" crap!

A couple of suggestions. Has it occured to you that you should control your temper, perhaps? You travel a lot, is having to take your shoes off a new thing to you? Why does this make you angry, or give you a temper?
Does anyone think that THEY can get the TSA "supervisor" (loosely use term in most situations) to take their suggestion and make a significant change in the system? How many times does the TSA Sup hear these suggestions?
Finally, I would hate to live in a system where everything is mechanical and standarized and operates the same way. Imagine, treating the traffic at JFK the same way as the traffic at SMF, for example. Different airport, different volume, different reality. As a school teacher, I am supposed to test my students with the identical test that all students in California use, and I believe that "one size does not fit all" when it comes to people.

Quoting SNATH (Reply 7):
Sometime ago, I was at BOS (I think...) and someone asked the TSA guy whether he should take his shoes off or not. The answer was "The less you have on you, and the smaller the probability of setting the alarm off, the better." I think this is the only honest answer the TSA guys should give, not "you don't have to take your shoes off... oh, now we have to search you."

Why is it that people who are experienced in travel (like a.net members are) don't show up prepared for a flight. I wear clothes that are easy to remove, including my Land's End mocs that are also very comfortable for long flights. By the time my family and I reach the X-ray machine, we are almost naked. We don't act up, get angry, ask questions, and we usually fly through the line. There are others that are like us, so we are not unique nor are we wiser. However, I don't know why others don't show common sense.

Quoting SNATH (Reply 7):
I'm now used to this; just buy a pair of shoes you can easily take off and put back on. It makes life much easier...

Yep, as mentioned, I love my Land's End mocs.  Smile

FLY2LIM



Faucett. La primera linea aerea del Peru.
User currently offlineSNATH From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 3247 posts, RR: 22
Reply 14, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 3609 times:

Quoting FLY2LIM (Reply 13):
Yep, as mentioned, I love my Land's End mocs.

That's exactly what I used to wear on flights... Unfortunately, they are really not very sturdy and they started falling apart quite quickly (or I travel too much!). I recently got a new pair (Eccos perhaps?) that are very similar and made of much better and sturdier material. They were more expensive, but I'm pretty happy with them

Quoting FLY2LIM (Reply 13):
However, I don't know why others don't show common sense.

You expect common sense? On this board?  rotfl 

Tony



Nikon: we don't want more pixels, we want better pixels.
User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26626 posts, RR: 75
Reply 15, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 3606 times:

This is definately a pet peeve of mine. At MSY, they always give us the "remove your shoes or be subject to additional screening" run-around. At LAX, OXR, BOS, MDW, BUF and OAK (most recently used airports), they say no such things and often give passengers their opinion on whether shoes will set off the alarm or not. In fact, I believe the CFR was altered to note that removing shoes is no longer compulsory.


Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineLonghornmaniac From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 3335 posts, RR: 45
Reply 16, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 3606 times:

Just something I was told:

When was going back through security after clearing customs at DFW, going home to Austin from Cancun, the TSA lady said, as others have pointed out "I RECOMMEND you take your shoes off and put them through the x-ray machine." I don't understand why they can't just say, "take you're damn shoes off and put them through the x-ray machine." Its certainly much easier and there's less gray area.

Now, to the point. I was told that they recommend that shoes with soles 1 inch or more go through the x-ray machine, because its possible to conceal something in the sole. (a la Shoe Bomber) She even mentioned him, (I thought any form of the word BOMB was strictly forbidden in the airport  duck  )

Hope this helps.

Cheers,
Cameron


User currently offlineIAirAllie From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 3549 times:

Quoting Bond007 (Reply 12):
That means removing my shoes every time and not worrying about what today's TSA policy is at this airport. It works every time

Yeah I used to follow that philosophy too until I got screamed at not once but three separate times for taking OFF my shoes. "MA'AM MA'MA YOU DON'T HAVE TO TAKE OFF YOUR SHOES" At the point they start barking this at me my shoes are already off so it is more hassle to just put them back on. me "I know but I'm crew and I know they set off the alarm" "BUT YOU DON'T HAVE TOO" me "fine but they are off already" "BUT YOU DON'T HAVE TOO" then they will grab them and thrust them back out me and single me out for screening out of spite. Argh!


User currently offlineSllevin From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 3376 posts, RR: 6
Reply 18, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 3529 times:

From what I see (and I wear tennis shoes typically) the rule is, "you don't have to take off your shoes, but if you don't take them off, we'll conduct a secondary search in which you'll have to take off your shoes."

Steve


User currently offlineMidnightMike From United States of America, joined Mar 2003, 2892 posts, RR: 14
Reply 19, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 3509 times:

Quoting DeltaGator (Thread starter):
Of course I was now a little bit miffed and let my temper show some. I should have just taken my damn shoes off and been done with it. I asked the supervisor why TSA can't do the same thing across the board and he had no answer other than to tell me it was "genetics that made me grumpy." Probably so but why can't they standardize on something? Airport to airport differs and it drives me crazy when trying to make a flight. Either make us take all our shoes off at every airport or don't Enough of this "we recommend" crap!

It is done intentionally, as part of the 9/11 investigation they found out that the 9/11 terrorist flew the system to learn how Security operated, so, the TSA constanly changes how they operate. So, at some airports, you take off your shoes, while others you don't.



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User currently offlineDeltaGator From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 6341 posts, RR: 13
Reply 20, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 3388 times:

Quoting SNATH (Reply 7):
I believe the complaint are due to the fact that in some places they force you to take your shoes off, and in some others they don't (whether "places" are different airports or different security lines in the same airport).

Yes. Why not just make us take our shoes off across the board at all airports?

Quoting TheGreatChecko (Reply 9):
Quoting UAL Bagsmasher (Reply 8):
Did anyone ever think the unpredictability factor might just be an intentional thing?

DITTO, thats exactly why its done. It might not be convenient but grin and bear it or buy some really thin soled Addidas, I haven't been asked to take one of those off yet.

There's no randomness to the certain airports making everyone take off their shoes and others not. I specifically travel in tennis shoes or my "airport friendly" dress loafers to have one less thing to worry about. I put my watch, wedding band, change, and cell phones all in my backpack before I ever even approach the line so I'm good to go.

Quoting N1120A (Reply 15):
This is definately a pet peeve of mine. At MSY, they always give us the "remove your shoes or be subject to additional screening" run-around. At LAX, OXR, BOS, MDW, BUF and OAK (most recently used airports), they say no such things and often give passengers their opinion on whether shoes will set off the alarm or not. In fact, I believe the CFR was altered to note that removing shoes is no longer compulsory.

We agree again.  biggrin  Are you rubbing off on me? Please say I won't become a liberal!

Quoting MidnightMike (Reply 19):
the 9/11 terrorist flew the system to learn how Security operated, so, the TSA constanly changes how they operate.

I would completely disagree. TSA hardly changes anything up at the airports I go through. It is the same thing week after week.

Quoting MidnightMike (Reply 19):
So, at some airports, you take off your shoes, while others you don't.

Do you see the stupidness of this practice? If I'm one of the bad guys then I just go to an airport where they won't make me take my shoes off.


Perhaps this issue will go away when airports start getting the puffers in bigger numbers and can sniff it on you.



"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
User currently offlineFlying_727 From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 439 posts, RR: 5
Reply 21, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 3376 times:

You could just take off your shoes everytime that way you don't have to worry about it, its done and over with and that way, for you, it will always be uniform.


On ATA, You're On Vacation
User currently offlineFLAIRPORT From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 3332 times:

I don't see the problem here....I just take my shoes off no matter what! Now, this fall in BDL I might have a problem with the new machine as I am not fond of stepping into the thing to get a puff of air...I'd much rather recieve a hand screening, but thats just me.

User currently offlineIAirAllie From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 3217 times:

See my above post. There are screeners that will hassle you for REMOVING shoes.

I did the new screening at LHR. It isn't any faster. you have to pose 3 different ways and they take pictures to see if you are packing heat under your clothes.


User currently offlineApodino From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 4288 posts, RR: 6
Reply 24, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 3201 times:

The TSA in my hometown of ATW has it right. They have a little stool type thing that you can put your foot on before the checkpoint. If it goes off, you should remove your shoes before walking through the magnetometer. If it doesn't you have nothing to worry about.

If they did this in every airport in the country, we wouldn't even be having this discussion.


25 Post contains images Bond007 : Well, I'm not disagreeing that might be the case, but in flying almost every single week since 9/11, domestic US different airports, I have never, ev
26 Flywithken : I cant agree more with the original post... Ive been asked to take my flip flops off before at some airports but allowed to wear my running shoes thro
27 Post contains images Cgnnrw : I too think its totally stupid and worthless to have people remove their shoes. What I find strange is TSA encourages you to wear tennis shoes/sneaker
28 FlyingNanook : I really don't understand what the big deal is. Can some people just not handle the uncertainty of whether or not they have to take their shoes off? I
29 Cgnnrw : The problem is when you do ask you seldom get a "yes" or "no" for an answer. It's usaually a wishy-washy "if I were you..." or "well its up to you...
30 Post contains images FLY2LIM : CLASSIC AGAIN!!!! Tony, welcome to my RU list. Imagine if you removed the "gray area" from the government bureaucracy. How many people would simply l
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