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Longest 777-300 NON- ER Nonstop Flight  
User currently offlineAmirs From Israel, joined Dec 2003, 1333 posts, RR: 4
Posted (8 years 3 months 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 12871 times:

With the exclusive deal that was signed between GE and Boeing, a few airlines are reluctant to order the 773ER since they have RR powered 772 in their fleets. I was just wondering if it would be worthwhile for these airlines to order 773 (non-ER) with Trent 800 or PW 4098's. I am sure these planes still have a long range.
An airline like LY, It would probably put any 773 on the NYC, LHR, MIA, HKG, and BKK route.
Does the non-ER have the range for HKG, NYC YYZ nonstop from TLV? Will it be done efficiently and economically? It looks like it has the range for all except MIA.
The range for a 773 is 5729 nm.
TLV - HKG on LY is about 4435nm
TLV - BKK on LY is about 4918 nm
TLV - NYC is about 4934nm
TLV - YZZ is about 5030 nm
TLV - MIA is about 5738 nm
These are all 10 hours + flights ( this is what I added in the edit)
What airlines use their nonER on long haul flights?

[Edited 2006-04-22 22:20:14]

40 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineB742 From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2005, 3766 posts, RR: 19
Reply 1, posted (8 years 3 months 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 12860 times:

Well EK use their 773's on routes such as: (or have used)
DXB-LHR 3420 mi
DXB-SIN 3633 mi
SIN-SYD 3907 mi

Rob!  wave 


User currently offlineAvianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5922 posts, RR: 40
Reply 2, posted (8 years 3 months 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 12831 times:

Quoting Amirs (Thread starter):
The range for a 773 is 5729 nm.
TLV - HKG on LY is about 4435nm
TLV - BKK on LY is about 4918 nm
TLV - NYC is about 4934nm
TLV - YZZ is about 5030 nm
TLV - MIA is about 5738 nm

Amirs, your distances for HKG and BKK are not correct.

TLV (32°00'41"N 34°53'12"E) HKG (22°18'32"N 113°54'53"E) 4179 nm
TLV (32°00'41"N 34°53'12"E) BKK (13°54'45"N 100°36'24"E) 3741 nm



Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
User currently offlineKaran69 From India, joined Oct 2004, 2884 posts, RR: 18
Reply 3, posted (8 years 3 months 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 12817 times:

CX use their 773s on HKG-DXB---non-stop 7+ hours flight
SQ use their 773s on SIN-DXB again 7 hrs non-stop

Quoting B742 (Reply 1):
Well EK use their 773's on routes such as: (or have used)
DXB-LHR 3420 mi
DXB-SIN 3633 mi
SIN-SYD 3907 mi

Rob, one more is DXB-BKK/KUL


User currently offlineAmirs From Israel, joined Dec 2003, 1333 posts, RR: 4
Reply 4, posted (8 years 3 months 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 12804 times:

Quoting Avianca (Reply 2):
Amirs, your distances for HKG and BKK are not correct.

TLV (32°00'41"N 34°53'12"E) HKG (22°18'32"N 113°54'53"E) 4179 nm
TLV (32°00'41"N 34°53'12"E) BKK (13°54'45"N 100°36'24"E) 3741 nm

Thats if they flew direct over arab counties, LY needs to fly up to Turkey and then proceed to HKG and to BKK they fly south down to ETH - Sharm - Djibouti and then BKK.


User currently offlineAvianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5922 posts, RR: 40
Reply 5, posted (8 years 3 months 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 12774 times:

Quoting Amirs (Reply 4):
Thats if they flew direct over arab counties, LY needs to fly up to Turkey and then proceed to HKG and to BKK they fly south down to ETH - Sharm - Djibouti and then BKK.

a ok, thanks for the infor!

regards



Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
User currently offlineNZ107 From New Zealand, joined Jul 2005, 6406 posts, RR: 39
Reply 6, posted (8 years 3 months 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 12573 times:

SQ flys the AKL-SIN using a 773 direct in the Southern Summer, distance 4540nm.


It's all about the destination AND the journey.
User currently offlineHa763 From United States of America, joined Jan 2003, 3634 posts, RR: 5
Reply 7, posted (8 years 3 months 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 12515 times:
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KE used to use their 773s ICN-HNL every Sunday, which is 3977nm. They also have used them to LAX, probably through NRT, which is 4737nm. If KE did use the 733 ICN-LAX non-stop, it is 5209nm. And, KE is the only 773 operator with PW4098s.

User currently offlineLTU932 From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 13864 posts, RR: 50
Reply 8, posted (8 years 3 months 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 12441 times:

Quoting Ha763 (Reply 7):
If KE did use the 733 ICN-LAX non-stop, it is 5209nm. And, KE is the only 773 operator with PW4098s.

I believe KE did use the 773A nonstop on ICN-LAX. However doing so gave them severe weight restrictions because of the fuel guzzling PW4098s, but I believe this could change, because somebody mentioned that KE is converting the PW4098s to regular PW4090s.


User currently offlineRedChili From Norway, joined Jul 2005, 2213 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (8 years 3 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 12366 times:

The photo database contains several pictures of TG 773s in Europe. I assume that they made nonstop flights.

Athens and Geneva:


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Elliott Kefalas
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Charles Falk




Top 10 airplanes: B737, T154, B747, IL96, T134, IL62, A320, MD80, B757, DC10
User currently offlineFlyDeltaJets From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 1843 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (8 years 3 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 12338 times:
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I thought that all 773's are ER. I didn't know that there was a difference. Is the a visible way of telling.


The only valid opinions are those based in facts
User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21474 posts, RR: 60
Reply 11, posted (8 years 3 months 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 12283 times:

Quoting FlyDeltaJets (Reply 10):
I thought that all 773's are ER. I didn't know that there was a difference. Is the a visible way of telling.

wingtips and different engines. and there are some aero tweaks on other parts of the wing you'd have to be an expert to see, as well as a modified articulating main landing gear.

the 773 used to be offered only in a range that fell between the 772A and the 772ER (closer to the 772A). Now the 773ER has a slightly longer range than the 772ER. though it was designed to have a slightly shorter range, it exceeded design criteria by a great deal by EIS, and even by more after 1 and 2 years post EIS.



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineUAL747 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (8 years 3 months 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 12279 times:

Yeah, the 773ER's have raked wingtips and the biggest set of engines you've ever seen in your life. The standard 777-300 has been used by KE on ICN-LAX. That's 5209 nautical miles. Boeing lists the 777-300 range at 5,995 nautical miles.

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/777family/pf/pf_300product.html

UAL

[Edited 2006-04-23 03:14:00]

User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26361 posts, RR: 76
Reply 13, posted (8 years 3 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 12011 times:

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 8):
I believe KE did use the 773A nonstop on ICN-LAX. However doing so gave them severe weight restrictions because of the fuel guzzling PW4098s, but I believe this could change, because somebody mentioned that KE is converting the PW4098s to regular PW4090s

They weren't taking severe weight restrictions. The route was still well within the range of even PW4098 powered 773s

Quoting UAL747 (Reply 12):
he standard 777-300 has been used by KE on ICN-LAX. That's 5209 nautical miles.

They were not used on ICN-LAX. They were used on ICN-NRT-LAX



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offline777fan From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 2490 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (8 years 3 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 11987 times:

I've flown UA's ORD-NRT route on a 772 (PW engines, IIRC):

ORD (41°58'43"N 87°54'17"W) NRT (35°45'53"N 140°23'11"E) 6274 mi



DC-8 61/63/71 DC-9-30/50 MD-80/82/83 DC-10-10/30 MD-11 717 721/2 732/3/4/5/G/8/9 741/2/4 752 762/3 777 A306/319/20/33 AT
User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26361 posts, RR: 76
Reply 15, posted (8 years 3 months 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 11919 times:

Quoting 777fan (Reply 14):
I've flown UA's ORD-NRT route on a 772 (PW engines, IIRC):

That is a 772ER, which has much longer range than the 773A. In UA's crippled configuration, they can do about 7000nm still air



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21474 posts, RR: 60
Reply 16, posted (8 years 3 months 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 11874 times:

Quoting N1120A (Reply 15):
That is a 772ER, which has much longer range than the 773A.

Exactly. 773A is about 1/3 of the way between a 772A and 772ER range. And of course engine choice, age of aircraft, etc. mitigates that. That breakdown is for the 777s as they are offered in 2006.



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26361 posts, RR: 76
Reply 17, posted (8 years 3 months 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 11828 times:

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 16):
Exactly. 773A is about 1/3 of the way between a 772A and 772ER range. And of course engine choice, age of aircraft, etc. mitigates that. That breakdown is for the 777s as they are offered in 2006.

Actually, it is less than 1/3rd. The 773A only has 785nm more range than the 772A, while the 772ER has almost 2000nm more range than the 773A. Also, the KE birds have range about halfway between the 772A and 773A with GE or RR engines.



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineFkruiver From Netherlands, joined Apr 2000, 55 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (8 years 3 months 5 days ago) and read 9793 times:

How about the -200's....KLM does AMS-MNL non-stop....

User currently offlineTrex8 From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 4692 posts, RR: 14
Reply 19, posted (8 years 3 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 9558 times:
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Quoting N1120A (Reply 15):
In UA's crippled configuration

why are they crippled? I have done ORD-PEK several times with a packed plane and its several hundred miles further than NRT

Quoting Fkruiver (Reply 18):
How about the -200's....KLM does AMS-MNL non-stop....

thats even shorter than the UA ORD - NRT or PEK flights.


User currently offlineAirxLiban From Lebanon, joined Oct 2003, 4506 posts, RR: 54
Reply 20, posted (8 years 3 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 9493 times:

Quoting Amirs (Thread starter):
PW 4098's.

The PW4098 has proven to be a dog and only KE has ordered 773s with that engine. I forgot exactly what happened, but in the development of the PW4098 P&W had some problems meeting emissions requirements IIRC and in the end the changes that they made to meet those requirements ended up increasing the engine's fuel consumption significantly to the point where it was no where near competitive with the Trent.

So PW was only able to keep KE as a customer and are paying them for fuel penalties.

Interesting to note though that the KE 773s with PW4098s (which is all of them) have the highest thrust to weight ratio of any commercial aircraft.



PARIS, FRANCE...THE BEIRUT OF EUROPE.
User currently offlineJrosa From Brazil, joined Jun 2005, 367 posts, RR: 11
Reply 21, posted (8 years 3 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 8833 times:

Quoting Amirs (Thread starter):
With the exclusive deal that was signed between GE and Boeing

Sorry for my ignorance, but how was this deal entered into by Boeing and GE?

Thanks,

Jose Carlos


User currently offlineYULWinterSkies From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2176 posts, RR: 5
Reply 22, posted (8 years 3 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 8518 times:

Quoting Fkruiver (Reply 18):
How about the -200's....KLM does AMS-MNL non-stop....

These are 200ER, one of the longest range airliner in the world. They are not pushed to the limit on that precise route...



When I doubt... go running!
User currently offlineFlyDeltaJets From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 1843 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (8 years 3 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 8444 times:
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Thanks guys. I probably didn't know because I haven't seen a non ER version I have only seen AF, NH and KE's 773.


The only valid opinions are those based in facts
User currently offlineZK-NBT From New Zealand, joined Oct 2000, 5294 posts, RR: 11
Reply 24, posted (8 years 3 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 6946 times:

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 6):
SQ flys the AKL-SIN using a 773 direct in the Southern Summer, distance 4540nm.

Not scheduled. But they do use them in place of the 772ER's to AKL and CHC which is 10.5 hours.

KE have used them to AKL but again as SUBS for 772ER's AKL-ICN is about 12.5 hours, not sure on miles.


25 Airxliban : Just that the GE-90 will be the sole powerplant option on the 777-200LR and the 777-300ER.
26 Post contains images Ikramerica : You french and your arguing for no reason. I was agreeing with you, and you went and corrected me anyway, and with incorrect information... First, it
27 N1120A : Because United chose to stick with PW engines, they were only able to certify their 772ERs to 648,000 pounds, as opposed to 656,000 pounds. That is 8
28 Planemanofnz : I flew on a TG 773 AKL-SYD-BKK back in 2001. I think EK would have the longest flight with a 773 WITH stops. It would probably be AKL-BNE-SIN-DXB usi
29 UAL747 : That may be the case now, but I flew PEK-ORD in a 777, 2001. UAL
30 CHRISBA777ER : I know SQ does/did SIN - IST with a 773A - thats got to be up there I would guess.
31 LTU932 : Didn't the PW4098 actually become an embarrassment for Boeing? And also, please somebody confirm if KE is having their PW4098s converted to PW4090 or
32 CHRISBA777ER : Is JAL and ANA (the other PW-powered 773A users IIRC) using the 4090, or the 4098?
33 Cricket : Given that the 773 was only ordered by Asian carriers - the only non-South East Asia/East Asian carrier operating them is EK the majority of them are
34 N1120A : It meant that UA had to take an inferior 777 to their competition and LAN dropped the 777 altogether. It is not a simple conversion. The engines have
35 Cricket : I was led to believe that the Pratt screw-up on the 4098's more than messed up their chances on the 777LR family and the 787.
36 CX flyboy : We do not fly non-stop to DXB with the 773s. They go HKG-BKK-BOM-DXB. We fly 772s and A333s non-stop. Our 773s are in fact downrated to a MTOW of 263
37 Aviationfreak : I've seen a KE773 at AKL not too long ago. Don't know which route they're flying though. SQ comes with a daily 744 to AKL and 4 times per week with a
38 ZK-NBT : ICN-AKL non stop! Thats a long flight! The 773 did sub a couple of times for the 772ER! Maybe you weren't working that day. The 772ER flight is 5x we
39 N1120A : Yep. If they couldn't scale up to 98K, how in the world were they going to do 115K. Their GTF technology does have a good shot on the 737RS/A320NG
40 MarkC : LTU932, I think Korean only have 1 aircraft left with 4098's. And I believe only 9 engines were ever made. There were two recently donated to museums.
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