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SFO-India Nonstop  
User currently offlineFlamedude707 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 235 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 10580 times:

When will we see nonstop flights from sfo to india? The indian population in the bay area is only rising and as moe business shifts there, the demand will only increase. Also, what airlines and aircrafts would fly the route? Is it too long of a flight?


Time you enjoy wasting, is not wasted.
51 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineAeroflot777 From Russia, joined Mar 2004, 2999 posts, RR: 27
Reply 1, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 10506 times:

If any airline would start the service, it would have to be Air India. I just don't see any other airline, with the exception of United, being interested of doing non-stop. Right now, pax have quite a few choices of getting to India using connecting flights in Asia and Europe. Air France and Delta come to mind for easy connection through Europe, so that's not that big of a problem.

Aeroflot777


User currently offlineKLMcedric From Belgium, joined Dec 2003, 810 posts, RR: 22
Reply 2, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 10464 times:

Quoting Aeroflot777 (Reply 1):
Air France and Delta come to mind for easy connection through Europe, so that's not that big of a problem.

A lot more easy connections can be made truogh Europe, strange that only
AF & DL come to your mind! How about LH,BA,KL,NW...

Anyway at 6700nm this flight would be shorter then SQ's SIN-LAX,SIN-EWR,
and besides from 772LR and A345 even the 772ER should be able to operate on this leg!

Would it be too long? This flight would take 14-15hrs, I think that's managable
and worth considering next to much longer connection-flight times!


User currently offlineAeroflot777 From Russia, joined Mar 2004, 2999 posts, RR: 27
Reply 3, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 10427 times:

Quoting KLMcedric (Reply 2):
A lot more easy connections can be made truogh Europe, strange that only
AF & DL come to your mind! How about LH,BA,KL,NW...


I just know quite a few people that fly to India on a regular basis and they fly AF and DL thats why they just spontaneously popped into my head.  Smile Of course you are right, many airlines offer connections in Europe.

Aeroflot777


User currently offlineKaitak744 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 2360 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 10399 times:

Well, JFK, ORD, and LAX would probably become non-stop first. AI might for the time being just send 777-300ERs to IAH and SFO.

User currently offlineAmerican777 From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 10391 times:

9W has ordered long range Boeing aircraft and when they take delivery of their Boeing 777-300/ER's they might launch service from BOM to SFO.

So AI & UA are not the only ones that are able to launch services to SFO from India!!!


User currently offlineAeroflot777 From Russia, joined Mar 2004, 2999 posts, RR: 27
Reply 6, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 10376 times:

Quoting American777 (Reply 5):
9W has ordered long range Boeing aircraft and when they take delivery of their Boeing 777-300/ER's they might launch service from BOM to SFO.

American777, sorry but who is 9W. I'm not familiar with that code, and it's not coming up when putting the cursor over it...

Aeroflot777


User currently offlineDesiguy2447 From United States of America, joined May 2005, 96 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 10341 times:

9W is Jet Airways. The only problem with AI is that the aircrafts Boeing 747's are so old, and one never knows when a tire is going to burst, or something in the interior is going to fall off. (this might sound funny, but this is Air India) Till Air India gets there new Boeing aircrafts not much will change.

User currently offlineConcorde001 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2005, 1230 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 10318 times:

Quoting Aeroflot777 (Reply 6):

Jet Airways, India's leading private airline. The airline has a large domestic route network, and has only recently started to fly DEL-LHR and BOM-LHR.




User currently offlineKaitak744 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 2360 posts, RR: 3
Reply 9, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 10147 times:

Quoting Concorde001 (Reply 8):
Jet Airways, India's leading private airline. The airline has a large domestic route network, and has only recently started to fly DEL-LHR and BOM-LHR.

They also go to SIN, KUL, Kathmandu, and Colombo.

http://www.airlineroutemaps.com/West_Asia/Jet_Airways.shtml

[Edited 2006-04-24 01:27:57]

User currently offlineJacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 60
Reply 10, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day ago) and read 10049 times:

Quoting KLMcedric (Reply 2):

A lot more easy connections can be made truogh Europe, strange that only
AF & DL come to your mind! How about LH,BA,KL,NW...

BA is certainly easy from SFO/LAX.....also, many can fly CO SFO-EWR-DEL or AA SFO/SJC/LAX-ORD-DEL...

that being said, I've been mentioning ad nauseam that AA should try to fly to India from the west coast, especially NoCal...given its huge Indian population in Sunnyvale, Fremont, San Jose, etc....not to mention, the silicon valley connection

I think the problem with AA would however, their 777's can't go the distance..AI won't have a problem with their -200LR's..maybe AA can use some 5th-freedom rights...

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 4):
Well, JFK, ORD, and LAX would probably become non-stop first. AI might for the time being just send 777-300ERs to IAH and SFO.

EWR as well as ORD serve DEL nonstop.......AI serves LAX via FRA..

as much as its good to have nonstop service from West Coast to India, I think intr-india connections need to be much improved, not to mention, airports and infratructure..



"Up the Irons!"
User currently offline9W77W From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 40 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day ago) and read 10026 times:

Quoting KLMcedric (Reply 2):
Anyway at 6700nm this flight would be shorter then SQ's SIN-LAX,SIN-EWR,

As per Great Circle Mapper, DEL-SFO = 7478 & BOM-SFO 8397 http://216.147.18.102/dist/.

Regards


User currently offlineShane From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 180 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day ago) and read 10012 times:

could any of United's current equipment do that flight nonstop?

User currently offlineAmerican777 From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 9946 times:

Quoting Shane (Reply 12):

It depends which city in India you want to fly to. If you fly from SFO to BOM you will only be able to serve that route with the Boeing 777.

If you want to fly from SFO to DEL you can serve that route with either the Boeing 777 or the Boeing 747-400.


User currently offlineJacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 60
Reply 14, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 9926 times:

Quoting Shane (Reply 12):
could any of United's current equipment do that flight nonstop?

UA's 747's can probably do ORD-DEL, but that's about it..their 777's don't have the MTOW to go the distance without being weight-restricted.....even from ORD

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 10):
BA is certainly easy from SFO/LAX...

I mean SFO-India with BA...but once again, not a direct flight....



"Up the Irons!"
User currently offlineMandargb From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 195 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 9915 times:

"BA is certainly easy from SFO/LAX.....also, many can fly CO SFO-EWR-DEL or AA SFO/SJC/LAX-ORD-DEL"

Actually BA is absolutely not good for SFO - BOM via LHR. (Unless you like a 20+ hours layover in LHR) (SFO- to BOM) (On the way back the halt is I think 3 hours or so which is good.)

Who will fly it.
Boeing did give a demo to AI folks of this non-stop routes back in first week of september of 2005. So keep guessing. (It was 777-200LR I think. please correct me on the model number.)


User currently offlineStealth777 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 372 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 9897 times:

actually I am amazed that SFO-DEL is longer than the other pairs of ORD/EWR -DEL per the great circle mapper. I would have assumed that SFO would be closer than the other two but I was wrong.

From To Distance
SFO (37°37'08"N 122°22'30"W) DEL (28°33'59"N 77°06'11"E) 6697 nm
ORD (41°58'43"N 87°54'17"W) DEL (28°33'59"N 77°06'11"E) 6503 nm
EWR (40°41'33"N 74°10'07"W) DEL (28°33'59"N 77°06'11"E) 6364 nm


User currently offlineGr8Circle From Canada, joined Dec 2005, 3089 posts, RR: 4
Reply 17, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 9852 times:

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 10):
as much as its good to have nonstop service from West Coast to India, I think intr-india connections need to be much improved, not to mention, airports and infratructure..

What's one got to do with the other? Why should India-SFO direct flights start only after domestic connections and infrastructure improve  Confused


User currently offlineGr8Circle From Canada, joined Dec 2005, 3089 posts, RR: 4
Reply 18, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 9846 times:

Quoting Desiguy2447 (Reply 7):
The only problem with AI is that the aircrafts Boeing 747's are so old, and one never knows when a tire is going to burst, or something in the interior is going to fall off. (this might sound funny, but this is Air India) Till Air India gets there new Boeing aircrafts not much will change.

Sorry, it doesn't sound funny at all....it sounds biased....!!!

AI had a few incidents of tyre burst at LAX and BOM....but it's not a situation of "no one knows when...." the problem with the 744's is that they do not have the range to fly India - SFO non-stop...nothing to do with their age or condition....  sarcastic 


User currently offlineJacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 60
Reply 19, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 9804 times:

Quoting Gr8Circle (Reply 17):
What's one got to do with the other? Why should India-SFO direct flights start only after domestic connections and infrastructure improve

er, I didn't say it did..... Wink

Quoting Mandargb (Reply 15):
"BA is certainly easy from SFO/LAX.....also, many can fly CO SFO-EWR-DEL or AA SFO/SJC/LAX-ORD-DEL"

Actually BA is absolutely not good for SFO - BOM via LHR. (Unless you like a 20+ hours layover in LHR) (SFO- to BOM) (On the way back the halt is I think 3 hours or so which is good.)

the connection time between flights is only 4 hours, and there is a terminal change, so that will take up about 2 hours right there....

the only downside is lots of sleeping on the plane...but that isn't all too bad of a route when one thinks about it....



"Up the Irons!"
User currently offlineCtang From Australia, joined Jul 2001, 139 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 9590 times:

I know for a fact that SQ has a large share of the indians travelling to india. They fly SQ1 via HKG.

User currently offlineCOEWR787 From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 334 posts, RR: 3
Reply 21, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 8884 times:

Quoting 9W77W (Reply 11):
As per Great Circle Mapper, DEL-SFO = 7478 & BOM-SFO 8397 http://216.147.18.102/dist/.

Only fly in the ointment is that that route flies right over Tibet. So the actual route that can be flown will have to deviate considerably to avoid Tibet and will be longer.

Even the EWR - SIN flight, when it flies the polar route, deviates East over Chengdu and Kunming from the most direct route in order to avoid Tibet. Tibet is too high for aircrafts to be able to come down to 7000' in the stipulated time in case of an accidental cabin depressurization.


User currently offlineDeaphen From India, joined Jul 2005, 1425 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 8847 times:

Quoting Ctang (Reply 20):
I know for a fact that SQ has a large share of the indians travelling to india. They fly SQ1 via HKG.

ypu we do... its rather convinient to fly east wards over the pacific. especially if you going to the west coast. SQ is a good option but an even better optiion is CX. It works out to be the shortest connection to SFO. DEL-HKG is about 4:20 (hh:mm) and HKG-SFO is only 11:00 while going and 13:00 while coming back. Mainly because of the easterly jet winds over the pacific.

This is compared to SQ which has great service but is much longer.. DEL - SIN is 5:45 then SIN to Seoul is about 6:30-7:00 hrs. Then Seoul to SFO is another 11 hours or so. Its similar with their other flights out of Tokyo and Hongkong.

Hence, CX does well.



I want every single airport and airplane in India to be on A.net!
User currently offlineUA777222 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3348 posts, RR: 11
Reply 23, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 8769 times:

Expect SFO to start a DEN-India route. Very easy from both SFO and ORD to get to and with non-stop service it's a nice fix-it to their current issues.

Matt



"It wasn't raining when Noah built the ark."
User currently offlineBaw716 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 2027 posts, RR: 27
Reply 24, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 8703 times:

For those of you who want SFO-India nonstop, then discuss it with the local Air India guy (yes there is one there), have him draft a proposal and see what transpires. SFO would love to have another international long haul carrier at the airport. The airport does a significant amount of marketing; between the airport and Air India, if the original poster really wants the service, then those are the people with whom to discuss the issue.

A dose of airline economic reality: For that flight to be successful, it has to be filled with high fare business traffic. Although the fares from SFO to India are pretty high, even in Economy.

The better mix would be a YVR-DEL or BOM nonstop; I believe (opinion not stating fact) that the YVR market is much larger than SFO, and the shorter distance (about 750 miles) makes it within the range of most existing long haul aircraft.

baw716



David L. Lamb, fmr Area Mgr Alitalia SFO 1998-2002, fmr Regional Analyst SFO-UAL 1992-1998
25 Nimish : AI will hopefully launch this route once they have all their aircraft on board (another 3-5 years down the line)? The initial set of aircraft arriving
26 Superfly : Has Air India consider ording any more 747-400s? I'd love to see Air India 747s flying here to SFO.
27 KC135TopBoom : The world isn't that small. The distance from BOM to SFO is 7305nm, across the North Pole. At 410 knots average ground speed, that is just under 18 h
28 Cricket : AI gets their first 777-200LR early 2007 and the second a couple of months after that. Now the reason the LR was ordered (and AI has gone for the extr
29 Post contains images Nimish : My personal opinion is that 9W will live to rue the day they decided that one-stops are the way to go. I've flown on the TG 345 LAX-BKK, and nothing
30 SeeTheWorld : There is no way UA is going to start DEN-India. Den is UA's 4th choice as an international gateway and it's local market is smaller than SFO, ORD, an
31 RayChuang : I'm not sure how much of a market for the SFO to India route AI can get. Don't forget that BA, LH, SQ and VS have get you to India with only one fligh
32 Gr8Circle : Well, if AI or 9W start flights to SFO, they will be either non-stop or one-stop flights (probably via Europe) and the pax won't have to change plane
33 LAXDESI : True. Many seniors that I know prefer the convinience of AI's one aircraft service on BOM/DEL-USA routes.
34 Aseem : I did AC's YYZ-DEL-YYZ 14hr non-stop and believe me towards the end it was a bit too much. Although I admit that SQ's executive economy must have bee
35 SeeTheWorld : Personally, I've probably been on a couple of dozen 14+ hour flights in the past ten years, and your questions should be: "Would you want to spend 16
36 UAL#1fan : Why United does not start service to India from ORD or SFO is beyond me. They could make it happen, and I'm sure they'd get plenty of demand for eithe
37 Post contains links Blrsea : Kingfisher in talks with US carrier for �silicon� flights
38 RoseFlyer : There seems to be a lot of argument on this. For comparison's sake, United's longest route is ORD-HKG on a 747, which is 300 miles shorter than SFO-D
39 Nimish : I agree fully, I don't know what UA hopes to gain by just "monitoring" the situation endlessly. They've let relative pip-squeaks like AA/CO (on the U
40 Cricket : USA-India is a ready-made market, and with many Indians belonging to relatively higher-income groups in the US, they'ld even get high-yields on the r
41 InitRef : All depends on where the non-stops go to.. not much point for a BLR bound traveller to take a non-stop to DEL and switch to a domestic flight, if 9W
42 Cricket : They're 343's btw. And those 777's start arriving within the next twelve months. However, you have a point - 9W might just start using a major Europe
43 RoseFlyer : There is no reason at all for a BLR passenger to go via DEL since it can require overnighting in DEL. Yes there are a few 10pm departures from DEL, b
44 InitRef : Typo - called them 345 just after reading Nimish's tongue-in-cheek comment. I meant the ex-SAA 343E the 330s will take over (or add) Asia routes as t
45 AirxLiban : What about SFO-Bangalore? I think the last time this topic came up someone suggested that there would be a big market for service to BLR and many agre
46 CHI787ORD : Well, I have talked to some people at UA, no one at the top of course, and they say they have no plans for India at the moment. However, my UA source
47 Blrsea : Does UA have 5th freedom rights from NRT?
48 Nimish : Yes - I believe they do. They fly to a number of points all over Asia from NRT, and so does NW.
49 BAW716 : UA does not have the right aircraft to fly SFO-DEL. The 747-400 would be too big and as others have said, the 777s they have can't make the distance.
50 Post contains links Nimish : AI have ordered brand new 777LRs and 773ERs, and expect deliveries to start next year. Their planned non-stops are based on these new aircraft joinin
51 Post contains images DeltaGator : I think the SFO-BLR route would do quite well given the high tech communities that would be connected. I flew the JFK-LHR-DEL-BLR route to get there.
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