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BA Pulling Out Of Pakistan?  
User currently offlineAirmale From Botswana, joined Sep 2004, 376 posts, RR: 1
Posted (13 years 10 months 4 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 1807 times:

i read in one of the threads here that BA is going to axe its 777 service to Islamabad, is that true? thought they were resuming flights to Karachi.


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26 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineCapt.Picard From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (13 years 10 months 4 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 1695 times:

Hi Airmale, it was probably me.

I flew with my parents recently to Islamabad with BA, and the aircrew stated they wouldn't be flying to Pakistan for much longer.

BTW, Islamabad looks great, we were staying at the Marriot, and met Imran Khan in the gym   (seriously !)

We flew a PIA 737 to Peshawar, and visited the Khyber pass-fabulous place.


User currently offlineJaysit From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (13 years 10 months 4 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 1674 times:

Why are so many European Airlines pulling out of the pakistani market? Is it because of low yields? Or is it because the Gulf carriers are giving them a run for their money?

User currently offlineGardermoen From Australia, joined Jul 1999, 1520 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (13 years 10 months 4 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 1671 times:

Yes, BA is pulling out of Islamabad due to low yields.(as well as Dhaka, Bangladesh)And also, Lufthansa is ending Karachi this October I think from something i read a few weeks back.
This is probably due to generally low yields and decreasing number of visitors to Pakistan ever since the militiary coup. However on the plus side, Cathay Pacific will soon launch three weekly A330 Hong Kong-Bangkok-karachi flgihts.


User currently offlineCedarjet From United Kingdom, joined May 1999, 8045 posts, RR: 54
Reply 4, posted (13 years 10 months 4 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 1665 times:

Most places look great from a nice airconditioned room / suite at the Mariott. Otherwise, what happened to Islamabad to make it so great all of a sudden? (I'd love to visit Peshawar.)


fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
User currently offlineCapt.Picard From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (13 years 10 months 4 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 1652 times:

Cedarjet, no need to be so cynical, I meant Islamabad was a nice surprise, lush green suburbs, relatively cool and very friendly people.

I didn't know what to expect, and I enjoyed Pakistan, yes, I'm sure you would like Peshawar; as for the hotel, well my Dad was on business etc.

It is rather ironic that BA are pulling out of such a massive market, perhaps most use PIA, although I do think people like EK/GF are also making a big scoop on the route; GF is only using an A320 though (last time I looked).



User currently offlineJaysit From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (13 years 10 months 4 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 1628 times:

I think that BA are increasing services to Dhaka !

On the other hand, it leaves the Pakistan - Europe - US market all to PIA. Should be better for the bottom line.

I've heard that Islamabad is indeed quite a beautiful city. Much like Delhi used to be 20 years ago before pollution, slums, and factories took over.


User currently offlineAirmale From Botswana, joined Sep 2004, 376 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (13 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 1601 times:

i find it strange all the european carriers pulling out of Pakistan, Lufthansa(A300-600) did almost two years back, Air France(A310-300,747-200/400) in '94, KLM(MD-11) in march this year, BA(767-300) from Karachi in '91, leaves on Swissair(A330-200) here and Aeroflot(A310-300) if its considered European.Could it be a sinister western govt policy?


.....up there with the best!
User currently offlineJaysit From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (13 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 1594 times:

Maybe Virgin should be lobbied to start services to Karachi !!

User currently offlineThud From Pakistan, joined Aug 2000, 204 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (13 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 1596 times:

Sad news if true. The flights to Islamabad are always full so it does not make sense. Probably the MidEast Airlines are eating into profits.

Karachi airport was a really important point of call once but with high landing charges, high fuel prices, low volume and I guess Karachi and Pakistan in general being pretty low on the tourism scale as opposed to India. Western airlines are fighting for landing spots at Indian airports. Shame really as the NWFP Gilgit etc are quite stunning. There is also skiing in Swat.


User currently offlineVadheim From Norway, joined Jul 2000, 623 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (13 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 1591 times:

How is the business traffic segment to Pakistan?

...or is it most family/friends traffic?

I know PIA is selling really cheap tickets to Asian people out of Norway to stimulate their travelling, I guess airlines need a higher load factor then to break even! Maybe even 80% load factor is'nt enough to break even!!!!


User currently offlineAirmale From Botswana, joined Sep 2004, 376 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (13 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 1584 times:

forgot to mention that Alitalia, Tarom and SAS also quit Karachi as well as Japan airlines, Philippine airlines,Garuda Indonesia, Royal Nepal and Sudan airways. Why cant BA operate the 767 to Pakistan instead of the 777 and route the service via the Middle East to make it more feasible?


.....up there with the best!
User currently offlineAvion From Bouvet Island, joined May 1999, 2205 posts, RR: 7
Reply 12, posted (13 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 1576 times:

I can tell you that Swissair has no plans to axe the daily A330-200 to Karachi!   Just to tell you that not all european airlines are quitting pakistan.

Avion


User currently offlineEmirates777 From Tanzania, joined Feb 2000, 655 posts, RR: 3
Reply 13, posted (13 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 1581 times:

BA and other airline's moves are interesting in the context of Emirates.

Emirates will upgrade its Islamabad service to 777s (two class) next year. 2 of the weekly flights will be 777 the other 2 A330.

With regards Karachi, it certainly is one of EK's trunk routes. They operate twice daily with an additional two freqs. 6 months before the coup they added an additional 5 weekly services, but withdrew them shortly after the coup.

On its KHI flights, EK predominantly uses 777s (config. in two classes). There are a few flights here and there operated by A300-600Rs, A310-300s and A330-200s. Early next year one of the daily services will be a dedicated 777-300 service. Note: EK 773 in two class seats 430 pax !

While the yields on this market may not be great, there certainly is the pax. traffic. Also, EK has a big cargo operation out of Pakistan. The pax traffic is evenly split between transfer pax and point to point pax (ie. DXB-KHI-DXB).

FYI, in addition to KHI, EK flies 3x weekly to LHE using 330/310, to ISB 4x weekly and to PEW 2x weekly using 310.

Rgds
Mohammed


User currently offlinePakistania From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (13 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1550 times:

yes why cant BA operate the 767 to ISB? instead of the 777, and perhaps extend the service to Karachi also.


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Pakistania


User currently offlineJaysit From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (13 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1545 times:

THey're axeing all their long range 767 services.

User currently offlineThud From Pakistan, joined Aug 2000, 204 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (13 years 10 months 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 1523 times:

Is that because most of their 767's are going to Qantas?

User currently offlineAirmale From Botswana, joined Sep 2004, 376 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (13 years 10 months 1 week 5 hours ago) and read 1510 times:

what about the 757 cant they fly that here, like their franchise British Mediterranean is operating the A320 to Bishkek in Kyrghyzstan?


.....up there with the best!
User currently offlineCapt.Picard From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (13 years 10 months 1 week 4 hours ago) and read 1507 times:

Guys, I think it's a question of PREMIUM PAX, ie. in our 777 flight to ISB in June, FIRST and CLUB sections were pretty empty, World Traveller was not a problem, that cabin is much easier to fill.

And as we know, BA gets all worried when their forward cabins are empty (ISB 777's). As for smaller a/c, I'm no expert, but 1)BA don't like stopping v.much

2) 767's are going??/needed for Europe

3)They don't have a FIRST cabin/v.large no.'s of PREMIUM cabins.

So I guess that is the problem. As I mentioned before, BA are utterly obssessed with FIRST/CLUB WORLD pax. They are the people who bring profits.


User currently offlineAirmale From Botswana, joined Sep 2004, 376 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (13 years 10 months 1 week 3 hours ago) and read 1501 times:

Thats a sad attitude.


.....up there with the best!
User currently offlineCapt.Picard From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (13 years 10 months 1 week 3 hours ago) and read 1498 times:

Sad but true!  Sorry, couldn't resist.

Airmale, if you're flying a 747 which is full in Y but near emtpy in J/F you're not making money.

BA PRIORITY LIST:
=1) Make money 2)Provide a good service.


User currently offlineAirmale From Botswana, joined Sep 2004, 376 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (13 years 10 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 1485 times:

ok then how about allowing British Med to operate the route? perhaps with the 757. 


.....up there with the best!
User currently offlineJaysit From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (13 years 10 months 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 1481 times:

But doesn't BA operate 2-class 777s in a dense configuration on some Caribbean routes?
Since most of the UK-Pakistan traffic is leisure traffic, the 777s would be ideal, especially if they pack in over 320 pax? Or is it just that the 777s arent' available for such a route? Or is it that the 777 with very high payloads can't fly London-Pakistan nonstop (especially the return flight with strong headwinds)? I thought that the IGW versions wouldnt' have that problem.

I find it incredulous that there are no direct BA flights into Pakistan given the fact that the UK has over 1 million residents of Pakistani descent. On the other hand, BA and VS are slugging it out over additional flights into India.


User currently offlineCapt.Picard From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (13 years 10 months 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 1473 times:

Jaysit, there are direct BA flights into Pakistan!!

LHR-ISB, 777, FJY, it hasn't been axed yet!!


User currently offlineJaysit From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (13 years 10 months 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 1471 times:

I know, but I assumed they were discontinuing them soon. Or is that just a rumor on here too?

But what happened to their Karachi services? Commercial and industrial hubs should have point to point services to Europe !


25 Post contains images Airmale : i agree with jaysit
26 Capt.Picard : Jaysit, if it's a rumour, I'll be the first to confirm it. I flew to ISB with BA in June, and upon visiting the flightdeck, the issue of axing flights
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