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Must Have Been An Interesting Flight-EWR YYT  
User currently offlineDFW13L From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (8 years 7 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 5172 times:

Last night's Continental Express 2527 EWR-YYT tried an approach and initially diverted all the way back to YHZ, which is over 500 miles. It ended up diverting to YJT which is still over 250 miles. The flight is on the EMB 145XR, but the EWR-YYT leg is 1150 miles. Does it actually have the range to fly 1650 miles, which would be the flight to YYT, missed approach, and then to YHZ? I checked the weather and it was 100' ceiling with 1/4 mile vis, so it went below minimums on the way out there.

And if so, do they actually carry that much fuel, if they have the range? If so, I would think there are some serious weight restrictions on the flight.



For those who are not familiar with where YYT is, it's the very edge of NF, and on the map it's to the far right where the loop is. The loop is from the missed approach. It first diverted toward YHZ and then amended that to YJT, so that's why they both show up on the flight aware map. I've always been intrigued with this flight.

12 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineRoseFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9810 posts, RR: 52
Reply 1, posted (8 years 7 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 5125 times:

Quoting DFW13L (Thread starter):
The flight is on the EMB 145XR, but the EWR-YYT leg is 1150 miles. Does it actually have the range to fly 1650 miles, which would be the flight to YYT, missed approach, and then to YHZ? I checked the weather and it was 100' ceiling with 1/4 mile vis, so it went below minimums on the way out there.

Well when the weather is marginal, the plane has to have an alternate filed on its flight path. There are not that many alternates way out there, so it is possible that YHZ was listed as the alternate, which means that the plane would be required to have enough fuel to fly back to YHZ. I don't know anything specific about this incident, but that does seem like a very long diversion. Could there have been fuel concerns that mandated them flying to YJT instead? Stephenville is a city of only 7,000 people, and obviously would not be a choice for a diversion unless absolutely necessary.



If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineDFW13L From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (8 years 7 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 5119 times:

Quoting RoseFlyer (Reply 1):
. Could there have been fuel concerns that mandated them flying to YJT instead? Stephenville is a city of only 7,000 people, and obviously would not be a choice for a diversion unless absolutely necessary.

That's what I was thinking too. I don't know anything about Stephenville, but was thinking they initially chose YHZ because it is a Continental Express station.


User currently offlineRoseFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9810 posts, RR: 52
Reply 3, posted (8 years 7 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 5068 times:

Stephenville use to be a US Air Force base that was built during WWII. It has a big runway that isn't used much anymore. It's 10,000ft runway is useful for cases like this, but I feel sorry for the Continental people that got stuck in the middle of no where. In 1990 the airport was further designated for alternate use, fueling only, by international scheduled air transport and for international general aviation regular use. In recent years, Stephenville has become a favorite technical stop for international flights on route to Europe. It's in the middle of no where in a tiny city, but it can handle pretty much any airplane including widebodies.

[Edited 2006-05-19 00:56:49]


If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineRomeoMike From Canada, joined Nov 2005, 36 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (8 years 7 months 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 4899 times:

You just have to make sure you phone ahead and arrange fuel, cause they don't keep much on hand  Wink

Gander is a better option for diversions, but likely in this case was experiencing the same weather as YYT.


User currently offlineTurnit56N From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (8 years 7 months 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 4832 times:

If YHZ was filed as the flight's alternate, the plane would have carried enough fuel to make it from EWR to YYT to YHZ plus reserve, and probably some on top of that. Embraer actually lists the 145XR's range as 2,000 nm. While that might be pushing it on a fully loaded aircraft, I can assure you that 1,600 nm is within the XR's range. If I recall correctly, XJT routinely flies scheduled flights that are in the 1,500 nm range (IAH-BOI). Maybe one of the XJT people here can confirm that.

While I don't have any charts on the XR, rough calculations using round numbers seem to indicate that the flight probably wouldn't be weight restricted. The ERJ 145XR has some pretty amazing capabilities.


User currently offlineDFW13L From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (8 years 7 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 4643 times:

I'm more familiar with the American Eagle 145, and we end up fuel stopping RDU-AUS whenever there are strong headwinds, so I'm just not used to a 145 having that kind of range. An alternate 500 miles away blows my mind.

User currently offlineTurnit56N From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (8 years 7 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 4472 times:

Again, someone from XJT may be able to confirm this, but I heard they had some kind of in depth weight and balance system that allows them to carry more weight, and hence more fuel, on their aircraft than most 145 operators. I also don't think you could do anything like that on a regular 145 without the XR's extra tank.

User currently offlineRamper@IAH From United States of America, joined Dec 2001, 240 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (8 years 7 months 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 4429 times:

The EMB-145XR is by far the most capable 50 seat jet airliner out there. To answer the original question - yes, the aircraft has the range to fly from ERW to YYT and use YHZ as an alternate. With full tanks and a max payload a flight origin to destination of 1,800 miles is possible with reserves available for an alternate and 45 minutes of flying thereafter. In other words, it can remain airborne for well over five hours and land with an acceptable amount of fuel.

User currently offlineYOW From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (8 years 7 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 4253 times:

Quoting RoseFlyer (Reply 1):
. Could there have been fuel concerns that mandated them flying to YJT instead? Stephenville is a city of only 7,000 people, and obviously would not be a choice for a diversion unless absolutely necessary.

As was mentioned, YJT has a 10,000 runway. Provincial Airlines plus summer charters are about the only flights YJT sees nowadays. YJT is an alternate for Gander.


User currently offlineLongHauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 5155 posts, RR: 43
Reply 10, posted (8 years 7 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4165 times:

Quoting DFW13L (Thread starter):
I checked the weather and it was 100' ceiling with 1/4 mile vis, so it went below minimums on the way out there.

Runway 29 at YYT is CAT II capable, and quite common for those of us that regularly fly in there. Is Continental Express not CAT II capable?

Also, it is quite common to be fogged in ... and ... with 50 knot winds (defies logic, huh?) ... and ... have moderate turbulence on short final. Not for the faint of heart!

The prize if you make it in? Among the most astounding scenery, and the nicest people in North America. (As most who ended up there on 9/11 will attest).



Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
User currently offlineJetskipper From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 405 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (8 years 7 months 3 days ago) and read 3970 times:

All XJT aircraft and crew are CAT II certified. All we know however is that the visibility was 1/4 sm, the RVR may have been below the CAT II minimums for the approach, or the aircraft could have had an MEL that prevented the operation of CAT II approaches.

User currently offlineBwaflyer From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2004, 690 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (8 years 7 months 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 3840 times:

One of Astraeus' 737-700s operating LGW-YDF (Deer Lake) diverted into Stephenville due to weather at Deer Lake during the winter.

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