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Northwest & TWA In New Zealand  
User currently offlinePulkovokiwi From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (8 years 3 months 2 weeks ago) and read 5658 times:

To my knowledge each of the above carriers has only made one visit to NZ. A TWA 707 to RNZAF Ohakea in 1966 with the LBJ entourage and a NWA 707 to Auckland in 1968 with South Korean President Park. Anyone got any information to the contrary? Thanks!

45 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineOznznut From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 153 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 5478 times:

Hi There
Search the photo data base. There is a TWA 707-331 shown at Auckland. I dont know how to do links.
[www.airliners.net/open.file0268618/M/]
Dave

[Edited 2006-05-23 02:27:02]

User currently offlinePulkovokiwi From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 5370 times:

Oznznut
Thanks Dave will do. Never knew TWA had been to AKL.
Simon


User currently onlineZK-NBT From New Zealand, joined Oct 2000, 5320 posts, RR: 11
Reply 3, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 5177 times:

They TWA weren't scheduled I don't think just to clear that up.

I wonder if NW might someday give AKL a go and SYD another go with 787's?


User currently offlineNZAA From New Zealand, joined Jul 2005, 163 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 5152 times:

If they get out of their financial troubles!


Planes Piloted Tecnam P2002 JF, Cessna 172R, Cessna 152, Airbus A320
User currently offlineDutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 57
Reply 5, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 5111 times:

Quoting ZK-NBT (Reply 3):


I wonder if NW might someday give AKL a go and SYD another go with 787's?

After NW's last attempt at starting service to Australia, which was a financial disaster and even resulted in some minor political implications between Australia, Japan and the US, I doubt that NW will be back in the region any time soon.


User currently offlineParisien From France, joined Dec 2000, 823 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 5064 times:

Wasnt the NW "disaster" as you called it due to NW carrying more Tokyo SYD pax (rather than US SYD through pax) than was allowed ?
If they have that right they might be back dont you think ? but unlikely to get it I guess.


User currently offlineDutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 57
Reply 7, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 5061 times:

Quoting Parisien (Reply 6):
Wasnt the NW "disaster" as you called it due to NW carrying more Tokyo SYD pax (rather than US SYD through pax) than was allowed ?
If they have that right they might be back dont you think ? but unlikely to get it I guess.

Aside from this issue, NW lost a lot of money on its South Pacific experiment.


User currently offlineOnedude From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 214 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 5051 times:

Quoting Parisien (Reply 6):
Wasnt the NW "disaster" as you called it due to NW carrying more Tokyo SYD pax (rather than US SYD through pax) than was allowed ?

It was actually Osaka.


User currently onlineZK-NBT From New Zealand, joined Oct 2000, 5320 posts, RR: 11
Reply 9, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 4998 times:

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 7):
Aside from this issue, NW lost a lot of money on its South Pacific experiment.

Not surprising when they flew 3 different routings with about 10 flights weekly total. I think with 787's they could make it work when they are out of chapter 11.

I think it was

LAX-SYD 3x weekly 744
LAX-HNL-SYD 4x weekly D10, 742
JFK-KIX-SYD 3x weekly 741


User currently offlineNwab787techops From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 219 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 4876 times:

I would love to see NWA fly back to SYD. But, If NWA put a B787 on LAX-SYD it would loose money to QFs A380s. NWA's B787s are for rout that can't fill a B747-400, but too long of a flight for the A330.(IE JFK-NRT).

User currently offlineKkfla737 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1033 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 4761 times:

I thought NW actually did well on the Osaka/Sydney run but had to pull out because of the political controversy created between Japan and Australia. Perhaps I'm mistaken, but that was my recollection.

User currently offlineParisien From France, joined Dec 2000, 823 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 4700 times:

thanks OneDude youre right, its Osaka.
Kklfa737, indeed I read that NW did well on the Osaka-SYD but that was because they carried more japan originated pax that they were supposed to (only a pourcentage of japan originated pax was allowed on the flight, the rest was supposed to be US originated). so that did not sit well with others !


User currently offlineMotorHussy From New Zealand, joined Mar 2000, 3198 posts, RR: 9
Reply 13, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 4524 times:

From memory, the only US airlines to have flown to New Zealand on a regular scheduled service have been PA, CO and UA, none of which fly here any more.


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Colin Hunter




View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Alan Gaskin




View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Frank Schaefer



Of course UA still codeshare with Star partner NZ.



come visit the south pacific
User currently offlineNZ767 From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 1620 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 4374 times:

Add American Airlines to the list too MotorHussy. Smile

User currently offlineKiwiandrew From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 8557 posts, RR: 13
Reply 15, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 4356 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting NZ767 (Reply 14):
Add American Airlines to the list too MotorHussy.

with two separate attempts - early '70s with 707 and sometime in the '80s with DC-10s - neither visit lasted very long



Moderation in all things ... including moderation ;-)
User currently onlineZK-NBT From New Zealand, joined Oct 2000, 5320 posts, RR: 11
Reply 16, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 4338 times:

Quoting Kiwiandrew (Reply 15):

with two separate attempts - early '70s with 707 and sometime in the '80s with DC-10s - neither visit lasted very long

AA last flew to AKL in 1992/93 timeframe.


User currently offlineDutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 57
Reply 17, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 4294 times:

Quoting ZK-NBT (Reply 16):

AA last flew to AKL in 1992/93 timeframe.

Sorry, the dates seem wrong to me, I really dont think that AA was flying into AKL at any time during the 1990s, atleast not with its own aircraft (codeshare maybe?)


User currently offlineNZ767 From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 1620 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 4232 times:

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 17):
Sorry, the dates seem wrong to me, I really dont think that AA was flying into AKL at any time during the 1990s, atleast not with its own aircraft (codeshare maybe?)

Not sure exactly what year they finished but I'm pretty sure it was in the 90s.
They used MD11s then Smile


User currently offlineDutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 57
Reply 19, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 4195 times:

Quoting NZ767 (Reply 18):

Not sure exactly what year they finished but I'm pretty sure it was in the 90s.
They used MD11s then

I checked..........no MD11s to NZ, and not in the 1990s. AA flew a South Pacific network that included NZ in the 1970s/1980s......with 707-320Bs.


User currently offlineNZ767 From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 1620 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 4093 times:

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 19):
I checked..........no MD11s to NZ, and not in the 1990s. AA flew a South Pacific network that included NZ in the 1970s/1980s......with 707-320Bs.

Can you imagine AA using 707's when Continental and NZ were using DC10's and PanAm were using 747's on US-NZ routes at the time?
Come on Kiwis, help me out here. No pics in the database. Smile


User currently offlineDutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 57
Reply 21, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 4081 times:

I dont think that CO, PA and AA all flew to NZ at the same time........but if they did, it was for a very short period of time. PA flew with 707s, 747s and SPs until the UA deal. AA was at AKL from about 1975 until maybe 1979 or 1980 with 707s. And, CO showed up in AKL and Austalia in 1979 or 1980, first with DC10s and 747s were added after the PE merger where by CO got 747s back into their fleet......CO closed up its South Pacific system in the mid 1990s to my recollection.

I think that your timing is a bit off......thus you are imagining old AA 707s flying against the newer types, which was not the case.

If my memory is correct, back in the mid 1970s, AA went out and specially purchased a handful of the most advanced 707-320B, with lots of range, to specifically operate the South Pacific system.


User currently offline767ER From Australia, joined Apr 2001, 1092 posts, RR: 4
Reply 22, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 4053 times:

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 21):
AA was at AKL from about 1975 until maybe 1979 or 1980

I think AA only flew the 707s for a brief period in about 1972 and the then CAB withdrew their rights to fly to SYD and AKL in favour of PA. I recall some intense lobbying of the White House by PA.



Aircraft flown:F27,Viscount. EMB120, SAAB340, ATR70, 737-200.737-300,DC8, DC10,747-100,747-200,747-300,747-400, A320, A3
User currently offlineDutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 57
Reply 23, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 4053 times:

Quoting 767ER (Reply 22):

I think AA only flew the 707s for a brief period in about 1972 and the then CAB withdrew their rights to fly to SYD and AKL in favour of PA. I recall some intense lobbying of the White House by PA.

Dont know about that, but there is a pic here at a.net of an AA 707 at MEL in 1975.


User currently offlineNZ767 From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 1620 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 4017 times:

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 21):
I think that your timing is a bit off......thus you are imagining old AA 707s flying against the newer types, which was not the case.

Yeah I think my timing might be a bit twisted too Dutchjet. I hope it's not the age thing creeping up already. Hell I'm only 40.  Smile
Yes, CO did withdraw in the 90s. I flew them AKL-HNL in 1982 on a DC10-30.
Where did you find your info on AA flying to AKL. I've tried all sorts of searchs on the net.


25 Pulkovokiwi : American was at Auckland from 1969.I went to the launch party at The Hotel Intercontinental Auckland (owned by PanAm) as my dad was a journo at "The A
26 767ER : me too and no luck......i doubt AA ever flew the DC10s into AKL but I could be wrong. I do remember see AAs !0s in SYD in 1990.....that service died
27 NZ767 : I did another search and came up with a history of AA. That site states that AA flew 747s to AKL before trading the Pacific routes for PA's Caribbean
28 767ER : I saw that too...I'm with you...they have got it confused!
29 ZK-NBT : AA definalty flew to AKL in the early 1990's with DC10-30's! DFW-HNL-AKL 3x weekly, the other days they flew DFW-HNL-SYD! I have a feeling they were h
30 Dutchjet : And how did you come to this conclusion........is there any source or reference that you discovered as I would be interested in taking a look. I find
31 Post contains images MotorHussy : Love this shot of two PanAm and one TWA 707's in AKL in the 70's: Regards MH
32 ZK-NBT : Thats a cool shot MH! Saw them with my own eyes!
33 Post contains images TWAtwaTWA : Nice one, MotorHussy Here is the matching photo from the database p.s. MotorHussy, I honeymooned in your country, and it was an absolutely amazing tr
34 Post contains images NZ767 : Wow, That's when the international wing was just to the west side of the present domestic (Air NZ) terminal. I remember seeing Pan Am and Qantas with
35 Pulkovokiwi : And occasionally we got a CPA DC8-63 which was something else way back then.
36 767ER : and wasn't that a dump and a half???
37 Post contains links and images IsuA380B777 : Any idea what route did the PanAM DC7s followed when serving the AKL in early sixties? View Large View MediumPhoto © Ray Massey Regards[Edited 20
38 Pulkovokiwi : Pan Am had a crew base at AKL and flew Auckland-Nadi-Pago Pago return. I flew DC7C "Clipper Defender" to Pago Pago in January 1965 and it was magic. I
39 767ER : Yes agreed........PA was the first US airline to fly to New Zealand and had a long history until they pulled out when the, foolshily, sold their Sth
40 Antskip : Whenuapai was a wonderful airport in its last years. I used to go out there every now and then for a day's plane-spotting, with a camera. It was such
41 IsuA380B777 : Thank you very much Pulkovokiwi and 767ER. The information you guys provided are very useful. You are correct. I live near by and think it is a great
42 Post contains images NZ8800 : Would you be able to post some of those photographs here on A.net Antskip? That would be fantastic! Counted 2 50's photos and 11 from the 60s for Whe
43 MotorHussy : I flew the NZ (or TE back then) version of this many times, one time, back in '72 very circuitously. CBR to SYD on a TN (TAA) 727 SYD to NAN on a PA/
44 Pulkovokiwi : Yes Whenuapai was great in the 6o's for spotting. Canadian Pacific Britannia,TAI DC4,Qantas DC4,Constellation and Electra. I remember TEAL/Air NZ had
45 Antskip : If I ever find them again in the family archives, of course I will. But I am not hopeful, I'm afraid.
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