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Canjet & Harmony Partner  
User currently offlineLawnDart From United States of America, joined May 2005, 970 posts, RR: 3
Posted (8 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 3288 times:

Canjet and Harmony Airlines have announced a marketing partnership to transfer passengers between each others' systems at Toronto. Sounds interesting, but are they really the same? Have heard good things about Harmony, haven't heard much about Canjet.

Do you think this alliance will benefit either carrier? Could an alliance like this benefit LCCs in the United States or Europe?

37 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineCaptaingomes From Canada, joined Feb 2001, 6413 posts, RR: 55
Reply 1, posted (8 years 3 months 2 weeks ago) and read 3228 times:

Interesting. We are basically combining the two weakest airlines that concentrate on domestic travel (excluding some flights operated by Sunwing and Skyservice domestically). There are consistent rumours both airlines not doing very well, so we'll see what this means in the long-run.


"it's kind of like an Airbus, it's an engineering marvel, but there's no sense of passion" -- J. Clarkson re: Coxster
User currently offlineYYZYYT From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 948 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 3179 times:

Quoting LawnDart (Thread starter):
Have heard good things about Harmony, haven't heard much about Canjet.

I'm a fan of Canjet - fly'em all the time.
Basic service, but inexpensive, comfortable enough, reliable and very freindly.

As for a deal with Harmony, I can see how this could work out, given that Canjet is great for eastern Canada, whereas Harmony seems to do mostly YVR....

Quoting Captaingomes (Reply 1):
are consistent rumours both airlines not doing very well, so we'll see what this means in the long-run.

truly? I haven't heard that before...


User currently offlineMatt From Canada, joined May 1999, 694 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 3136 times:

Quoting YYZYYT (Reply 2):
truly? I haven't heard that before...

I haven't heard that either!

I, too, am a CanJet fan. I fly them reguarly. Their fares are usually the best around (most often better than WestJet on similar routes). They are also doing more and more charter flying out of Atlantic Canada on behalf of tour operators Transat Holidays and Sunquest. I also have to add that their "new" 737-300s are more confortable than their 737-200s. The leather seats add a lot.



Next flights: YQM-YYZ-YOW v.v. / YQM-CUN v.v. / YQM-YUL-YWG v.v. / YSJ-YYZ-SEA-SFO / SFO-YYZ-YOW-YQM / YQM-YYZ-MUC-TXL /
User currently offlineKrisYYZ From Canada, joined Nov 2004, 1593 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 3123 times:

thats great news!! both CanJet and Harmony are great Canadian airlines. I think YYZ would be a perfect ( and costly) hub where CanJet pax from the east and the US could transfer on to westbound HMY flights. If this deal is successful I bet we can see some additions to HMYs fleet, perhaps some more used B757s or even a B787 order.


PS. for some reason I remember a Canjet flight that flew to Halifax with at FL100 with no pressurization, am I correct or was it a different airline?

KrisYYZ


User currently offlineNiagaraFlyer From Canada, joined May 2006, 49 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 3061 times:

Quoting KrisYYZ (Reply 4):
PS. for some reason I remember a Canjet flight that flew to Halifax with at FL100 with no pressurization, am I correct or was it a different airline?

Yeah I remember that too, I think it was a 732 coming from YYZ but I may be mistaken.

Also does anyone have the link to anything confirming this news between Harmony and Canjet?

-Johnathan


User currently offlineCaptaingomes From Canada, joined Feb 2001, 6413 posts, RR: 55
Reply 6, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 3044 times:

Quoting YYZYYT (Reply 2):
truly? I haven't heard that before...

Just rumours of course, can't substantiate  Wink

I've heard mostly good about Canjet, mostly about their very friendly staff. I've only flown on the former Canjet, after the C3 merger though, so I can't comment on their current service levels.

I hope this works out well for both airlines though.



"it's kind of like an Airbus, it's an engineering marvel, but there's no sense of passion" -- J. Clarkson re: Coxster
User currently offlineFLYACYYZ From Canada, joined Jan 2004, 1914 posts, RR: 12
Reply 7, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 3022 times:

Both are good airlines, but with only two YVR-YYZ flights per day, marketing and interline opportunities are limited.


Above and Beyond
User currently offlineCaptaingomes From Canada, joined Feb 2001, 6413 posts, RR: 55
Reply 8, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 3012 times:

Harmony has really nice service by the way. Despite their lack of frequencies as pointed out, they're definitely worth trying.


"it's kind of like an Airbus, it's an engineering marvel, but there's no sense of passion" -- J. Clarkson re: Coxster
User currently offlineChalliday From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2006, 88 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 2861 times:

Quoting Captaingomes (Reply 6):
I've heard mostly good about Canjet, mostly about their very friendly staff. I've only flown on the former Canjet, after the C3 merger though, so I can't comment on their current service levels.

The pre C3 Canjet is the Canjet that is running now, same owner and alot of the same employees.

Quoting Captaingomes (Reply 6):
Also does anyone have the link to anything confirming this news between Harmony and Canjet?

http://www.canjet.com/en_view_press_release.aspx?NewsID=140


User currently offlineTennisace From Canada, joined Feb 2001, 219 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 2841 times:

A bit of an odd pairing that's for sure, but hey if it feeds passengers into each other's routes then it's got to be good for both Harmony and Canjet.

I'm a little skeptical of the schedule though. If you look at it, the frequencies aren't necessarily 7 days a week on all the routes and some of the connections are very long at T3. They would have to be pretty loyal Harmony/Canjet customers to NOT just book on WJ or AC.

http://harmonyairways.com/travel_information/flights_canjet.shtml


User currently offlineIrobertson From Canada, joined Apr 2006, 601 posts, RR: 3
Reply 11, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 2828 times:

Quoting Matt (Reply 3):
737-300s

Very picky, I think they're -500s.

Canjet consistently beats WestJet's prices on the east coast, say between YHZ and YYZ, often by very substantial margins by my experiences. I can imagine that the two airlines will be able to offer very competitive prices to AC and WJ for coast to coast trips. It would be nice to see some expanded fleets on both sides and this just might help things out a bit.

In the end, Canjet and Harmony aren't really offering much competition to Westjet, who serves all the rest of the airports in between YVR and YYZ, not to mention the southwest USA. I think this is great news.


User currently offlineTribird1011 From Canada, joined Mar 2005, 208 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 2655 times:

Quoting Irobertson (Reply 11):
Very picky, I think they're -500s

Indeed - they do have 1 -300 though (C-FHGE), with rumours of one or two more to come.
 Smile


User currently offlineMkirch72 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 198 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 2628 times:

Any rumors of growth plans for Canjet? Specifically - flights to Florida. I live right next to PIE (St. Pete/Clearwater) and would love to have a direct flight to YOW. I have family just over the border in Massena, NY and YOW is the closest larger airport. Currently Canjet only has seasonal service out of PIE to Toronto.

About 40 minutes south is SRQ (Sarasota). Canjet DOES have a nonstop to Ottawa - but again, only seasonal and only once/week.

I'd love to give them a try but the frequency doesn't work for me (same with Westjet - only once/week from TPA to Toronto). Not to mention the fares on Air Canada are ridiculous.

[Edited 2006-05-25 05:19:12]

User currently offlineIrobertson From Canada, joined Apr 2006, 601 posts, RR: 3
Reply 14, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 2615 times:

Quoting Tribird1011 (Reply 12):

Thanks, I had no idea!

Quoting Mkirch72 (Reply 13):

I can partially relate. I live in London, Ontario and my hometown is Halifax, Nova Scotia. Westjet flies into London, but they only go west, not east. Sunwing is just starting direct service, which I hope to take advantage of at some point, and AC is horribly priced. You pay an extra $200 over Sunwing (or any flight out of YYZ two hours by car away, 40 minute flight) and you fly a DHC8 to YYZ or YOW first. I'd rather use AC because of the great frequency they have, but it's just not worth the money to me. I don't imagine Sunwing will keep up this service (YHZ-YXU-YVR) when the summer is out, so it would be nice for Canjet to fly to YXU from YHZ come winter time.


User currently offlineA332 From Canada, joined Feb 2005, 1644 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 2603 times:

Well, I wish both airlines the best of luck... it is especially important for Canjet to try and get some kind of market share in the west, since they have been pretty lacklustre performers out here thus far.

In all honesty, I have looked to book airfare several times to YYZ where Canjet is only moderately cheaper.. and who wants to be cramped on a 735 with no comforts when WJ/AC offer a far more attractive package for a little more money...?

This is also the second time Canjet is going to attempt to make the YVR run profitable... let's hope it pans out!



Bad spellers of the world... UNTIE!
User currently offlineIrobertson From Canada, joined Apr 2006, 601 posts, RR: 3
Reply 16, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 2591 times:

Quoting A332 (Reply 15):

I took a flight on Royal/C3000 just as the merger was taking place with Canjet too. Flew a Canjet 732 from YHZ to YYZ and a Royal 757 from YYZ to YVR. It was very nice, great price, free drinks and a meal on the 757, times worked out quite well. I would be more than willing to give the same service a try the second time around, as I hear Harmony tries to treat their customers a touch nicer than AC (meals on their YVR service, it's something).


User currently offlineChalliday From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2006, 88 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 2564 times:

Quoting A332 (Reply 15):
This is also the second time Canjet is going to attempt to make the YVR run profitable

Canjet did try the run toward the end of last year but it was "seasonal". From my understanding the loads were not the problem but lack of air craft that caused Canjet to rethink about the route.

Quoting Tribird1011 (Reply 12):

Indeed - they do have 1 -300 though (C-FHGE), with rumours of one or two more to come.

Heard that rumour myself but they're having trouble finding used 737-300's and 500's.


User currently offlineFly2YYZ From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 1044 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2544 times:

Quoting Tennisace (Reply 10):

I'm a little skeptical of the schedule though. If you look at it, the frequencies aren't necessarily 7 days a week on all the routes and some of the connections are very long at T3. They would have to be pretty loyal Harmony/Canjet customers to NOT just book on WJ or AC.

I have to agree with ya there as looking at the schedules this agreement between HQ/C6 doesnt leave very much room unless either of them skew their schedules to allow for more connecting opportunities.

ie
From YVR-YYZ-Atlantic Canada only offers a handful of connecting opportunities: I'm being pretty generous with the connecting times as well.

YVR-YYZ

09 May 06-30 Apr 07 1234567 HQ228 1430-2200
06 Jun 06-27 Oct 06 123.5.. HQ212 0800-1530
28 Jun 06-30 Apr 07 12345.6 HQ216 2345-0715

Connecting to:
YYZ-YYT
1234567 C6188 1945-0015

YYZ-YHZ-NFLD
12345.7 C6160 1810-2115
.....6. C6160 1830-2135

YYZ-YQM
1234567 C6550 0915-1215


---------------------------------
Even worse going westwards where it seems only the YHZ-YVR has "decent" connecting times.

NFLD-YHZ-YYZ
12345.7 C6135 1230-1355
1234567 C6161 1810-1935


YYZ-YVR
09 May 06-30 Apr 07 1234567 HQ213 0825-1030
06 Jun 06-27 Oct 06 123.5.. HQ219 1625-1835
28 Jun 06-30 Apr 07 12345.7 HQ217 2300-0105+1


But I have a feeling one of the two will either skew times to be more passenger connecting friendly. Though I think they should wait until their interline baggage agreements kicks in... as from the C6 Website under the Harmony Q&A Page (http://www.canjet.com/en_faqs.aspx?ID=12) Question 13 states:

13. Do passengers have to pick up their luggage in Toronto and check into the connecting flight?

CanJet and Harmony are currently working out the details for interline baggage. Further information will be posted when it becomes available.


Good luck Canjet and Harmony!

J.


User currently offlineChalliday From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2006, 88 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 2526 times:

Quoting Fly2YYZ (Reply 18):
But I have a feeling one of the two will either skew times to be more passenger connecting friendly.


http://harmonyairways.com/travel_information/flights_canjet.shtml

"Sample schedule based on July 3 departure dates, please call to confirm flight schedules at time of booking."

According to the Harmony website, so I think you'll find this WILL change before the agreement kicks in next week.

[Edited 2006-05-25 11:01:20]

User currently offlineAeroplan73 From Canada, joined May 2006, 165 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 2521 times:

Quoting LawnDart (Thread starter):

Harmony and Canjet seems like a strange partnership.

From my experiences, Harmony offers a fairly decent full service economy class, superior to Air Canada domestic service. Canjet is fairly basic service, but decent.

Harmony has many YVR routes, so perhaps Canjet can give them greater eastern access.



I remember, the choices were chicken or fish. I had the lasagna.
User currently offlineIrobertson From Canada, joined Apr 2006, 601 posts, RR: 3
Reply 21, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2447 times:

Quoting Aeroplan73 (Reply 20):
Harmony has many YVR routes, so perhaps Canjet can give them greater eastern access.

This seems to be the biggest/only-good reason for Harmony to sign on  Wink

Didn't Canjet also go to Winnipeg? Their current map at www.canjet.com doesn't show it anymore. Also, their map is colored rather oddly. It looks at first glance that the blue indicates where they fly to. But the only province out west they serve (aside from Hamony codesharing) is Alberta at the moment... so are they just coloring all of Canada just for the hell of it?

Things I think about at work when it is slow...


User currently offlineChalliday From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2006, 88 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2440 times:

Quoting Irobertson (Reply 21):
Didn't Canjet also go to Winnipeg?

Kind of in February 2005 but they only connected Winnipeg to Florida and only as a seasonal route, they didn't connect it to their Canadian route network.

http://www.canjet.com/en_view_press_release.aspx?NewsID=76

Quoting Irobertson (Reply 21):
so are they just coloring all of Canada just for the hell of it?

Yes, yes they are.....

And more news from Canjet:

CanJet and Government of Canada Sign Air Travel Agreement

CanJet Airlines is pleased to announce it has entered into an agreement with the Government of Canada which will result in substantial air travel savings for the federal government and increased business for CanJet.

Julie. N. Gossen, CanJet Airlines Executive Vice-President and Chief Operating Officer, said, “Our airline is thrilled to enter into this agreement and we look forward to meeting the air travel requirements of personnel employed by the Government of Canada.”

http://www.canjet.com/en_view_press_release.aspx?NewsID=141


User currently offlineDFORCE1 From Canada, joined Jul 2005, 505 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 2370 times:

Glad to see Canjet solidifying its position in the marketplace.

I take a different view on the whole topic. While CanJet and Harmony seem to currently be positioning themselves as an East-West connector. In the future (way far down in the future), I see Harmony focusing on internationals and long-hauls with CanJet operating the domestic services. So what we would have is CanJet feeding Harmony flights out of YVR, YYZ and maybe even YYC. We already know that Harmony is looking at Asia.

Quoting Aeroplan73 (Reply 20):
From my experiences, Harmony offers a fairly decent full service economy class, superior to Air Canada domestic service. Canjet is fairly basic service, but decent.

Much like the AC Jazz & AC relationship, services between connecting airlines do not have to be consistent although it is better for the consumer and helps airlines to build brand loyalty. What CanJet and Harmony are both missing are a frequent flyer program.


User currently offlineFly2YYZ From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 1044 posts, RR: 2
Reply 24, posted (8 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 2348 times:

Quoting Irobertson (Reply 21):
Didn't Canjet also go to Winnipeg? Their current map at www.canjet.com doesn't show it anymore. Also, their map is colored rather oddly. It looks at first glance that the blue indicates where they fly to. But the only province out west they serve (aside from Hamony codesharing) is Alberta at the moment... so are they just coloring all of Canada just for the hell of it?

CanJet flew a service from YWG I believe to MCO or SRQ, I forgot which one it was but I know it was some FL destination. Anyone care to shed light?


25 Jayce : Dforce, if indeed you are correct, what do you think the odds are of an eventual merger between the two?
26 Post contains links Challiday : Just incase you missed it two posts above yours http://www.canjet.com/en_view_press_release.aspx?NewsID=76
27 Captaingomes : In fact, Harmony have excellent on-board service. If schedules are fares are acceptable, I highly recommend them. I only flew them once, and they kin
28 Post contains images DFORCE1 : I think it is extremely difficult to predict a merger at this point as it is so far fetched. Without truly knowing the financial situation of either
29 RicardoFG : HQ is doing very well with its partnership with China Eastern. The YVR-YYZ route is for the most part transfer pax of China Eastern. HQ have long been
30 YOW : That was a -200 doing a YYZ-YHZ run. That flight was a PR nightmare for CanJet. It was perfectly safe to operate the aircraft unpressurized at FL100.
31 Post contains links and images MD90fan : They (HQ) seem like a nice Canadian niche carrier, maybe my favorite one. I hope they grow strong and make alot of money I wasnt aware Voyageur had an
32 YOW : Until this agreement happened, they didn't. Voyageur are more known for their Dash 7s.
33 RyGuy : I think that they should try to attract business people trying to get the hop between YYZ and YUL!! then i would be on it 100% Very competitive pricin
34 Post contains images Aeroplan73 : Yes, I think that is something they should both consider. Not that I am a fan of Aeroplan or anything mind you.
35 YYZYYT : Can't speak for Harmony, but Canjet does have a very good reward program: 6 one-way flights and the 7th is free. And much less stupid red tape than o
36 Post contains links DFORCE1 : Well there goes my theory about CanJet being the regional feeder into Harmony..... Looks like Collins has announced that they are looking at regional
37 Voodoo : Some armchair CEO-ing given Air Canada uncertainty on YYT-LHR.: Harmony 757 LHR-YYT-YYC-YYT-LHR. Canjet feeding Eastbound at YYT, collecting Westbound
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