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Boeing 757-400?  
User currently offlineContinentalGuy From United States of America, joined May 2006, 90 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 26244 times:

Would Boeing ever make an extremely long (longer than 757-300 or 777-300) 757-400? If so, what would the airline benefits be?

32 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineZvezda From Lithuania, joined Aug 2004, 10511 posts, RR: 64
Reply 1, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 26209 times:

No. Boeing will not make any more B757s of any length. The tooling has been scrapped. Also, the B757-300 already has a high length to fuselage height ratio for a metal airliner. It is conceivable that the longest variant of the B737RS (formerly Y1) might be longer than the B757-300, but it will not be as long as a B777-300.

User currently offlineAndrewuber From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2528 posts, RR: 40
Reply 2, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 26209 times:

The 757 line closed last year, so I really doubt they would re-open it to offer an aircraft that would compete with the 787 and / or 739.

Anyway - the 753 looks quite long already, I'm not sure if they could put much more on that airframe.

Drew



I'd rather shoot BAD_MOTIVE
User currently offlineLN-MOW From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 1909 posts, RR: 13
Reply 3, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 26171 times:

757-400? Didn't you know? We're using it for our overseas military flights!

http://www.cardatabase.net/modifiedairlinerphotos/photos/big/00001207.jpg



- I am LN-MOW, and I approve this message.
User currently offlineAmerican 767 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 3993 posts, RR: 12
Reply 4, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 25803 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

No there won't be a 757-400. As mentioned above, the B757 production line closed a year ago and I really doubt Boeing would ever reopen the line. Boeing did not even think of a 757-400 while the 757 line was still open. Even if Boeing did think of it, the 400 would not have been any longer than the 300, the 400 would probably have had the same lenght as the 200 but it would have had improved features such as raked wingtips, LCD cockpit like that of the B777/B767-400, while it would still be part of the B757/767 type rating when certified by the FAA.

Ben Soriano
Brussels Belgium



Ben Soriano
User currently offlineJetjack74 From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 7437 posts, RR: 50
Reply 5, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 25729 times:
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Quoting Zvezda (Reply 1):
Boeing will not make any more B757s of any length. The tooling has been scrapped. Also, the B757-300 already has a high length to fuselage height ratio for a metal airliner.

That's not correct, a 757 can be built, but it will have it's price. The option to build a 757 airframe is still possible, but the customer will pay an inflated list price, plus additional production costs. Boeing can, and will build any airframe, but it's most likely going to come from a gov't-related order. When the US Navy was looking for a platform for the E-6, they selected the 707-320 airframe. The RAF also selected the new-built airframes of the 707 for their E-3D Sentry AWACs aircraft. Any redundant airframe can be constructed, but it's just gonna cost more.



Made from jets!
User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 1001 posts, RR: 51
Reply 6, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 25681 times:

Quoting Jetjack74 (Reply 5):
That's not correct, a 757 can be built, but it will have it's price.

Wrong, wrong, wrong.

The production line is gone. The tools to make non-replaceable 757 parts are gone. The subcontractors have gone on to other things. There's absolutely no way to build a 757 for any customer without relaunching the entire program. That would take millions of dollars and a vote by the board of executives.

In other words, it ain't gonna happen.


User currently offlineBR715-A1-30 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 25665 times:

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 6):

You said it pal. Straight from the horse's mouth


User currently offlineFlyDreamliner From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 2759 posts, RR: 15
Reply 8, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 25597 times:

They closed the 757 line for a reason, that reason was not that airlines were ordering too many.


"Let the world change you, and you can change the world"
User currently offlineN328KF From United States of America, joined May 2004, 6491 posts, RR: 3
Reply 9, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 25218 times:

Quoting Jetjack74 (Reply 5):
When the US Navy was looking for a platform for the E-6, they selected the 707-320 airframe. The RAF also selected the new-built airframes of the 707 for their E-3D Sentry AWACs aircraft. Any redundant airframe can be constructed, but it's just gonna cost more.

This misses a very important point: The 707 line was still running when these orders came in, and these orders kept production going until 1989.



When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' T.Roosevelt
User currently offline797charter From Denmark, joined Jun 2005, 219 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 24638 times:

Quoting ContinentalGuy (Thread starter):
Would Boeing ever make an extremely long (longer than 757-300 or 777-300) 757-400? If so, what would the airline benefits be?

Gooood idea whit this 757-400-!

But I think the Boeing R&D first have to finish the 707-800.
 hyper 



Keep it clear of the propellers
User currently offlineMush From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 97 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 23263 times:

Quoting Jetjack74 (Reply 5):
That's not correct, a 757 can be built, but it will have it's price. The option to build a 757 airframe is still possible, but the customer will pay an inflated list price, plus additional production costs.



Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 6):
That would take millions of dollars and a vote by the board of executives.

The board would vote yes and Boeing would spend the money if, like Jetjack said, the customer paid an inflated price.
Think about it...if someone was willing to pay $300 million each for 20 brand new 757s, Boeing would bend over backwards to make the airplanes for the customer.

I personally think that no more 757s will be built, but it is possible...for the right price.

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 6):
The production line is gone. The tools to make non-replaceable 757 parts are gone. The subcontractors have gone on to other things.

And if the subcontractors could make a few extra dollars they could replace everything (tooling, production line, etc.) that is gone and destroyed.



Sprung from cages out on highway 9
User currently offlineNoelg From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 23099 times:

Haven't you heard Condor have already tried it, crammed in a few extra seats at least!  Wink

http://www.marshgiddings.com/images/757-400.jpg

Hope you like the product of my bored lunch break!  Wink


User currently onlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 31393 posts, RR: 85
Reply 13, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 22901 times:
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If, for some reason, the USAF needs any additional C-20s (the military transport version of the 757), they will purchase already existing commercial frames and convert them, just as they did with 707s when they built the E-8C JSTARS.

User currently offlineAirportGal From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 73 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 22630 times:

Quoting Noelg (Reply 12):
Hope you like the product of my bored lunch break!

I think you need a few more doors - LOL!


User currently offlineMush From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 97 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 22607 times:

Quoting Stitch (Reply 13):
If, for some reason, the USAF needs any additional C-20s (the military transport version of the 757), they will purchase already existing commercial frames and convert them, just as they did with 707s when they built the E-8C JSTARS.

I agree that the US Government would buy used commercial hulls if they were required, but it is possible for them to get new ones (at an inflated price that would cover the costs of recommissioning the line). And I think that was the point Jetjack was trying to make.

Let's go Mets!!!



Sprung from cages out on highway 9
User currently offlineChiGB1973 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 1619 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 22260 times:

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 1):
No. Boeing will not make any more B757s of any length. The tooling has been scrapped.



Quoting Andrewuber (Reply 2):
The 757 line closed last year,



Quoting American 767 (Reply 4):
B757 production line closed



Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 6):
The production line is gone. The tools to make non-replaceable 757 parts are gone.



Quoting FlyDreamliner (Reply 8):
They closed the 757 line for a reason, that reason was not that airlines were ordering too many

I know it's true that there will never be anymore built and there are still a lot of them out there, but all these statements still make me a little sad.

When I would see DL's 757 at BHM, I thought it looked a little awkward with the nose gear set so far back, at least compared to the other aircraft. I had not seen a 777 except UA's that stayed a few days in BHM on 9/11. My airplane experience was limited.

I worked for TZ for 2 1/2 years and from the beginning I fell in love with the 757. That is one awesome plane. I always was glad to fly on them. I was at MDW last night picking up a friend and saw one of the 752s and brought back good memories.

I know I will see them around for years to come and always look forward to change in the industry, but the 757-200 and -300 are great planes. Though I think I have stayed on subject, I will mention that anything longer than the -300, without 2 aisles, would be a huge hassle. Some charters had air stairs at L-1 and L-4 and that was great, but standard boarding from one door and standard deplaning from one door took quite a while.

There is my sentimental story for the day. Long live the 757 and TZ.

M


User currently offlineJetjack74 From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 7437 posts, RR: 50
Reply 17, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 21649 times:
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Quoting N328KF (Reply 9):
This misses a very important point: The 707 line was still running when these orders came in, and these orders kept production going until 1989.

Wrong. The production line ceased long before that. The 707 line ceased on December 9th, 1977, when the last 707 when the last 70 rolled off the production line and was delivered, a -3F9C to Nigeria Airways in January of '78. Production ended more than 10 years before your alleged date. The E-6 situation required an airframe that could accomodate the TACAMO equipment that was on the EC-130Q's, to the point, that a new-built airframe was the only option. Also, when the E-6 was commissioned in 1986, the availability of low-time, well-maintained 707's were hard to come by because the owners were either unwilling to part with them, or they were all being snapped up by the US gov't for the KC-135E upgrade programme underway. So the only option was to build 16 new ones, first one being in 1989, last one in 1994. The E-8 JSTARs programme was a bit different. The Senate Appropriations Committee awarded the USAF in January of 1989 the funds to purchase newly built 707's for the E-8C, however because of cost overruns, and budget shortages, the idea was later cast to acquire civilian 707's, and convert them. The Navy's needs justified the means to purchase new 707's, while the Air Force's did not.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 13):
If, for some reason, the USAF needs any additional C-20s (the military transport version of the 757), they will purchase already existing commercial frames and convert them, just as they did with 707s when they built the E-8C JSTARS.

Number 1, the the C-20 is a Gulfstream, the C-32 is the 757. Number 2, the mission of the C-32 is executive transport of the executive branch, which in this case would never be tasked with former civilian aircraft. As I said above, the E-8 programme originally called for new 707 airframes, but the USAF decided to go with conversion because of budgeting shortfalls in defense spending for that fiscal year. Completely different senarios

Quoting Mush (Reply 15):
I agree that the US Government would buy used commercial hulls if they were required, but it is possible for them to get new ones (at an inflated price that would cover the costs of recommissioning the line). And I think that was the point Jetjack was trying to make

Exactly, if a customer wants something bad enough that only Boeing can build, than it can be built. It's just going to cost alot more than it did in the past. This mumbo-jumbo about production lines ceasing is garbage. it's meaningless.


Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 6):
The production line is gone.

So what? Boeing wouldn't need to open an entire production line to build a few airframes.

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 6):
The tools to make non-replaceable 757 parts are gone. The subcontractors have gone on to other things.

Rubbish. Everything has a price.

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 6):
There's absolutely no way to build a 757 for any customer without relaunching the entire program.



Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 6):
That would take millions of dollars and a vote by the board of executives.

B F-ing S, the production of an aircraft has nothing to do with the a board of executives. It's up to the sales and engineering division. You can build aircraft without a production line. The 707 airframes I referenced above weren't built on the 707 prodution line. The VC-25A's weren't built on the 747-200 production line. If a 757 was built, under special circumstances, it would most likely be built in Witchita, KS. The likelyhood is slim to none, but to say that it can never happen is just garbage. You can't say that with any certainty, you or I can only speculate.



Made from jets!
User currently offlineUSADreamliner From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 21456 times:

I was on a CO 753 from FLL to IAH. I don't know you, but when I was inside the plane, my first thought was "Oh, this is SO narrow". Very crampred seats ( even for me, a skinny guy). And you can't avoid the claustrophobic feeling on such long and thin tube!


USADreamliner  crowded 


User currently offlineCOA735 From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 202 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 20807 times:

Quoting Noelg (Reply 12):
Hope you like the product of my bored lunch break!

Funny as hell  rotfl   rotfl 

JM  mischievous 


User currently offlineJAL From Canada, joined Apr 2000, 5093 posts, RR: 8
Reply 20, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 20504 times:

There's no point for Boeing to relaunch the 757 line with the 787 in the horizon plus don't think many airlines will want to order it.


Work Hard But Play Harder
User currently offlineRichardPrice From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 20347 times:

1

Quoting Jetjack74 (Reply 17):
Wrong. The production line ceased long before that. The 707 line ceased on December 9th, 1977, when the last 707 when the last 70 rolled off the production line and was delivered

That was the last civilian 707, the military 707 variant production carried on.

US Military:
1959 Model 707-153 VC-137A 3
1962 Model 707-353B VC-137C 2
1972 Model 707-320B EC-137D 2
1975 Model 707-320B E-3A 22
1980 Model 707-320B E-3B 10
1987 Model 707-320C E-6A 16
1990 Model 707-320C YE-8B 1

Foreign Military:
1980 Model 707-320B E-3A 23
1986 Model 707-320B KE-3A 8
1989 Model 707-320B E-3D 7
1990 Model 707-320B E-3F 4 Total: 42
1975 Model 707-3F3B delivered to: Argentina 1
1974 Model 707-3L6B/C delivered to: Malaysia 2
1968 Model 707-307C delivered to: West Germany 4
1970 Model 707-347C delivered to: Canada 5
1974 Model 707-366C delivered to: Egypt 1
1975 Model 707-368C delivered to: Saudi Arabia 1
1971 Model 707-3F5C delivered to: Portugal 2
1975 Model 707-3M1C delivered to: Indonesia 1
1974 Model 707-3J9C delivered to: Iran 14
1977 Model 707-3P1C delivered to: Qatar Emiri 1


User currently offlineBR715-A1-30 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 20294 times:

Quoting Jetjack74 (Reply 17):
The VC-25A's weren't built on the 747-200 production line.

Which leads me to ask, How did they build the VC-25As.. Did they just make 2 747-200Bs from Scratch, or did they use 747-400F parts and just convert it to executive/civilian use. And how come they didn't order 2 747-400s instead, seeing as how they were newer, and already on the line.


User currently offlineRichardPrice From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 20266 times:

Quoting BR715-A1-30 (Reply 22):

Two standard -200B aircraft were delivered as normal, and they were then converted to the VC-25 standard. There was no need for a production line conversion, as there wasnt enough ordered.


User currently offlinePikky02 From United States of America, joined May 2006, 5 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (8 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 20068 times:

I've never imagined a 757 with 4 engines LN-MOW. LOL.

25 Post contains links and images Rampkontroler : Just some food for thought for you.... The following quoted from "Great Airliners- Volume 3 747SP" by Brian Baum: "The 45th and final SP built ( A6-ZS
26 RichardPrice : It was built in the same production line as the -200, -300 and -400 wasnt it? Just assign a bay to that aircraft and build it - chances are 99% of th
27 Rampkontroler : Hi Richard--- I'm not sure, but that's my guess as well...It would make the most sense. For all their similarities, they had many striking difference
28 N328KF : Sort of. A lot of -400 parts (engines, cockpit) were used on the VC-25s.
29 Rampkontroler : And just to follow up, the same book states that the SP shared a 92% structural commonality with the -100 series. So, it sounds like a reasonable pro
30 Boeing Nut : Engines yes, cockpit, no. The VC-25's have a standard -200 cockpit.
31 Jetjack74 : The production line was shut down, period. Boeing built the new examples when orders were placed. They were constructed at Boeing/Witchita. The reaso
32 Post contains images DfwRevolution : And guess who is responsible for giving the sales division the authority to offer a product? Ding ding ding... the board of executives. And guess who
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