FlyDeltaJets From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 1623 posts, RR: 3 Reply 1, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 8171 times:
Actually the first flight was on Friday June 1st. I wasn't there but the load was pretty good. It looks like a moneymaker,
Sushka From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 4784 posts, RR: 16 Reply 2, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 8160 times:
FlyDeltaJets From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 1623 posts, RR: 3 Reply 3, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 8120 times:
PWM2TXLHopper From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 1217 posts, RR: 1 Reply 5, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 7958 times:
Quoting DL4EVR (Reply 4): but it's Delta Air Lines not Delta Airlines!
Actually it's just Delta these days, the 'Airlines" part was removed from the name a year or two back.
OttoPylit From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 7, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 7889 times:
Quoting DL4EVR (Reply 6): Um...well even though it's referred to as Delta...it's still "Delta Air Lines, Inc."
The "Air Lines" was removed from the logo in 2000.
Yes, Delta was just removed from the mainline logo. However, if you see Song aircraft, the sticker next to the boarding door says, "Operated by Delta Air Lines."
The company will never change to just Delta. You don't see Carnival Cruiseline just changing their name to Carnival. You don't see Greyhound Buslines changing their name to Greyhound. You need to let it be known what product you offer.
Ramprat74 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1455 posts, RR: 2 Reply 8, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 7865 times:
Quoting FlyDeltaJets (Reply 1): Actually the first flight was on Friday June 1st. I wasn't there but the load was pretty good. It looks like a moneymaker,
Just because the flight went out full, doesn't make it a money maker.
Panamair From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 4583 posts, RR: 26 Reply 10, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 7831 times:
Quoting RJpieces (Reply 9): What is this he is talking about?
DL's refreshed BusinessElite product - improved seat, AVOD IFE, new meals - is gradually being rolled out on the 763ER fleet. The JFK-KBP flight got one of the three 763ERs outfitted with the revamped Business product. An additional 8 will be converted by the end of June.
Does anyone know whether these 763ERs with the new BE set-up are being targeted for specific routes or are they just used randomly all over the system and for inaugurals?
RJpieces From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 11, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 7813 times:
Quoting Panamair (Reply 11): DL's refreshed BusinessElite product - improved seat, AVOD IFE, new meals - is gradually being rolled out on the 763ER fleet. The JFK-KBP flight got one of the three 763ERs outfitted with the revamped Business product. An additional 8 will be converted by the end of June.
Are they refurbishing them in ATL?
Quoting Panamair (Reply 11): Does anyone know whether these 763ERs with the new BE set-up are being targeted for specific routes or are they just used randomly all over the system and for inaugurals?
Dartland From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 636 posts, RR: 2 Reply 12, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 7755 times:
Quoting Ramprat74 (Reply 8): Just because the flight went out full, doesn't make it a money maker.
True. But as an international, trans-atlantic flight with basically no competition --- if the loads are good it should definitely be a money maker. (and if it isn't, DL should be firing people in revenue management...it's not like this is JFK-FLL where losing money on full flights is the norm)
FoxBravo From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 2806 posts, RR: 5 Reply 14, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 7705 times:
Quoting RJpieces (Reply 14): Then why does DL continue to operate 4 or 5 757s a day on this run...Even after Song is gone?
It's part of having a complete network and a presence in the NY market. In theory at least, NY-based frequent flyers will stay loyal to DL for business trips and trips on the real moneymaking flights (e.g., Europe) if they know they can also count on DL to get them to FLL or LAS on vacation.
There is also connecting traffic--those FLL flights feed people onto the more profitable international flights.
Dartland From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 636 posts, RR: 2 Reply 15, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 7688 times:
Quoting RJpieces (Reply 13): Then why does DL continue to operate 4 or 5 757s a day on this run...Even after Song is gone?
Because planes being used are better than planes not being used. Because they need the people on those planes to connect to profitable routes. Because they earn and maintain loyalty from many overall highly profitable customers by flying those routes. Because during peak travel periods they can make money on those routes. Etc. Etc. Etc.
All I'm saying is that on highly competitive routes, you often seen flights that lose money on an absolute route by route basis (note that doesn't mean the airline should stop flying them, as they contribute revenue to the rest of the system and may be profitable on a purely variable basis).
My point in this thread is that on routes that have little competition and are international, revenue premiums should be high enough for an airline to make money on an absolute basis so long as loads are high, as RM would price the flight to make money since they are not fare matching to maintain share like they would do in highly competitive market.
RJpieces From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 16, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 7677 times:
Quoting FoxBravo (Reply 14): It's part of having a complete network and a presence in the NY market. In theory at least, NY-based frequent flyers will stay loyal to DL for business trips and trips on the real moneymaking flights (e.g., Europe) if they know they can also count on DL to get them to FLL or LAS on vacation.
I guess that makes sense. But are frequent fliers really throwing down serious miles for free tickets on flight that are ~$69 each way?!
Quoting FoxBravo (Reply 14): There is also connecting traffic--those FLL flights feed people onto the more profitable international flights.
AirMailer From United States of America, joined May 2006, 413 posts, RR: 0 Reply 17, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 7677 times:
Quoting PWM2TXLHopper (Reply 5): Actually it's just Delta these days, the 'Airlines" part was removed from the name a year or two back.
According to the FAA:
DELTA AIR LINES INC
Operator is doing business as
1. DELTA
2. DELTA AIR LINES
3. DELTA AIR LINES, INC.
4. DELTA EXPRESS
5. DELTA SHUTTLE
6. SONG
AirMailer From United States of America, joined May 2006, 413 posts, RR: 0 Reply 18, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 7677 times:
Quoting Ramprat74 (Reply 8): Just because the flight went out full, doesn't make it a money maker.
This was a DL flight, not B6.
(just referring to pax revenue)
SESGDL From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 3385 posts, RR: 11 Reply 19, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 7604 times:
Quoting Ramprat74 (Reply 8): Just because the flight went out full, doesn't make it a money maker.
Of course not, but according to people at DL loads are great and the fares are very high, which in most cases does mean it's a money maker. Being the only carrier on a route with a great demand is a good thing.
B777ER From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 547 posts, RR: 0 Reply 21, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 7552 times:
Quoting Panamair (Reply 10): DL's refreshed BusinessElite product - improved seat, AVOD IFE, new meals - is gradually being rolled out on the 763ER fleet. The JFK-KBP flight got one of the three 763ERs outfitted with the revamped Business product. An additional 8 will be converted by the end of June.
Anybody see the TOC ramp at ATL lately? Somebody should snap a pic of it....its very full with 763's and Song 757's (as of Sunday 6/4 anyway).
RJpieces From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 24, posted (6 years 11 months 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 7479 times:
Quoting B777ER (Reply 21): Anybody see the TOC ramp at ATL lately? Somebody should snap a pic of it....its very full with 763's and Song 757's (as of Sunday 6/4 anyway).
Isn't it usually? Or are they trying to refurbish many at once?
25 SESGDL: In America anyway, passengers are going to be more willing to fly Delta than AeroSvit. Also for government, government officials flying to the Ukrain
26 Ba757gla: what routing will this flight take to kiev , over scotland perhaps?
27 Aeroflot777: I'm glad to hear the flight went well. I'll probably take this flight a few times in the future to visit family in Kiev. Believe me, this flight will
29 Positiverate: I would guess it depends on where the NAT's are that day, and a whole host of things especially including winds aloft and such.
30 UN_B732: Does anyone have exact load info? Were they able to get a jetway at KBP? Any other updates? The 767 has song IFE in Y? Congratulations to Delta, and g
31 Airzim: Do you work for Fox News? Nice attempt to spin reality to suit your own agenda. You said no one else flies the route. I pointed out that isn't true.
32 Evan767: As a matter of fact I know exactly what your talking about. I was there on Sunday 6/4 flying CMH-ATL-RIC and you're right I saw multiple 757's and 76
33 Evan767: Yet another interesting note: http://travel2.nytimes.com/2006/06/0...business/worldbusiness/06road.html
34 DL4EVR: Only 25% of the people sitting on J are on full fare tickets? I know that's true domestically...but I thought int'l was more like 75%...
35 Panamair: That's the real full fare (in J inventory) they are talking about. There are others who pay Business Class fares but at the discounted level (i.e., D
36 UN_B732: Even if they're paying D, it's still $2800 + -Mr. X
37 Jakbar: Two of us were out there at JFK for the inaugural flight. Check out http://www.pbase.com/joshandbrian/deltasong061006jfk . We don't have any pictures
38 Sushka: Very cool pictures thanks. I would love to see it on the ground in Borispol too. Im sure the flight will be succesful. My trips to Kiev have been thro
39 UN_B732: I'm wondering if they got a jetway at KBP. As you know, they only have two I've flown through Amsterdam, Zurich, Vienna, and non-stop to Kiev from NYC
40 Jetdeltamsy: The flight was most likely full of press and dignitaries flying for no charge. No way on Earth tell to judge any route's viability based on first day
41 Airplane: And dont forget DL is starting service on 8JUN to UIO and GYE ! Daily with a 757 FLT INFO 195/08JUN- 9JUN LOF ARR DEP ETA ON IN ETD OUT OFF SHP ELPD A
42 RwSEA: I think that this was one of the holdups to getting final clearance to the flight, but I'm assuming it's been taken care of now that the flight has s
43 Airportmanager: With the latest weather were getting here these apst few days in UIO...., lets hope they make it in for their inagural flight ! Id wouldnt mind to se
44 Sushka: Pictures from Kiev sent to me by someone. I wish I was there, hope to be soon! http://www.aviation.com.ua/forum/vie...&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=
45 Positiverate: They did. That's what caused the delay to June 1.
46 RJpieces: Nice pics....Any idea whose those dignitaries are? Do Delta executives fly out for the opening of every new international route?
47 Panamair: Nice pics, thanks. Looks like they got the jetway. Not on every one, probably just the 'important' or auspicious ones. COO Jim Whitehurst was on hand
48 RJpieces: Do you by any chance know who was there for ATL-ATH?
49 ArtieFufkin: I wonder if the flight will pick up business from Odessa and/or Moldova?
50 Panamair: Sorry, no idea. ATL-ATH may not have had the big shots considering that ATH is not a new destination and ATL-ATH is just a seasonal route.
51 Sushka: I would think Odesa yes, all heading to the US just transferring through Kiev.
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