Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
WN 300's With Plugged Eye Brow Windows  
User currently offlineBarney Captain From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 925 posts, RR: 13
Posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 2990 times:

Just completed a 3 day trip and on day one, climbed in to N635SW to settle in for the day. Wait, something is different, it took me a second, but sure enough, those melanoma causing eye brow windows were gone. It looked like she had just come out of a D check - fresh paint and REALLY clean. I thought I was up on latest stuff, but I didn't realize we had started plugging those windows.

OPNL, do you know if 635 just had a D check and if this is a sign of things to come wrt our 300's?


...from the Banana Republic....
15 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 2852 times:

Quoting Barney Captain (Thread starter):
OPNL, do you know if 635 just had a D check and if this is a sign of things to come wrt our 300's?

I've been off on vacation for a couple of weeks and am due back Friday, so I'll ask around. I suspect that you're correct...


User currently offlineTZTriStar500 From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 1451 posts, RR: 9
Reply 2, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 2774 times:

Perhaps SWA was used for the Boeing SB validation because the SB for the Classics has not yet been released. The NG SB was released on May 17 and is 737-56-1017.

After Line Number 1649 on the NGs, the #4 and 5 flight deck eyebrow windows where deleted. These SB's delete them from existing aircraft by removing and plugging.



35 years of American Trans Air/ATA Airlines, 1973-2008. A great little airline that will not be soon forgotten.
User currently offlineDAYflyer From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 3807 posts, RR: 3
Reply 3, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 2759 times:

Interesting, but why dont they just install some slide down shades in instead of a removal and plugging? Is this possible?


One Nation Under God
User currently offlineTZTriStar500 From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 1451 posts, RR: 9
Reply 4, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 2716 times:

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 3):
Interesting, but why dont they just install some slide down shades in instead of a removal and plugging? Is this possible?

The main purpose for removal was cost and weight savings as they are no longer necessary from an operational standpoint.



35 years of American Trans Air/ATA Airlines, 1973-2008. A great little airline that will not be soon forgotten.
User currently offlineSeven3seven From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 316 posts, RR: 23
Reply 5, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 2359 times:

why the hell would they take the eyebrows OUT? waste of money.

I can see not installing them but going out of your way to remove them seems stupid



My views are mine alone and are not that of any of my fellow employees, officers, or directors at my company
User currently offlineGQfluffy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 2338 times:

Ok, call me ignorant, but why did Boeing remove the eyebrow windows from all of the new production NG 737s? Were they not needed anymore (and if so, why?)? Does it save Boeing and airlines money? Why are they gone?  Confused I honestly loved the look. It made every aircraft with them (707, 727, 737) look "Boeing"...

User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26361 posts, RR: 76
Reply 7, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 2319 times:

Quoting Seven3seven (Reply 5):
why the hell would they take the eyebrows OUT? waste of money.

Actually, the CBA that was jointly done by WN and Boeing showed that plugging the windows ends up costing less than keeping them there. First, the aircraft weighs less but the bigger thing is that the windows no longer have to be replaced which means significantly lower cost over time

Quoting GQfluffy (Reply 6):
Ok, call me ignorant, but why did Boeing remove the eyebrow windows from all of the new production NG 737s? Were they not needed anymore (and if so, why?)? Does it save Boeing and airlines money? Why are they gone?

It saves the airlines money from both a weight and MX standpoint.

Quoting GQfluffy (Reply 6):
It made every aircraft with them (707, 727, 737) look "Boeing"...

Douglas aircraft had them too



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 2279 times:

Quoting Seven3seven (Reply 5):
why the hell would they take the eyebrows OUT? waste of money.

I can see not installing them but going out of your way to remove them seems stupid

I think it was 737doctor who, some time ago, detailed the steps in replacing an eyebrow window when it was cracked etc. That's also a waste of money, i.e. fixing something that really no longer serves any purpose, other than keeping the aircraft pressurized.

Pulling aircraft off the line and out of revenue service solely to remove/plug the eyebrow windws would indeed be stupid. Doing so as an additional work card item in a planned heavy check is pretty smart.


User currently offlineStudentFlyer From Australia, joined Sep 2004, 688 posts, RR: 3
Reply 9, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 2248 times:

Sorry for being an ignorant, but what was the actual purpose of these eyebrow windows?

User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26361 posts, RR: 76
Reply 10, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 2241 times:

Quoting StudentFlyer (Reply 9):
Sorry for being an ignorant, but what was the actual purpose of these eyebrow windows?

Navigation



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineSilver1SWA From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 4769 posts, RR: 26
Reply 11, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 2236 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Wow, thanks for the update! I was just thinking about this the other day. Finally something to keep an eye out for. It's been a while since we've had a fleet update worth looking out for.  bigthumbsup 

Off topic, but I have seen quite a few of our -700s missing the red "flap"/gear door that hangs over the main landing gear. Anyone know why? I heard it has something to do with a lot of them being cracked. I'd imagine having them removed creates a drag penalty...



ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
User currently offlineBarney Captain From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 925 posts, RR: 13
Reply 12, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 2180 times:

Quoting N1120A (Reply 10):
Quoting StudentFlyer (Reply 9):
Sorry for being an ignorant, but what was the actual purpose of these eyebrow windows?

Navigation

I'm fairly certain the primary purpose was to see/avoid other aircraft. This of course long before the concept of TCAS.



...from the Banana Republic....
User currently offlineStudentFlyer From Australia, joined Sep 2004, 688 posts, RR: 3
Reply 13, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 2039 times:

Hi N1120A and Barney Captain,

Thanks for the answers. It makes more sense to me now. I do believe that both of them are the main reason for it being there. As you said, with the advent of both GPS and TCAS, they are no longer needed, so that it could be eliminated and save more money.

Cheers


User currently offlineDacman From United States of America, joined Oct 2000, 444 posts, RR: 8
Reply 14, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 1973 times:

I did a story for Airways or Airliners magazine, I can't remember which on the removal of the "eye brow" windows. Originally the idea for them was to allow the pilots to be able to keep a visual on the runway when in a turn, but when studies were conducted by Douglas it was determined that the normal length of time for line of sight to the runway using the windows was approx. 2 seconds, not that useful.

The Boeing 717 (MD-95) was the first model to have the windows removed, shaving 60 pounds (both) from the OEW and significantly reducing maintenance costs.

As we only get -700s in SNA, guess I'll have to watch for it at LAX.

Thanks for the info.

Mike (WN Ops SNA)
dacman
LAX/LGB Local



"Airliner Photography is not a crime"
User currently offlineWNCrew From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 1441 posts, RR: 10
Reply 15, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 1911 times:

Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 11):
Off topic, but I have seen quite a few of our -700s missing the red "flap"/gear door that hangs over the main landing gear. Anyone know why? I heard it has something to do with a lot of them being cracked. I'd imagine having them removed creates a drag penalty...

Don't know why but just the other day I was working mid-cabin and I noticed a strange vibration and noise, I reported it to the capt. and he said it was b/c we were missing those doors/flaps/covers...he also thanked us for being astute enough to notice it and bring it to his attention.



ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Will WN Fit Their 737-300 With Winglets? posted Sat Jul 10 2004 19:35:46 by NW7E7
Delta Domestic 767-300 With Refurbished Interior posted Mon May 1 2006 21:38:38 by 1337Delta764
WN 737s With Blinking Landing Lights At BWI posted Tue Mar 7 2006 02:38:49 by AviationAddict
Future Plans For 757-300 With Winglets? posted Thu Jan 26 2006 06:50:27 by N484ER
Future Plans For 757-300 With Winglets? posted Thu Dec 22 2005 20:22:07 by N484ER
WN 737s With Old 70's Interiors posted Tue Sep 6 2005 21:36:20 by ARGinLON
WN: Airports With At Least 50 Flts Per Day? posted Fri Sep 2 2005 14:15:53 by Pe@rson
WN's Routes With Few Leisure Pax, More Biz, Etc posted Thu Feb 5 2004 12:19:37 by Pe@rson
BA Dash 8-300 With Leather Seats posted Wed Dec 10 2003 17:45:10 by Djb77
First Shot WN 737 With Winglets posted Sun Oct 12 2003 23:45:10 by Clickhappy