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A320 Replacement  
User currently offlineGrantcv From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 430 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 3070 times:

I was wondering when the A320's replacement will be launched?

19 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offline787engineer From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 572 posts, RR: 15
Reply 1, posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 3019 times:

In short, when the engines are ready. Most likely Airbus won't start a new major project until they finish the base model A350-800 or A370 which will be around early 2012.

User currently offlineEMBQA From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 9364 posts, RR: 11
Reply 2, posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 3017 times:

Quoting Grantcv (Thread starter):
I was wondering when the A320's replacement will be launched?

Why do we need to replace it...?? Just look at the Boeing 737. It's push 40+ years old and still selling well.



"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
User currently offlineZvezda From Lithuania, joined Aug 2004, 10511 posts, RR: 64
Reply 3, posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 2914 times:

The earliest plausible dates are, IMO, 2008 for launch, 2012 for first flight, and 2013 for EIS. Probably a few years later.

Quoting 787engineer (Reply 1):
In short, when the engines are ready.

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User currently offlineEbbUK From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 2908 times:

Quoting Grantcv (Thread starter):
I was wondering when the A320's replacement will be launched?

give it a rest dear boy, Airbus this airbus that.


User currently offlineGrantcv From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 430 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 2789 times:

Quoting EbbUK (Reply 4):
Why do we need to replace it...?? Just look at the Boeing 737. It's push 40+ years old and still selling well

Well, there have been 3 generations of 737 - the first was in service for 18 years before it was superceded, the second 14 years. The current generation is a far cry from the original - it was almost all new. The current A320 is now pushing 18 years. At the very least, it is due for an update.


User currently offlineZvezda From Lithuania, joined Aug 2004, 10511 posts, RR: 64
Reply 6, posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 2752 times:

Quoting Grantcv (Reply 5):
The current A320 is now pushing 18 years. At the very least, it is due for an update.

The Airbus NSR and B737RS will probably EIS within 18 months of each other. As 787engineer pointed out, it all depends on the availability of engines.


User currently offlineKaneporta1 From Greece, joined May 2005, 739 posts, RR: 12
Reply 7, posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 2625 times:

Quoting Grantcv (Reply 5):
The current A320 is now pushing 18 years. At the very least, it is due for an update.

Well, they put new winglets on recently...



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User currently offlineBomber996 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 391 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 2546 times:

Quoting Kaneporta1 (Reply 7):
Well, they put new winglets on recently...

You could say that about the 757 and 737NG. I think what he means by update is new engines, ala 787, and new fuselage components.

Peace  box 



AVIATION - A Vacation In Any Town, I Own Nothing
User currently offline787engineer From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 572 posts, RR: 15
Reply 9, posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 2506 times:

Quoting Grantcv (Reply 5):
The current A320 is now pushing 18 years. At the very least, it is due for an update.

Airplanes aren't "due" for updates after approximately a certain number of years. They will be updated when the technology advances enough that the update will provide a favorable ROI. If Airbus produced a NG A320 everytime there's a small improvement it'd be a waste of money. If it doesn't hurt sales why not wait until technology provides a 5, 10, or 15% improvement?


User currently offlineGrantcv From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 430 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 2453 times:

So in the 20 years since the A320 was launched there has been no significant technological advancement to improve the A320 significantly? (putting winglets aside).

User currently offlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30870 posts, RR: 86
Reply 11, posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 2446 times:
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Quoting Grantcv (Reply 10):
So in the 20 years since the A320 was launched there has been no significant technological advancement to improve the A320 significantly? (putting winglets aside).

That appears to be the case. Airbus picked an excellent time to launch their product, capitalizing on the improvements available at the time to maximize the time the plane would be effective.

Boeing, coming later with the 737NG, was able to capitalize on those same improvements, which is why we have not seen any major updates to that family, as well.


User currently offlineJoffie From Australia, joined Mar 2006, 806 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 2320 times:

Speaking of the A320, the new ones are coming with LCD PFD's. Back 10 years ago, they were all CRT. There's an update Big grin

User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 968 posts, RR: 51
Reply 13, posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 2309 times:

Quoting 787engineer (Reply 9):
Airplanes aren't "due" for updates after approximately a certain number of years.

18 years for a narrowbody is a lot. Prior to the A320 and 737NG, short-haul aircraft were overturning on 12-14 year cycles.

At this point, the A320 is at 18 years and there is no forseable end before the platform hits 24-26 years old. That's quite unprecedented


User currently offlineGrantcv From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 430 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 2231 times:

It seems that the new widebodies (B787, B748, A3?0) are offering a 20% improvement in operating costs over the 1980's designs they replace. And none too soon given the price of fuel. So I am wondering, does the price of jet fuel impact narrowbodies more or less than the widebodies? Or, in other words, are the fuel costs for a narrowboday a smaller or larger percentage of the operating costs versus a widebody. Surely both Airbus and Boeing should be scrambling right now to find a way to produce a cost-effective narrowbody for the future. Or will the price of jet fuel drop down to 2000 levels again?

User currently offlineZvezda From Lithuania, joined Aug 2004, 10511 posts, RR: 64
Reply 15, posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 2187 times:

Quoting Grantcv (Reply 14):
does the price of jet fuel impact narrowbodies more or less than the widebodies? Or, in other words, are the fuel costs for a narrowboday a smaller or larger percentage of the operating costs versus a widebody.

Fuel is a larger component of operating costs for narrow-bodies than for wide-bodies.


User currently offlineBoeing7E7 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 2098 times:

Quoting EMBQA (Reply 2):
Why do we need to replace it...?? Just look at the Boeing 737. It's push 40+ years old and still selling well.

The technology shift will dictate it. You're probably looking at a bleedless system, composite or Li airframe, composite wing, and a wider airframe. So much has changed in the last 10 years. Dornier was onto something with the 728 family in terms of aerodynamics... Just look at it vs. how the 787 is shaking out physically.

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User currently offlineOyKIE From Norway, joined Jan 2006, 2732 posts, RR: 4
Reply 17, posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 1975 times:

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 13):
18 years for a narrowbody is a lot. Prior to the A320 and 737NG, short-haul aircraft were overturning on 12-14 year cycles.

At this point, the A320 is at 18 years and there is no foreseeable end before the platform hits 24-26 years old. That's quite unprecedented

I wonder why that is? Is it because both the 737 and A320 continuous to sell well, and since neither Boeing or Airbus has pushed for an update the engine manufacturers has been putting their products development on hold in the thrust class for the A320/737?



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User currently offlineKappel From Suriname, joined Jul 2005, 3533 posts, RR: 17
Reply 18, posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 1936 times:

Quoting EMBQA (Reply 2):
Why do we need to replace it...?? Just look at the Boeing 737. It's push 40+ years old and still selling well.

As pointed out, the 737-100 only resembles the 737NG in fuselage width. Almost everything is new, avionics, wings, engines, the NG also has some composites (the fin IIRC and other components).

Quoting OyKIE (Reply 17):
I wonder why that is? Is it because both the 737 and A320 continuous to sell well, and since neither Boeing or Airbus has pushed for an update the engine manufacturers has been putting their products development on hold in the thrust class for the A320/737?

I believe the engines did receive several updates, just no major ones like now with the GEnx and Trent 1000 and their derivatives. No doubt engines with that technology will be under the new 737 and a320.



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User currently offlineHPAEAA From United States of America, joined May 2006, 1024 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (8 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 1910 times:

With the latest redesign on the the A350, I think I remeber hearing that Airbus is fully commited between the A380 and A350, and by fully commited meaing they have no more money that they can divert to R&D over the next couple years until orders begin to pickup... I'll see if I can find the article...


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