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Can Airliners Really Do This?  
User currently offlineKl692 From Canada, joined Feb 2006, 676 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 15589 times:

We are having a problem with Air India right now. A family member book a flight for India and he booked for the 8th June, on monday Air India called and told him that his departure date have change from the 8th to the 7th so he had to make other arrangements and then this morning they called and told him that his flight has been change to the 8th which screw him up big time cause he have to change everything all over again. Anyways, Can the airline really make this changes anytime they want and what rights does the customer have regarding this. I know there is nothin wrong with A/C cause no flights have been cancel by Air India from yyz from what I know. Just in case the flight was AI188

Thanks
Ernest


A310, A330,A346,B73H, B747,B772,B77W,CRJ
25 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineStylo777 From Germany, joined Feb 2006, 2968 posts, RR: 12
Reply 1, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 15564 times:

It's Air India so everything is possible. Big grin

User currently offlinePrebennorholm From Denmark, joined Mar 2000, 6431 posts, RR: 54
Reply 2, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 15482 times:

Time to read the conditions... The small letters.

I have seen several airlines advertise low prices on conditions like:
- you decide which week to go
- we decide which day to go
- and we tell you no later than x days in advance what we decided.

If you aim for the very lowest prices on long haul, then that's often the sort of deal you make.

The cure is to order a full fare business or first class ticket. And stay far away from offers advertised like "to x-city from $x99.99".



Always keep your number of landings equal to your number of take-offs, Preben Norholm
User currently offlineNZ8800 From New Zealand, joined May 2006, 425 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 15210 times:

Quoting Prebennorholm (Reply 2):
The cure is to order a full fare business or first class ticket. And stay far away from offers advertised like "to x-city from $x99.99".

Could not agree more. The more you pay the airline, the more rights you have. On a $99 fare or whatever - you're generally pretty stuffed if anything goes wrong.



MDZWTA ~ Mobile Disaster Zone When Travelling Abroad
User currently offlineKl692 From Canada, joined Feb 2006, 676 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 15032 times:

that really sucks that day can do these things. I don't know much the airlines but someone have got to put an end to it.


A310, A330,A346,B73H, B747,B772,B77W,CRJ
User currently offlineStealthpilot From India, joined May 2004, 510 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 14844 times:

Quoting Kl692 (Reply 4):
that really sucks that day can do these things. I don't know much the airlines but someone have got to put an end to it.

If you do in fact have a promotional fare, then be very careful and read the fine print. All airlines do this, if you want a cheap ticket then expect some 'conditions'.
If there were no such clauses, good luck  Smile

eP007



eP007
User currently offlineFlywithjohn From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 122 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 14644 times:

Well it's the airlines decision and when you get down to it there attitude is if you don't like it fly someone else and 90% of the time you can't fly someone else due to either it cost more or there is no flight.


Always Blue Sky's.....
User currently offlineHAWK21M From India, joined Jan 2001, 31679 posts, RR: 56
Reply 7, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 14597 times:

Depends on the Scheme you've booked the Ticket on.Cheaper fares have some toug terms & conditions.Read the Fine print.If its not stated.Approach the Airline with a complaint.
regds
MEL



Think of the brighter side!
User currently offlineManchesterMAN From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2003, 1224 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 14274 times:

I don't care whatever was paid - once you have a confirmed booking you have a confirmed booking. If the airline wants to change the date of your flight they should have a bloody good reason i.e. the flight on your date of travel is cancelled and even then if they are changing dates on you they should give you the option to cancel.

In this case I'd guess they foresaw that the flight on the 8th would not operate so then changed bookings but even then people should have had an option to either cancel or travel on another date of their choosing. If they foresaw that the flight on the 8th was going to be overbooked that is another issue. They should have been up front and offered compensation.



Flown: A300,A319,A320,A321,A330,A340.A380,717,727,737,747,757,767,777,DC9,DC10,MD11,MD80,F100,F50,ERJ,E190,CRJ,BAe146,Da
User currently offlineKnightsofmalta From Malta, joined Nov 2005, 1821 posts, RR: 19
Reply 9, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 12801 times:

Quoting Prebennorholm (Reply 2):
The cure is to order a full fare business or first class ticket. And stay far away from offers advertised like "to x-city from $x99.99".

With respect, what a load of B. S. I don't think this has anything to do with the price of the ticket at all. If there was a timechange and AI move the date of departure forward by one day, you'd be in trouble with a full fare ticket as well. If you're travelling with a full fare ticket the only difference is that it might be valid on other airlines, thus you could be rerouted or rebooked as an involuntary on another carrier operating the route. One way or another you would still be inconvenienced, even with an expensive ticket.

It would be interesting to know exactly why AI changed the passenger's date of departure. If it was a timechange due to operational reasons, then AI would at least be obliged to offer the passenger the option of having the price of the ticket refunded completely, irrespective of the conditions of the fare paid. If the passenger was rebooked because the flight was overbooked for example, then he would be eligible for DBC.

If it didn't occur to the passenger to ask for the reason of the change, then it's his own fault.


User currently offline7LBAC111 From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2004, 2566 posts, RR: 35
Reply 10, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 12700 times:

Quoting NZ8800 (Reply 3):
The more you pay the airline, the more rights you have

*giggles* - really?? Where in the name of Guiseppe did you get that from? The value of your ticket bears no relation whatsoever to your rights. All passengers have the same 'rights' under the Warsaw Convention and newly introduced EU legislation. (where relevant). However all this can be superceded by your acceptance of the carriers Terms and Conditions.

Quoting ManchesterMAN (Reply 8):
I don't care whatever was paid - once you have a confirmed booking you have a confirmed booking. If the airline wants to change the date of your flight they should have a bloody good reason i.e. the flight on your date of travel is cancelled and even then if they are changing dates on you they should give you the option to cancel.

Correct. A major schedule change such as this should be communicated along with an offer of refund for the inconvenience. I'd be surprised if this wasn't offered.

Quoting Knightsofmalta (Reply 9):
Quoting Prebennorholm (Reply 2):
The cure is to order a full fare business or first class ticket. And stay far away from offers advertised like "to x-city from $x99.99".

With respect, what a load of B. S.

While a little direct, your right. It is twaddle. I think the thread starter and a few of the posters since, are confusing Fare Rules with your passenger rights.
As I say above, the ticket value is not relevant.

7L



Debate is what you put on de hook when you want to catch de fish.
User currently offlineMERLIN From India, joined Mar 2006, 70 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 12117 times:

Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 7):
Approach the Airline with a complaint.

Should have but of no use,esp air india.

Quoting ManchesterMAN (Reply 8):
once you have a confirmed booking you have a confirmed booking

is correct..

Good that the tread starter posted this issue..this case is very com'om on airindia flights...as far as co-ordination is concerned the airline actually doesnt take much care of it..Last time i had an heated arguement on the issue of air-india ( was having no evidence to post) had to stay blank..now that some 1 has experienced it, can ask for no more... i would say ask them to give a valid reason for there so called " scheduled service".

I would say that if ne 1 on airliners.net faces this kinda similar situation on Air-india, Ask em to give a valid reason.



"Aviation & Black hole carry same effect,once any where near it you're bound to get sucked in".
User currently offlinePNQIAD From India, joined May 2006, 586 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 11162 times:

I personally know of such a story - not AI but DL. My friend's wife had booked tix for a specific date so that she could travel with her parents holding a return ticket from US to India for the same date. But since DL reduced their frequency to BOM - airline changed her flight to a day earlier and her parents were put on a flight a day later. DL said they would not change anything unless they paid USD 100+ per person.... so not just AI who screws up.... plenty of airlines do....

User currently offlineANITIX87 From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 3303 posts, RR: 13
Reply 13, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 9675 times:
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Quoting Knightsofmalta (Reply 9):
If there was a timechange and AI move the date of departure forward by one day,

They did not move the departure day, if I understood the thread-starter correctly. AI called his friend to tell him that his ticket had been changed for the flight on the 7th, instead of the 8th that he had booked.

Kl692, am I correct? Because if that's the case then I can't believe the airline could possibly have the right to do that, even if it's explicitely stated by them.

TIS



www.stellaryear.com: Canon EOS 50D, Canon EOS 5DMkII, Sigma 50mm 1.4, Canon 24-70 2.8L II, Canon 100mm 2.8L, Canon 100-4
User currently offlineJetdeltamsy From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 2987 posts, RR: 8
Reply 14, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 8061 times:

Quoting Kl692 (Thread starter):
Can the airline really make this changes anytime they want and what rights does the customer have regarding this.

The ONLY think any airline guarantees in writing is to guarantee to transport you between point A to point B (and back again) for a set price.

EVERY SINGLE other detail is left up to the airline. They can change your days. They can change your seat assignments. They can change your routing. They can change anything.

Most airlines will refund your money, even on non-refundable tickets, when they change dates of travel but even that is not required.

It's all in the Contract of Carriage.



Tired of airline bankruptcies....EA/PA/TW and finally DL.
User currently offlineHAWK21M From India, joined Jan 2001, 31679 posts, RR: 56
Reply 15, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 7334 times:

Quoting PNQIAD (Reply 12):
.... plenty of airlines do....

True.
regds
MEL



Think of the brighter side!
User currently offlineStarlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 17030 posts, RR: 67
Reply 16, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 6426 times:

Quoting 7LBAC111 (Reply 10):
Quoting NZ8800 (Reply 3):
The more you pay the airline, the more rights you have

*giggles* - really?? Where in the name of Guiseppe did you get that from? The value of your ticket bears no relation whatsoever to your rights. All passengers have the same 'rights' under the Warsaw Convention and newly introduced EU legislation. (where relevant). However all this can be superceded by your acceptance of the carriers Terms and Conditions.

In theory yes. But I bet if I was flying JFK-LHR Business on AA they would treat me (Exec Platinum) better than Joe SixPack in Economy on a discounted fare. If nothing else I would have less time on the phone and they might put me on another flight.

Bottom line, if they piss Joe Sixpack off, the lose $300. If they piss me off, the lose $3000 and potentially also $30000+ of business per year. Simple economics.

You get what you pay for.



"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots."
User currently offlineSevenforeseven From France, joined Nov 2005, 164 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 6426 times:

The sooner Air India is privatised the better for Air India and India.
Air India is full of employees who have no idea about customer service and loyalty.
I hope that privitisation comes soon. Air India employees will disagree, why?
Well because it will be end of 10 people doing 1 persons job, that the 10 people doing it are incapable of doing, if you see what I mean.
I just hope that Jet, Kingfisher and Deccan seal the fate of a corrupt and useless airline.


User currently offlineRaventom From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2006, 269 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 6300 times:

I know it's pretty harsh but people need to start reading the small prints.


I love the smell of burnt kerosene!!!!!!!!!!!!
User currently offlineChecksixx From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 1088 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 5574 times:

Quoting Kl692 (Thread starter):
I know there is nothin wrong with A/C cause no flights have been cancel by Air India from yyz from what I know.

The key words there are "from what I know". Fact is you don't know. A plane could have canned itself and they are shuffling people around so that everyone gets to where they are going. Don't assume. Fact is your at the mercy of most airlines. Almost every one has some type of "act of God" clause or condition. Most, if not all, make good on they're customers, but there is always fine print. Your buddy should be glad he still has a flight and enjoy his trip.

Safe Flying,

Check


User currently offlineFlybynight From Norway, joined Jul 2003, 1005 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 5146 times:

Quoting Checksixx (Reply 19):
Your buddy should be glad he still has a flight and enjoy his trip

I never could understand when I read replies like this here.
What successful business would adopt that frame of mind?
If I bought a ticket, I sure as hell wouldn't want to be jerked around like that. As a consumer you have rights as well; it's not all about the airline.

So, I go buy a movie ticket. Hmm, should I consider myself lucky because I actually got a seat?
I go buy a new car. Maybe I should feel lucky that the manufacturer even gave me a car in return for my money.

No way! Any business that operates like that will not last (unless it is a government controlled business, in which case they have you by your balls).



Heia Norge!
User currently offlineAirframeAS From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 14150 posts, RR: 24
Reply 21, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 3693 times:

ALWAYS ALWAYS AND ALWAYS READ THE FARE RULES!!!!!!!!!! There is always a 'catch' when the fares are so low. WN is a great example....


A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
User currently offlineStarlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 17030 posts, RR: 67
Reply 22, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 3388 times:

Quoting Flybynight (Reply 20):
What successful business would adopt that frame of mind?
If I bought a ticket, I sure as hell wouldn't want to be jerked around like that. As a consumer you have rights as well; it's not all about the airline.

So, I go buy a movie ticket. Hmm, should I consider myself lucky because I actually got a seat?
I go buy a new car. Maybe I should feel lucky that the manufacturer even gave me a car in return for my money.

No way! Any business that operates like that will not last (unless it is a government controlled business, in which case they have you by your balls).

Most airlines operate like this. While such annoyances are typically rather uncommon, with tens of thousands of flights a year they will happen every now and then. As has been said, read the fare rules. The condensed version is only about 20 lines. And if they are hard to understand, just call the airline and ask.

Having said that: The measure of an organization is not if it has problems, but how it reacts to them.



"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots."
User currently offlineChecksixx From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 1088 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 3241 times:

Quoting Flybynight (Reply 20):
Quoting Checksixx (Reply 19):
Your buddy should be glad he still has a flight and enjoy his trip

I never could understand when I read replies like this here.
What successful business would adopt that frame of mind?
If I bought a ticket, I sure as hell wouldn't want to be jerked around like that. As a consumer you have rights as well; it's not all about the airline.

So, I go buy a movie ticket. Hmm, should I consider myself lucky because I actually got a seat?
I go buy a new car. Maybe I should feel lucky that the manufacturer even gave me a car in return for my money.

No way! Any business that operates like that will not last (unless it is a government controlled business, in which case they have you by your balls).

So your upset that I said he should be glad he's going and enjoy his trip?? I guess in your world a sorry, were going to refund your money and cancel your trip would be better??? Get real and read the last sentence of the post above.

Check


User currently offlineNZ8800 From New Zealand, joined May 2006, 425 posts, RR: 2
Reply 24, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 3073 times:

Quoting 7LBAC111 (Reply 10):
*giggles* - really?? Where in the name of Guiseppe did you get that from? The value of your ticket bears no relation whatsoever to your rights. All passengers have the same 'rights' under the Warsaw Convention and newly introduced EU legislation. (where relevant). However all this can be superceded by your acceptance of the carriers Terms and Conditions.

I should have been clearer - this is what I was meaning - acceptance of the carrier's terms and conditions can supersede the convention and legislation
You have to read the fine print very carefully. That was the point I was trying to get across - that you get more rights in the fine print the more you pay.



MDZWTA ~ Mobile Disaster Zone When Travelling Abroad
User currently offlineFlybynight From Norway, joined Jul 2003, 1005 posts, RR: 2
Reply 25, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 2814 times:

Quoting Checksixx (Reply 23):
So your upset that I said he should be glad he's going and enjoy his trip?? I guess in your world a sorry, were going to refund your money and cancel your trip would be better??? Get real and read the last sentence of the post above

I did. The former quote said he should be glad he's going which implies he is lucky he has a seat on the flight.
Get real? I don't even know what you are talking about. My point has/was/will be that any business that jerks around its clients like that will eventually suffer.
Worst thing about posting on this website is the unconditional protection of airlines most people take.
Air India should have given the option of refunding the money actually. Consumers relie on airlines to fly the posted schedules, or at least within close proximity. OUR schedules depend on it. Frankly my schedule is more important. I have business meetings, connecting flights, etc to worry about. If, for example, AS, jerks me around like this, I will likely never fly them again.
Also, how about replying in a less combative reply???



Heia Norge!
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