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A320's Now Being Scrapped!  
User currently offlineLrgt From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 711 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 12535 times:

It seems as if the scrapping of A320's (non-crash) has already begun!

Is there some reason for this breakup that is not obvious??? The fact that it was done in the most dangerous part of Florida makes it seem like it could have something to do with a scam or shady deal?

March 2005 - Pristine aircraft awaiting scrapping in Florida:

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Photo © Sunbird Photos by Don Boyd




February 2006 - All broken up:

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Photo © MarkStevens




Don't bring up the NW DC9's unless you have to!
44 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineNewark777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 9348 posts, RR: 29
Reply 1, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 12478 times:

Quoting Lrgt (Thread starter):

Is there some reason for this breakup that is not obvious??? The fact that it was done in the most dangerous part of Florida makes it seem like it could have something to do with a scam or shady deal?

I'm guessing that it had a lot of cycles put on it, and something like a D check came along, and it was cheaper just to scrap it.

Just looked up the airframe, and saw that it was first flown back in 1988, the 28th A320 built. It was no new aircraft.

Harry

[Edited 2006-06-14 05:07:20]


Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
User currently offlineMCOflyer From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 8690 posts, RR: 16
Reply 2, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 12425 times:

I agree, its old a D checks are expensive. I've seen happen to relatively young US a/c. The 734's that were broken up werent that old.

MCOflyer



Never be afraid to stand up for who you are.
User currently offlineJoffie From Australia, joined Mar 2006, 819 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 12365 times:

This has been covered many times.

Simply, it seems more economic to use the Parts then to replace them.

The oldest A320's IE BA A320-100 without Winglets i assume will be getting scrapped once the replacement aircraft are delivered.


User currently offlineAirwave From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 1117 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 12311 times:

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 4):
Amazing how quickly airplanes get recycled now..

It's a shame, isn't it? They just don't build 'em like they used to. That's "progress" for ya...

Quoting Joffie (Reply 6):
Simply, it seems more economic to use the Parts then to replace them.

I'd really love to see what the ledger looks like for that. I mean, a frame like the one above is probably fully depreciated, so there's no charges associated with it, but for younger frames, what's the story? How about the storage and deconstruction costs? What percentage of parts are resellable?

I'm curious to see how profitable something like this really is.


Airwave  eyebrow 



When you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all.
User currently offlineWarreng24 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 708 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 12291 times:

Do you think the crews that flew the A320's in were picked up and flown out by 737's?

User currently offlineLitz From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1787 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 12234 times:
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I'd like to know who managed to mess up their A320 bad enough that they needed the middle wall sections over the wingbox on both sides of the fuselage.

How odd that they cut JUST that section out, and in perfect rectangles, too.

Notice the cockpit has also been surgically removed (someone's flightsim, perhaps?) ...

As for why? Simple : high cycles, older model, probably due for a D-check, and likely worth far more in parts/salvage then as a flying airframe.

Sad, but it's simple economics.

Relatively new 737-300s and 400s, MD80s, et al have all met their fate 'cause of the same thing.

As much as we hate to see old (or even not so old) planes go away, remember that Boeing and Airbus have to sell NEW planes ... and the size of the world's airfleets are finite in size (and in fact, getting smaller as the airlines shrink themselves) ...

You can't have new without disposing of the old. What doesn't go to 3rd world airlines, goes to the desert, then to OpaLocka.

- litz


User currently offlineMCOflyer From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 8690 posts, RR: 16
Reply 7, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 12220 times:

Most likely they flew via MIA to Cyprus, that is if Cyprus flew the plane in. If not, good question. Those Pro Air MD-90's were awful young to be scrapped dont you think?

http://www.airliners.net/open.file?i...r=2&prev_id=1010456&next_id=NEXTID



Never be afraid to stand up for who you are.
User currently offlineLrgt From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 711 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 12179 times:

Quoting Lrgt (Reply 8):
I was shocked to find that the same facility also scrapped a 737 (ex-UA N915UA) built 8/30/91 ...have any aircraft built after that been scrapped, or does that 737 hold the current record (not including aircraft involved in accidents)?

Perhaps a Continental 767-200's built 2000-2002 (already slated to be replaced by 787's) will set the new record down the road  stirthepot 

Actually the 8/30/91 record is far beat by MD-90's P4-MDF, P4-MDG, and P4-MDH... all built 11/??/98 and scrapped 2005!!!



Don't bring up the NW DC9's unless you have to!
User currently offlineNewark777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 9348 posts, RR: 29
Reply 9, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 12153 times:

Quoting Litz (Reply 11):
I'd like to know who managed to mess up their A320 bad enough that they needed the middle wall sections over the wingbox on both sides of the fuselage.

How odd that they cut JUST that section out, and in perfect rectangles, too.

They are probably using the overwing exit doors for FA emergency training.

Quoting Litz (Reply 11):

Notice the cockpit has also been surgically removed (someone's flightsim, perhaps?) ...

Why get rid of an otherwise good cockpit.

Harry



Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7089 posts, RR: 4
Reply 10, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 11941 times:

Quoting Airwave (Reply 9):
It's a shame, isn't it? They just don't build 'em like they used to. That's "progress" for ya...

Yeah, but not only aircraft but all kind of electronics as well. I don´t know how many CD-players I have had over the last 15 years.
My grandmother has a 30 years old "Miele Dish Washer" and a 20 years old vacuum which work more than fine (even better than today´s product) while I had just to buy another vacuum for my apartment since it broke and beyond repair.



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineAirbusA346 From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2004, 7437 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 11776 times:

I think it might have also been, because of the salt air around the airport in Cyprus, corroding the aircraft.

Might be wrong though.

Tom.



Tom Walker '086' First Officer of a A318/A319 for Air Lambert - Hours Flown: 17 hour 05 minutes (last updated 24/12/05).
User currently offlineCalAir From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2005, 298 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 11650 times:

Well, its that age old saying, they just dont make em like they used to!! And how true it is! My mum's hairdryer was 32 yrs old when it finally died last month, and the new one she bought to replace it has had to be replaced once as it was faulty! Workmanship and build quality are not as good as say 20 or 30 years ago, on pretty much anything. Remember Patroni's saying ;

"take the wings off a 707 and you could use it as a tank, and the 707 is designed to withstand anything,except a bad pilot!"

Well, theres still a few 707's and DC-9's flying about that are 3 times the age of that A320.



British Caledonian...we never forget, you have a choice
User currently offlineAADC10 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 2103 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 11571 times:

The condition of the plane also depends on the maintenance. Used planes from a large flag carrier are worth a lot more on the secondary market because it is known that they were properly maintained. Smaller airlines usually have poorer maintenance and their used planes are less valuable and who knows about Cyprus.

It also may well have been corroded in the Mediteranian humdity and subject to a high number of cycles over the 16-17 years it operated. It was proabaly a mess and its part value is high due to all of the A320s flying around.


User currently offlineAMSSFO From Netherlands, joined Feb 2005, 952 posts, RR: 10
Reply 14, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 11492 times:

for some more answers see http://www.airliners.net/discussions...ion/read.main/2240624/6/#ID2240624
and the last reply in this thread: http://www.airliners.net/discussions...ion/read.main/2049926/6/#ID2049926

Quote:
DBCooper: -DAT was CY's oldest A-320...and had the -A1 engines. There is a very limited market for 320s with -A1 engines (everyone strongly prefers the -A5 for both maintenance and performance reasons). Perhaps it was also due for a heavy check?


User currently offlineSmokeyrosco From Ireland, joined Dec 2005, 2112 posts, RR: 13
Reply 15, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 11256 times:

I was on the Airbus website the other day and noticed that there where 20 less aircraft in service then where delivered.


John Hancock
User currently offlineLitz From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1787 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 11040 times:
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Quoting CalAir (Reply 14):
Well, theres still a few 707's and DC-9's flying about that are 3 times the age of that A320.

Consider this ... NWA's oldest DC9s are getting retired. Aside from the fuel efficiency issues w/the older JT8D why are they being retired? Because the FAA set an upper limit on the number of cycles the plane could run. And because of that, it wasn't cost effective to rejig the planes for the new reduced separations standards.

Without that limit, with proper maintenance, a DC9 could probably go forever.

- litz


User currently offlineIrobertson From Canada, joined Apr 2006, 601 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 10995 times:

Quoting CalAir (Reply 14):
Well, theres still a few 707's and DC-9's flying about that are 3 times the age of that A320.

This is what I was wondering about. How can UPS and DHL and others fly DC8s built in the 1960s and pass their D checks and not use the same "simple economics" and scrap them too?


User currently offlineWarreng24 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 708 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day ago) and read 10818 times:

Quoting Irobertson (Reply 19):
Quoting CalAir (Reply 14):
Well, theres still a few 707's and DC-9's flying about that are 3 times the age of that A320.

This is what I was wondering about. How can UPS and DHL and others fly DC8s built in the 1960s and pass their D checks and not use the same "simple economics" and scrap them too?

One must remember that UPS and DHL fly cargo aircraft that may only take one or two flights a day at most. So that's maybe two cycles per day. The aircraft will last virtually forever at that rate.


User currently offlineLitz From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1787 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 1 day ago) and read 10759 times:
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Quoting Warreng24 (Reply 20):
One must remember that UPS and DHL fly cargo aircraft that may only take one or two flights a day at most. So that's maybe two cycles per day. The aircraft will last virtually forever at that rate.

Aren't margins for cargo are vastly greater than for passengers?

It's been said that some Hawaii-mainland flights pay for themselves with cargo only - the pax are pure profit on top ...

Remember - cargo doesn't complain, cargo doesn't sue, and cargo doesn't eat or drink.

That being said, you can still operate older aircraft for cargo quite profitably ... they make 1 or 2 flights a day and they're dirt cheap to buy.

- litz


User currently offlineN774UA From Netherlands, joined Aug 2004, 343 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 23 hours ago) and read 10690 times:

Weren't there also 2 Frontier A320's in the process of being scrapped? I think there was a thread about it last month.

United



...follow his instructions, switch off at the stand.
User currently offlineShowerOfSparks From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 23 hours ago) and read 10653 times:

Quoting N774UA (Reply 22):
Weren't there also 2 Frontier A320's in the process of being scrapped? I think there was a thread about it last month.

United

Don't see how since Frontier doesn't operate A320's yet.


User currently offlineLegoguy From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2006, 3313 posts, RR: 39
Reply 22, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 10482 times:

Quoting Lrgt (Thread starter):
It seems as if the scrapping of A320's (non-crash) has already begun!

Seems like such a waste. I thought they might have been sold to third world countries however if the aircraft are corroding....

Quoting AADC10 (Reply 15):
It also may well have been corroded in the Mediteranian humdity and subject to a high number of cycles over the 16-17 years it operated

...then maybe its for the best, rather than passing the problems on to the poorer countries.



Can you say 'Beer Can' without sounding like a Jamaican saying 'Bacon'?
User currently offlineMEA-707 From Netherlands, joined Nov 1999, 4358 posts, RR: 35
Reply 23, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 10433 times:

Quoting N774UA (Reply 22):
Weren't there also 2 Frontier A320's in the process of being scrapped?

It were former America West aircraft, also fairly high cycle machines of the early 1990s with a non standard configuration.



nobody has ever died from hard work, but why take the risk?
User currently offlineN774UA From Netherlands, joined Aug 2004, 343 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (8 years 6 months 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 10433 times:

Quoting ShowerOfSparks (Reply 23):

Don't see how since Frontier doesn't operate A320's yet.

My bad  Embarrassment . I meant America West.

Regards
United



...follow his instructions, switch off at the stand.
25 Cadet57 : I dont know why we are discussing this again. There are many threads on the scrapping of this plane. Do a search. It was said, IIRC that it was scrapp
26 Post contains images OB1504 : I live about three miles from where this airplane was broken up, and God help you if you think Miami Lakes (the town bordering the airport to the wes
27 PillowTester : Geez A320s are starting to be scrapped now? I feel old.
28 Post contains images IDAWA : I don't know what happened with this early A320, but I'm sure that when the last A320 will be parked in the desert, the crew will fly back on a DC-9
29 Post contains images Newark777 : Haha, I remember that was the joke when the WN and HP 732's were being retired. Harry
30 GDB : I too feel old seeing early production, high cycle A320's broken up. I can remember when it was launched, was just artist's impressions! To answer Jof
31 CYatUK : I am sorry to disappoint you but no-one had managed to correctly guess tha main reason for the aircraft scrapping. The main reason is the difficult f
32 Post contains images Slider : Nope. By NW DC-9s.
33 Post contains images Lightsaber : Right now the parts are worth quite a bit (expanding A320 fleet with a relatively low quantity of used parts on vendor's shelves). Redo this evaluati
34 Drinkstrolley : I flew on that one LHR-LCA about three years back, it even SMELT new then!!! Amazing.
35 BR715-A1-30 : No, but NW sent in a DC-9 to pick them up. DAMN! Beat me to it.
36 Post contains images Carledwards : An NW DC-9? Arent they going to be scrapped sometime soon? they are much older than A320's Ok its a joke I just could not help mentioning, as I've not
37 747727 : It make a change to see an airbus being cut up instead of a nice old boeing.
38 Spetouss : Cyprus Airways likes keeping their planes in perfect operational condition. The truth for this aircraft is exactly as CYatUK explained earlier. That
39 AirframeAS : Add AS's 732's in that mix...they've been around a long, long time! 18+ years I believe.
40 Prebennorholm : I think that we will have to get used to seeing old 320s fall by the wayside. With the current fuel prices I think that we can draw a fat red line bet
41 Boo25 : I'll be glad to see the back of the 10 old BA A320's (All start G-BUS A-I) - the toilets are something else! They're real noisy in the cabin too at th
42 Bredman1 : 2 scrapped in KROW more to go
43 Post contains images Bredman1 : I think that we will have to get used to seeing old 320s fall by the wayside. With the current fuel prices I think that we can draw a fat red line bet
44 CYatUK : Same applies to those of CY.
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