Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
QF & AC YVR To SYD  
User currently offlineDYK From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 407 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 2 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 6835 times:

It is looking like Air Canada and Qantas will change there schedules ex YVR in the coming year. We have been told unofficially that Air Canada will drop AC033 YVR- SYD the same time Air Canada commences service from YYZ-LAX-SYD. Qantas has told us today the YVR-SYD route will become year round effective in 2007 with hopes the flight will eventually become non-stop.

I have to admit, if this actually happens i am kind of put off by Air Canada. They really should re-name themselves Air Toronto, our national carrier really does not see anything beyond the World's greatest city?,YYZ.
wonder what is next?
Maybe YYZ-MIA-BJS, or YYZ-SEA-NRT and so on.

Wish there was a western Canadian based carrier like the old Canadian to push this airline out of the west.!!


AC,CP,PW,WD,ND,UA,AA,NW,CO,DL,WA,AS,QX,PR,SQ,AI,TG,MH,JL,9W,IC,UL,PG,BW,NZ,QF,DJ,BA,LH,KL,OA,OS,ME,RJ,HA,AQ
55 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineOlympus69 From Canada, joined Jun 2002, 1737 posts, RR: 7
Reply 1, posted (8 years 2 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 6804 times:

Toronto's population is more than double Vancouver's. But Vancouver has something Toronto will never have - scenery. Smile

User currently offlineCruiser From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 1001 posts, RR: 7
Reply 2, posted (8 years 2 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 6801 times:

You have to realise that Air Canada will now have a fleet of the most capable commercial airliners in the world. As a result, they will use this to their advantage and will fly more planes from their main hub which is YYZ. Don't forget that there will be a YVR-LAX flight as well!

James



Leahy on Per Seat Costs: "Have you seen the B-2 fly-by at almost US$1bn a copy? It has only 2 seats!"
User currently offlineSunriseValley From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 4932 posts, RR: 5
Reply 3, posted (8 years 2 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 6789 times:

Quoting DYK (Thread starter):
I have to admit, if this actually happens i am kind of put off by Air Canada.

This validates , I believe, my view that YVR is overblown as a O/D point for service to the South Pacific. It only works now because of the feed's from cities to the east of it. These can be fed just as easily into LAX on existing services.


User currently offline6thfreedom From Bermuda, joined Sep 2004, 3325 posts, RR: 20
Reply 4, posted (8 years 2 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 6779 times:

I think Air Canada will undertake a broad expansion of North America - Australia ops, and will offer far greater capacity than QF. I also think they will alternate schedules to allow 2 departures every day...

My thinking for AC...

YVR-SYD non-stop daily.
YYZ-LAX-SYD daily, with feed from Canadian ports over LAX.

YVR-HNL-MEL resumption. B767, 3-4pw.

The LAX-SYD flight will be majority US pax, therefore the increase in Canada capacity is limited, even under the above scenario...


User currently offlineDYK From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 407 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (8 years 2 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 6718 times:

Quoting SunriseValley (Reply 3):
This validates , I believe, my view that YVR is overblown as a O/D point for service to the South Pacific. It only works now because of the feed's from cities to the east of it. These can be fed just as easily into LAX on existing services

ya I totally agree with you? cant figure out why Qantas flies to vancovuer in the first place or why Air Canada does not fly YYZ-HNL-SYD? or even why Air new Zealand would be considering Vancouver. Despite Vancouver having a very large Australia and NZ expat poplulation it seems totally overblown.



AC,CP,PW,WD,ND,UA,AA,NW,CO,DL,WA,AS,QX,PR,SQ,AI,TG,MH,JL,9W,IC,UL,PG,BW,NZ,QF,DJ,BA,LH,KL,OA,OS,ME,RJ,HA,AQ
User currently offlineFLYACYYZ From Canada, joined Jan 2004, 1914 posts, RR: 12
Reply 6, posted (8 years 2 months 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 6701 times:

Quoting DYK (Thread starter):
We have been told unofficially that Air Canada will drop AC033 YVR- SYD

By whom?? It's our understanding within the company that the flight will remain until an aircraft capable of flying non-stop will be available for the route.

Quoting SunriseValley (Reply 3):
This validates , I believe, my view that YVR is overblown as a O/D point for service to the South Pacific. It only works now because of the feed's from cities to the east of it.

And to Asia as well. The 340's flying from YYZ to NRT/PEK/PVG etc. are full, somewhat diluting the YVR loads. I think YVR will largely become a 787 operation to replace load levels consistent with the 767.

Quoting DYK (Reply 5):
why Air Canada does not fly YYZ-HNL-SYD?

As previously discussed YYZ-HNL is a low/no yield route, and was the big "dumping ground" flight for frequent flyer points. LAX has hub capability with flights converging upon it from YUL/YYZ/YYC/YEG/YVR..think this will be augmented by YOW & YWG as well in years to come.



Above and Beyond
User currently offline6thfreedom From Bermuda, joined Sep 2004, 3325 posts, RR: 20
Reply 7, posted (8 years 2 months 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 6652 times:

Quoting DYK (Reply 5):
cant figure out why Qantas flies to vancovuer in the first place

perhaps beats leving the aircraft on the ground for 16 hours in SFO. what else do you do with it??

Quoting FLYACYYZ (Reply 6):
It's our understanding within the company that the flight will remain until an aircraft capable of flying non-stop will be available for the route.

spot on. that's what i keep hearing. YVR-SYD either via HNl or non-stop will remain, regardless of what happens with YYZ-LAX-SYD.

Quoting DYK (Reply 5):
Air Canada does not fly YYZ-HNL-SYD?



Quoting FLYACYYZ (Reply 6):
As previously discussed YYZ-HNL is a low/no yield route,

this was tried when AC operated YYZ-HNL-MEL, connecting with YVR-HNL-SYD.
I still think this option has merit. timing was bad, with service slaunched post S11...


User currently offlineSebring From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 1663 posts, RR: 14
Reply 8, posted (8 years 2 months 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 6550 times:

Quoting DYK (Thread starter):

I have to admit, if this actually happens i am kind of put off by Air Canada. They really should re-name themselves Air Toronto, our national carrier really does not see anything beyond the World's greatest city?,YYZ.
wonder what is next?
Maybe YYZ-MIA-BJS, or YYZ-SEA-NRT and so on.

Wish there was a western Canadian based carrier like the old Canadian to push this airline out of the west.!!

You will also be getting Vancouver-Guangzhou next year, but don't let that stop a good whine.


User currently offlineDYK From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 407 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (8 years 2 months 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 6457 times:

Quoting Sebring (Reply 8):
You will also be getting Vancouver-Guangzhou next year, but don't let that stop a good whine.

I believe when it happens, Until then, yes I am and Viva BC Libre



AC,CP,PW,WD,ND,UA,AA,NW,CO,DL,WA,AS,QX,PR,SQ,AI,TG,MH,JL,9W,IC,UL,PG,BW,NZ,QF,DJ,BA,LH,KL,OA,OS,ME,RJ,HA,AQ
User currently offlineANother From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (8 years 2 months 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 6432 times:

Quoting DYK (Reply 9):
Viva BC Libre

What language is that? Spenglaise? Frangish?


User currently offlineJayce From Canada, joined Nov 1999, 520 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (8 years 2 months 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 6400 times:

Personally, I think all the airlines should leave YVR and just fly to YYZ.  sarcastic 

QF and NZ are flying here because there is demand and it makes sense. YYZ has always been AC's "fortress hub", just as CP had YVR. I remember not too long before AC took over CP, CP had a plan to triple their number of daily departures out of YVR.

YVR just makes sense as a trans-Pacific gateway. Hopefully Harmony will pick up where CP left off. Let's not forget that YVR is the second busiest airport on the West Coast in terms of international passengers.



"Trying is the first step towards failure" -Homer Simpson
User currently offlineANstar From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2003, 5187 posts, RR: 6
Reply 12, posted (8 years 2 months 1 day ago) and read 6350 times:

Quoting 6thfreedom (Reply 4):
I think Air Canada will undertake a broad expansion of North America - Australia ops, and will offer far greater capacity than QF. I also think they will alternate schedules to allow 2 departures every day...

My thinking for AC...

YVR-SYD non-stop daily.
YYZ-LAX-SYD daily, with feed from Canadian ports over LAX.

YVR-HNL-MEL resumption. B767, 3-4pw.

AC won;t trump QF on USA-AUS capacity. QF have about 5 744's each day to the US - dont forget about their HNL service and JQ's new HNL service.


User currently offlineMotorHussy From New Zealand, joined Mar 2000, 3179 posts, RR: 9
Reply 13, posted (8 years 2 months 23 hours ago) and read 6318 times:

Any word on an AC YVR-AKL service? NZ have mooted this several times and it would be a great *alliance codeshare. Will we have to wait for the 787's to arrive?

Regards
MH



come visit the south pacific
User currently offlineVHVXB From Australia, joined Apr 2006, 5524 posts, RR: 18
Reply 14, posted (8 years 2 months 23 hours ago) and read 6311 times:

Quoting 6thfreedom (Reply 7):
spot on. that's what i keep hearing. YVR-SYD either via HNl or non-stop will remain, regardless of what happens with YYZ-LAX-SYD.

Everytime i have family come from canada on this flight they always coment on how full it is all the time. There also seems to be limited capacity to YVR from SYD route. You currently have AC which is daily(double daily during Australian Summer), FJ which i think is 3 weekly and the same with QF. It would be good if AC kept this running even though they are starting the YYZ-SYD


User currently offline6thfreedom From Bermuda, joined Sep 2004, 3325 posts, RR: 20
Reply 15, posted (8 years 2 months 23 hours ago) and read 6307 times:

Quoting ANstar (Reply 12):
AC won;t trump QF on USA-AUS capacity. QF have about 5 744's each day to the US - dont forget about their HNL service and JQ's new HNL service.

I said broad expansion on North America - Australia.... North America does not only mean USA!
I agree, AC won't trump QF to the USA, but I thnk they will stand their ground and take market share of Canada traffic.

QF shares equal market share with AC on Canada - SYD traffic, despite QF traffic having to transit in LAX in the past. From BNE and MEL, all of QF's Canada traffic is on LAX services. I think this is the market that AC will try to take back...

Quoting MotorHussy (Reply 13):
Any word on an AC YVR-AKL service? NZ have mooted this several times and it would be a great *alliance codeshare. Will we have to wait for the 787's to arrive?

YVR-AKL is a B787 sector. Won't happen for a while. NZ will continue to feed traffic over SFO and LAX, and to a lesser degree HNL...


User currently offlineMotorHussy From New Zealand, joined Mar 2000, 3179 posts, RR: 9
Reply 16, posted (8 years 2 months 8 hours ago) and read 6092 times:

Quoting 6thfreedom (Reply 15):
YVR-AKL is a B787 sector. Won't happen for a while. NZ will continue to feed traffic over SFO and LAX, and to a lesser degree HNL...

Chur Bro. I concur, but when I ski at Whistler/Blackcomb I want to fly direct and soon.
MH



come visit the south pacific
User currently offlineThreepoint From Canada, joined Oct 2005, 2130 posts, RR: 9
Reply 17, posted (8 years 2 months 7 hours ago) and read 6043 times:

Quoting SunriseValley (Reply 3):
This validates , I believe, my view that YVR is overblown as a O/D point for service to the South Pacific. It only works now because of the feed's from cities to the east of it.



Quoting DYK (Reply 5):
Despite Vancouver having a very large Australia and NZ expat poplulation it seems totally overblown.

Perhaps what you two may have overlooked is that not all the traffic going to/from Australia is Vancouver O&D. The number of Canadians from the rest of Western Canada headed down under in the northern winter is immense, as are the numbers of Aussies flying the opposite direction to any number of interior ski resorts (several of which are Australian-owned). While the yields may certainly be lower than the business traffic out of YYZ, there are always full airplanes and profits to made by AC. Routing through LAX is a hassle due to the longer flight times and the US visa requirements.

I agree with 6th Freedom and FLYACYYZ when they predict the continuation of YVR-SYD services (with the aim towards non-stop flights with AC's new widebodies).



The nice thing about a mistake is the pleasure it gives others.
User currently offlineGuyBetsy1 From Canada, joined Aug 2001, 840 posts, RR: 6
Reply 18, posted (8 years 2 months ago) and read 5899 times:

AC will most likely route people flying YVR - SYD to fly via LAX to connect on the flight from YYZ.

BUT they forget that many people does not like going through the US and be subjected to stupid INS questions...

"Why are you going to the US"

- Connecting to Sydney.

"Why can't you fly direct from Vancouver?"

- Because our moronic airline doesn't think of the needs of Canadians!

I will be flying QF next time, thank you.


User currently offlineAirbear From Australia, joined May 2001, 648 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (8 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 5842 times:

Why on earth - when talking about flying the AUST-USA route, does every airline want to fly from SYD to LAX? SYD, OK. It's the mani Aussie gateway. But contrary to popular opinion, we already have more than enough flts to the LA Zoo. Perhaps just not enough choice in carriers or Alliances. Some route swapping amongst the Star carriers would be good, if ever the Aust. govt stops asking "How high?" every time QF tells them to jump!

How about someone (Richard Branson & Brett Godfrey please take note...) going non-stop from SYD to some less congested or more convenient destinations like either LAS (good connections for Star, oneworld & Virgin), SJC (oneworld & Star) or PHX (oneowrld- BA-and Star courtesy of the AmWest/US merger) any of which should be able to be flown by current a/c.


User currently offlineAccargo From Canada, joined Sep 2004, 610 posts, RR: 8
Reply 20, posted (8 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 5810 times:

Quoting GuyBetsy1 (Reply 18):
AC will most likely route people flying YVR - SYD to fly via LAX to connect on the flight from YYZ

Why, simply because you say so? Because you believe some unsubstantiated rumour posted on anet? What a crock. Enjoy QF through LAX or SFO, because guess what? QF does not have a non-stop from YVR to SYD.


User currently offlineFLYACYYZ From Canada, joined Jan 2004, 1914 posts, RR: 12
Reply 21, posted (8 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 5761 times:

Quoting GuyBetsy1 (Reply 18):
"Why are you going to the US"

- Connecting to Sydney.

"Why can't you fly direct from Vancouver?"

- Because our moronic airline doesn't think of the needs of Canadians!

I will be flying QF next time, thank you.

Agree with ACCargo. Why don't we have this hypothetical "moronic" conversation, once flight 033 is wiped off the radar screen. Nothing more than pure speculation.  Yeah sure

And guess what. Flying on a direct flight on QF YVR-SFO-SYD, you're sorry little bum will probably be hauled off the aircraft at SFO so that US Customs can pocket a head tax for processing every originating Canadian passenger.



Above and Beyond
User currently offlineYVRSR From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (8 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 5701 times:

I have done YVR-HNL-SYD on AC several times during the past 3 years. I have taken the trip YVR-LAX-SYD once.

On the current YVR->HNL->SYD route one must pre-clear US customs and immigration in YVR. One the return trip SYD->HNL->YVR one must clear US customs and immigration in HNL. (The stop in HNL on the trip back to Canada is in the middle of the night. One gets off the plane, goes through US customs, waits for an hour or so, then gets back on the plane at 1 or 1:30AM.)

For a few short months Dec 2004 - Mar 2005. SYD -> YVR was nonstop and YVR->HNL->SYD had a technical stop in HNL where passengers did not have to clear US customs in YVR and did not get off the plane in HNL. (I did this trip once.)

Living in YVR, I would like to see more AC flights out of my home airport. However, an AC route out of LAX makes sense to me. Passengers can connect to LAX on AC from YVR, YEG, YYC, YYZ, YUL and have a one stop trip to Australia as opposed to a 2 stop trip from 4 of these cities. One has to clear US customs on the current route and the proposed routine. It would be better if the flight were YVR-LAX-SYD, but that's another story.

My gut feeling on the matter is that if YYZ-LAX-SYD goes ahead, then YVR-HNL-SYD or YVR-SYD nonstop will only operate during the northern winter, the time during which AC has recently had 2 daily flights to Australia.


User currently offline2travel2know From Panama, joined Apr 2005, 3580 posts, RR: 4
Reply 23, posted (8 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 5686 times:

All Via HNL or LAX?
Great news for those who don't mind going thru U.S. Port of Entry Facities at the Canadian Airports when flying to Australia.
If that's the mentality, then why not have daily YVR-HNL, some YYC/YWG-HNL and daily YYZ-HNL flights and make a hub in HNL with flights to SYD daily, MEL some days and AKL some days.



I don't work for COPA Airlines!
User currently offlineDYK From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 407 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (8 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 5672 times:

Quoting FLYACYYZ (Reply 21):
Agree with ACCargo. Why don't we have this hypothetical "moronic" conversation, once flight 033 is wiped off the radar screen. Nothing more than pure speculation.

I would think it is a very valid point now. Air Canada main focus in the development of future International routes in to/from Toronto. Air Canada views outside the Toronto hub; a bi-product.



AC,CP,PW,WD,ND,UA,AA,NW,CO,DL,WA,AS,QX,PR,SQ,AI,TG,MH,JL,9W,IC,UL,PG,BW,NZ,QF,DJ,BA,LH,KL,OA,OS,ME,RJ,HA,AQ
25 YVRtoYYZ : I know that Sebring has provided insight into the choice of YYZ-LAX-SYD using the -LR instead of a direct YYZ-SYD flight with the -LR (something to d
26 Yyztpa : A couple of reasons: I don't think AC is thinking all those seats are going to be filled with Canadian/Australian rear-ends. Think outside the 'Canad
27 Travelin man : It gets more int'l passengers than SFO or LAX? I'd be shocked if that were true. If you do, you will still be subject to the same "stupid" questions.
28 Jayce : Now I understand that the market is there for AC and yes, it does make economic sense. However, Air Canada should serve the needs of Canadians and le
29 Post contains images Jacobin777 : Air Canada is looking to see where they can get the most profits with their planes...if it means flying YYZ-BUF, they will....
30 DYK : well said. The new AC flight should route in YVR-LAX-SYD and AC should have a feeder flight from Toronto to LA. The West Coast of Canada particulalry
31 RP TPA : Two things come to mind regarding this subject: 1) Don't forget...it's not just Canada to Australia, or Los Angeles to Australia we're talking about.
32 EnviroTO : Why would AC route a plane YVR-LAX-SYD when YVR-HNL-SYD or simply YVR-SYD direct once the new aircraft arrive makes more sense from YVR. YVR-LAX is a
33 Wunala : I am going the SYD-YVR sector next month. Yes, there is a stop in SFO, but we are not thinking too much about that. Why are we going to YVR? Because w
34 Accargo : So given this stand I guess you are in favour of the gov't taking control of Air Canada and making it a crown corporation without the need to be prof
35 Jayce : So given your logic, it makes perfect sense for AC to route all of their flights through LAX, JFK or LHR simply because they can make more money than
36 Accargo : If AC can be more profitable then YES. It's not owned by the gov't. It is a business that has a responsibility to shareholders. Next year AC is flyin
37 6thfreedom : I'm with ACCargo on this. No one has suggested that YYZ-LAX-SYD will replace a YVR-SYD link, whether via HNL or non-stop. I put 10 bucks on AC mainta
38 Jayce : Essentially what you're saying is that it would be perfectly alright for AC to fly from Canadian cities to an American gateway and then put them on a
39 EnviroTO : There are people in YYZ wanting to go to SYD. A direct route to SYD from YYZ passes over LAX. If AC needs to stop in LAX because the distance YYZ-SYD
40 Post contains links Jayce : Well then shocked you are. According to the YVR website: "YVR is Canada's second busiest airport, with some 16.4 million passengers (including same p
41 Gemuser : Not since your government, of the time, sold it off to the private sector. AC ONLY responsiabilities (within the law) are to its shareholders, Unless
42 QANTAS077 : don't worry, we have Air Sydney down here...Qantas isn't interested in developing any routes west of Sydney. god help us if they did come up with som
43 Jayce : Yes, I understand my idea of a country's national airlineactually serving the entire nation does sound a little far fetched. I have no problem with an
44 RP TPA : I'm sitting here trying to understand the reasoning behind your statement. Are you saying that Westjet has more routes than AC? More domestic flights
45 Travelin man : Interesting. I am shocked. I have to say, however, that I still do not fully believe it (even though the website said it). I am certain LAX is #1 on
46 Baroque : After all this I am totally confused. I need to go from Sydney (Aus) to Vancouver in mid 2007, and I am conscious of the hassles of having an intermed
47 Jayce : Yep, shouldn't be posting in forums when I'm tired. WS, in my opinion at least, does a better job of serving the entire country, not just one pocket
48 Threepoint : What, a transit lounge in HNL in the middle of the night isn't interesting?!? Unfortunately Baroque, your options are currently limited to transiting
49 EnviroTO : Air Canada serves 26 domestic destinations from YVR, 13 US destinations, SYD via HNL, 6 Asian destinations, and a European destination. How does West
50 9252fly : Okay,lets look at the non-stop destinations flown by AC and WS from YVR? AC: International(Asia)NRT,KIX,ICN,PEK,SHA,HKG(South Pacific)SYD(Europe)LHR.
51 FlyboyOz : in mid 2007...i think AC staff to me that it will operate b777 to fly directly between SYD and YVR nonstop.
52 Baroque : Thanks for that, I usually end up more confused than illuminated by using Airline website. Why ever does AC post the Syd to Vancouver flight by 763 w
53 Jayce : In my opinion, Canada it too large a country for an airline to have one major hub. I tried booking a YVR-HKG route for my dad a few months back and on
54 YYZYHZ : As much as I love this country, this East vs West crap, that comes up from everything from Air Canada to politics, is getting old REALLY FAST. AIR CAN
55 ChrisA330 : Perhaps because that was a cheaper option? Gimme a break...you really think AC has only 1 hub? Get real...
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
What Are The Loads Like On AC YVR - HNL - SYD? posted Wed Nov 9 2005 18:29:35 by AirCanada014
AC YVR->SYD posted Sun Jun 1 2003 10:29:24 by Planenutz
AC 747 To SYD. 74M Or 744? posted Wed Sep 11 2002 22:43:46 by Al
Info Need For JAL SIN-YVR & AC YVR-Calgary posted Wed Dec 12 2001 15:14:20 by G-KIRAN
Does AC Use 767-200ER To SYD From YVR Via HNL? posted Thu Mar 2 2006 01:23:37 by AirCanada014
What Happened To SYD-YVR On QF? posted Wed Mar 24 2004 17:13:43 by BCAInfoSys
Help QF Or AC To SYD From HNL posted Fri Mar 5 2004 19:42:30 by Lahaina
Could AC Do YVR To AKL Using 340-300 If...? posted Mon Jan 23 2006 15:58:51 by AirCanada014
QF Flight Returns To Syd? posted Tue Jan 17 2006 08:03:56 by QF108
How Is AC's YVR-SYD Doing posted Mon Jan 2 2006 04:44:53 by PlaneLuver