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US 737's - Which Will Go First 734 Or 733?  
User currently offlineJfrworld From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 365 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 6 months 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 3829 times:

There have been several threads about US and their 737's and I think we can all agree that the 737 fleet is going nowhere fast. They make up 28% of the fleet (total 97) 57 -733's and 40 - 734's.

When they do start replacing, which do we think US will look to replace first? My guess is that US will start retiring the 733 first as some of the former HP 733's are in pretty bad shape. I was on two HP 733's last year and their interiors were pretty bad - some holes and lots of patching on the interior panneling, etc. On takeoff, the interior window frame fell out and I could see the metal skin and insulation. The FA reassured me that it was simply cosmetic and gave me a free bloody mary.

It seems as though the 734's are a big newer and might last the longest.

Does anyone else have some thoughts.

28 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineHPRamper From United States of America, joined May 2005, 4151 posts, RR: 8
Reply 1, posted (8 years 6 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 3768 times:

I'm sure it won't be by model, but by whatever planes are in the most need of maintenance as their times come up, and also by age. Obviously the oldest will be going first as a general rule.

User currently offlineDutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 56
Reply 2, posted (8 years 6 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 3740 times:

My understanding is that the US/HP 737 fleet is not going anywhere just yet, and the 733/734 will remain in service with the airline in medium-term future as the airline needs the lift and HP/US does not have enough A32X aircraft on order to allow for the replacment of the entire 737 fleet and allow for expansion in the coming years.

My guess is that 733s and 734s will not be retired by group, aircraft will be retired as individual leases expire and/or as individual aircraft are due for heavy maintainence, or as other events occur. A few 733s will be retired, then a few 734s will be retired, and so on, until the 733/734 fleet has been replaced.

The interesting question is what will replace this large fleet.....the quick answer is more A32X aircraft, but that may not be the case. Consider that there is a credible rumor out there that HP/US is seriously looking at the 739ER for domestic operations (think LAX and PHX to east coast routes and transcons) and the HP management was seriously considering placing a 737NG order before the entire US Airways deal came up. Or, will US/HP go directly to the next generation of single aisle airplane and be a launch customer for the next generation Boeing or Airbus airliner?


User currently offlineDesertJets From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 7811 posts, RR: 16
Reply 3, posted (8 years 6 months 3 days ago) and read 3720 times:

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 2):
Or, will US/HP go directly to the next generation of single aisle airplane and be a launch customer for the next generation Boeing or Airbus airliner?

By 2010, if the next gen 737 or A320 is launched by then, I could see that as a possibility. Especially if the operating economics were attractive enough. And by the time 2010 rolls around the vast majority of the 737 fleet will be 20+ years old... so ripe for retirement. Plus the eldest of the A320s will be near 20 as well. Not to mention most of the 757 fleet. So if their finances are in good shape, then a large order would make sense.

However until then retiring/replacing the 737s on a case-by-case basis makes the most sense. They still form the backbone of the short to medium haul network out east and in the west.



Stop drop and roll will not save you in hell. --- seen on a church marque in rural Virginia
User currently offlineJfrworld From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 365 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (8 years 6 months 3 days ago) and read 3675 times:

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 2):
My guess is that 733s and 734s will not be retired by group, aircraft will be retired as individual leases expire and/or as individual aircraft are due for heavy maintainence, or as other events occur. A few 733s will be retired, then a few 734s will be retired, and so on, until the 733/734 fleet has been replaced.

.

That's a good thought. I always kind of assumed that US would retire them by group, but age does make sense.


User currently offlinePVD757 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3420 posts, RR: 16
Reply 5, posted (8 years 6 months 3 days ago) and read 3675 times:

I personnally think that the 733 will have a life until an order for the E190 is ordered. I thought they were finishing up the negotiations on payscale for this plane. I still think that management is going to try to shove these off like they did with the E170s to the regional partners.

User currently offlineFalcon Flyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 1332 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (8 years 6 months 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 3604 times:

Looks like several of the -400s are being reregistered to UW suffixes. Wouldn't that indicate that they may be around at least for a little while longer ?


My definition of cool ? Not trying so hard to be cool.
User currently offlineSonOfACaptain From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1747 posts, RR: 6
Reply 7, posted (8 years 6 months 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 3540 times:

Quoting PVD757 (Reply 5):
I personnally think that the 733 will have a life until an order for the E190 is ordered.

Uh dude, they have already ordered the 190...

-SOAC



Non Illegitimi Carborundum
User currently offlineA330323X From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 3039 posts, RR: 43
Reply 8, posted (8 years 6 months 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 3493 times:

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 2):
My guess is that 733s and 734s will not be retired by group, aircraft will be retired as individual leases expire and/or as individual aircraft are due for heavy maintainence, or as other events occur. A few 733s will be retired, then a few 734s will be retired, and so on, until the 733/734 fleet has been replaced.

Yes, that's exactly what will happen, whenever that may be.

Quoting PVD757 (Reply 5):
I personnally think that the 733 will have a life until an order for the E190 is ordered. I thought they were finishing up the negotiations on payscale for this plane.

I think you're just a little behind the times.  Wink

They've had a payscale in place for almost a year, and a firm EMB-190 order since February. Deliveries start in November.

Quoting Falcon Flyer (Reply 6):
Looks like several of the -400s are being reregistered to UW suffixes. Wouldn't that indicate that they may be around at least for a little while longer ?

They will indeed be around a while longer--I don't know why people have so much trouble accepting that, I really don't--but the renumbering is to align the numbers of the US and HP fleets, and to get rid of any planes which have conflicting numbers, for computer purposes. Almost every fleet type will have some numbers changed (I believe all but the A321s), not just the 737s.



I'm the expert on here on two things, neither of which I care about much anymore.
User currently offlineFalcon Flyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 1332 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (8 years 6 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 3438 times:

Quoting A330323X (Reply 8):
I don't know why people have so much trouble accepting that,

No problem here with that. It'll be nice to see some 400s roaming around the East Coast.



My definition of cool ? Not trying so hard to be cool.
User currently offlineHPRamper From United States of America, joined May 2005, 4151 posts, RR: 8
Reply 10, posted (8 years 6 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 3384 times:

Quoting Falcon Flyer (Reply 9):
It'll be nice to see some 400s roaming around the East Coast.

That's where they have been this whole time though  Smile As the former HP only flew the -300, those will be making more frequent appearances in the East.


User currently offlineSteeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 9272 posts, RR: 21
Reply 11, posted (8 years 6 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 3383 times:

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 2):
My guess is that 733s and 734s will not be retired by group, aircraft will be retired as individual leases expire and/or as individual aircraft are due for heavy maintainence, or as other events occur. A few 733s will be retired, then a few 734s will be retired, and so on, until the 733/734 fleet has been replaced.

As quite a few have stated above, I also agree with this. The 733s and 4s have been fairly dependable for US, and I don't think that they are in any hurry to replace them just yet. Yes, some of the planes are in pretty bad shape and are in need of a pretty solid fixer-upper, but these birds will be retired over time

Quoting PVD757 (Reply 5):
I personnally think that the 733 will have a life until an order for the E190 is ordered.

Yeah, as someone stated before (SOAC, I believe), they already have those on order as well as in their fleet if I am not mistaken. Also, I think that the E90 is more of a modern DC9, in terms of capacity and use for that equipment... How many do those planes seat, 90-100? and aren't they used primarily for short range as well? Although I believe that given their fuel efficiency, they could go from PHL-LAS or DEN... So in terms of their intended use, I'd say they'd be of good use on low density routes... Then again, the 733 and 734 are used for this as well. Maybe it's in terms of capacity then...



Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
User currently offlinePanAm330 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 2693 posts, RR: 9
Reply 12, posted (8 years 6 months 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 3289 times:

Quoting Steeler83 (Reply 11):
So in terms of their intended use, I'd say they'd be of good use on low density routes... Then again, the 733 and 734 are used for this as well. Maybe it's in terms of capacity then...

The 737s and E190s will have completely different missions for US. 737s are most certainly not used on thin routes, either. US is heavily Express in the east, and mainline aircraft are used on mostly mid- and high-density routes. The E190s will do thinner routes that a CRJ can't do, or that don't have quite the demand for a 737 or A32S. The mainline aircraft will continue to ply the heavier and/or longer routes in the system.


User currently offlineSteeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 9272 posts, RR: 21
Reply 13, posted (8 years 6 months 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 3273 times:

Quoting PanAm330 (Reply 12):
The 737s and E190s will have completely different missions for US. 737s are most certainly not used on thin routes, either. US is heavily Express in the east, and mainline aircraft are used on mostly mid- and high-density routes. The E190s will do thinner routes that a CRJ can't do, or that don't have quite the demand for a 737 or A32S. The mainline aircraft will continue to ply the heavier and/or longer routes in the system.

Then it's more or less my initial thoughts regarding the two aircraft...

Quoting Steeler83 (Reply 11):
Also, I think that the E90 is more of a modern DC9, in terms of capacity and use for that equipment... How many do those planes seat, 90-100?



Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
User currently offlineCa2ohHP From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 955 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (8 years 6 months 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 3264 times:

They'll just phase them out as the leases expire so they don't have to renew anything. Then they'll replace the 734's with E90's on a two-for-one basis since they're cheaper to operate.  Big grin

User currently offlineThering From Brazil, joined Jun 2006, 530 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (8 years 6 months 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 3252 times:

Don't think that 733 or 734 one will be retired first! They will be retired together as new A319/A320 arrives, since they have differente pax capacities!
Always good to remember that US was the first user of 734!



146 319 320 321 332 722 732 733 734 735 73G 738 742 743 744 762 763 772 773 CRJ ER4 100 F50 F27 M11 D10
User currently offlineMCOflyer From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 8690 posts, RR: 16
Reply 16, posted (8 years 6 months 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 3226 times:

Thering,
I believe that Piedmont was the first user of the 734. US have several 401 models.

Dutchjet,
Parker stated that new a/c orders will be Airbus. Look for more A321 a/c to be ordered as they can do transcon from CLT and PHL efficently. Also US sends them down to FLL,MCO,MIA,TPA,PBI fully loaded. Additional A319 a/c are on order.

Look for the A320-231 models to be replaced b/c of the earlier engine type. Can someone clarify if HP has any A5 models of the A320? If so, the A320-216 might be a logical choice or the 214.

MCOflyer



Never be afraid to stand up for who you are.
User currently offlineThering From Brazil, joined Jun 2006, 530 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (8 years 6 months 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 3221 times:

Quoting MCOflyer (Reply 16):
Thering,
I believe that Piedmont was the first user of the 734. US have several 401 models.

I flew one time in a US 734 and the pilot informed that that one was the first 734 in service! That's why I think US was the first to fly 734, but I can be wrong!



146 319 320 321 332 722 732 733 734 735 73G 738 742 743 744 762 763 772 773 CRJ ER4 100 F50 F27 M11 D10
User currently offlineMCOflyer From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 8690 posts, RR: 16
Reply 18, posted (8 years 6 months 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 3213 times:

Heres your proof Thering:

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/0993513/M/

MCOflyer



Never be afraid to stand up for who you are.
User currently offlineThering From Brazil, joined Jun 2006, 530 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (8 years 6 months 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 3196 times:

Ow, you are right!
Sorry  Smile



146 319 320 321 332 722 732 733 734 735 73G 738 742 743 744 762 763 772 773 CRJ ER4 100 F50 F27 M11 D10
User currently offlineMCOflyer From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 8690 posts, RR: 16
Reply 20, posted (8 years 6 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 3196 times:

I believe US was the first to take delievery of the 733.

MCOflyer



Never be afraid to stand up for who you are.
User currently offlineRamerinianair From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1486 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (8 years 6 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 3182 times:

I think that Doug Parker is a VERY smart guy. Outside of mx concerns, he will retire the A/C with the highest cost. If the 734 leases are higher, you can kiss them goodbye. I don't think that they will be in the fleet over the long haul but, they aren't being retired yet. If they have the need to retire 30 or more, it will be by mx and lease cost priority.
SR



W N = my Worst Nightmare!!!!!
User currently offlineBluewave 707 From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 3152 posts, RR: 6
Reply 22, posted (8 years 6 months 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 3099 times:

There have been a few ex-US 733s passing through HNL. I'm guessing these were leased ones that were returned to the lessors, and getting a new life.
http://www.airliners.net/discussions...eneral_aviation/read.main/2629639/
http://hnlrarebirds.blogspot.com



"The best use of your life will be to so live your life, that the use of your life will outlive your life" -- D Severn
User currently offlineHPRamper From United States of America, joined May 2005, 4151 posts, RR: 8
Reply 23, posted (8 years 6 months 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 3082 times:

Quoting MCOflyer (Reply 16):
Look for the A320-231 models to be replaced b/c of the earlier engine type. Can someone clarify if HP has any A5 models of the A320? If so, the A320-216 might be a logical choice or the 214.

HP has some of both A1 and A5, but I believe majority A5.


User currently offlineDutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 56
Reply 24, posted (8 years 6 months 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 3080 times:

Quoting MCOflyer (Reply 16):
Dutchjet,
Parker stated that new a/c orders will be Airbus. Look for more A321 a/c to be ordered as they can do transcon from CLT and PHL efficently. Also US sends them down to FLL,MCO,MIA,TPA,PBI fully loaded. Additional A319 a/c are on order.

I wasnt aware of this statement by Parker.........I know all about the Airbus exit loan, etc.....but that loan was paid off. As I mentioned, I have heard several rumors (yes, rumors) that US was giving the 739ER a long, hard look and is considering the type - but US is not yet ready to place orders for additional new aircraft at this time. I realize that additional A319s are on the order books.


Re the A321s - nice airplane but a big headache at PHX and LAS during the long hot desert summer. Is US seriously considering adding to its A321 fleet?


25 TL925 : Looking at the fleet of US Airways, they currently have 26 B737-300's either in service (21) or in storage (5) that are older than the oldest B737-400
26 Post contains images A330323X : Don't worry, that's because it doesn't exist. They do have 13 of them on order for delivery in 2009-10 which I certainly do believe they'll take, but
27 MCOflyer : I want US to add the 739ER. It would be perfect for US. I have one question. Around noon there is one A321 sitting at a remote stand in SAN, couldn't
28 MCOflyer : Parker is a smart guy. I hope he looks at the 739ER. They need those for transcons from the east and west. Dutchjet, From what I hear. US loves their
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