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GUM To US Mainland  
User currently offlineLPLAspotter From Portugal, joined Jan 2005, 682 posts, RR: 1
Posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 3350 times:

I recall Braniff flying a 747SP from Guam to LAX during their good times. I was wondering why CO doesn't do the same since they have so many connections out of GUM to places in Asia? Any ideas, comments, etc..?

LPLAspotter


Nuke the Gay Wales for Christ
46 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineDrerx7 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5173 posts, RR: 8
Reply 1, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 3333 times:

Shortage of widebodies
Low yield...though cargo might be good on it



Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
User currently offline2travel2know From Panama, joined Apr 2005, 3580 posts, RR: 4
Reply 2, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 3212 times:

I would like to see CO fly IAH/EWR-ANC-GUM. The cargo loads on such a flight may be quite good.
As for GUM-Mainland U.S.A. non-stops, maybe NW out of SEA or UA out of SFO?



I don't work for COPA Airlines!
User currently offlineThomasphoto60 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 3939 posts, RR: 22
Reply 3, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 3210 times:

Quoting Drerx7 (Reply 1):
Shortage of widebodies
Low yield...though cargo might be good on it

Didn't CO operate GUM/IAH via HNL (same plane) once?

Thomas



"Show me the Braniffs"
User currently offlineJmy007 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 598 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 3177 times:

Quoting Thomasphoto60 (Reply 3):
Didn't CO operate GUM/IAH via HNL (same plane) once?

Well according to Apollo, they still do.

WE 12JUL HOU / GUM Š15:00 HR
CO 1 J1 D1 Z1 Y0 IAHGUM 935A 530PŠ INTL CITIES UNAVL * 1
H0 K0 N0 B0 O0 V0 U0 Q0 I0 S0 W0 764



Cookies are the Gateway pastry. They lead to Éclairs and Bear Claws.
User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6745 posts, RR: 32
Reply 5, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 3069 times:

Quoting Jmy007 (Reply 4):
Quoting Thomasphoto60 (Reply 3):
Didn't CO operate GUM/IAH via HNL (same plane) once?

Well according to Apollo, they still do.

As I recall, that GUM-HNL-IAH routing (CO 1/2) generally involves a change of aircraft at HNL -- even though the flight number and aircraft type remain the same. GUM-HNL/HNL-GUM are "operated by Continental Micronesia."

Quoting LPLAspotter (Thread starter):
I was wondering why CO doesn't do the same since they have so many connections out of GUM to places in Asia?

If I recall correctly, much of the GUM flying is targeted to local O&D since GUM is a fairly popular tourist destination, especially for Japanese. It's not a terribly well-located connecting point from the U.S. to most of Asia when compared to NRT or SEL. With the two-segment IAH-HNL-GUM published as a single flight number, the connections aren't any worse in the GDS than IAH-LAX-GUM (or just IAH-GUM) might be, and U.S. Mainland to GUM would require the 777 instead of the 764.


User currently offlineETA Unknown From Comoros, joined Jun 2001, 2074 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 3052 times:

CO has the GUM-mainland market mostly to itself and with it- all the government travel. Therefore, there's no reason to launch a nonstop mainland service.

Those passengers not willing to pay the high CO fares usually opt for JAL to the mainland where the fare is usually about $300 cheaper.


User currently offlineMasseyBrown From United States of America, joined Dec 2002, 5403 posts, RR: 7
Reply 7, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 3052 times:

Quoting LPLAspotter (Thread starter):
I was wondering why CO doesn't do the same since they have so many connections out of GUM to places in Asia?

US-GUM-onward only makes sense if "onward" is in SE Asia. GUM is way off the great circle when NE Asia, where many of the GUM flights go, is the final destination.



I love long German words like 'Freundschaftsbezeigungen'.
User currently offlineCory6188 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2686 posts, RR: 6
Reply 8, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 3048 times:

Quoting ScottB (Reply 5):
that GUM-HNL-IAH routing (CO 1/2) generally involves a change of aircraft at HNL

Exactly - while the aircraft type doesn't change, the aircraft itself does. I remember coming off a CO flight from LAX in HNL, and the lounge was filled with pax and a crew heading to GUM. I guess that unlike the dedicated CO Mike 738's, the 764s rotate entirely throughout the whole system.


User currently offlineVega From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 3020 times:

Quoting ScottB (Reply 5):
As I recall, that GUM-HNL-IAH routing (CO 1/2) generally involves a change of aircraft at HNL -- even though the flight number and aircraft type remain the same. GUM-HNL/HNL-GUM are "operated by Continental Micronesia."

#1 and #2 are 767-400ERs operated by Air Micronesia and I believe are through - no change of plane flights with about a 1 hour lay-over in HNL(IAH-HNL-GUM).


User currently offlineLPLAspotter From Portugal, joined Jan 2005, 682 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 3013 times:

Quoting MasseyBrown (Reply 7):
US-GUM-onward only makes sense if "onward" is in SE Asia

That makes perfect sense. With Cairns and Bali being the only ones in that direction I guess I answered my own question.

LPLAspotter



Nuke the Gay Wales for Christ
User currently offlineCALMSP From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3939 posts, RR: 7
Reply 11, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 3008 times:
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the a/c for the HNL-GUM segment, changes almost daily, sometimes it is the a/c from IAH, othertimes it is the plane from LAX............or it very well might be the inbound from NGO, all depending on any MX issues or dedicated MX at a station for that plane.


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User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16858 posts, RR: 51
Reply 12, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 2941 times:

Guam's economy is getting a huge boost through Government spending, here's a few items:

1.) The US and Japan recently reached an agreement that will have 8,000 Marines leave Okinawa for Guam, when you factor in their Civilian dependents and civilian contractors who provide services to the Marines and families were talking somewhere between 15,000 - 20,000 people coming to Guam in the next decade from this move alone.

2.) The US Navy is bolstering it's position on Guam at Apra Harbor, they recently permantly based 4 Los Angeles Class attack subs at Apra Harbor which also brought their families and civlian dependents with them. The US Navy is looking to bring more assets to the Pacific, they want to permantly base a Carrier to either Pearl Harbor or Guam.

3.) The Air Force is constantly upgrading and expanding Anderson AFB, the base is now the permant home to an Air Wing which hosts Wings of B-2s, B-1s, B-52s and F-22s on a rotational basis.

All these Military facilities are seeing huge amounts of investments, with more on the way. The government and Civilian traffic to Guam from Hawaii and the West Coast is growing to grow tremendously during the next decade, at the least I can see CO adding a second daily Honolulu-Guam flight.

As for nonstops to Guam from the US West Coast, if the long rumored CO/UAL merger happens I can bet a nonstop flight from LAX, SFO or both would materialize.

Outside of a CO/UAL merger the 787 offers the best possibility to date for flights to Guam from the US Mainland.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineThomasphoto60 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 3939 posts, RR: 22
Reply 13, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 2904 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 12):
if the long rumored CO/UAL merger happens

Well, for one hope that this rumor remains just that, a rumor.

Sorry for the off topic post.

Thomas



"Show me the Braniffs"
User currently offlineYULYMX From Canada, joined May 2006, 977 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 2897 times:

Philippine ailines fly 747-400 SFO-Gum Nonstop before flying back home.. it is a techstop going west...

User currently offlineCoronado990 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 1597 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 2882 times:

Quoting ETA Unknown (Reply 6):
CO has the GUM-mainland market mostly to itself and with it- all the government travel. Therefore, there's no reason to launch a nonstop mainland service.

Those passengers not willing to pay the high CO fares usually opt for JAL to the mainland where the fare is usually about $300 cheaper.

I thought a foreign airline such as JAL cannot sell GUM-U.S. Mainland due to cabotage. Is that correct?



Uncle SAN at your service!
User currently offlineYellekc From United States of America, joined May 2006, 30 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 2833 times:

I fly between GUM and the US quite regularly, the cheapest method I found is to fly to Japan, which has tons of flights, and then get a round trip ticket out of there for under $800. A side benefit is I get to visit NRT quite regularly, that place is widebody heaven  Smile

A direct flight would be quite nice. IAH-GUM is 7446 miles, which is well within range of the 787-800. And with many more marines and their families moving there, a direct flight may be necessary.


User currently offlineDutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 57
Reply 17, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 2817 times:

Quoting LPLAspotter (Thread starter):
I recall Braniff flying a 747SP from Guam to LAX during their good times. I was wondering why CO doesn't do the same since they have so many connections out of GUM to places in Asia? Any ideas, comments, etc..?

LPLAspotter

I believe that the Braniff flight actually flew LAX-GUM-HKG....and I dont think that it lasted long enough for anyone to really notice.

I really dont see CO doing LAX-GUM nonstop......the current system works with the HNL stop; pax travelling to/from LAX and IAH make easy connections at HNL for the trip to/from GUM. And dont forget that cargo operations are a big part of this route.

As for CO setting up a larger hub at GUM to move pax to/from IAH or LAX and Asian cities, I dont think that much is gonna happen there either.....pax are really not interested in flying BOS-IAH-GUM-HKG, and those that would do it are lower yeild.

In the long term future, we could see an IAH-GUM nonstop, but for coming years, I dont see much change in CO's Air Mike operation.......is ain't broken, so why try and fix it?


User currently offlineCALMSP From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3939 posts, RR: 7
Reply 18, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 2749 times:
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a IAH-LAX-GUM routing would be nice. This would open up the opportunity to carry more pax/cargo on our IAH-HNL flight, along with frt on LAX-HNL. We ship a lot of cargo from Houston on to GUM, and many times, we have to split the plane with cargo on the HNL flight. 1/2 HNL frt, and 1/2 GUM frt. And of course, many times, flight 3 carries more than 50% GUM pax, tack on the 50% of pax that orginate in IAH, then maybe a LAX-GUM flight would be feasible.


okay, I'm waiting for the rich to spread the wealth around to me. Please mail your checks to my house.
User currently offlineAlias1024 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 2754 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 2712 times:

Quoting Cory6188 (Reply 8):
I guess that unlike the dedicated CO Mike 738's, the 764s rotate entirely throughout the whole system.

CO has a different configuration on the 764s that operate out in the Pacific. They are 20/236 instead of the 35/200 that is used for Europe.



It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems with just potatoes.
User currently offlineCALMSP From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3939 posts, RR: 7
Reply 20, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 2708 times:
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yes, all 767-400s are rotated throughout the entire system. We are now seeing the pacific configuration on our EWR-MAD routes.....


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User currently offlineCRGsFuture From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 536 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 2692 times:

But is there really a reason why one must go to GUM besides the Millitary? I really don't think there is a demand for it? I mean GUM has what maybe 5/6 Commercial Operations a day?


Flying you to your destination; your girlfriend to her dreams.
User currently offlineCALMSP From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3939 posts, RR: 7
Reply 22, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 2692 times:
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are you saying 5/6 flights a day??

traveling through GUM gets you to many islands that other airlines do not fly to.



okay, I'm waiting for the rich to spread the wealth around to me. Please mail your checks to my house.
User currently offlineJFK998 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 2687 times:

There definately isnt enough demand passenger wise on routings from the U.S. to Guam. Thats why no one started any flights with that routing as of yet.

User currently offlineCALMSP From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3939 posts, RR: 7
Reply 24, posted (8 years 1 month 2 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 2656 times:
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we can fill a flight with a routing of IAH-LAX-GUM..............but we do not have the plane to do so............we dont only ahve a one-stop through HNL, but also through NRT....there certainly is a passenger demand for a flight, along with a cargo demand.


okay, I'm waiting for the rich to spread the wealth around to me. Please mail your checks to my house.
25 Post contains links Yellekc : 5/6 flights a day? That's way off, there are far more commercial flights than that. The latest statistics from the GIAA (Guam International Airport A
26 Post contains images MasseyBrown : Manila, Cebu, Hanoi, Saigon (not even the Vietnamese call it HCM City), Bangkok, Singapore, and maybe Perth could work very well. CO just doesn't go
27 Diesel33 : CEB was once served and MNL is still served.
28 MasseyBrown : Thanks for the correction.
29 LPLAspotter : Those places were in the planning book before the Asian economic crisis. They, however, still fly to Manila (took it 3 years ago). LPLAspotter
30 ThaiAggie : TG used to fly from BKK to GUM via MNL with A300. It didn't last long though
31 AAL0616 : That Guam Braniff 747SP run was one of the bunch of very thin Pacific expansion routes that they started along with some very strange domestic routes
32 ScottB : Are you serious? * JAL (Actually JALways/JO) has a daily 747 and a daily 767 operating NRT-GUM, as well as a daily 767 operating KIX-GUM. * ANA opera
33 Tsnamm : Dont' forget CTS...we used to run DC-10's to most of these cities...we also used to have OKA too.. we added 2 other cities in Japan as well KIJ & OKJ
34 RoseFlyer : That isn't very useful. Only US airlines can fly passengers between two airports within the United States including its territories.
35 ScottB : Heck, the CO 747's were flying two daily GUM-NRT round-trips before they were retired! Plus, I forgot that NW is operating daily 757's to KIX and NGO
36 DxBrian : Guam is the closest US territory to Japan. Throw in the tropical weather and beaches, and you have a big tourist destination for the Japanese market.
37 Dutchjet : Dont forget Golf.......I recall reading that its not unusual for Japanese businessmen to fly down to Guam for a day to play 18 holes.
38 ScottB : I was just thinking that Guam is sort of like Aruba for the Japanese... Actually, my understanding was that it is less expensive to fly to Guam and s
39 Drerx7 : I would. It would have to be well after more widebodies come online. We'd probably see the 2nd flight from HNL that you postulated before LAX.
40 Humberside : Do NW have any flights to Guam?
41 ScottB :
42 Yellekc : Yes they do. Here are the daily flights I could find: NW 73/74 operates GUM-NRT with a 747-200 NW 23/24 operates GUM-NGO with a 757 NW 79/80 operates
43 CALMSP : either last summer, or the previous summer, we ran a 2nd HNL-GUM flight 2-3 times a week, (73 IAH-HNL-GUM) but I think that was before NGO came on boa
44 LPLAspotter : I went to Bali on vacation when living in PNI. On the trip back there were alot of Japanese tourists flying from DPS-GUM-Different points in Japan. Th
45 ScottB : Well, there's also a lack of non-stop service between FUK and DPS, so it's very possible that CS either offered the most convenient times or the best
46 Mitchell Gant : 1) Waste of a valuable widebody 2) CO already owns all of USA- GUM over HNL 3) Connecting traffic would only be a factor if GUM-Asia service was daily
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