Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
ANA To Commence Retirement Of 744s  
User currently offlinePanAm_DC10 From Australia, joined Aug 2000, 4162 posts, RR: 89
Posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 7987 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
COMMUNITY MANAGER

Tokyo, Japan, July 12, 2006 - (JCN Newswire) - The ANA Board of Directors today decided that the company will sell six aircraft from its fleet of 23 Boeing 747-400 jumbo jets to Avion Aircraft Trading of Iceland commencing next year. This aircraft is the largest of the ANA fleet and is used on both domestic and international routes, carrying up to 569 passengers in a domestic configuration. It entered service with ANA in 1990.

ANA's current mid-term corporate strategy for the fiscal years 2006 - 2009 (April 1, 2006 - March 31, 2010) encompasses the introduction of newer and more economical aircraft, such as the 737-700 series and 787, to secure better cost performance and raise ANA's competitive edge. The retirement of the 747-400 fleet is also part of the strategy, and will commence from 2007 at the rate of two aircraft per year.


The first 6 to go will be as follows;

JA8094
JA402A
JA8095
JA401A
JA8096
JA8097

Seems like they are going the same way as JAL and intend to operate smaller aircraft. Interesting they have not signed up for the 747BCF program and have instead opted for the 767BCF which they recently launched.

[Source: http://www.ana.co.jp/eng ]

Regards, PanAm_DC10


Ask the impossible to achieve the best possible
33 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineCentrair From Japan, joined Jan 2005, 3598 posts, RR: 20
Reply 1, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 7870 times:

Quoting PanAm_DC10 (Thread starter):
Seems like they are going the same way as JAL and intend to operate smaller aircraft. Interesting they have not signed up for the 747BCF program and have instead opted for the 767BCF which they recently launched.

I think it is actually the other way around. NH started first and JL followed. NH stated that they want to go with smaller aircraft. Much of the Asian regional flights are flown with 737s and 767s now. The largest aircraft in NH's fleet will be the 777-300 in short time. Much of the fleet will be medium sized and be able to do capacity and frequency in the region as well as on long-haul. It will be exciting.

Future NH fleet will be
737-700ER
737-800
737-900 (I think)
787-3
787-8
777-200ER
777-200
777-300
777-300ER

Three families.



Yes...I am not a KIX fan. Let's Japanese Aviation!
User currently offlineMBJ2000 From Germany, joined Dec 2005, 426 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 7816 times:

maybe we'll see ANA ordering a bunch of A380 at Farnborough?!

 duck 



Like most of life's problems, this one can be solved with bending -- Bender Unit 22
User currently offlineCloudyapple From Hong Kong, joined Jul 2005, 2454 posts, RR: 9
Reply 3, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 7788 times:

I'm surprised ANA is retiring B744s so soon. Japanese carriers tend to fly their aircraft to death. Both JAL and ANA have still got B741SRs, B742s for example.

Quoting MBJ2000 (Reply 2):
maybe we'll see ANA ordering a bunch of A380 at Farnborough?!

Fat chance.



A310/A319/20/21/A332/3/A343/6/A388/B732/5/7/8/B742/S/4/B752/B763/B772/3/W/E145/J41/MD11/83/90
User currently offlineTokyoNarita From Palau, joined Aug 2003, 570 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 7531 times:

ANA cannot ignore the economics and the saving it can attain by getting rid of the a relatively expensive B744s that are no longer new. Sure, ANA may lose about 40 economy class seats by downgrading the cities that are served by B744 to B773 for both domestic and international but I hear the cargo capacity on the B773 are respectable. The passenger capacity on B773 is plenty for the most of the cities ANA currently serve. In domestic configuration, the B773 carries over 500 passengers. The cost saving of streamlining the fleet with efficient common aircraft is just enormous. JAL will follow the same trend.

TokyoNarita.


User currently offlineAirFrnt From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 2826 posts, RR: 42
Reply 5, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 7475 times:

Quoting MBJ2000 (Reply 2):
maybe we'll see ANA ordering a bunch of A380 at Farnborough?!

Given that Airbus directly targeted the Japanese carriers as being prime customers for the A380, this has to be a bitter moment for them.


User currently offlinePavlin From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 7447 times:

[quote=Cloudyapple,reply=3]Quoting MBJ2000 (Reply 2):
maybe we'll see ANA ordering a bunch of A380 at Farnborough?!

Fat chance.[/quote

The A380 for domestic use with 853 passenger could be a hit.


User currently offlineBoeingFever777 From United States of America, joined Jul 2009, 409 posts, RR: 53
Reply 7, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 7390 times:

Quoting PanAm_DC10 (Thread starter):
Interesting they have not signed up for the 747BCF program and have instead opted for the 767BCF which they recently launched.

Could this be because they order the (7) 744F's and (8) 748F's 8F back in 05 and 2006 and are not needing BCF kits on these older 747s?

Quoting MBJ2000 (Reply 2):
maybe we'll see ANA ordering a bunch of A380 at Farnborough?!

Since their fleet plans call for so many long haul airbus planes i'm sure they will...

Wonders if NH is getting ready for the purchase of the 748 passanger and more 773ERs?



Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre.
User currently offlineDAL767400ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 7343 times:

Quoting BoeingFever777 (Reply 7):
Wonders if NH is getting ready for the purchase of the 748 passanger and more 773ERs?

More 773ERs, definitely. 748s, no, not when they are eliminating the 744 for fleet simplification purposes.

Quoting Pavlin (Reply 6):
The A380 for domestic use with 853 passenger could be a hit.

And the landing fees would be an even bigger hit  Wink .


User currently offlineManni From South Korea, joined Nov 2001, 4221 posts, RR: 22
Reply 9, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 7294 times:

Quoting BoeingFever777 (Reply 7):
Could this be because they order the (7) 744F's and (8) 748F's 8F back in 05 and 2006 and are not needing BCF kits on these older 747s?

You're confusing ANA with NCA. NCA is a cargo airline independent from ANA, ANA's cargo division is called ANA Cargo and only operates the 767F.



SUPPORT THE LEBANESE CIVILIANS
User currently offlineN328KF From United States of America, joined May 2004, 6485 posts, RR: 3
Reply 10, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 7260 times:

Quoting Pavlin (Reply 6):
The A380 for domestic use with 853 passenger could be a hit.

The fact that Japan, Inc. is using 777-300s in domestic configuration shows that they don't necessarily think they need it.



When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' T.Roosevelt
User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21531 posts, RR: 59
Reply 11, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 7260 times:

Quoting Cloudyapple (Reply 3):
I'm surprised ANA is retiring B744s so soon. Japanese carriers tend to fly their aircraft to death. Both JAL and ANA have still got B741SRs, B742s for example.

No, they are gone.

Now they are getting rid of the oldest 744s, which will be approaching 20 years.



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30992 posts, RR: 86
Reply 12, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 7199 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting Pavlin (Reply 6):
The A380 for domestic use with 853 passenger could be a hit.

It is looking like NH and JL just don't need that kind of capacity anymore. Between the expansion of the shinkansen train system and the sheer amount of time it would take to load and unload an 853-seat A380, it's probably faste to "next time, take the train".  Smile


User currently offlineCloudyapple From Hong Kong, joined Jul 2005, 2454 posts, RR: 9
Reply 13, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 7191 times:

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 11):
No, they are gone.

Not quite yet. Still seeing JAL 200s in Hong Kong often.

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Resocha




A310/A319/20/21/A332/3/A343/6/A388/B732/5/7/8/B742/S/4/B752/B763/B772/3/W/E145/J41/MD11/83/90
User currently offlineTitch From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2004, 328 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 7191 times:

Quoting Cloudyapple (Reply 3):
Both JAL and ANA have still got B741SRs, B742s for example.

Incorrect. Only JAL currently operate any of the 747 Classics. ANA retired their last -100SR earlier on this year.

Cheers,
Titch



I'll make weapons out of my imperfections
User currently offlineBoeingFever777 From United States of America, joined Jul 2009, 409 posts, RR: 53
Reply 15, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 7172 times:

Quoting Manni (Reply 9):
You're confusing ANA with NCA. NCA is a cargo airline independent from ANA, ANA's cargo division is called ANA Cargo and only operates the 767F.

KZ and NH are not own by the same party? If not then NH's cargo fleet is small.



Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre.
User currently offlineCloudyapple From Hong Kong, joined Jul 2005, 2454 posts, RR: 9
Reply 16, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 7145 times:

Quoting Titch (Reply 14):

My point was they fly their aeroplanes to death. If 100s are not active now they have been until recently. 200s are definitely still around.

Quoting BoeingFever777 (Reply 15):
KZ and NH are not own by the same party?

ANA sold its stake to Nippon Yusen.



A310/A319/20/21/A332/3/A343/6/A388/B732/5/7/8/B742/S/4/B752/B763/B772/3/W/E145/J41/MD11/83/90
User currently offlineBaron95 From United States of America, joined May 2006, 1335 posts, RR: 8
Reply 17, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 7062 times:

Quoting PanAm_DC10 (Thread starter):
carrying up to 569 passengers in a domestic configuration

Does anyone know what the maximum number of passangers (evacuation test, etc) the 744 was certified to? How about the 748 target?

Thanks.



Killer Fleet: E190, 737-900ER, 777-300ER
User currently offlineTitch From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2004, 328 posts, RR: 4
Reply 18, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 6847 times:

Quoting Cloudyapple (Reply 16):
My point was they fly their aeroplanes to death. If 100s are not active now they have been until recently. 200s are definitely still around.

Fair enough - point taken.

And, yes, you're right - the -200's are still around, but only with JAL. ANA do not have any classics left in the fleet. That's the point I was making.  Wink

Cheers,
Titch



I'll make weapons out of my imperfections
User currently offlineDeltaDC9 From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 2844 posts, RR: 4
Reply 19, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 6797 times:

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 8):
no, not when they are eliminating the 744 for fleet simplification purposes.

The 748 has the same basic engine as the 787, maybe that is simple enough.

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 11):
Now they are getting rid of the oldest 744s, which will be approaching 20 years.

20 years is a long time for a plane, makes perfect sense. But they still have decent resale value I am sure, maybe that is a consideration.



Dont take life too seriously because you will never get out of it alive - Bugs Bunny
User currently offlineDa man From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 887 posts, RR: 12
Reply 20, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 6770 times:

Quoting DeltaDC9 (Reply 19):
But they still have decent resale value I am sure, maybe that is a consideration.

Also, with the A380 delivery delays, they will be very much in demand with the airlines that have A380s on order such as EK, QF, etc.



War Eagle!
User currently offlineKtachiya From Japan, joined Sep 2004, 1794 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 6360 times:

Quoting BoeingFever777 (Reply 15):
KZ and NH are not own by the same party? If not then NH's cargo fleet is small

Well, BoeingFever777. In the beginning, NCA was invested heavily upon by NH. But it was never completely owned by NH. But NH did a lot of investment by giving them their retired classic jumbos, with the pilots flying them. Now, NCA is trying to become an independent company and are trying to build their own hangar at NRT.

NH indeed has a very small cargo fleet, but I think you can see it expand shortly.

BTW, there was a special corner for KZ in the aviation magazine of Japan this week. Its interesting. They are acquiring so many 747-400 and of course the B747-800. Once they do that, their fleet would be on average, 6 years!!! And in contrary to things that I've read on other forums, KZ wants to eliminate stop-overs in ANC to Europe (at least). They think that it would save money. On the other hand, I've read that the ANC stop makes cargo very profitable. Is it only me that's confused?



Flown on: DC-10-30, B747-200B, B747-300, B747-300SR, B747-400, B747-400D, B767-300, B777-200, B777-200ER, B777-300
User currently offlineWarreng24 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 707 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 6196 times:

Don't forget the MX cost reduction from going from 4 engines to 2 very reliable GE 90's.

User currently offlinePanAm_DC10 From Australia, joined Aug 2000, 4162 posts, RR: 89
Reply 23, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 6169 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
COMMUNITY MANAGER

Quoting BoeingFever777 (Reply 15):
KZ and NH are not own by the same party

That's right, as explained by others NH sold their equity in KZ.

Quoting BoeingFever777 (Reply 15):
If not then NH's cargo fleet is small.

True which would explain why NH recently launched the 767BCF program. As 787s come online they should convert some of their 767BCF options into firm conversions. Interestingly they have recently set up a joint cargo venture with Japan Post, amongst others, I feel that they may need more than just converted 767s to fullfill this requirement over the long term. Just a thought.

Regards, PanAm_DC10



Ask the impossible to achieve the best possible
User currently offlineBoeingFever777 From United States of America, joined Jul 2009, 409 posts, RR: 53
Reply 24, posted (8 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 5503 times:

Quoting PanAm_DC10 (Reply 23):
That's right, as explained by others NH sold their equity in KZ.

For what reasoning? They sold now they want to grow? Does not make business sense to me. If NH doesn't convert to the 767BCF would they look at ordering the 748F or 772F?

Thanks for the explaining all.



Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre.
25 Tom12 : I read in the wikipedia that ANA were set to become an all Boeing carrier. Why are they getting rid of the 744's when they still have that old SR?? O
26 MCOflyer : I agree with BoeingFeaver777, they need more than the 767BCF. If ANY GE 763ER comes onto the market, NH will pick it up in a heart beat. Did UPS dump
27 TL925 : NCA was originally a venture b/w several shipping companies and ANA, though ANA sold out their stake last year.I believe that ANA wanted to focus the
28 United Airline : JAL's B 747-400s will probably stay for a long time. And I think JAL will order the B 747-8 which is needed for many of their routes. ANA might order
29 BoeingFever777 : What about QF 763's what powerplant they using? Aren't they looking to unload some 767's when they start getting their 787's or will that be to far d
30 MDorBust : Given the prohibition against operating four engined aircraft at most domestic Japanese airports, I highly doubt it will be procured for that purpose
31 PanAm_DC10 : They sold out because they were entering into a new joint venture with Japan Post, Nippon Express Co. and Mitsui O.S.K. Lines Ltd. some of whom are i
32 BoeingFever777 : So they are looking to start freighter service not just domestic but on an international level then? where to the EU and or both North America? So yo
33 PanAm_DC10 : Not quite. Most of ANAs 767s are GE powered and with 787s due to enter service in 2008 why buy used frames when they can convert frames that they alr
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
United To Accelerate Retirement Of 727s posted Tue Dec 19 2000 22:32:44 by Trvlr
AZ - Official - State To Sell Part Of Its 49,9% posted Fri Dec 1 2006 13:06:33 by Ikarus2006
Possibility To Eliminate Language Of Aviation posted Sun Nov 26 2006 07:30:36 by Ptugarin
ANA To Introduce Business Class On 737/320 posted Mon Nov 20 2006 06:28:55 by Jimyvr
Eads In Talks To Sell Part Of Airbus posted Thu Nov 16 2006 07:41:00 by N1786b
Eads In Talks To Sell Part Of Airbus posted Thu Nov 16 2006 07:39:44 by N1786b
Emirates, First To Allow Use Of Mobile Phones! posted Wed Nov 8 2006 09:10:31 by QatarA340
Airbus To Dump 8 Out Of 10 Suppliers? posted Tue Nov 7 2006 03:07:16 by Dougloid
Retirement Of Lufthansa A300-600? posted Thu Nov 2 2006 18:59:55 by FlightLover
Northrop Grumman To Buy Shares Of Eads? posted Sun Oct 8 2006 16:52:52 by Columba