LipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 10935 posts, RR: 64 Posted (5 years 7 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 24012 times:
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Hi A.Net friends,
Let me give to all some fresh information on Varig:
1) Fleet Update
PP-VRJ (the last 777 flying) was really grounded on July 11. Also, two 737-400 (PP-VTM and PP-VTN) were grounded.
PR-SAF e PR-SAG will fly GIG-SJO on July 19 as their return flights. But they will return back to Brazil as GOL aircrafts (IIRC PR-GIK and PR-GIL).
The first 777 to be returned, PP-VRC, will fly GIG-MZJ on July 18, no info on its destination.
Two 752 will fly GIG-MIA (with stop probably at MAO): PP-VTQ and VTR
The two 738 (PP-VSA and PP-VSB) as per rumors could also take part on GOL fleet very soon. And a big one rumor... Tam could inspect today some 777 (including VRA and VRB) at GIG.
2) Auction Update
It has been postponed by Rio de Janeiro Corporate Court Judge from July 17 to July 18 due to the demand of a guarantee deposit 24 hours before the auction (and also, on July 16 a creditors meeting will decide if they agree with the conditions of the new auction and the offer made by VarigLog, so the competitors need one day to make the deposit and obtain a bank guarantee)
3) Routes Update
RG keep running the shuttle service with a single plane (last week they used 2), New York and Miami keep service at every 2 days (monday Miami, tuesday New York, wednesday Miami...) using 1 763 from EuroAtlantic (PP-VTC)
Frankfurt nowadays is a 10x weekly route due to the fact that they grounded the 2 777. London is not daily anymore, runs about 5x weekly (on Amadeus shows 1x with the leg to CPH and more 4x with final destination LHR). EZE is now a 2x daily (RG8640 that use to fly GRU-EZE is nowadays GIG-GRU-POA-EZE). Concerning to domestic, GRU-MAO service was downgraded to 4x weekly only and GIG-BSB-MAO to 6x weekly.
4) More Pictures....
Another sad view...
PP-VRC is the 777 behind two M11.
The 73G PR-SAG is the one with Varig, Varig, Varig
Grounded planes - another view
PP-VRF (w/o 2 engines), brother of PP-VRE grounded at JFK (w/o 1 engine)
Sad... really sad!
Felipe
New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
Flyingbabydoc From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 1, posted (5 years 7 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 23984 times:
Thanks again Felipe for the update.
When will this finally be over? As I mentioned to you before, my wife is booked on LH code-share RG in the beginning of September, and I am flying with a bunch of friends to meet her on Sept 19th. We are all LH ticket holders, but I feel a bit uncomfortable that there may be problems flying FRA-GRU and then on to POA.
I wish there was a clear cut decision soon. Bankruptcy or an effective change of hands (to an administration that would actually manage the company, not destroy it).
Thering From Brazil, joined Jun 2006, 530 posts, RR: 0 Reply 5, posted (5 years 7 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 23895 times:
Quoting LipeGIG (Thread starter): And a big one rumor... Tam could inspect today some 777 (including VRA and VRB) at GIG.
Considering that TAM's maitance centre in São Carlos is will now be able to work with Boeing planes, this may be true. Will be good to se a TAM 772, at least the birds won't leave Brazil.
Teixeim From United States of America, joined May 2005, 131 posts, RR: 0 Reply 7, posted (5 years 7 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 23776 times:
I'm not sure I understand why Varig continues to fly at this point except to sustain cash flow somehow.
Or, is there some legal obligation to continue flying, such as they lose their certification from Brazilian Aeronautica?
What is different in Varig's case from what happened to other fallen Brazilian giants Vasp and TransBrasil? I don't recall TransBrasil or Vasp hanging on this long. Varig's ordeal has been a train wreck in slow motion. Painful.
I hope someone in Brazil is working on a book about all this. I'm sure there's lots of info certain parties don't want us to ever know!
(/end conspiracy theory rant)
Leskova From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 6075 posts, RR: 78 Reply 8, posted (5 years 7 months 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 23549 times:
Today's FWV (Germany's premier tourism industry newspaper) newsletter included the announcement that RG is discontinuing GIG-FRA immediately... not a good sign... this way, FRA is down to 7 flights per week.
Donzilasse From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 237 posts, RR: 0 Reply 11, posted (5 years 7 months 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 23289 times:
The FF points are part of the legal case but with these new news does anybody really believe at this time that Varig will have any chance to even exist as a much smaller airline or will they be completely out of business within a month and maybe also create problems for Varig Log.
TAM eventually taken a couple of 777,s! That would be big news but I guess that they will need a few widebodies until they can get new ones from Airbus.
TAM is a class act and I just hope that they will continue to grow smart and take advantage of the situation after Varig but not start to run where not prifitable.
LipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 10935 posts, RR: 64 Reply 12, posted (5 years 7 months 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 23242 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW FORUM MODERATOR
Quoting Thering (Reply 4): So, now, wich is RG's flying fleet?
Hard to know, but it seems to be: 3 M11, 1 763, 8 733. An EuroAtlantic 763 is also used by Varig.
Quoting KrisYYZ (Reply 3): How come one of the B777s is without it's engine's? is the engines owner different than the airframes?
VRF engines are nowadays: one at VRJ and the other was returned to the lessor (of the engine) on VRE.
Two PW engines face problems and need to be replaced, and one has been returned to the lessor due to the end of the lease agreement, that's how there are missing 3 engines on PW 777-200ER RG fleet.
Quoting Teixeim (Reply 7): Or, is there some legal obligation to continue flying, such as they lose their certification from Brazilian Aeronautica?
Its a mix, they need to keep flying not to loose all credibility and also RG knows what happen to VP and TR that ground all planes and never return. Concerning to the slots, ANAC advised today by local press (O Globo) that RG will keep all slots/frequencies as they are under law protection.
Quoting Leskova (Reply 8): Today's FWV (Germany's premier tourism industry newspaper) newsletter included the announcement that RG is discontinuing GIG-FRA immediately... not a good sign... this way, FRA is down to 7 flights per week.
This is the third time i heard this, but due to the problems, RG pax nowadays are looking for other airlines. Very sad, and another problem for GIG as the airport is facing a strong shortage of flights due to the high demand (the airport become 2x bigger than 2003).
Quoting Canib7599 (Reply 9): Can anyone tell me what happens to FF points..will they be lost, or will they still have to be honoured by other StarAlliance partners ?
VarigLog, probably the company that will made the winning bid, guarantee the FF points. Even today you can book LH, LX and some other Star partners thru Varig.
Felipe
New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
RCS763AV From Colombia, joined Jun 2004, 3927 posts, RR: 15 Reply 13, posted (5 years 7 months 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 23096 times:
I feel very sorry for Brazilians. You must be feeling the pain to loose such an important airline, we also felt it here to, but in a much smaller scale, when we lost ACES. I just hope JJ and G3 pick up the slack and that the market doesn´t get flooded with a bunch of international companies, just like Peru, Ecuador and Belgium.
USADreamliner From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 14, posted (5 years 7 months 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 23092 times:
Just a simple question, sorry for my ignorance, but if RG survives, what it would be? Just a fraction of what it was? Can they compete with a stronger Tam and Gol in the future?
I guess RG can be saved, but for how long can keep flying?
I really believe that if RG miraculously survive, it will be transformed in a LCC or something similar. The int'l routes could be kept, but then it would take a good time for them to fly to all destinations again, because of aircraft (and money) shortage.
If JJ really gets those 777, where would they be flying to? Any ideas?
Legacy135 From Switzerland, joined May 2005, 1052 posts, RR: 34 Reply 18, posted (5 years 7 months 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 22815 times:
Quoting Teixeim (Reply 18): If Swissair with its ugly ending can come back to life as Swiss, why can't Varig come back?
Unfortunately Swiss isn't a reincarnation of good old Swissair. UBS, Credit Suisse and the Swiss Confederation bought Crossair from Swissair before they left Swissair finally go belly up.
On the legal base of Crossair they created a new company called "Swiss", using staff and airplanes of former Swissair. This can basically also be done in Brazil with Varig, but it's an extremely expensive way. In the case of Swiss it costed a total of 4 billions CHF which is an equal to about 3,2 billion US$. As Brazil has other airlines being capable to take over the Varig flights, I don't think this way as done in Switzerland would be necessary.
Still, it's a shame to see a reputed company as Varig going down the drain and this in such a painful manner, fighting with the dead for weeks now. But never give up the hope............ I keep the fingers crossed for all the Varig employees. Good Luck,
KL808 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 1570 posts, RR: 3 Reply 19, posted (5 years 7 months 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 22764 times:
If RG closes its doors, will their foreign slots be auctioned off?
If so don't they have valuable LHR and NRT slots that a lot of carriers would want. EK is one of those that I could think of, that would be interested on both.
In conditions to fly: PP-VRA (200ER GE), PP-VRC (200 non-ER GE, but it will fly to MZJ), PP-VRI/VRJ (200 non-ER PW)
Not in conditions: PP-VRB (200ER GE, missing one engine), PP-VRD (200 non-ER GE, to be confirmed but probably missing one engine), PP-VRF (200ER PW missing both engines)
If TAM get some 772, i believe it will be VRA/VRB and if they need 4 frames, VRE and VRF. Those four are the best (VRA need just some details like a few PTVs broken, few seats also broken, VRB despite the missing engine is perfect) aircraft RG use to fly (and mainly used on both FRA routes).
Quoting KL808 (Reply 20): If RG closes its doors, will their foreign slots be auctioned off?
That's a big Brazilian Government concern, they are trying to keep Varig flying to JFK, LHR and FRA where slots are very hard to obtain.
Quoting TR763 (Reply 16): If JJ really gets those 777, where would they be flying to? Any ideas?
Due to a better capacity, i believe to CDG. We could expect new routes to be announced, and with 4 772 for example, i believe MEX, more flights to CDG (TAM and Air France announced today they will improve their partnership and AF will provide connections not only to France, but also to other European cities, it could drive TAM to run a 3rd daily flight to CDG even a daily light using the planes that use to be parked during the day at CDG, and the plane nowadays used for GRU-REC flight. AF get connections to/from GIG in addition to the connections provided by JJ at GRU, now it seems more flights GIG-CDG are more clear). AMS could become a new JJ destination also using the 772.
Quoting KL808 (Reply 20): If so don't they have valuable LHR and NRT slots that a lot of carriers would want. EK is one of those that I could think of, that would be interested on both
I believe RG could sell (if they do not sold it) the slots at NRT, i don't expect a return during the next 2 years.
Felipe
New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
HALFA From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 1266 posts, RR: 19 Reply 21, posted (5 years 7 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 22549 times:
Felipe,
Thanks for the update. It's so very sad. A few questions.
Are there still a back log of people trying to get on flights out of GIG/GRU to the USA or are there enough flights and seats between the other airlines (AA/DL/JJ/CO/UA) to accomodate everyone?
Are the RG employees that are still working getting paid? I was under the impression that RG has no money. How is this being handled?
Thering From Brazil, joined Jun 2006, 530 posts, RR: 0 Reply 22, posted (5 years 7 months 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 22383 times:
Quoting TR763 (Reply 16): If JJ really gets those 777, where would they be flying to? Any ideas?
These 777s would help JJ a lot. If they get 2, they could improve the JFK and the CDG service. If they want new routes, than I see these 7772 flying to MXP, MEX and maybe FRA again.
If they get 4 777s, they could also improove the "existing" FRA, MXP and MEX flights and maybe get MAD or LAX.
Not forgetting, that all the 777s could fly also on the Southeast/Northeast routes, such as GRU/REC/FOR, GIG/FOR.. maybe GRU/MAO also.
Having 4 777s, they could even take one A330 to fly FOR/BEL/MAO/MIA once in a week.. Just thoughts..
Donzilasse From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 237 posts, RR: 0 Reply 23, posted (5 years 7 months 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 22294 times:
Thanks Lipe for the update! Let us know what you will find out about the 772,s and JJ. I will be back at GIG on August 12 with AA905 so I guess that I will see some leftover RG,s sitting there then.
LipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 10935 posts, RR: 64 Reply 24, posted (5 years 7 months 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 22278 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW FORUM MODERATOR
Quoting HALFA (Reply 22): Are there still a back log of people trying to get on flights out of GIG/GRU to the USA or are there enough flights and seats between the other airlines (AA/DL/JJ/CO/UA) to accomodate everyone?
Are the RG employees that are still working getting paid? I was under the impression that RG has no money. How is this being handled?
Hi Halfa! Nice to read your words. Hope you're ok!
Varig keep flying with one plane to MIA and JFK (so it become a 3x and 4x weekly flights to MIA/JFK , JFK/MIA next week), using EuroAtlantic 763 PP-VTC. TAM keep some available seats on the daily light, and American also, but CO and DL (DL informed last week that their flights GIG-ATL and GRU-ATL are running with loads of 100%, always overbooked) do not shows availability. RG is not a strong ticket seller nowadays so they just take 2 days of MIA and fly on a single day/flight.
Concerning to RG salaries, they are paying only for people that receives less than R$ 800 (US$ 350) or a fixed amount of R$ 800 for who keep higher salaries. VarigLog is helping RG to pay at least a part of their staff salaries.
I believe up to April or may they do not receive more than this amount which is very sad!
Felipe
New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
25 ANNOYEDFA: I can't believe people are still bothering to work there. What a pathetic shame.
26 Donzilasse: It is not exactly as easy as here in Florida to find a well paid job in Brasil.
27 Spartanmjf: From Varig's US website: "VARIG has reduced its flight operations until July 31, 2006. If you are traveling during this period, please contact our Res
28 UA777222: It's a little thing called ETOPS. Go baby go. Well when someone feels truly for their company and what they strive to provide, this is the end result
29 Arcano: A question (sorry if stupid)... What happened with the engines of those 777s? Why were them removed? It's like they sold them??? Regards )( Arcano
30 Planemanofnz: Very, very sad. I hope NZ fly to Brazil, and that Star Alliance carriers will up their services to this continent.
31 ABK777: With TAM's possible fleet expansion what would the possibility be that TAM would fly to LAX in the near future?
32 Antiuser: What I hear is LAX is a very real possibility for the future, but we all know how JJ is very conservative with their international expansion.
33 Kiwiandrew: engines are sometimes the property of a different leasing company from the aircraft - this can be a bit awkward for the owner of the airframe - if th
34 Varig_dc10: Does anyone know what will become of the MD-11 PP-VQF? varig_dc10
35 LTU932: Hello Felipe, It's sad to see what is happening to RG in recent days. I have a few questions though: In the case JJ acquires 2 or possibly for T7s, wo
36 LipeGIG: Never a stupid question! We are learning all the days in here. 1) VRA flying over Atlantic on January while running GIG-FRA face an engine shutdown -
37 Thering: Why so many incidents with RG's 772s? Lack of maintance? Or just coincidence?
38 LTU932: Thanks for the information, Felipe. From the looks of it, it could mean that eventually JJ might join SkyTeam eventually.
39 Hiflyer: Is it not the case that the main reason Varig is flying is money from Varig Log? I seem to remember reading that Varig Log is using the Varig certific
40 LVZXV: Cargo conversion for Aeroflot, probably in 2007. Best regards, ZXV
41 AlitaliaMD11: I was just thinking about if TAM where to obtain some of the 777-200's, could MAD be considered?
42 LipeGIG: Forgive my mistake. I was thinking about the one at BSB. Please see ZXV comments above (#40) This is right, they invested around US$ 13 million up to
43 CessnaLady: I saw and ex-Varig a/c at MEX today; It is currently at the apron of MX's maintenance base, being stripped off of its white paint and RG logos. One th
44 LJ: I think a GRU-CDG-AMS flight is more likely as I doubt GRU-AMS would do well (moreover as KL indicated they wanted to increase frequencies to GRU) an
45 EddieDude: Could it have been a 737-300 Marie? Maybe Aviacsa is the taker.
46 LTU932: If JJ was to start GRU-CDG-AMS, would they also get the 5th Freedom Rights RG used to have on that route for CDG-AMS?
47 LipeGIG: Both RG 73G are still on GIG and will be returned to the lessor (GIG-SJU) next week. They will fly for Gol. RG 738 (VSA and VSB) have winglets. So pr
48 LJ: However I vaguely remember that codeshare flights are also counted as "frequency". I remember that there were some problems as JJ intended to fly to
49 Ghost77: Hi CessnaLady! The frames you saw currently @ Mexicana are 03 B757-500s ex. RG. 02 of them will go to Avolar from TIJ and possibly the 3rd too which
50 Jog: TAM is actually "training" for a daylight GRU-CDG at the moment, however I think the schedule is not optimal with an arrival time at CDG of about 23.
51 LipeGIG: The reason was a bird strike at SCL on MVL while runing GRU-SCL. The flight SCL-GRU was delayed due to this (info is that both engines were damaged)
52 Jog: Thanks for the update, Felipe! And good to see that TAM's nicest aircraft is back at work (estimated arrival 21:05 at GRU).
53 Donzilasse: Lipe I read the article in Oglobo online today about the meeting among creditors at SDU. What is your take on this now?
54 LipeGIG: Donzilasse, foreign creditors (including GECAS, GE and others), their pension fund (Aerus), rejected the VarigLog bid. Now situation is even worst, V
55 Donzilasse: Do you have any idea what kind of expectations the creditors have if a bankrupcy. Would they have a chance to retrieve more on a bankrupcy then what t
56 Coronado: Good Bye RG. First Flight in 1965 on CV990. Last flight 1998 MIA-GIG on a 747. And in between a lot of great service. It is tough to get old. Airlines
57 Flyingbabydoc: Seems now that the end is unavoidable, Lipe... Sad. Any news on how LH will connect passenger @ GRU (ex: to POA or CWB) in the future? Obrigado, um a
58 Hardiwv: Indeed, without RG air ticket Brazil-Europe are sky rocket. There is room for at least another 30 weekly flights, which slowly are being filled by ai
59 Flyingbabydoc: Seems that the Judiciary power in the state of Rio might revoke the decision of yesterday's Meeting (i.e. against the VarigLog bid). More info under:
60 AutoThrust: I feel sorry for employees and company. I hope the can manage to revive it. However my favourite Airline in Brasil is Tam wich i wish all the best for
61 CessnaLady: Thanks to both! Any indication as to when will this decision be announced? (Couldn't open the link) Marie
62 C010T3: This is already being discussed in the following thread: Varig's Restructuring Plan Rejected
63 Alohajock: Thanks Felipe for keeping us updated on RG....Very sad indeed! I read that a US investment group deposited $24mil(US) on 18,July and promised to inves
64 AwysBSB: In my opinion, as RG seems to be more focused on GIG, LH and other Star members which serve Brazil should transfer from GRU to GIG a great part of th
65 C010T3: In a perfectly reasonable world, that would be the case. However, this is not the case at all, especially in Brazil.
66 Thering: Update: RG's operating flights today: Internatinal: GRU/FRA GIG/FRA GIG/GRU/MIA and GRU/JFK (these are operated by the same airplane (767 I think) on
67 FMAL: Does anybody have any information as to any aircraft repairs in order to put them back into service? Are there any scheduled work for RG planes that w
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