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Swiss To Lease 4 A 343 From AC?  
User currently offlineZRH From Switzerland, joined Nov 1999, 5566 posts, RR: 36
Posted (8 years 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 10483 times:

In the NZZ am Sonntag is an interesting article about Swiss that they probabely want to lease four A 340-300 from Air Canada from 2007 on. They say that this would be possible because of the better performing and the new agreement with the pilots. But they also say in the article that they have to stay realistic and that LH gives them a tight target regarding the figures.
If this became true this would be a huge step on Swiss' long-haul service, considering that this year they already will get two new 332. This would make 6 new long-haul aircrafts till 2007.
Here is the article (only in German).
http://www.nzz.ch/2006/07/23/wi/articleEBKO6.html

[Edited 2006-07-23 14:13:41]

[Edited 2006-07-23 14:14:44]

86 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineLegacy135 From Switzerland, joined May 2005, 1052 posts, RR: 26
Reply 1, posted (8 years 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 10455 times:

Thank you for the link ZRH! If this becomes truth, our Swiss aviation industry is definitely on track, including LX. The signs are good, lets keep the fingers crossed,

Cheers
Legacy135 Wink


User currently offlineEI321 From Iraq, joined Jul 2009, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (8 years 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 10391 times:

BTW, when do AC's first 777s arrive?

User currently offlineSwissy From Switzerland, joined Jan 2005, 1734 posts, RR: 4
Reply 3, posted (8 years 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 10367 times:

That would be great new for LX and us......... lets hope it will happen.

What I have heart last was early 2007 should be the time for the first AC T7

Cheers,


User currently offlineCruiser From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 1001 posts, RR: 7
Reply 4, posted (8 years 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 10329 times:

Quoting EI321 (Reply 2):
BTW, when do AC's first 777s arrive?

I believe they receive 8 next year with the first one arriving in March. So next year, we will see 4 300ER's and 4 LR's join the fleet.

I cannot wait!!

James



Leahy on Per Seat Costs: "Have you seen the B-2 fly-by at almost US$1bn a copy? It has only 2 seats!"
User currently offlineCV990 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (8 years 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 10217 times:

Hi ZRH!

Good to see you back! I want to use famous Martin Luther King words "I Have a dream!"...and my dream would be...seeing SWISS ordering the A350 during 2007 to start replacing the A330's and latter the A340s!!! That would be a great "dream"! But looking to the possibility that SWISS can get those AC 343's, at least give me a great sign that SWISS is emerging has one of the best airlines in the world, with a great network...like in the old days!!! I think swiss aviation deserve that and SWISS have a place for that!!!
I have now a schedule visit to Congo early next year and in my mind I said - "If this was a few years ago, I would certainly fly SWISS or Swissair...", I keep chasing this dream, to have SWISS flying all over the world again!
regards


User currently offlineBriboy From Canada, joined Jul 2001, 366 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (8 years 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 10174 times:

Yes, AC is getting 8 777s next year, see:

press release

and

press release

The first release gives 8 as the number of 777s for 2007, with the second indicating March 2007 for first delivery.

/Brian



next up: YYC, SFO, SYD, AKL, WLG, CMB, BKK, SIN, FRA, VCE, JFK
User currently offlineZRH From Switzerland, joined Nov 1999, 5566 posts, RR: 36
Reply 7, posted (8 years 2 days ago) and read 10108 times:

Quoting CV990 (Reply 5):
.seeing SWISS ordering the A350 during 2007 to start replacing the A330's and latter the A340s!!

Considering the time till the 350 will enter service I can see Swiss ordering them. Their 330/340 are not too old but in some time they anyhow have to think about the renewal of the fleet. But this most probably will not happen 2007 yet.

[Edited 2006-07-23 16:02:04]

User currently offlineCV990 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (8 years 2 days ago) and read 10096 times:

Hi ZRH!

Well, I understand your view and probably also SWISS view, we have SWISS A330's with about 7 years now and the A340's are even younger....but it will be a "hell of a great airliner" with SWISS colours don't you think???
Regards


User currently offlineZRH From Switzerland, joined Nov 1999, 5566 posts, RR: 36
Reply 9, posted (8 years 2 days ago) and read 10076 times:

Quoting CV990 (Reply 8):
.but it will be a "hell of a great airliner" with SWISS colours don't you think???

I absolutely agree with you. It would be great to see the 350 in Swiss colours. Let's hope so.  Smile


User currently offlineCV990 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (8 years 2 days ago) and read 10061 times:

Hi ZRH!

Don't worry, those guys will certainly order the A350!!! It's interesting to see that during all these decades swiss aviation and portuguese aviation have been quite close. It all started in early 60's when TAP wanted to buy two Swissair DC-8-30's....latter we got 3 of Swissair A330-200's ( by the way TP is very happy with these airplanes...), 1 A319 and 1 A320...all ex: Swissair. Now TP have an order for 12 A350's and I expect an order for SWISS A350 in the future!!! And we are both at Star Alliance!!!! Very interesting!!!
regards


User currently offlineZRH From Switzerland, joined Nov 1999, 5566 posts, RR: 36
Reply 11, posted (8 years 2 days ago) and read 10048 times:

Hi CV 990

You are right. It also will be interesting what LH will order. Perhaps they make a larger order of 350 for LH and LX.


User currently offlineCV990 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (8 years 2 days ago) and read 10008 times:

Hey ZRH!!! I'm counting on that!!!! TP got them, I'm sure LH/LX will need them in the future!!!! I hope those guys at LH/LX listen to you and me!!!! Even with all this "mess" and "noise" regarding the A350, TP NEVER even got close to cancel the order!!!! We have a great plane comming in I tell you!!!
Regards


User currently offlineYoungflyer From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 176 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (8 years 2 days ago) and read 10008 times:

Does anyone know if the leased A340's will be outfitted with LX's personal entertainment system? as far as i know AC does not have PTV's on their A340's while LX has AVOD on their A340's.
Dan



"An eye for an eye only makes the whole world blind" -Gandhi
User currently offlineZRH From Switzerland, joined Nov 1999, 5566 posts, RR: 36
Reply 14, posted (8 years 2 days ago) and read 9996 times:

CV990

BTW I like your username. My first flight as a boy was on a Swissair CV990 Coronado from Zurich to Athens in 1972. I was very impressed and remember the cabin as very spacious.


User currently offlineZRH From Switzerland, joined Nov 1999, 5566 posts, RR: 36
Reply 15, posted (8 years 2 days ago) and read 9984 times:

Quoting Youngflyer (Reply 13):
Does anyone know if the leased A340's will be outfitted with LX's personal entertainment system

I think this is not the question at the moment. It is by fare not yet sure that they really get those AC 340. When the contract is fixed we will see if they will keep the AC interior or change to Swiss standards.


User currently offlineCV990 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (8 years 2 days ago) and read 9984 times:

Hi ZRH!!!

Please...don't even talk about that...( just kidding of course...)! I remember well in mid 70's seeing EVERY DAY SR flying their SR690 LIS/GVA/ZRH with the good old Convair CV990 Coronado!!!! Just a great site at LIS airport! I'm sincerely glad that you ever had the chance to fly that great airplane. My first flight was indeed also with SR in 1979 but......it was unfortunetely HB-ISR, a DC-9-51 from SR too.
Regards


User currently offlineDeltaWings From Switzerland, joined Aug 2004, 1294 posts, RR: 17
Reply 17, posted (8 years 2 days ago) and read 9950 times:

What about getting their A340-500s? It may be a good addition Swiss' lonh-haul service.

DeltaWings



Homer: Marge, it takes two to lie. One to lie and one to listen.
User currently offlineHB-IWC From Greece, joined Sep 2000, 4496 posts, RR: 72
Reply 18, posted (8 years 2 days ago) and read 9923 times:

Swiss could very well do with the extra capacity to supplement existing longhaul service on core routes to daily service. Such daily operations are necessary to stand a better chance of attracting premium traffic. Longhaul routes lacking daily service include BKK, SIN, NRT, JNB, GRU, and, if they decide to keep it, LAX. MIA services will become daily with the addition of 2 A332 frames later in the year. As for NRT, LX has had the rights to operate daily services for about 3 years now, but have so far not done so.

As for future growth, I can see Swiss reopening the ZRH-IAD route, given the new UA partnership, and a return to China is very much on the cards as well. I've never really understood why they abandoned China at a time when other European carriers were stampeding for China rights in the first place.


User currently offlineSwissy From Switzerland, joined Jan 2005, 1734 posts, RR: 4
Reply 19, posted (8 years 2 days ago) and read 9907 times:

Quoting Youngflyer (Reply 13):
Does anyone know if the leased A340's will be outfitted with LX's personal entertainment system? as far as i know AC does not have PTV's on their A340's while LX has AVOD on their A340's.

Believe me if that deal happens they sure will get the "Swiss" interior as these birds still have the "old" AC color and look pretty tiered.

Cheers,


User currently offlineZRH From Switzerland, joined Nov 1999, 5566 posts, RR: 36
Reply 20, posted (8 years 2 days ago) and read 9896 times:

Quoting DeltaWings (Reply 17):
What about getting their A340-500s? It may be a good addition Swiss' lonh-haul service.

Why the A 340-500? I agree it is probably the best looking 340 but Swiss does not have these ultra long haul routes which would legitimate to buy these birds. All the long Swiss routes to SIN, BKK, NRT, LAX or GRU can be flown easily with the 340-300. The 340-500 is actually only a niche aircraft like the 777LR is.


User currently offlineKrisYYZ From Canada, joined Nov 2004, 1593 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (8 years 2 days ago) and read 9896 times:

AC is getting 5 B773ER , the fifth being leased through IFLC.

I've herd that some A340's maybe withdrawn from AC's fleet as early as Q4 2006. I'm sure that if Swiss get's the ex AC 340's they will want to significantly improve the interior. AC's A340 fleet was delivered between 1996 and 1999.



KrisYYZ


User currently offlineAirCanada014 From Canada, joined Oct 2005, 1513 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (8 years 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 9816 times:

Its nice to see fellow member star alliance helping one another. Lets hope Swiss gets AC A340s. Nice to see Swiss back on the right track. I wish them well  Smile One thing I'm so happy was Swiss joining Star Alliance, I remember long time ago AC and SR were a very good partners in the early 90s and late 80s too if I do recall?.. Its nice to see Swiss back in partnership with AC.

User currently offline747400F From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (8 years 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 9760 times:

I keep hearing that the AC 340 will be going to Europe, but Northern Europe ie. SAS

User currently offlineDutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 57
Reply 24, posted (8 years 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 9714 times:

My goodness, such excitement over four used airplanes?!

First, does AC own the four A343s in question? I thought that most of the AC A340 fleet was leased.

Second, why would AC lease the airplanes to Swiss? Thats an unususal financal arrangement and AC would probably like to get the A343s off of their books......I would expect a third party lessor to come in and arrange this deal, if its happening.

Third, what would LX do with two A345s? There are no existing or potential routes that would require that type.

---------

AC has a mix of A340-300 and A340-300X aircraft - I assume that Swiss is interested in the slightly newer 300X variants?


25 HB-IWC : Are the AC A343s even owned? If not, LX or SK or whoever were planning to get its hands on those airframes would be dealing with the respective leasin
26 RJ100 : According to my knowledge the aircraft are owned by ILFC. Regards, RJ100
27 Dutchjet : Well, now this is starting to make some sense.
28 Post contains images Solnabo : Wonder how AC 777 look in the famous toothpaste c/s? Maybe Kingfisher buys 2 A345 from AC. Time will tell... Micke//SWE  [Edited 2006-07-23 18:09:04]
29 Post contains links and images AirCanada014 : check out the pictures. Here's the other picture of B787
30 Post contains images Solnabo : I rest my case!!AC pics.... Micke/SWE   [Edited 2006-07-23 18:24:39]
31 CV990 : Hi! I sincerly think SWISS needs extra capacity, but I also agree with ZRH, SWISS doesn't need the A340-500!!! So SWISS can add those AC 343's ( I als
32 HB-IWC : As I said before, priorities should be to complement existing core longhaul destinations to daily service. Extra frequencies to NRT, BKK-SIN, JNB, GR
33 Ka : I think there are quite some people at LX wishing they hadn´t cancelled the remaining 3 options they held for the A343. They would come very handy no
34 Post contains images LTU932 : While I agree LX going for more A343 would make sense, I hear they have major problems with departing at MTOW out of ZRH, which is why, if I'm not mi
35 Skookum : I am terribly sad to see the A343 and A345 leaving the AC fleet in favour of the T7, and even more sad that we never saw the A346 in AC colours! I hop
36 HB-IWC : Never heard of such problems, and I am quite surprised to hear about them. Furthermore, earlier A343 operators into ZRH, including Cathay, Air China
37 ANITIX87 : There's no point in replacing them, for several reasons. 1) I love the A332, and if it got replaced I'd be very disappointed. 2) The planes are not o
38 Post contains images Skookum : Well, when you put it like that... Cheers Skookum
39 Dutchjet : I think that you need to get out more.
40 ANITIX87 : Obviously reason number one is because of me! I do get out more, my other loves are Concorde, A333, 773, A345, and 722. TIS
41 Dutchjet : You are unfaithful......I hope that you play safe..
42 Skookum : Good on you. Dutchjet, do you find it all that suprising that you may find some true airliner buffs on this forum? Cheers Skookum
43 Briboy : I think the key is availability. Where would the 333s come? AC is dropping them, but not this year, nor next. 343s are hard enough to get -- esp. 343
44 CV990 : Hi ANITIX87! I agree with Skookum.....the way you emphasise the love for the A330-200 there's "no way" SWISS will EVER get rid of those airplanes!!!!
45 LTU932 : It was something I heard on a Swiss aviation forum. Maybe I misinterpreted that or don't remember exactly, I read that a long time ago anyway.
46 ZRH : Actually they don't have any runway problems, the runways are fare long enough. But because of the slow climbing performance of the 343 they have to
47 Ka : Well, the last few times I flew on LX A343s it was full AVOD - and nothing less. Starting, stopping, rewinding films and music at any time. Not so on
48 Post contains images LTU932 : That's what I meant, the departure procedures after T/O. I never said anything about the runway length (specifically 14/32 and 16/34) affecting climb
49 Ka : Well, they take the same procedures as anybody else, too. The climb performance will result in a later or no direct routing - which is no different t
50 Post contains images ChrisZRH : there are no special procedures at all... just a normal takeoff with as much flexing as possible to get the plane airborne on the desired runway. a ve
51 FlyDreamliner : AC's interior is pretty trademark, I really doubt they'd keep that. Is there a market for ULH service for swiss? The A345 doesn't really offer a sign
52 Post contains images AutoThrust : Yes the A350 is the future i hope LX will order it sometime. They would be eyepopping to see them in LX livery.    Me to i would be very sad when t
53 Thering : Wich is Swiss long haul fleet today??
54 LTU932 : LX's longhaul fleet has 9 A343s, 9 A332s, 1 A300 and one 737 BBJII. The BBJII is operated on behalf of LX by Privatair while the A300 is operated by
55 Thering : Thought they had a couple os M11s yet...
56 LTU932 : Nope. The last LX MD-11, HB-IWE, was retired in October 2004.
57 Post contains images ANITIX87 : Oh, I do, don't worry I've been tested. I stand corrected, then. Did not know the IFE was different on the 343's. Have never had the opportunity to f
58 Canuckpaxguy : I knew AC planned to phase out the 343s, but I have never heard anyone confirm that AC was unhappy with and/or getting rid of their 345s for sure. Is
59 Post contains images Swissairtaz : If you want to know it, SR Technics "people" are trained a long time ago for the A340-500/600
60 Columba : I always wondered, too, if the big LH order will contain aircraft for Swiss as well or if Swiss is "allowed" to make its own decision regarding their
61 N1120A : That scheme has actually really grown on me. The E190 I flew with it looked great. This deal makes a lot of sense given that LX need aircraft and AC
62 Bennett123 : How would the A340-300 and A340-500 compare in terms of acquisition cost and availability?.
63 KrisYYZ : Don't forget that the A345's were pretty much acquired exclusively for the YYZ-HGK route. Maintaining 2 of a type in not very economical especially t
64 YULYMX : weren't they first routed on YYZ-DEL-YYZ first?
65 LTU932 : AFAIK, AC used to fly YYZ-DEL-YYZ with A343s nonstop, although there were tech stops in some of those flights. That was before AC rerouted YYZ-DEL th
66 HB-IWC : The nonstop YYZ-DEL route was operated with the A343, hence the frequent technical stops in ARN, although it is very well possible that the route has
67 AirCanada014 : It seems AC will be getting quite a bit of B777-200LR so we can see its possible AC will bring back the nonstop YYZ-DEL in near future. If AC does bri
68 Swissy : I hope not, at least not in the travel season............. Cheers,
69 Thering : They don´t have not even some A345 options??
70 YULWinterSkies : The illustration that the A340 is not as outdated as some would love to. And that second-hand A340s are not common. You don't find any of these in VC
71 HB-IWC : I would very much doubt so, as the YYZ/YUL-ZRH-DEL/BOM solution seems to be beneficial to both Air Canada and Swiss. Unless Swiss decides to go back
72 Knightsofmalta : Apart from the fact that they weren't making any money there...
73 HB-IWC : Well, if they weren't making any money there, while other European airlines were stampeding to get their hands on extra rights to fly to DEL - rememb
74 SR 103 : I flew MNL-HKG-ZRH a good number of times, the flights were always full to the brim, so I assume the payload restrictions were made on the cargo side
75 HB-IWC : Yes indeed, the westbound SR179 HKG-ZRH sector, as well as the westbound SR187/189 SIN-ZRH sectors were often problematic. SR would be forced to leav
76 Post contains links YukonTrader : Hi guys the only thing I recall was that some adjustments were to be made to departure routes and controlled air space regarding minimum altitudes and
77 HB-IWC : YukonTrader, thanks for insightful comments! As far as I know, there two airframes still have cabin layouts which are virtually identical to the Saben
78 YukonTrader : Hi Whiskey Charley, Hmm, here our sources seem to differ. For 2001 I do positively still have the same F12C49Y187 for all four ex LTU MD-11s in my boo
79 Post contains links and images SwissA330 : This is great news, glad they will be expanding again. Any news on what routes might be (re-) opened? I hope China will be in the focus again, maybe S
80 PM : Ten years ago I flew on a Swissair MD11 ZRH-KIX and it was full. Any chance of Swiss looking again at that route...?
81 HB-IWC : You are right about the cabin layout. What I was pointing at was that the range of the four LTU frames was not the same as the 15 other SR frames. SR
82 HB-IWC : I presume that a return to China is definitely in the cards. I don't believe in the chances of a return to Taipei though. Just like MNL, SGN and CGK,
83 Soups : try and find a seat to LOS/ACC virtually impossible
84 HB-IWC : You believe are return of Swiss to this route is possible? Wouldn't you think that it is more likely that Lufthansa would split the route and serve L
85 Post contains links Revelation : Sorry I cannot read German, but at the time I thought the issue was more economics rather than safety. As others have stated, A343s have operated saf
86 Soups : i flew SR 3 days after the crash of flight 111(i think), their flights were always full they added 2 extra weekly flights during the christmas period
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