Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
MH And Skyteam Latest...  
User currently offlineSQ452 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 1114 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 5005 times:

What's the latest on Malaysia joining an alliance? I know Skyteam and MH started talks but I have not heard anything since. You think MH would join that ASAP given the fact that you have TG, and SQ to the north and south in Star Alliance. Additionally, you have Changi and Don Muong as major hubs where as KUL isn't as busy.

not that I don't like KLIA airport, its beautiful, but I know when they built it their aim was to take away market share from places like SIN.

Anybody know anything???


SIN > CVG > BOS
47 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineZKNBX From New Zealand, joined Jul 2006, 464 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 4999 times:

I know that they are planning on code sharing and closer cooperation with AZ and KL and this has been announced only in the past week or so...

User currently offlineHB-IWC From Indonesia, joined Sep 2000, 4503 posts, RR: 72
Reply 2, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 4958 times:

The changes to its frequent flyer program Enrich as well as the reinforced frequecies on the KUL-FCO route and the ensuing closer cooperation with AZ on that route all seem to point to the fact that MH is enroute to Skyteam membership.

User currently offlineSQ452 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 1114 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 4939 times:

I hope it comes soon! They are mileage partners with DL, but...if you look closely at the restrictions, you get no miles for intra-malaysia flights, and...

no miles in economy class according to the DL website, you have to go J or F  checkmark .

[Edited 2006-07-24 11:47:37]


SIN > CVG > BOS
User currently offlineAA2MM From United States of America, joined Aug 2001, 119 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 4922 times:

This might not be current. A few years ago, my F travel could be credited to DL...and Y travel had to be credited to NW !!!

User currently offline9MMAR From Malaysia, joined Jul 2006, 2110 posts, RR: 18
Reply 5, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 4780 times:

Good day All,

I am also asking the same questions. Not too much information about this subject. Perhaps exhibiting not too much progress MH has made with Skyteam, (apart from the recently revamped Enrich Frequent Flyer Program to resemble Fkying Blue and the additional service to FCO from KUL by MH).


User currently offlineAeroflot777 From Russia, joined Mar 2004, 3007 posts, RR: 27
Reply 6, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 4675 times:

Quoting 9MMAR (Reply 5):
I am also asking the same questions. Not too much information about this subject. Perhaps exhibiting not too much progress MH has made with Skyteam, (apart from the recently revamped Enrich Frequent Flyer Program to resemble Fkying Blue and the additional service to FCO from KUL by MH).

Don't be too sure about that. Aeroflot had the same thing. Everyone was always clueless about Aeroflot's position in Skyteam, and then one fine day the executives were in Moscow, and the joining ceremony happened...MH will get there in the near future....

Aeroflot777


User currently offline9MMAR From Malaysia, joined Jul 2006, 2110 posts, RR: 18
Reply 7, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 4511 times:

Quoting Aeroflot777 (Reply 6):
Don't be too sure about that. Aeroflot had the same thing. Everyone was always clueless about Aeroflot's position in Skyteam, and then one fine day the executives were in Moscow, and the joining ceremony happened...MH will get there in the near future....

That is indeed a very good news for MH if it is happen in the nearest future. So there is no really an appoinment as associate airline, then have to wait for certain period (several months to years) and going through various assessments before being appointed as a full member.


User currently offlineB777-700 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 4480 times:

Quoting Aeroflot777 (Reply 6):
Don't be too sure about that. Aeroflot had the same thing. Everyone was always clueless about Aeroflot's position in Skyteam, and then one fine day the executives were in Moscow, and the joining ceremony happened...MH will get there in the near future....

MH won't be joining in the near future. The most I can say is they're attractive to SkyTeam. China Southern will be next, and after that, who knows?  Wink

How's LED man?  Smile


User currently offline9MMAR From Malaysia, joined Jul 2006, 2110 posts, RR: 18
Reply 9, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 4458 times:

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 8):
China Southern will be next

I can sense that too, based on the information on Skyteam's website. Nothing being mentioned abot MH in Skyteam's website. But as what Aeroflot777 informed, Aeroflot was appointed as a Skyteam member in a sudden. If it can happened to Aeroflot, it may happen to MH as well.


User currently offlineB777-700 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 4412 times:

Quoting 9MMAR (Reply 9):
I can sense that too, based on the information on Skyteam's website. Nothing being mentioned abot MH in Skyteam's website. But as what Aeroflot777 informed, Aeroflot was appointed as a Skyteam member in a sudden. If it can happened to Aeroflot, it may happen to MH as well.

Na...Aeroflot has been due for a while, and spring this year was always the target. CZ later this year / early 2007. Then...we'll see. I don't see another official member for at least another year. There may be an annoucement of an invitation before then, but the process can take almost 2 years to complete.


User currently offlineFewsolarge From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 409 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 4411 times:

There's invitation and then there's actual membership. Rumors aside, invitations are always sudden, because they like to make a media splash. Then there's the long process of safety and service audits and harmonizations. SU took practically two years to join, CZ is taking so long that they had to convince everyone in a separate press conference that it was still going to happen. Not to mention many invited associates but not a single associate member. So there are plenty of reasons for MH and SkyTeam to be looking at each other, but don't expect them to become a member overnight.

User currently offlineB777-700 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 4342 times:

Quoting Fewsolarge (Reply 11):
There's invitation and then there's actual membership. Rumors aside, invitations are always sudden, because they like to make a media splash. Then there's the long process of safety and service audits and harmonizations. SU took practically two years to join, CZ is taking so long that they had to convince everyone in a separate press conference that it was still going to happen. Not to mention many invited associates but not a single associate member. So there are plenty of reasons for MH and SkyTeam to be looking at each other, but don't expect them to become a member overnight.

Exactly correct. That's a perfect summation of the process.


User currently offlineZone1 From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 1035 posts, RR: 7
Reply 13, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 4324 times:

I don't think MH has signed a MOU with SkyTeam yet. I think we had at least a MOU before SU became an official member. CZ just signed theirs a couple of months ago. Hopefully MH will do this sooner than later. They would be a great addition to the alliance.


/// U N I T E D
User currently offlineSQ452 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 1114 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 4313 times:

In my opinion MH is about 5 years behind on getting into an alliance. Either oneworld or skyteam to compete with Star (especially with SQ and TG in their neighborhood).

I think it is absolutely invaluable for an airline to be in an alliance. All I know is, I like to go on airline I get miles on, and for example, since US joined Star, I fly them more because I get miles on SQ. If they were not in Star, i would not fly them...



SIN > CVG > BOS
User currently offlineCHANGYOU From Singapore, joined Nov 2003, 270 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 4266 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Someone wrote in another post that AF is reluctant on MH joining ST was because of AF-QF codeshare service to Aust via SIN. Apparently AF is very happy on the agreement with QF and letting MH into ST and concentrate on South Pacific will directly compete against the AF-QF codeshare flights.

User currently offlineHB-IWC From Indonesia, joined Sep 2000, 4503 posts, RR: 72
Reply 16, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days ago) and read 4192 times:

Quoting CHANGYOU (Reply 15):
Someone wrote in another post that AF is reluctant on MH joining ST was because of AF-QF codeshare service to Aust via SIN. Apparently AF is very happy on the agreement with QF and letting MH into ST and concentrate on South Pacific will directly compete against the AF-QF codeshare flights.

I cannot possibly imagine that Air France would be willing to block a major strategic decision such as the entrance of a major carrier like MH into Skyteam because it is unhappy about just one aspect of that deal. The AF-QF deal on CDG-SIN-Australia cooperation affects all in all 60 or 70 tickets a day. You don't let MH, and thereby the last chance for ST to attract a much needed partner in South East Asia, slip away over a futile detail like that.


User currently offline9MMAR From Malaysia, joined Jul 2006, 2110 posts, RR: 18
Reply 17, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days ago) and read 4189 times:

Quoting SQ452 (Reply 14):
In my opinion MH is about 5 years behind on getting into an alliance

MH faced several internal problems during the last 5 years, which results in its delay in joining any alliances. SQ and TG have surely benefitted a lot from MH's internal problems. It was after the new CEO Idris Jala took helm MH is seen seriously wanting to get into an alliance.


User currently offlineGneissGuy From Singapore, joined Jul 2006, 200 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 4161 times:

I guess one issue with MH joining any alliance would be its route network which seems to be less developed than its Southeast Asian peer airlines.

User currently offlineMAS747 From Malaysia, joined Mar 2004, 88 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 4161 times:

Less developed in what aspect GneissGuy?

User currently offlineGneissGuy From Singapore, joined Jul 2006, 200 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 4144 times:

Quoting MAS747 (Reply 19):
Less developed in what aspect GneissGuy?

I think in terms of connectivity they are ok with many important destinations in their network.

However, many of their international flights do not depart daily, thus frequency becomes an issue for successful interlining to take place.

e.g. KUL - AKL is 5x a week, KUL-FRA 5x, KUL-LAX 3x, KUL-EWR 3x, KUL-PAR 5x, KUL-ROM 3x, KUL-ZRH 3x.......etc


User currently offlineZK-NBT From New Zealand, joined Oct 2000, 5320 posts, RR: 11
Reply 21, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 4090 times:

Quoting GneissGuy (Reply 20):
I think in terms of connectivity they are ok with many important destinations in their network.

However, many of their international flights do not depart daily, thus frequency becomes an issue for successful interlining to take place.

e.g. KUL - AKL is 5x a week, KUL-FRA 5x, KUL-LAX 3x, KUL-EWR 3x, KUL-PAR 5x, KUL-ROM 3x, KUL-ZRH 3x.......etc

I agree.

The first 5 there, AKL, FRA, LAX, EWR and CDG should all be able to sustain daily flights with 772's or 744's.

AKL, daily 744's in Southern summer, used to be daily in winter until this year with a mix of 744's and 772's, they should be able to sustain daily year round flights, SQ have more than 1 flight to AKL.

FRA should certainly be able to sustain a daily flight, SQ have 2 daily 744's and MH can't sustain 1 772.

LAX is currently 5x weekly 744's via TPE, maybe they should change to a daily 772?

EWR well NYC is one of the largest cities in the world, I think MH should look at going via ZRH or something here and increasing flights, are they allowed? Then they could also increase flights to ZRH aswell.

CDG, the French Goverment are blocking MH from operating daily flights, they currently operate 772's, but a daily flight would probably increase yeilds and obvioulsy offer more convienient connections.

FCO is increasing to 5 weekly, not sure what aircraft.

Basically I compare MH to SQ because their respective hubs are so close to each other yet SQ are one of the best and MH well they could be one of the best, I think alot of their problems are due poor management and flying some routes for Prestiege rather than demand.

Maybe they need to reinstall F into some 772's aswell for some longer thinner routes with high yeilds.


User currently onlineL410Turbolet From Czech Republic, joined May 2004, 5697 posts, RR: 18
Reply 22, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 4074 times:

Quoting CHANGYOU (Reply 15):
Someone wrote in another post that AF is reluctant on MH joining ST was because of AF-QF codeshare service to Aust via SIN. Apparently AF is very happy on the agreement with QF and letting MH into ST and concentrate on South Pacific will directly compete against the AF-QF codeshare flights.

The other reason presented was that AF is basically waiting for TG to leave the STAR and "defect" for SkyTeam - with MH joining SkyTeam this less likely to happen. I mean how long are they going to wait before - if ever - TG makes up its mind and will they rather keep their coverage of the SE Asian/Australia-Pacific region subpar in comparison with OW or Star?
It's hard to separate rumors from credible info. Other stories I've heard and read on different aviation forums was that SU was basically admitted to SkyTeam purely on political grounds, compliance with safety/quality standards was not really releveant and apparently again AF was the force pushing for SU.
I just have hard time believing the AF runs the SkyTeam and the remaining 7 airlines just sit there and let this happen against their will.


User currently offlineSQ452 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 1114 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 3986 times:

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 22):
The other reason presented was that AF is basically waiting for TG to leave the STAR and "defect" for SkyTeam - with MH joining SkyTeam this less likely to happen

Where did you hear this rumor? I'd be shocked if TG left star, they were one of the founding members! TG I don't think could afford to leave Star in particular with the new airport opening up in BKK. Pure rumor I think...I'd bet money on it that TG isn't going anywhere.

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 22):
I mean how long are they going to wait before - if ever - TG makes up its mind and will they rather keep their coverage of the SE Asian/Australia-Pacific region subpar in comparison with OW or Star?

i guess you mean MH being subpar???



SIN > CVG > BOS
User currently offlineHB-IWC From Indonesia, joined Sep 2000, 4503 posts, RR: 72
Reply 24, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 3957 times:

Quoting GneissGuy (Reply 20):
However, many of their international flights do not depart daily, thus frequency becomes an issue for successful interlining to take place.



Quoting ZK-NBT (Reply 21):
The first 5 there, AKL, FRA, LAX, EWR and CDG should all be able to sustain daily flights with 772's or 744's.

AKL, daily 744's in Southern summer, used to be daily in winter until this year with a mix of 744's and 772's, they should be able to sustain daily year round flights, SQ have more than 1 flight to AKL.

FRA should certainly be able to sustain a daily flight, SQ have 2 daily 744's and MH can't sustain 1 772.

LAX is currently 5x weekly 744's via TPE, maybe they should change to a daily 772?

EWR well NYC is one of the largest cities in the world, I think MH should look at going via ZRH or something here and increasing flights, are they allowed? Then they could also increase flights to ZRH aswell.

CDG, the French Goverment are blocking MH from operating daily flights, they currently operate 772's, but a daily flight would probably increase yeilds and obvioulsy offer more convienient connections.

FCO is increasing to 5 weekly, not sure what aircraft.

I agree that MH has issues with the frequencies of its longhaul flights, yet they are supposedly working on that.

As for Europe, it is MH's stated objective to focus on the Skyteam hubs AMS, CDG and FCO, apart from the obvious LHR. MAN and VIE were recently closed and FRA was reduced from daily to 5 weekly. I don't think that FRA and ZRH have a lot of future as part of MH's network.

MH is striving for daily frequencies into CDG - currently blocked by the French government but undoubtedly becoming available if and when MH enter Skyteam - and FCO, where they are about to up the frequency to 5 weekly. There is talk about additional frequencies into AMS.

The North American component of the MH network is problematic indeed. LAX should be able to sustain daily frequencies, and, as for EWR, something needs to be done there as the flight is ill-timed ex KUL. Maybe MH is thinking about rerouting this flight through AMS.

Apart from Europe and North America, the less than daily service of many destinations in the longhaul network is far from optimal when it comes to creating high yielding traffic, but I don't see how other Skyteam members could have issues with that.

So, while MH does have issued to deal with pertaining to scheduling, I believe that their most recent moves in that domain are meant to accomodate rather than irritate the airlines belonging to Skyteam. As such, I see this as an indicator that Skyteam membership is on the horizon.


25 ZK-NBT : Thanks for that HB-IWC. It would be sad indeed if MH were to drop FRA and ZRH but thats life in the aviation world. Yes I remeber reading that in anot
26 L410Turbolet : I think it was actually a.net...!? What I was trying to say was that currently SkyTeam is super strong in its coverage of the Europe-North America ro
27 9MMAR : are some information that I have gathered about the procedure in becomming a full member. However, given many incoming rumours like is dizzying. Rega
28 L410Turbolet : I know. It's obvious just from looking on their network. I just don't understand why finding solution for this obvious handicap of the SkyTeam was no
29 B777-700 : I've heard that too and let me squash that rumor. The odds of that happening are practically nill, when you consider the logistics. Also, Thai does n
30 9MMAR : The followings are the international destinations that could be included in Skyteam's coverage should MH become a full member: Perth, Australia Melbou
31 KEno : MH is not part of any alliance now, so there's no pressing need to have ideal connectivity with other airlines. However, should Skyteam membership ma
32 HB-IWC : Chengdu and Hyderabad are already served by KLM, whereas Air France serves Bangalore. Chennai is currently served by Delta and Air France will take o
33 Odie : ZRH will still be around for Northern Winter 2006/2007, so is ARN and FRA. Recently, the Swiss Economics Minister had asked MH not only to keep ZRH,
34 HB-IWC : It never ceases to amaze me how EZE and the exotic KUL-JNB-CPT-EZE route manages to keep escaping the axe. This route is a treasure for frequent flye
35 MAS777 : This was the original plan when KLM-NWA-MAS applied for antitrust immunity from the US DoT. Kuala Lumpur, Narita and Amsterdam were going to be hubs
36 Pers : Remember, there are a lot of people of Malay descent living in the Cape Town area, Johannesburg is the commercial hub as well. My partner and I have f
37 9MMAR : I compared the Skyteam's route map in their website with MH's destinations. Looks like their website was not updated.
38 RobertS975 : As for the timing of eventual SkyTeam membership for MH, don't anyone hold your breath. China Southern was announced in 2004 and they are still not fi
39 B777-700 : Associate members. Think of it as a glorified codeshare. Slowing things down is the financial situation of three of the members. That aside, there ar
40 HB-IWC : That is very honorable, and I dare say that, in terms of quality, Skyteam should not have any fears of MH, which has absolutely no problem outperform
41 787KQ : That's exactly how I think of the full members of the alliance too. Little difference.
42 B777-700 : That really doesn't have much to do with it. MH is very attractive to ST, but that's all their is right now. The whole process can take years. It's a
43 787KQ : Since apparently you know better, what are those differences? Or is yours just another smug...and useless comment.
44 B777-700 : If we're talking about inner workings in an alliance between full-on menbers and associate members, the difference has everything to do with voting r
45 787KQ : I suggest you check out other threads on the differences between associate and full members here on A-net. The bottom line is that there is no practi
46 B777-700 : Haha, I don't need to refer to this fountain of misinformation when I can talk to SkyTeam people personally. Further, last I checked, I was never tal
47 787KQ : Refer to some unseen authority about facts to which only you are privy but A-net members are gas bags without facts. Hmmmm. References to your commen
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
MH And/or EK To Join Skyteam? posted Tue Dec 7 2004 17:06:10 by AeroAussie
Explosive Sniffer Dogs And The Latest Threat posted Thu Aug 10 2006 22:36:14 by Axio
MEA And SkyTeam - Update? posted Tue Jun 6 2006 22:47:12 by B742
AMS And SkyTeam posted Thu Jun 9 2005 17:55:41 by MauriceB
One World And Skyteam Liveries posted Wed Mar 23 2005 11:16:19 by RootsAir
Malaysian Airlines And Skyteam posted Tue Mar 15 2005 10:29:47 by Star_member
Aeroflot And Skyteam posted Sat Feb 19 2005 05:32:33 by Hjulicher
NWA And SkyTeam Logo posted Fri Feb 11 2005 22:32:00 by Dmt52
DL's New Pricing And SkyTeam posted Tue Jan 4 2005 20:42:52 by Ssides
MH And KE Build Partnership posted Thu Oct 21 2004 00:58:00 by Mas777