SQ452 From United States, joined Apr 2004, 1015 posts, RR: 0 Posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 5659 times:
I'm surprised that DL hasn't added more int'l flights to Europe out of CVG since they decided to go on a spree at JFK and ATL with new routes.
It looked like they were going to cut down some of their transcon services with the realignment of aircraft to JFK and ATL, but I am looking in the schedule and I see LGW, AMS, FCO, and FRA are all still there with 767's, and in the fall/early winter CDG will be operated by AF with a 330-200.
What surprised me more is that DL will be on the route too with a 777, which kind of surprised me given that they are going to need these for TLV, other routes, etc.
Any plan on DL adding more transcons from CVG as part of its international growth projection??? I know we've got Carribean service expanding, but seeing something new for a change would be nice.
DAL767400ER From Germany, joined Feb 2005, 5434 posts, RR: 48 Reply 1, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 5649 times:
Quoting SQ452 (Thread starter): I'm surprised that DL hasn't added more int'l flights to Europe out of CVG since they decided to go on a spree at JFK and ATL with new routes.
There's two major reasons for that: JFK has the O&D to support the flights, and ATL has the feed. CVG doesn't have either. Except FRA and LGW, where DL has traditionally had a rather big presence, the other cities are Skyteam hubs. If it weren't for that fact, neither FCO nor AMS would be there, and CDG would not be a 777.
Quoting SQ452 (Thread starter): What surprised me more is that DL will be on the route too with a 777, which kind of surprised me given that they are going to need these for TLV, other routes, etc.
ATL-DKR-JNB will be operated with 763ERs, so that's 2 777s that can be used for other routes, including CVG-CDG.
Quoting SQ452 (Thread starter): Any plan on DL adding more transcons from CVG as part of its international growth projection???
Delta already serves all larger MSAs with transcon service from CVG.
Quoting SQ452 (Thread starter): I know we've got Carribean service expanding, but seeing something new for a change would be nice.
Don't expect much. DL could add a few 1-3x weekly routes in Mexico or the Caribbean, or another Canadian city (IIRC they'll add CVG-YOW soon), but other than that, their primary international focus is on ATL, JFK and to a lesser degree LAX and SLC.
Mason747 From United States, joined Jul 2006, 44 posts, RR: 0 Reply 2, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 5490 times:
Cincinnati is located some 300+ miles south of Chicago and not terribly far from Atlanta. The market for these kinds of flights arent strong enough at CVG.
Boeing7E7 From , joined today!, posts, RR: Reply 3, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 5413 times:
Quoting Mason747 (Reply 2): Cincinnati is located some 300+ miles south of Chicago and not terribly far from Atlanta. The market for these kinds of flights arent strong enough at CVG.
Not to mention the Skyteam alliance with NW at MSP and DTW serving the same destinations.
Unless something has changed since the press releases, I believe that you are mistaken. The official word from Delta was that Accra will be 767-300ER while JNB will be a 777.
MAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 22591 posts, RR: 66 Reply 5, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 5308 times:
Quoting WorldXplorer (Reply 4): Unless something has changed since the press releases, I believe that you are mistaken. The official word from Delta was that Accra will be 767-300ER while JNB will be a 777.
Something has indeed changed, and its called JFK-BOM. 763 for JNB and DKR.
Jbmitt From United States, joined Jan 2002, 391 posts, RR: 1 Reply 6, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 5308 times:
ATL to DKR & JNB was announced as a 772, the consensus was that a 763 can make it with the stop. The 772 can't make it non-stop either, so they are using the 763. I checked Delta.com and it does show the 763 out of ATL and the seat map matches the 763. They may have changed it, after deciding to to fly the JFK-BOM route which requires the range.
Panamair From United States, joined Oct 2001, 2957 posts, RR: 16 Reply 7, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 5308 times:
Quoting WorldXplorer (Reply 4): Unless something has changed since the press releases, I believe that you are mistaken. The official word from Delta was that Accra will be 767-300ER while JNB will be a 777
Yes, something has changed since the press releases - the introduction of the JFK-BOM nonstop in November which has made it necessary to pull the 777 off ATL-DKR-JNB.
If you check the schedules and all reservations systems, DL 34/35 between ATL and DKR/JNB will now be a 763ER.
WorldXplorer From United States, joined Feb 2005, 381 posts, RR: 0 Reply 8, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 5226 times:
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 5): Something has indeed changed, and its called JFK-BOM. 763 for JNB and DKR.
Quoting Panamair (Reply 7): Yes, something has changed since the press releases - the introduction of the JFK-BOM nonstop in November which has made it necessary to pull the 777 off ATL-DKR-JNB.
SLCUT2777 From United States, joined Dec 2005, 3509 posts, RR: 8 Reply 9, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 5169 times:
Quoting Panamair (Reply 7): Yes, something has changed since the press releases - the introduction of the JFK-BOM nonstop in November which has made it necessary to pull the 777 off ATL-DKR-JNB.
If you check the schedules and all reservations systems, DL 34/35 between ATL and DKR/JNB will now be a 763ER.
Until DL gains some additional 772s sometime in late 2007 or more likely 2008.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
SLCUT2777 From United States, joined Dec 2005, 3509 posts, RR: 8 Reply 10, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 5138 times:
Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 1): Don't expect much. DL could add a few 1-3x weekly routes in Mexico or the Caribbean, or another Canadian city (IIRC they'll add CVG-YOW soon), but other than that, their primary international focus is on ATL, JFK and to a lesser degree LAX and SLC.
Both CVG and SLC suffer from a similar problem as DL hubs; Not having very high O&D numbers. This is largely due to being "small market" metro-areas when compared to places like NYC-JFK or LAX, the later being discussed in another thread about being Delta's trans-Pacific route hub just as JFK is for the trans-Atlantic routes.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
RwSEA From United States, joined Jan 2005, 2234 posts, RR: 2 Reply 11, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 5069 times:
Quoting Jbmitt (Reply 6): ATL to DKR & JNB was announced as a 772, the consensus was that a 763 can make it with the stop. The 772 can't make it non-stop either, so they are using the 763. I checked Delta.com and it does show the 763 out of ATL and the seat map matches the 763. They may have changed it, after deciding to to fly the JFK-BOM route which requires the range.
I think starting this route with a 763 makes a lot of sense. It can always be upgraded to a 764 if the needs warrant. Additionally, they might be able to rotate in 777's over busy periods if there are any remaining 777's on European routes.
Quoting SQ452 (Thread starter): It looked like they were going to cut down some of their transcon services with the realignment of aircraft to JFK and ATL, but I am looking in the schedule and I see LGW, AMS, FCO, and FRA are all still there with 767's, and in the fall/early winter CDG will be operated by AF with a 330-200.
For a hub and a city of its size, CVG is well-served. While CVG and it's feed can support the major destinations (LGW, FRA, CDG, AMS, FCO), it couldn't support say a SVO or even BRU or ZHR.
Thegooddoctor From United States, joined Nov 2005, 478 posts, RR: 1 Reply 12, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 5037 times:
Quoting SQ452 (Thread starter): I'm surprised that DL hasn't added more int'l flights to Europe out of CVG since they decided to go on a spree at JFK and ATL with new routes.
...maybe because Delta finally figured out that not only does CVG serve Ohio (the other white meat), but that their O&D and connex clientele out/through other hubs is probably much greater.
Yeah, I'm not a fan of Ohio, and please no comments about CVG also serving northern Kentucky... Gimme a break?
SLCUT2777 From United States, joined Dec 2005, 3509 posts, RR: 8 Reply 13, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 4994 times:
Quoting Thegooddoctor (Reply 12): Yeah, I'm not a fan of Ohio, and please no comments about CVG also serving northern Kentucky... Gimme a break?
Please don't tempt me to insert an "F" in place of a "T" in Kentucky as Bobby Knight reportedly once did in one of his many tirades during a press conference!
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
MAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 22591 posts, RR: 66 Reply 14, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 4931 times:
Quoting RwSEA (Reply 11): it couldn't support say a SVO or even BRU or ZHR.
Funny you chose ZRH and BRU. Delta has flown CVG-ZRH in the past, as well as CVG-MUC. Sabena flew CVG-BRU with a 747-300, and it was one of their most profitable trans-Atlantic routes.
RwSEA From United States, joined Jan 2005, 2234 posts, RR: 2 Reply 15, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 4889 times:
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 14): Funny you chose ZRH and BRU. Delta has flown CVG-ZRH in the past, as well as CVG-MUC. Sabena flew CVG-BRU with a 747-300, and it was one of their most profitable trans-Atlantic routes.
Yeah, they worked all right when they fed alliance partners. CVG was also a lot larger hub back then as well. Obviously these can't survive on a standalone basis without all that extra feed on both sides, as they are no longer in operation.
MalpensaSFO From , joined today!, posts, RR: Reply 16, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 4826 times:
Quoting WorldXplorer (Reply 4): Unless something has changed since the press releases, I believe that you are mistaken. The official word from Delta was that Accra will be 767-300ER while JNB will be a 777.
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