Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Upper Deck Windows On The First 747  
User currently offlineDuke From Canada, joined Sep 1999, 1155 posts, RR: 2
Posted (8 years 5 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 7762 times:

N7470, the first Boeing 747, was built with the original configuration of three upper deck windows on each side.

Now look at these pictures:


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Gerard Helmer


In 1982, the plane has the full 10 upper deck windows, at least on the side taken in this photograph.


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Joe G. Walker


But here in 1995, it is once again with three windows on that side!


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Ryan J. Pearl


This more recent picture from 2004 confirms the three windows on the other side.

So what did they do to this plane? Did they install the ten windows on just one side or on both, and why did they plug them? Or did they rebuild it in the original skin configuration? I can't seem to see any plugs in the large version of the photo above.

11 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineSkymonster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (8 years 5 months 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 7705 times:

They painted the extra windows on the side to make it appear like it had extra upper deck windows. Check the top photo. The real windows are covered over (like the lower deck windows) whereas the black paint is left as it is. From some angles, if you look closely at #1 in BFI today, you can still just about make out where the extra "windows" were painted on.

Andy


User currently offlineDuke From Canada, joined Sep 1999, 1155 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (8 years 5 months 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 7609 times:

I see. These confusions abound in plane spotting...

User currently offlineFalstaff From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 6170 posts, RR: 29
Reply 3, posted (8 years 5 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 7439 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting Skymonster (Reply 1):
They painted the extra windows on the side to make it appear like it had extra upper deck windows.

Why would they paint on windows? That seems kind of silly to go through the hastle of painting. It reminds me of people who stick dual exhuast on their car, but really on have a single or have hood scoops going to nothing.



My mug slaketh over on Falstaff N503
User currently offlineDtwclipper From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (8 years 5 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 7409 times:

Quoting Falstaff (Reply 3):
Why would they paint on windows?

I suspect as a marketing technique.

It's also worth noting, that Capitol, LY and BN, for example, painted the windows of their DC-4's with a square outline, so that people would think they were the more modern DC-6.

Look closely at this Capitol DC-4 and not the square outlines on the oval windows!

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Mel Lawrence




Same thing on Trans Carib!

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Mel Lawrence



User currently offlineEGNR From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2004, 513 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (8 years 5 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 7367 times:

Quoting Dtwclipper (Reply 4):
Quoting Falstaff (Reply 3):
Why would they paint on windows?

I suspect as a marketing technique.

It may have been to highlight the option for 10 windows...

In a similar vein, A340-600 F-WWCA (owned by Airbus) has a painted on overwing exit. This aircraft was constructed without the exit, and can therefore not go into passenger service. But when Airbus revised their house livery, they painted on the overwing exit to make it look like all other A346s.


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Kristof Jonckheere
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Belpix - AirTeamImages




7late7, A3latey, Sukhoi Superlate... what's going on?
User currently offlineRikkus67 From Canada, joined Jun 2000, 1684 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (8 years 5 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 7320 times:

Quote:
Why would they paint on windows?

...or paint fake windows?

In the case of windows, this is how the term "cheat-line" came into being.

It is a litteral term, cheating the eye to see something else. In the case of the prototype 747 upperdeck windows, perhaps we can call it the "cheat-glass"?



AC.WA.CP.DL.RW.CO.WG.WJ.WN.KI.FL.SK.ACL.UA.US.F9
User currently offlineKL5147 From Netherlands, joined Aug 2005, 338 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (8 years 5 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 7230 times:

Quoting Rikkus67 (Reply 6):
...or paint fake windows?

It still happens today. Look at this Qantas 747. See there are 7 windows painted grey/black, left of door #2. Compare it to the 4 blinded/plugged (white) windows on the upper deck.

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Jason Milligan




"The world is just a click away!"
User currently offlineVV701 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 7739 posts, RR: 17
Reply 8, posted (8 years 5 months 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 7055 times:

Nevertheless all initial production of the 741 and 742 had three-window upper cabins that were fitted out with a first class bar on the upper deck as standard.

From around line number 95 Boeing offered the alternative of a ten-window upper deck fitted out to the customer's specification. I believe the first two Sabena aircraft (OO-SGA/B) were the first so delivered.

The option of 3- or 10- window upper deck aircraft was offered until around line number 240 by which time I think about 160 aircraft with the 3-window upper deck had been produced.

By then many airlines were converting their 3-window versiuons to the 10-window version. These included BA who inherited around a dozen 3-window versions from BOAC and converted them all in the late 70s and very early 80s. So all of the windows in these photos are real, not painted:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © AirNikon
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Fergal Goodman



User currently offlineCitationJet From United States of America, joined Mar 2003, 2469 posts, RR: 3
Reply 9, posted (8 years 5 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 6962 times:

Raytheon's Premier business jet does the same thing today. The Premier only has three actual passenger windows per side. Anything more than 3 are not real windows, they are paint or decals. Raytheon did this because they thought that it made the plane "look better".
Note in the photos below the 3 and 5 window photos are of the same aircraft. Evidently 2 more windows were "added".

3 window Premier:
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Ilya Morozov


4 window Premier:
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Tamon Takeoka - AirTeamImages


5 window Premier:
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Dmitriy Pichugin




Boeing Flown: 701,702,703;717;720;721,722;731,732,733,734,735,737,738,739;741,742,743,744,747SP;752,753;762,763;772,773.
User currently offlineRetRes From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 4 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (8 years 5 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 6761 times:

TWA 800 N93119 in a picture on this site taken one month before the tragedy shows three upper deck windows on the right side. On National Geographic 'Seconds from Distater' they show the TWA flight 800 747 being reassembled and it has nine upper deck windows on the right side. Can someone explain this. I can't find any reference to this and it seems there would have been some questions.

User currently offlineCitationJet From United States of America, joined Mar 2003, 2469 posts, RR: 3
Reply 11, posted (8 years 5 months 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 6595 times:

When TWA ordered its 747-131s, most were built with the three-window upper deck. The last few, however, were built when Boeing switched to the standard ten-window upper deck. To maintain uniform appearance of their Jumbos, TWA had Boeing modify these ships to the old three-window configuration by plugging seven of the ten windows (a reversal from most airlines, such as KLM, BA, and United, which switched from three to ten). N98109, the aircraft involved in the tragic Flight 800 crash, was one of the latter: pictures of the salvaged remains show ten openings in the upper deck.

Actual windows and plugged window openings made in the structure are two different things.

http://www.airliners.net/discussions...ation/read.main/230752/6/#ID230752

I did a search on "TWA 800 window" in Archived Civil forum to find the old thread.

.



Boeing Flown: 701,702,703;717;720;721,722;731,732,733,734,735,737,738,739;741,742,743,744,747SP;752,753;762,763;772,773.
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Upper Deck Door On The B742 posted Sun Oct 20 2002 02:59:05 by Mr AirNZ
Three Windows On The Upper Deck posted Tue Feb 22 2000 06:00:29 by EI133
Longest 747 Upper Deck Compared To The Body. posted Thu Feb 12 2004 23:47:57 by Tony Lu
B 747-400"D" Upper Deck Windows? posted Thu Sep 4 2003 07:39:30 by AV8AJET
Upper Deck Windows Of JAL 747-100 posted Thu May 15 2003 19:32:29 by Super_cheung
747-357 Upper Deck Windows... posted Wed Jan 5 2000 12:52:40 by Pandora
More On The 737/747 In VVI posted Fri Jun 2 2006 20:01:54 by LatinAviation
A380: Upper Deck Windows Smaller? posted Thu May 18 2006 04:28:20 by PPSMA
Pax Windows On The United Express EMB170 posted Fri Aug 26 2005 15:58:23 by Liedetectors
Fewer Windows On The A380 - Bad For Passengers? posted Sun Apr 24 2005 06:29:09 by A380900