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US Air Nose Gear Collapse At PIT  
User currently offlineLUVRSW From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 498 posts, RR: 1
Posted (8 years 4 months 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 16357 times:

Just reported on MSNBC. US AIR flight PIT-PBI nose gear collapsed at gate with pax on board.

93 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineTooluther From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 306 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (8 years 4 months 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 16254 times:

figures, one of the few mainline flights left (737-400??)...and it can't even stay on its feet

[Edited 2006-07-27 17:09:54]

User currently offlineJdwfloyd From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 837 posts, RR: 4
Reply 2, posted (8 years 4 months 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 16187 times:

It should have been a 300.

User currently offlinePitflyer From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 40 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (8 years 4 months 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 16096 times:

http://kdka.com/topstories/local_story_208105439.html

Article has a picture of the kneeling plane!



User currently offlineKubus From Poland, joined Dec 2005, 183 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (8 years 4 months 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 16076 times:

http://www.wpxi.com/news/9584165/detail.html

Looks from the pictures that it already pushed back from the gate when it collapsed


User currently offlineTOLtommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3304 posts, RR: 5
Reply 5, posted (8 years 4 months 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 15990 times:

Funny, SABRE shows it as a "return to gate"! Delayed due to MX, estimated to depart 1050A...

User currently offlineDAYflyer From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 3807 posts, RR: 3
Reply 6, posted (8 years 4 months 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 15990 times:

What would a likely cause possibly be for this type of incident?


One Nation Under God
User currently offlineJdwfloyd From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 837 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (8 years 4 months 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 15866 times:

Quoting Kubus (Reply 4):
Looks from the pictures that it already pushed back from the gate when it collapsed



Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 6):
What would a likely cause possibly be for this type of incident?

It looks like it pushed off of B29 it also appears that the towbar is still attatched to to aircraft and the tug. So when the push was coming to an end and the tug driver went to stop the force collapsed the nose gear. Or since the tug is never disconected from the tug when unhooking the tug backed up and pulled the gear down with it. The force of the rear wheels with the parking brear set woud have done it.


User currently offlineCVG2LGA From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 635 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (8 years 4 months 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 15740 times:

Why can't anything like this ever happen to me?! I flew CVG-ORD-LGA and return on 7/22 and 7/25, the most i was always hoping for was a go-around. Oh well, maybe next time, glad all pax&crew are allright save for minor injuries. Sad for the 737.
Tchau
DA-



They don't call em' emergencies anymore. They call em' Patronies.
User currently offlineRikkus67 From Canada, joined Jun 2000, 1674 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (8 years 4 months 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 15682 times:

Depending on cost of repairs, I am sure you'll see this bird back in the air shortly... Heck, it might end up being in new colours sooner!

Glad no one was seriously injured!



AC.WA.CP.DL.RW.CO.WG.WJ.WN.KI.FL.SK.ACL.UA.US.F9
User currently offlineFlyDeltaJets From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 1928 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (8 years 4 months 6 days ago) and read 15564 times:
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Quoting Jdwfloyd (Reply 7):
Or since the tug is never disconected from the tug when unhooking the tug backed up and pulled the gear down with it. The force of the rear wheels with the parking brear set woud have done it.

Even though it is not practiced but the rules usually state that the towbar is to be disconnected from the tractor before disconnecting from the plane. Even if this was the case I highly doubt the force of disconnecting the towbar would collapse the nose gear. I mean planes land at a 100 plus mph.



The only valid opinions are those based in facts
User currently offlineLitz From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1774 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (8 years 4 months 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 15384 times:
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Just out of curiosity ... what would happen if someone stomped the airplane brakes while the tug was pushing against the nosegear?

Is the gear pin removed prior to pushback, or after the tug disconnects?

What are the mechanics of what can lead to this kind of collapse?

- litz


User currently offlineJdwfloyd From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 837 posts, RR: 4
Reply 12, posted (8 years 4 months 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 15368 times:

Quoting FlyDeltaJets (Reply 10):
Even though it is not practiced but the rules usually state that the towbar is to be disconnected from the tractor before disconnecting from the plane. Even if this was the case I highly doubt the force of disconnecting the towbar would collapse the nose gear. I mean planes land at a 100 plus mph.

What I was saying is that the tug backed up while the towbar was still on the A/C. The force of the tug pulling against the locked brakes on the A/C would be more than enoungh to pull the gear down. Also when landing the force is pushing against the nosegear, not pulling. On other scenerio is that the A/C tried to turn off the gate with the towbar still on the tug and plane. The twinsting and pulling motion could also collapse the nose gear,

In the end the A/C had to be lifted with airbags and the nose strapped onto a bed of a flat bed truck with tires used as pads.


User currently offlineSwissy From Switzerland, joined Jan 2005, 1734 posts, RR: 4
Reply 13, posted (8 years 4 months 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 15311 times:

Quoting Litz (Reply 11):
Is the gear pin removed prior to pushback, or after the tug disconnects?

After p/b

It is also possible that p/b was set and tug pulled forward, however tow bars have spacial "shear pins" or p/b were applied before p/b was completed.

Unfortunately we have no close up pic to see how the nose gear sits.

Cheers,


User currently offlineSolnabo From Sweden, joined Jan 2008, 857 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (8 years 4 months 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 15233 times:

The only "thrill" (if you can call it that) was on a B727 IB flight to PMI when they came in to fast on the runway that they had to go-around, we could feel n hear the wheels touch the tarmac and then schwwiiish....up againe!
The woman next to me was pale as a sheet thou.

Micke//SWE  wave 



Airbus SAS - Love them both
User currently offlineVega From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (8 years 4 months 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 15217 times:

Quoting Rikkus67 (Reply 9):
Depending on cost of repairs, I am sure you'll see this bird back in the air shortly... Heck, it might end up being in new colours sooner!

If the engine pods touched the ground - I can't tell from the pictures, there could be wing and/or pod structural damage - even microscopic.

[Edited 2006-07-27 23:11:00]

User currently offlineFlyDreamliner From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 2759 posts, RR: 15
Reply 16, posted (8 years 4 months 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 15118 times:

Quoting Jdwfloyd (Reply 7):
The force of the rear wheels with the parking brear set woud have done it.

that sounds like the most likely scenario.

Quoting Vega (Reply 15):
If the engine pods touched the ground - I can't tell from the pictures, there could be wing and/or pod structural damage - even microscopic.

i'm sure it will be well inspected, but hopefully the turnaround won't be too long.



"Let the world change you, and you can change the world"
User currently offlineCentPIT From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 990 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (8 years 4 months 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 14565 times:

Happy that all PAX are safe...the worst part of this is that there were only 73 people on board a plane able to carry 134 people. Oh Pittsburgh, what are we going to do with you?

About a 55% load factor...  Yeah sure

Hahaha...we will be seeing this discontinued soon, hahaha!



Pittsburgh International: US Airways---160 daily departures! (52 destinations)
User currently offlineJmc1975 From Israel, joined Sep 2000, 3308 posts, RR: 15
Reply 18, posted (8 years 4 months 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 14468 times:

What was the reg. #?


.......
User currently offlineAnMCOSon From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 81 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (8 years 4 months 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 14305 times:

Quoting Jdwfloyd (Reply 7):
It looks like it pushed off of B29 it also appears that the towbar is still attached to to aircraft and the tug.

It was gate B27, a passenger who was interviewed on KDKA mentioned the gate.

I was just discussing this with my father, who's a maintenance control foreman for the Airbuses for USAirways here at PIT, said the damage is alot worse than it looks. He said that the guys from the Boeing desk said the nose gear is really f'ed up.

He wouldn't go any further in detail on how it happened, but he mentioned that the castings in the wheel well that hold the nose gear in place, were torn from the airframe.

If he gets pictures of the damage when he goes back in to work on Sunday, I'll post them on here.



What the? Did everything just jump around? Or did my brain just stroke off there for a second?
User currently offlineN670UW From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 1606 posts, RR: 8
Reply 20, posted (8 years 4 months 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 14040 times:

Quoting Jmc1975 (Reply 18):
What was the reg. #?

N529AU


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Rob Melehan



[Edited 2006-07-28 02:28:30]

User currently offlineUS AIRWAYS From United States of America, joined May 1999, 432 posts, RR: 4
Reply 21, posted (8 years 4 months 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 13972 times:

I once witnessed a minor incident when one of my friends at work was pushing back an E-170 off of F3 in PHL (when MidAtlantic was still around). The pilot somehow acidentally set the parking break, and it bent the towbar!!! The mechanics came out and did an inspection and said everything was fine with the gear. I never thought a towbar could bend like that, but boy was I wrong!


Go Eagles!
User currently offlineSteeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 9263 posts, RR: 21
Reply 22, posted (8 years 4 months 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 13552 times:

I am sure those passengers go one hell of a jolt!!! That sucks though. I am glad that nobody was hurt...


Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
User currently offlineUSPIT10L From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 3295 posts, RR: 7
Reply 23, posted (8 years 4 months 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 13389 times:

Quoting Litz (Reply 11):
Is the gear pin removed prior to pushback, or after the tug disconnects?

The pin is to be pulled AFTER the tug disconnects! The brakes are released, then the pushback backs up to the gate. The people walking the wings should disconnect the towbar, pull the bypass pin and put it in the hole inside the landing gear (just under where it's connected during pushback). Then the head marshaller salutes off the pilot, and the plane departs. The plane cannot depart without that bypass pin being pulled, as that is what keeps the gear from sliding around during pushback (we always used a chock to keep the plane from rolling forward after the brakes were released).

Quoting N670UW (Reply 20):
N529AU

That was an old USAir bird, IIRC.



It's a Great Day for Hockey!
User currently offlineJjbiv From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 1226 posts, RR: 5
Reply 24, posted (8 years 4 months 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 13307 times:

Wasn't the original ship 456 (flt 231 OUT 938A IN 939A)? Looks like the flight left PIT after noon on ship 406. Nice that there was an operational spare in PIT.

joe


25 DavestanKSAN : Not too sure what would happen if someone hit the brakes while pushback. However, a couple times when I was about to push a plane out, the PIC forgot
26 N670UW : Yep. 737-3B7. Delivered May 1989.
27 CentPIT : Yeah, it's a shock that US had a spare in Pittsburgh.
28 Jdwfloyd : Yeah there are usually about 3 down at the hanger that time of the morning. Either coming off a heavy check or just waiting for their gate to open fo
29 Litz : *ouch* ... that's some serious torque ... - litz
30 Coronado990 : I can't imagine what the pilots thought when they were eye-to-eye with the tug driver.
31 CentPIT : How many RONs does US Airways actually have in Pittsburgh on an average night?
32 Jdwfloyd : Bwt Republic and mainline I would say about a dozen or so.
33 CentPIT : Oh, less than I thought!!! I was thinking that the B concourse would have more like 15 or 18 RON aircraft for the morning rush at PIT, which for US i
34 Steeler83 : Wow... Was that bird then painted in all 3 US liveries?
35 Jdwfloyd : Remember that right now we have 6 redeyes that arrive bwt 5 and 7 with numerous arrivals from outstations from 630 and 730.
36 UALramperORD : Good thing the wing walker wasn't crouching down disconnecting the pin when this happened.
37 CentPIT : You are right, I did forget about these Pittsburgh arrivals: SEA SAN LAX SFO LAS PHX
38 USPIT10L : No, when it was delivered, it was painted in the silver USAir (red and blue) livery, and then it was switched to US Airways. Can't recall the exact t
39 Brdcessna : Agreed some one woulda had a real BAD day
40 HAWK21M : Another Sheared Pin. What caused it. regds MEL
41 FlyDeltaJets : THe towbar is designed to break befor that could happen. I cant speak for US but the towbars a DL will break the shear pin when you hit a bump so You
42 USPIT10L : Thanks. It's been a while since I wingwalked or marshalled. We did get 757s, and 737s periodically here and there, but the primary mainline aircraft
43 Post contains images Antoniemey : Isn't that the primary mainline A/C DL flies almost everywhere in the states?
44 VgnAtl747 : Not sure what the pushback procedure is for a 733, but perhaps they didn't install the gear pins prior to pushback.
45 NKP S2 : They don't install gear pins at pushback, it's not the proceedure there.
46 BoeingFixer : Our towbars have the shear pins as well(as all do) and I concur that you would never take a gear out before the shear pins 'shear'. I have seen towba
47 Luketenley : I work at PIT and was talking to several rampers and pilots. Noone knew for sure what exactly happened but some mentioned the tub operator being at fa
48 HAWK21M : Thats not SOP,except for Mx Towing. The Gear collapse is caused by the Shear Pin on the Strut gives in.Possible a Previous unreported Heavy strike on
49 CentPIT : Yes, a few Air Midwest BE1s are still in the old US Air livery. I actually saw one at PIT yesterday!
50 Jdwfloyd : There is one or maybe two still in the white UsAir livery. There are no plans to paint them and will probably wear them all the way to the boneyard.
51 Steeler83 : Do they come to LNS? USPIT10L, on a side note, do you know when the DC9s and 732s were painted in the red and blue USAir livery? I am guessing some t
52 TWAL1011727 : The towbar has a shear pin that will shear when a side ways moment is exerted on it( as though the pilot turned the nose gear - against the towbar.)
53 Jdwfloyd : They move about the system, in and out PIT and out west in MCI and DFW. Its a crap shoot to guess where the are, I will try to let you know the next
54 Jsposaune : I think ZVF has been around recently...It broke on my gate the other day. Ahh...speed tape!
55 Post contains images CentPIT : I love how I answer the same things as you and no one notices. I guess they feel threatened!
56 Jlbmedia : I Find it hard to believe that the "Pitt. crew" has not found a way to blame PHL for the 737 gear collapse. I am also amazed that "The crew" hasn't al
57 Jdwfloyd : Wow way to add a whole bunch of text that had nothing to due with the topic. Who knowes, maybe PHL goblins road along in the wheel well all the way t
58 Luketenley : You definately must be a PHL person. We didn't blame PHL for this problem. We just blame you guys and US for everything else!
59 Jsposaune : huh? You have a very nice airport, thank you...!
60 CentPIT : Well, you pretty much summed up why no one likes PHL! And you are right, no one working for US in PIT likes anyone working for US in PHL, oh wait the
61 Luketenley : Actually some of the people working in PHL are from PIT and had to be moved to PHL when they cut back all the flights. Seems like people in PHL shoul
62 CentPIT : I bet they stand out in the crowd, if they were smart they would!
63 Jlbmedia : CentPIT come across the state and well will show you sometime! Thanks for the invite to Pitt. My wife and I went to U. of PITT. and were back in the a
64 Steeler83 : Sweeet! Maybe I'll try to drive up Lititz Pike to LNS to spot 'em! Yeah, really. I really do not like arrogant posts like that. Yeah, but then again
65 Luketenley : I guess it's a bit of jealousy. You guys got what we once had, but thanks to US Airways, who built that beautiful terminal you go through, you get th
66 Catholic2006 : They do?? I knew we landed fast, but I didn't know it was that fast. Glad everyone on the plane was okay. ~chris~ Wow! I'm total opposite. I like fli
67 Post contains images HPRamper : Can't we all just get along? PHL and PIT are both important for US Airways. Think we could just dump PIT with its regional connection focus, and its h
68 Post contains images Steeler83 : Hmmm let's see... Come to think of it, something rather exciting did happen to me on a flight, a US one at that! It was US 5, a 757-200 en route from
69 USPIT10L : It was probably at the old airport. I never saw the old USAir logo anywhere at the new terminal until I was walking through baggage claim two-and-a-h
70 Post contains images CentPIT : Nope, I don't owe US any thanks, and especially not PHL. Imagine the profit PHL might pull in if the employees actually did work with pride? I agree,
71 Jlbmedia : CentPIT, Well I was hoping to sway you a little towards PHL. I have been impressed with the knowledge you show in your posts. I guess PITT has a very
72 Luketenley : It is listed as a "secondary hub" which is still higher then a Focus City. It has a big place in my heart too. I've been visiting it my whole life an
73 Jlbmedia : Luketenley, your passion for aviation and Pit, has earned your way onto my respected users list also. John
74 Luketenley : Thanks.
75 HAWK21M : Whats the Preliminary "Official Report" saying. regds MEL
76 FlyDeltaJets : Shear pins on towbars for MD88-757 are fragile. If you jerk too hard when you shift into Drive the pins will break so as for that about them hard to
77 Catholic2006 : I knew I always liked USAirways. . . .Yep, still my favorite airline. What makes an airport a hub? Number of flights? Number of destinations? I guess
78 Luketenley : I dont think it has to do with numberof flights. It where the majority of connections, maintenance hangers, crew base, and other stuff like that.
79 Post contains images Catholic2006 : Gotcha Thank you much! ~chris~
80 Post contains images Steeler83 : Well then I guess I was mistaken when I thought I flew on a DC9 with the old red and brown logo from the 80s. My bad    Pittsburgh is in my blood a
81 Jjbiv : Unfortunately, for all of "its rich history as a transportation...center", the roads here are abysmal in both quality and throughput. To boot, people
82 Post contains images CentPIT : Thank you, I have added you to my respected users list, and deleted other,. I think I will take more time and energy to add people. You just don't kn
83 Steeler83 : That's my take on that... I agree 110% with this!! It is obvious, given that regard, that CentPIT, you're a native like myself. The two of us are sup
84 Luketenley : I do agree. The roads here do suck. We definately need a better highway system. They are in the process of building new ones now.
85 Steeler83 : The M.F.E. Southern Beltway/I-576 projects. Let's see... here are the benefits that this project will bring to not only Pittsburgh, but all of Southw
86 Luketenley : This also benefits us here in Eastern Ohio. This will let us cut from 22 on the Southern Beltway directly to PIT without going through Imperial or Ro
87 N670UW : Yes, they do. In Pittsburgh's defense, however, the topography of the region pretty much prevents any chance for a logical freeway system. Good to se
88 Luketenley : Our topo does suck here. Too many hills. The beltway will help alot especially with getting around the city to get to the east and beyond. Thats the
89 OPNLguy : Careful... ...you've pretty much identified him so don't get him nailed by posting them. I realize that photos like these often do end up on the net
90 Post contains links and images AnMCOSon : Nahh, if you would've seen the number of forwarded email addresses that were on the email before my old mans address, you'd think they were sending t
91 DeC : Thanks a lot for sharing.....seems pretty bad!
92 CentPIT : Yeah, they weren't thinking ahead for future problems, they were just solving the ones in front of them. The tunnel should have at least been a 6 lan
93 Post contains images Steeler83 :     That one goes to the so called "planners" who designed the damned network... They should have known better that when you plan and propose proje
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