Dc10s4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Posted (8 years 10 months 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 14037 times:
AA plans to remove the ovens in the coach galley on most of its fleet. The aircraft effected will be the S80 (complete), 737, most of the 757 (the 757ER that are flown on legs to Europe keep them all others will have them removed) , and the 767-200 (used in transcon markets). Since these airplanes are flown on routes that no longer offer any meal service in coach the ovens are useless extra weight. The 767-300, 777 and the A300 will retain their ovens since they are still used on certain flights were those aircraft are flown.
Flypdx From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 636 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (8 years 10 months 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 13940 times:
Removing them from some 757s, doesn't that limit fleet utilization, because only certain aircraft can fly the longer routes? Or are there already certain aircraft that only fly the longer atlantic routes?
Dutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 56
Reply 7, posted (8 years 10 months 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 13820 times:
Quoting Dc10s4ever (Thread starter): (the 757ER that are flown on legs to Europe keep them all others will have them removed
Aside from the fact that there is officially no such airplane as the 752ER....does AA have a subfleet of ETOPS qualified 752s that it uses for its transatlantic and select latin american/transatantic services? Those aircraft will keep warm galleys?
I find the info concerning the 752 confusing......on one hand, AA is adding winglets and plans to use the 752s on longer routes (all of the talk about MIA-regional Brazilian airports, for example, once authorities can be worked out) and on the other hand, they are pulling the galleys out of the airplanes....odd.
I hope that AA is not making a mistake here......as things hopefully normalize in the US airline industry, at some point, AA may wish to return to being a full service carrier that offers meals onboard (for competitive reasons, etc).....and it will cost a lot to reinstall all of those ovens.
Dc10s4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (8 years 10 months 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 13634 times:
As far as the 757 fleet is concerned AA has about 20 or so that are designated as 757ER, they fly routes to Hawaii and Europe. The other 757s dont have overwater equipment, thus would never fly Hawaii or Europe and have no need for ovens. Now on the S80, they were originally equipped with double galley in the back. The second galley will be removed and seats added. A small galley will remain to park the carts, and store beverages etc.
Dc10s4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (8 years 10 months 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 13596 times:
Quoting EWRCabincrew (Reply 10): What if, by chance a non oven galley goes into rotation for a flight where hot meals are served. It would bound to occur. Would be a flight I do not want to work.
Basically the flights that still have hot meals in Y are Europe, Asia, and deep South America. AA will NEVER dispatch a S80, 737, or a non ER 757 on any of those routes. So it is safe to say it will never happen.
PSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7925 posts, RR: 27
Reply 12, posted (8 years 10 months 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 13596 times:
There are technically 4 subfleets of 757's:
1) ex-TWA PW-powered 757's: to be removed from the fleet as leases expire over the next 2 years
2) non-over water equiped 757's: some of the older 757's, that a limited to domestic runs as they do not have rafts....they may have made all 757's overwater equipment to increase fleet flexibility
3) overwater equiped 757's: have rafts and used to fly routes to/from Carribean, Latin America, better offshore routings, etc
4) ETOPS 757's: the newest delivery 757's, used for Hawaii & Trans-Atlantic, will receive winglets, will retain ovens in coach galleys.
Dutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 56
Reply 13, posted (8 years 10 months 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 13582 times:
Quoting Dc10s4ever (Reply 9): As far as the 757 fleet is concerned AA has about 20 or so that are designated as 757ER, they fly routes to Hawaii and Europe.
Cool, thanks for pointing that out....thus the 757ERs (as AA is calling them) are the ETOPS capable airplanes, thus, there is a 757 subfleet for longer haul operations.
Its going to be interesting to see how many 757s keep their warm galleys.....if AA plans to use the 752s on more longer routes, more than 20 will need warm galleys. I am still thinking that this could be a mistake, especially on airplanes like the 738 and 752, at some point, AA may want to use these airplanes on more longer range routes and will then have to replace the galleys. Time will tell.......thanks for the info!
Captaink From Mexico, joined May 2001, 5114 posts, RR: 11
Reply 14, posted (8 years 10 months 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 13582 times:
It is sad to see that is cost cutting measure is permanent. I used to somewhat think that it is a temporary thing, until the airlines get back on their feet. But we can beasically expect never to see meal service on certain flights again.
BigGSFO From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2976 posts, RR: 6
Reply 18, posted (8 years 10 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 13346 times:
I guess I too am a little surprised the ovens are going from all 757's and 737's. Some 737's head to Caribbean/South America and I guess I was hopeful AA would bring meal service back to transcon/Hawaii flights. I guess not.
MAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 33669 posts, RR: 71
Reply 19, posted (8 years 10 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 13315 times:
Quoting Dc10s4ever (Thread starter): The aircraft effected will be the S80 (complete), 737, most of the 757 (the 757ER that are flown on legs to Europe keep them all others will have them removed) , and the 767-200 (used in transcon markets). Since these airplanes are flown on routes that no longer offer any meal service in coach the ovens are useless extra weight.
All flights to South America (as well as POS, BGI, and, UVF) have hot meal service, and many are flown wiht 738s.
Lredlefsen From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 151 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (8 years 10 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 13224 times:
Quoting Captaink (Reply 14): But we can beasically expect never to see meal service on certain flights again.
Come on, it's not like plane food was ever any good, no matter how far up front you sit.
Just eat something at the airport before you leave. It doesn't have to be McDonald's if you look around. There's a great steak house at CO's EWR terminal ("Gallagher's"). MIA has the "Top of the Port" restaurant. I'm sure there's some "Zagat Guide to Airport Dining" somewhere...
Dc10s4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (8 years 10 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 13158 times:
Quoting Lredlefsen (Reply 20): Are cold meals refrigerated until they're served? If so, then they won't be able to remove any refrigeration equipment without kissing off on cold meal service, too, right?
There is no refreidgeration equipment on any of AA's aircraft. Most stuff is kept cold with dry ice.
Jetstar From United States of America, joined May 2003, 1695 posts, RR: 11
Reply 22, posted (8 years 10 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 13057 times:
I do not miss the meals on AA flights, most of the meals were ok but some were uneatable because someone in the kitchen who thought that because they like pepper or some other spices, everyone else should like it to.
I would rather spend the money and buy something that I like either off airport on at an airport shop. Now when I fly I carry a little foldable insulated cooler, I stop either at a Subway or similar type chain sub shop for a sandwich or buy one at an airport shop and carry it on the plane, small bistro sized coolers and bags are not considered one of your 2 carry on item allowance. I usually gat a bag of chips and a cookie to round out the meal and wait until the beverage service so I have something to drink with my meal. This way I get to eat what I want, not be told that “sorry we are out of your selection, this is all we have left”
On a recent flight back from TPA, my wife and I enjoyed some delicious wraps we purchased at the airport, the passenger seated opposite me on the aisle kept looking at my wrap as all he had to eat was a bag of pretzels.
DL4EVR From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 641 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (8 years 10 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 13026 times:
This is common practice these days. DL removed all of their ovens in Y on the MD-88 a few years ago (2003 I think). The 738s still have all of them though as well as a good portion of 757s as these are used on Latin American runs.
DTWAGENT From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 1283 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (8 years 10 months 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 11817 times:
AA does not have to worry about feeding anyone in coach class. I was on 2 7:00am flights and nothing was offered to even purchase to eat. And getting anything to drink was like pulling teeth. American Eagle howeve, gave us can's of soft drinks to drink. But, if AA proves this to be a big money saver, we will see all the other carriers doing the same...
: Now we can just remember the time when good meals, like real breackfasts, lunchs or dinners were served even in a 1hr flight... Wich flights flow by t
: JFK-STI/SDQ/MBJ MIA-LIM/GYE I really don't think they are going to get rid of kitchens on all their 738s. It makes no sense. They serve hot meals on
: Cereal or 'breakfast burrito' (...) on morning flights, a tasteless sandwich for lunch, I'd hardly call that extensive. Throw in the nonexistent smil
: This make sense.. Although, how much can be a oven's weight?? Heard that DL took of 24 cans of every flight and saved 250.000,00 dollars per year...
: I haven't flown AA in years, nor have I particularly paid attention to what they do. Nevertheless, can someone explain to me what the extent of their
: All of AA's widebodies, ie, 777, A300 and 763s/762s are equipped with chillers.
: The ovens are already gone on the S80. AA is begining to remove the cabinets that housed the ovens in order to put in the 2 rows of seats.
: AA's 767's and 777's have chillers in the galley's that keep things cool for items requiring it on long flights.
: Standard ovens with room for 32 entrees have an empty weight of 41-43lbs or 18-19kg, and a 757 probably have four ovens in the rear Y galley... so th
: Ovens, coffee makers (brewers), and coolers are all removeable on the aircraft. This will save on weight. Makes sense since AA wont do domestic meal
35 We're Nuts
: That was because our galleys and trash space is so limited on RJ's that it's easier to hand out cans than let them pile up while we're serving. And t
: Im glad american eagle still serves drinks and food (food for $ but still) . I always love that coffee / hot chocolate on the 7 am flight to DFW Garri
: Yeah but you missed part of the point. They will replace the galley with four additional seats. That will generate additional revenue. There may well
: CO offers cold meals on most of their flights that aren't too short. The meals are small, simple, but in my opinion a great touch, and when you are t
: I would note that of the airlines you mention only AA has beaten bankruptcy so far. The great cattle car of the sky WN is the only other major that h
: American Airlines (AA/ AAL) operates the Boeing 757-223ET on their ETOPS/ Longer Flights. Most of you will recognize these B752's as they are the one'
: Why does everyone love bashing AA so much, I have flown for years with American and have enjoyed 95% of my flights. Everyone seems to never have a nic
: My first thought too. Then I remembered this is pretty much the way we always do things.
: I think this is a good move. Times are changing and AA is maximizing their resources - again. By removing the ovens, they can indeed add more revenue
: I'll tell you why I'm going to bash AA - they took the fun and excitement out of flying - it's little better than taking a bus, at least on their dom
: I beg to differ. AA used to have very good food in coach, as well as first. I once had a Ceaser salad in coach that was much better than the Ceaser s
: Thinking outside the box here. If you are an airline, does it give a better impression on your passengers if you do BOB service, or if you simply char
: I agree -- my experience with AA (and, frankly, UA and CO) has been overwhelmingly good. NW is a different story -- I'll do just about anything I can
: I swear that my next trip will include me packing very spicy and aromatic food that I will sit and enjoy in flight when flying a no-longer-serving-foo
: Oh heck yeah. Food in coach isn't great (simply because it's the same two or three entrees on every flight) but it's nothing to complain about; meal
: this is sarcasm, right? The LAST thing I want is the person next to me busting out with the "spicy and aromatic food." Have pity on the rest of us! T
: I bring good ole' fashion home cookin' on my flights....tasty delicious Pakistani/Indian cuisine... nothing very oily like curry or something (my fam
: It does not have to be particularly spicy and aromatic. Leftover fish with garlic or stale chicken is usually quite pungent, particularly if I have be
: If you seek onboard food, then why don't you bash oil futures and the cost of post-september 11th security? Because that is the real reason why most
: Wouldn't you need to assume that all these planes are currently operating at 100% load - otherwise AA will not be able to sell the four additional se
: Yes, otherwise they wouldn't be using the 757 for transatlantic flights. And those that are ETOPS qualified, will keep there warm galleys. There are
: There is no such thing as a 757ER, unless it is internal AA Yes, and they are all maxed to 255K Again, only internally designated. They could be retr
: Being critical or commenting on one aspect of an airline's business is not bashing, its analyzing. My goodness, AA is an airline, not a religion...I
: I never understood people that flew for the food. I do understand that a flight of say, 4 hours or more should have something to eat. The ovens are be
: People dont fly for food, they go to restaurants for food....but its difficult to get to a restaurant if you are at 35000 feet. A pax is on an airpla
: Dutchjet , my friend, you are completely missing my points. Millions to put the ovens back on, but how much in fuel are they saving? It isn't difficul
: The rear cabin galley cooking equipment is obviously extra weight on all the MD80s. The 757 fleet can be segregated between types, which is better tha
: Fair question. I travel AA quite a bit and most planes leave at or very near 100% full. What I did in my estimate is use load factors of 70% to 85% b
: At least you were one of the lucky ones, the last time I was told they were out of my selections, I had to settle for a Mexican chicken, rice and bea
: Thats excatly what i was going to say. IF ship XXX goes on MX then only the ships with ovens can cover the trip or else you will have a ton of pissed
: The airlines definately do, just ask the folks at Rockwell-Collins, Thales or Panasonic. Cost and weight are why you don't see planes such as the MD8
: I'm waiting for pay toilets to be installed. Four quarters gets you 4 minutes in the can.
: Not in AA's terminology at least. After all, they like inventing names such as 752ER. But honestly I would qualify it as a medium haul as a medium ha
: Um................. will there be space to install an extra seat or two? Or maybe a "pay as you go" personal space? So, instead of congregating outsid
: Welcome to the world of the BYOB (bring your own bottle -to urinate in, of course-). Then, we will see more and more "unruly pax" deplaned and arrest
: And why is that? I, as a pax, do not accept that one standard of service is acceptable for domestic flights and another is appropriate for internatio
: For the record, United, as re-iterated (sp?) during today's conference call, is doing the same thing on parts of its domestic fleet, including the 737
: Dutchjet: You are correct. The only reason they are offering any food at all on the international flights (over the Atlantic/Pacific and not Caribbean