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China - Chile...flights?  
User currently offlineFlyfirst From Chile, joined Nov 2004, 74 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 8 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 3485 times:

China and Chile are partners in a free trade agreement, it was signed yesterday in Santiago. What are the chances for a direct flight between the two countries ?
Maybe SCL - PEK with LAN or Air China ??

23 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlinePHKLM From Northern Mariana Islands, joined Dec 2005, 1198 posts, RR: 2
Reply 1, posted (7 years 8 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 3485 times:

SCL-PEK is beyond the viable range of any a/c.
Maybe the A345 or 77W could make it with payload restrictions, but I don't see LA operating one of those types. Furthermore, PAX demand will be very limited and cargo doesn't mind to be routed thru LAX or AKL.

It would be possible when making a refueling stop on IPC; although it's still very unlikely.
FYI: IPC=Rapa Nui=Easter Island (Chilean Territory)

[Edited 2006-08-22 22:10:35]

User currently offlineFlyfirst From Chile, joined Nov 2004, 74 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (7 years 8 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 3466 times:

Quoting PHKLM (Reply 1):
SCL-PEK is beyond the viable range of any a/c.

Yes, what I think it should a one stop service, maybe AKL or LAX.


User currently offlineA342 From Germany, joined Jul 2005, 4675 posts, RR: 3
Reply 3, posted (7 years 8 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 3438 times:

I think codeshare with QF via SYD also does the job.


Exceptions confirm the rule.
User currently offlineHKGKaiTak From Australia, joined Jun 2005, 1050 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (7 years 8 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 3305 times:

Quoting A342 (Reply 3):
I think codeshare with QF via SYD also does the job.

QF doesn't fly to South America on its own metal, it codeshares with LA ...



4 Engines 4 LongHaul
User currently offline6thfreedom From Bermuda, joined Sep 2004, 3314 posts, RR: 20
Reply 5, posted (7 years 8 months 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 3281 times:

Quoting HKGKaiTak (Reply 4):
QF doesn't fly to South America on its own metal, it codeshares with LA ...

But connections would be excellent under a LA and QF arrangement over SYD.

11:05p SCL I 7:20a+2 SYD 1 LA 801 1-Stop 340 18:15
connect to:

11:35a SYD 1 6:50p PVG QF 129 Non-stop 333
or
10:30a SYD 1 8:10p PEK 2 QF 191 Non-stop 333 11:40


------------------------------------------------------------
7:35p PVG 8:10a+1 SYD 1 QF 130 Non-stop 333 10:35
connect :
10:15a SYD 1 12:10p SCL I *QF 321 1-Stop 343 15:55


User currently offlineSW733 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6265 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (7 years 8 months 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 3275 times:

Quoting Flyfirst (Reply 2):
Yes, what I think it should a one stop service, maybe AKL or LAX.

LAX, and all US airpots, are too much of a pain in the butt to transit through as a non-US citizens...I would bet airlines would try to avoid it if possible, maybe going via Auckland, Sydney, Vancover, Mexico City...?


User currently offlineHKGKaiTak From Australia, joined Jun 2005, 1050 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (7 years 8 months 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 3268 times:

Quoting 6thfreedom (Reply 5):
7:35p PVG 8:10a+1 SYD 1 QF 130 Non-stop 333 10:35
connect :
10:15a SYD 1 12:10p SCL I *QF 321 1-Stop 343 15:55

This part doesn't quite work unless you're able to transfer pax in mid-air ...  Wink



4 Engines 4 LongHaul
User currently offline6thfreedom From Bermuda, joined Sep 2004, 3314 posts, RR: 20
Reply 8, posted (7 years 8 months 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 3218 times:

Quoting HKGKaiTak (Reply 7):
This part doesn't quite work unless you're able to transfer pax in mid-air ...

Sorry, You've lost me...

you arrive SYD 8.10am, and connect on the flight to SCL that departs SYD at 10.15.

2hr 5 mins is plenty for an international to international connection!


User currently offlineFLY2LIM From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1183 posts, RR: 10
Reply 9, posted (7 years 8 months 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 3189 times:

Quoting Flyfirst (Thread starter):
China and Chile are partners in a free trade agreement, it was signed yesterday in Santiago. What are the chances for a direct flight between the two countries ?

Not to spoil the party, but a free trade agreement doesn't necessarily translate to air service between the two countries, right?

FLY2LIM



Faucett. La primera linea aerea del Peru.
User currently offlineVincewy From Taiwan, joined Oct 2005, 767 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (7 years 8 months 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 3144 times:

The only viable area for East Asia-Latin America markets is for NZ to develop AKL into a small hub, ie, AKL to PVG, ICN, PEK, NRT, KIX, HKG, those flights can connect perhaps 3 daily 787 flights to combo of SCL, LIM, GRU, GIG, and EZE. GRU may warrant daily, perhaps even 777, but the rest can be nonstop with 3-5 weekly. AKL to Asia sectors will have enough O&D traffics and many flights may even use 747s and 777s.

Another possibility is SA at JNB, but JNB is much further to Peru, Chile, and East Asia, plus JNB is slot constrained during the morning hours.

[Edited 2006-08-23 06:17:13]

User currently offlineZK-NBT From New Zealand, joined Oct 2000, 5193 posts, RR: 11
Reply 11, posted (7 years 8 months 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 3082 times:

Quoting Vincewy (Reply 10):
The only viable area for East Asia-Latin America markets is for NZ to develop AKL into a small hub, ie, AKL to PVG, ICN, PEK, NRT, KIX, HKG, those flights can connect perhaps 3 daily 787 flights to combo of SCL, LIM, GRU, GIG, and EZE. GRU may warrant daily, perhaps even 777, but the rest can be nonstop with 3-5 weekly. AKL to Asia sectors will have enough O&D traffics and many flights may even use 747s and 777s.

I agree, problem with NZ-South America is ETOPS. NZ could possibly offer a 3-4 flights a week with a 744 to EZE, GRU. But yes a schedule something like this, Asia AKL flights arrive in AKL between 0700 and 1100 and could connect to

AKL 1600 EZE 1100
continuing to GRU, not sure on time zones there and return via EZE
EZE 2330 AKL 0500

this would allow Australian connections aswell, problem is that HKG and PVG depart at midnight. Japan flights depart in the morning ex AKL. Also SQ and TG flights depart AKL in the afternoon to SIN, BKK.

Anyway would be nice for someone like LA to start SCL-AKL-PVG/PEK.


User currently offlineEddieDude From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 7524 posts, RR: 43
Reply 12, posted (7 years 8 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 2924 times:

Quoting 6thfreedom (Reply 5):
But connections would be excellent under a LA and QF arrangement over SYD.



Quoting Vincewy (Reply 10):
The only viable area for East Asia-Latin America markets is for NZ to develop AKL into a small hub

I don't think LA-QF connections at SYD would be very attractive because the LA flight has an intermediate stop in AKL, so someone going from South America to China would have to do more than just two segments. It might be better for LA to offer connecting service via a codeshare agreement with a Chinese carrier at AKL.



Next flights: MEX-GRU (AM 77E), GRU-GIG (JJ A320), SDU-CGH (G3 73H), GRU-MEX (JJ A332).
User currently offlineCamille38 From France, joined Aug 2006, 37 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (7 years 8 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 2863 times:

What about a hub in PPT? Air Tahiti Nui is linking Japan, the USA(and then France) & New Zealand from PPT
Is there any market to make a link between PPT and PVG or HKG? and between PPT and SCL?


User currently offlineLongHauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 4760 posts, RR: 43
Reply 14, posted (7 years 8 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 2849 times:

If you look at the great circle route from PEK to SCL, you see it passes right over LAX and YVR, the most obvious connection points .... if they existed.

AC management recently mentioned that one of the areas they are pursuing when available wide body equipment arrives, is YVR to Central / South America routes, to connect with Asia. This is much like Canadian Pacific of the 1950s, where it was possible to fly from Hong Kong to Buenos Aires, on one flight number.



Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
User currently offlineA342 From Germany, joined Jul 2005, 4675 posts, RR: 3
Reply 15, posted (7 years 8 months 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 2822 times:

Quoting HKGKaiTak (Reply 4):
QF doesn't fly to South America on its own metal, it codeshares with LA ...

I know that. I was referring to this:

Quoting Flyfirst (Thread starter):
Maybe SCL - PEK with LAN

I meant: LA flies to SYD, and QF brings the pax to PEK or PVG.



Exceptions confirm the rule.
User currently offlineCamille38 From France, joined Aug 2006, 37 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (7 years 8 months 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 2810 times:

Quoting LongHauler (Reply 14):
If you look at the great circle route from PEK to SCL, you see it passes right over LAX and YVR, the most obvious connection points .... if they existed.

so, there are connecting flights between China and Chile!!!..
chinese or US airline for the leg above the Pacific Ocean and then Chilean or again US airline between LAX and Chile


User currently offlineJayce From Canada, joined Nov 1999, 520 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (7 years 8 months 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 2804 times:

Quoting LongHauler (Reply 14):
AC management recently mentioned that one of the areas they are pursuing when available wide body equipment arrives, is YVR to Central / South America routes, to connect with Asia.

So they finally realized that YVR is closer to Asia than YYZ?



"Trying is the first step towards failure" -Homer Simpson
User currently offlineMotorHussy From New Zealand, joined Mar 2000, 3038 posts, RR: 9
Reply 18, posted (7 years 8 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 2758 times:

The optimum direct routes to SCL from PEK and PVG are illustrated in this chart from the Great Circle Mapper.



A route to PVG would therefore best go via AKL or PPT. NZ are about to commence thrice weekly flights to PVG and there is persistent talk about SCL, EZE and GRU.

The PEK route could feasibly stop in YVR or MEX so as to avoid the indignity of transiting via the U.S.

Regards
MH



come visit the south pacific
User currently offlineDYK From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 407 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (7 years 8 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 2726 times:

There is some strong rumours being generated in the cargo village at YVR that 2 Chinese carriers are looking at utilizing 5th freedom traffic right from YVR to MEX and South America. I would think eventhough YVR is a longer routing it would be a more lucrative routing than via AKL.


AC,CP,PW,WD,ND,UA,AA,NW,CO,DL,WA,AS,QX,PR,SQ,AI,TG,MH,JL,9W,IC,UL,PG,BW,NZ,QF,DJ,BA,LH,KL,OA,OS,ME,RJ,HA,AQ
User currently offlineLongHauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 4760 posts, RR: 43
Reply 20, posted (7 years 8 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 2676 times:

Quoting Jayce (Reply 17):
So they finally realized that YVR is closer to Asia than YYZ?

In this case ... SCL-YVR-PEK it is ... but not always!

SCL-YVR-PEK is only 75 nm shorter than SCL-YYZ-PEK. YVR has the edge as SCL is in western South America.

But:

GRU-YYZ-HKG is 318 nm shorter than through YVR. GRU-YVR-HKG
EZE-YYZ-HKG is 27 nm shorter than through YVR. EZE-YVR-HKG

Same thing with CCS and BOG, shorter through YYZ.
And, not just HKG, but also NRT, PEK, etc.



Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
User currently offlineMotorHussy From New Zealand, joined Mar 2000, 3038 posts, RR: 9
Reply 21, posted (7 years 8 months 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 2636 times:

Quoting DYK (Reply 19):
would think eventhough YVR is a longer routing it would be a more lucrative routing than via AKL.

Via YVR is shorter if you're headed from SCL to PEK and via AKL from SCL to PVG.

You may be right about YVR being a more lucrative 5th freedom point than AKL, but both AC and NZ can't miss the opportunity of channeling traffic to and from each of these continents. They shouldn't leave it to the Chinese carriers.

Also, New Zealand is in fairly advanced talks with both China and Chile with regard to bilateral trade agreements.

Regards
MH



come visit the south pacific
User currently offlineArcano From Chile, joined Mar 2004, 2402 posts, RR: 24
Reply 22, posted (7 years 8 months 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 2618 times:

I know there won't ne demand, but I would love to see some LA 343 SCL-HNL-NRT/PEK/PVG


in order: 721,146,732,763,722,343,733,320,772,319,752,321,88,83,744,332,100,738, 333, 318, 77W, 78, 773 and 380
User currently offlineLanas From Argentina, joined Aug 2006, 978 posts, RR: 13
Reply 23, posted (7 years 8 months 23 hours ago) and read 2558 times:

Quoting LongHauler (Reply 14):
where it was possible to fly from Hong Kong to Buenos Aires, on one flight number.

Nice, I didn´t know this.

I think a one-stop in YVR or LAX might be the best answer. How did RG did with its GRU-LAX-NRT flights?

Regards,
Lanas.-



"Faithless is he that says farewell when the road darkens." J.R.R. Tolkien
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