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Ranking Of N. American Intl. Airports  
User currently offlineJamincan From Canada, joined Aug 2006, 775 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 12 hours ago) and read 8478 times:

I was reading wikipedia recently, and came across this link to a ranking of the busiest airports by international traffic in the US. I was curious to see how YVR actually fit into the ranking since I had frequently heard that it was the second most important west coast gateway after LAX. Well, it seems that that rumour is right. Here's the list with the major Canadian airports inserted (data pulled from their websites). I tried to find out the data for MEX, but the website didn't seem to be that comprehensive, so maybe someone else who's more familiar with that area could contribute the data.

Ranking (000s)

1 New York Kennedy 18,444
2 Los Angeles 17,116
3 Toronto 17,000
4 Miami 16,629
5 Chicago O'Hare 10,185
6 Newark 8,794
7 Vancouver 8,070
8 San Francisco 7,846
9 Montreal 6,446
10 Atlanta Hartsfield 6,114
11 Houston 5,357
12 Honolulu 5,126
13 Dallas-Ft. Worth 4,812
14 Boston Logan 4,058
15 Detroit 3,929
16 Washington Dulles 3,896
17 Minneapolis-St. Pau 2,875
18 Guam Island 2,841
19 Calgary 2,772
20 Philadelphia 2,554
21 San Juan 2,501
22 Orlando 2,354
23 Seattle 2,202
24 New York LaGuardia 1,315

57 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineAirCop From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (8 years 12 hours ago) and read 8439 times:

Yea, were (PHX) #??, shoot didn't make the list again..

User currently offlineSLCUT2777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 4050 posts, RR: 11
Reply 2, posted (8 years 10 hours ago) and read 8323 times:

Quoting AirCop (Reply 1):
Yea, were (PHX) #??, shoot didn't make the list again..

Neither did DEN or SLC, the USA Mountain Time Zone gets shut out again!  hissyfit 
It is quite amazing to see four Canadian airports factored into this mix. But then again Canada has twice the population percentage possessing passports that the US has. It would be interesting to see how MEX would factor into all of this as well as a large Caribbean airport operation (SJU, PAP and SDQ come to mind). I'm sure the SEA-TAC people are all riled up to see YVR significantly ahead of them, SFO is even behind them (although I'm quite certain trans-border op's give it the edge in this count). And don't show people in DFW that IAH beat them out! That one will get the Hatfield's and the McCoy's of Texas gnawing at each other!  fight   devil   laughing   rotfl 



DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
User currently offlineSLCUT2777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 4050 posts, RR: 11
Reply 3, posted (8 years 10 hours ago) and read 8321 times:

Quoting Jamincan (Thread starter):
21 San Juan 2,501

Looks like SJU takes the Caribbean honors. Now where does MEX fit in all of this?



DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
User currently offlineCopaair737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (8 years 9 hours ago) and read 8243 times:

If Transborder Canadian-US flights are taken out, what would the rankings be? I have a feeling a large part of YVR's Intl. traffic is transborder flights. The rankings don't surprise me for the most part though. JFK and LAX at the top aren't surprising. I would have figured SFO would have been higher though.

-Copa


User currently offlineGunsontheroof From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 3503 posts, RR: 10
Reply 5, posted (8 years 9 hours ago) and read 8232 times:

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 2):
I'm sure the SEA-TAC people are all riled up to see YVR significantly ahead of them

This actually isn't terribly surprising, nor is it something that I'm going to get excited, let alone "riled up" about. YVR has had considerably more international service than SEA for years, so it's hardly shocking to see it considerably higher on this particular list.



Next Flight: 9/17 BFI-BFI
User currently offlineJayce From Canada, joined Nov 1999, 520 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (8 years 9 hours ago) and read 8225 times:

Quoting Copaair737 (Reply 4):
If Transborder Canadian-US flights are taken out, what would the rankings be? I have a feeling a large part of YVR's Intl. traffic is transborder flights.

I would imagine a large part of all four of the Canadian airport listed international traffic is transborder.

Having said that, I'm still surprised that YYC has more international passengers than SEA.



"Trying is the first step towards failure" -Homer Simpson
User currently offlineGunsontheroof From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 3503 posts, RR: 10
Reply 7, posted (8 years 9 hours ago) and read 8209 times:

Quoting Jayce (Reply 6):

I would imagine a large part of all four of the Canadian airport listed international traffic is transborder.

Having said that, I'm still surprised that YYC has more international passengers than SEA.

As would I. I'm extremely doubtful that YYC gets more int'l traffic than SEA (and probably not as much as many airports that aren't even on this list) if you take away U.S. traffic. YVR on the other hand gets a ton of transpacific traffic, so I doubt you'd see them drop too far down the list if U.S. traffic was factored out.



Next Flight: 9/17 BFI-BFI
User currently offlineDYK From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 407 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (8 years 9 hours ago) and read 8209 times:

Quoting Copaair737 (Reply 4):
If Transborder Canadian-US flights are taken out, what would the rankings be? I have a feeling a large part of YVR's Intl. traffic is transborder flights. The rankings don't surprise me for the most part though. JFK and LAX at the top aren't surprising. I would have figured SFO would have been higher though.

I wonder about this as well, but then how much of the transborder traffic
connects to international flights via U.S. airports ie. Houston, San Fran or LAX? So i guess you have to factor in the transborder traffic..



AC,CP,PW,WD,ND,UA,AA,NW,CO,DL,WA,AS,QX,PR,SQ,AI,TG,MH,JL,9W,IC,UL,PG,BW,NZ,QF,DJ,BA,LH,KL,OA,OS,ME,RJ,HA,AQ
User currently offlineSLCUT2777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 4050 posts, RR: 11
Reply 9, posted (8 years 9 hours ago) and read 8209 times:

Quoting Copaair737 (Reply 4):
If Transborder Canadian-US flights are taken out, what would the rankings be? I have a feeling a large part of YVR's Intl. traffic is transborder flights. The rankings don't surprise me for the most part though. JFK and LAX at the top aren't surprising. I would have figured SFO would have been higher though.

I'm certain the trans-border op's make the difference for YVR edging out SFO.
Like SEA-TAC, that has been the case for a number of years being Canada's Pacific gateway.

Quoting Jayce (Reply 6):
I would imagine a large part of all four of the Canadian airport listed international traffic is transborder.
Having said that, I'm still surprised that YYC has more international passengers than SEA.

Spread out over several more US airports I would say that is a definite factor. But as I eluded to in my post above, a higher percentage of Canadians travel outside North America, particularly to Mexico, The Caribbean and Central America. Canada has far and away more cheap charters and tour operators to destinations further south than the US does.



DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
User currently offlineVega From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (8 years 9 hours ago) and read 8199 times:

That list is 6 years old - note the date: 2000.

User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16858 posts, RR: 51
Reply 11, posted (8 years 9 hours ago) and read 8164 times:

Here's stats from Last year for EWR, JFK, LGA:

EWR:
9,621,264

JFK:
18,873,013

LGA:
1,371,321



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineYVRSR From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (8 years 8 hours ago) and read 8116 times:

The following webpage give information about the breakdown of passengers at YVR:

http://www.yvr.ca/authority/facts/

Click on Passenger Statistics. In a nutshell: in 2005

Domestic: 8,347,951

Transborder (USA): 4,106,420

Asia Pacific: 2,444,576
Europe: 1,202,031
Other International: 317,905
Total International: 3,964,512

Total International + Transborder = 8,070,932.

If you remove Transborder from the YVR total, one gets 3.964 million international passengers.


User currently offlineNateDAL From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 417 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (8 years 4 hours ago) and read 8005 times:

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 2):
And don't show people in DFW that IAH beat them out! That one will get the Hatfield's and the McCoy's of Texas gnawing at each other!

DFW fans mostly accept that they are losing badly. Since those are 2000 numbers, the gap has grown considerably. DFW is still far ahead in domestic numbers.

2005 numbers, from each airport's website:

DFW: 5,650,733 int...53,525,532 dom

IAH: 6,905,729 int....32,797,457 dom

For the fist six months of this year, interntional pax at DFW are up 3.1%. IAH is up 7.5%. Since AF added a 2nd daily flight in mid May and LH is moving up to a A346, I would expect an even larger disparity at year end.

DFW is hurt by its location and AA's dominance. Great domestic hub location, but not great for international routes. DFW does have some great routes that IAH lacks, such as ZRH, KIX, ICN, & SCL.



Set Love Free
User currently offlineJamincan From Canada, joined Aug 2006, 775 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (8 years 3 hours ago) and read 7950 times:

That's a good point re: the date being from 2000. I suppose that would probably have the effect of shifting some of the Canadian cities down a notch; however, it's only until recently that most cities have really recovered post-911, so I suspect that the ranking is still roughly accurate.

Except for Montreal, in each Canadian case, over half of the international traffic is transborder. I'm not really sure how relevant that is though. An international flight is an international flight whether it's on a CRJ to Cleveland or on a A345 to Honk Kong.


User currently offlineWJ From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 345 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (8 years 3 hours ago) and read 7911 times:

The question is also where are the transborder flights concidered international? With US immigration facilities in YVR and YYZ (maybe others, not sure) flights that are concidered international out of Canada arrive as domestics in the U.S. skewing the numbers some.


146,727,732,733,734,735,73G,738,739,742,743,744,752,753,762,763,764,772,300,310,319,320,321,330,343,DC9,D10,MD11,M80,E17
User currently offlineRoseFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9595 posts, RR: 52
Reply 16, posted (8 years 1 hour ago) and read 7818 times:

Quoting Copaair737 (Reply 4):
If Transborder Canadian-US flights are taken out, what would the rankings be? I have a feeling a large part of YVR's Intl. traffic is transborder flights

I think YYZ probably has a higher portion of transborder ops than YVR. YYZ has service to tons and tons of US cities that are often not that big.

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 2):
I'm sure the SEA-TAC people are all riled up to see YVR significantly ahead of them, SFO is even behind them (although I'm quite certain trans-border op's give it the edge in this count). And don't show people in DFW that IAH beat them out! That one will

SEA lacks international service. While Asian flights have been creeping up recently, there still isn't that much service. This just points it out. We all know YVR is a Pacific gateway, and SEA is mostly just an O/D destination.

Quoting Jayce (Reply 6):
Having said that, I'm still surprised that YYC has more international passengers than SEA.

YYC seems very high. A lot of people from YYC must leave during the winter.



If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineBnamaxx From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (8 years 1 hour ago) and read 7789 times:

Transborder flights work both ways right? So what are the northbound numbers for some airports, say like SEA, where AS/QX/AC operate quite a few flights into Canada. It's easy to tweak the numbers to make them fit your particular argument.

I agree about the DFW statement. In the 17 years I lived there, all they talked about was making it a true "international" airport. So many have tried and left, probably most because they have to go up against AA. Those int'l. carriers I can recall DFW losing (for whatever reason) included JM, AM, Aeroexo (don't know the code), CP, TG, NZ, JL, AF, SN. Are there more?


User currently offlineZrs70 From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 3164 posts, RR: 9
Reply 18, posted (8 years ago) and read 7754 times:

Boy, I remember when Boston was the number two gateway, behind JFK!


14 year airliners.net vet! 2000-2013
User currently offlineSLCUT2777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 4050 posts, RR: 11
Reply 19, posted (8 years ago) and read 7732 times:

Quoting Jamincan (Reply 14):
Except for Montreal, in each Canadian case, over half of the international traffic is transborder. I'm not really sure how relevant that is though. An international flight is an international flight whether it's on a CRJ to Cleveland or on a A345 to Honk Kong.

Trans-49th traffic is too close to being a domestic flight to really count, since customs and clearance is done considerably different given the close economic and political relations the US and Canada have. Going to Mexico or the Caribbean, then it becomes a whole different type of flight.

Quoting RoseFlyer (Reply 16):
YYC seems very high. A lot of people from YYC must leave during the winter.

Calgary has a very high percentage of the charters going to Mexico and the Caribbean during the winter months. If they aren't on those, then they are in RV's driving down I-15 clogging up traffic in SLC during rush hour trying to drive to Las Vegas, So. Calif or Arizona!

Quoting Bnamaxx (Reply 17):
I agree about the DFW statement. In the 17 years I lived there, all they talked about was making it a true "international" airport. So many have tried and left, probably most because they have to go up against AA.

The other factor is the cost of doing business at DFW, when they know they can get a better deal down the road at IAH/Bush. I think AA goes along with the cost factor at DFW just to get at WN, but that's a different argument for a different thread. The crux of the cost matter is however DFW has alternatives whereas Canada's YYZ (an even bigger case of an expensive airport) really doesn't, so hence foreign carriers will pay a premium to do business at Toronto/Pearson, but won't at DFW.



DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
User currently offlineBnamaxx From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (8 years ago) and read 7715 times:

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 19):
The other factor is the cost of doing business at DFW, when they know they can get a better deal down the road at IAH/Bush. I think AA goes along with the cost factor at DFW just to get at WN, but that's a different argument for a different thread. The crux of the cost matter is however DFW has alternatives whereas Canada's YYZ (an even bigger case of an expensive airport) really doesn't, so hence foreign carriers will pay a premium to do business at Toronto/Pearson, but won't at DFW.

Isn't this why DFW is offering incentives to foreign carriers? It is my understanding that is how they got MX to come back so quickly after they left.


User currently offlineAirplanetire From United States of America, joined May 2001, 1809 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (8 years ago) and read 7659 times:

I wonder if ATL would have moved up that list. Granted, the cities above it are very major international hubs, but Delta's build up of international flights from ATL has at least made a visible difference. Whereas several years ago, the international terminal would be busy only in the afternoons and evenings (flights from and to Europe), it is now packed in the mornings with flights to the Caribbean and Latin America and never gets too empty during the day, with the afternoons and evenings still being chaotic because there are so many people waiting for big planes.

User currently offlinePzurita1 From Greenland, joined Sep 2002, 1392 posts, RR: 14
Reply 22, posted (8 years ago) and read 7651 times:

I could not find the proper source but, if I remeber correctly, CUN has more international pax than MEX. CUN is somewhere around 7M international pax (out of a total of 10M during 2004). MEX is around 6.5M international pax (with over 22M total pax during 2004).

PZ



Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
User currently offlineRoseFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9595 posts, RR: 52
Reply 23, posted (7 years 12 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 7609 times:

Quoting Bnamaxx (Reply 17):
Transborder flights work both ways right? So what are the northbound numbers for some airports, say like SEA, where AS/QX/AC operate quite a few flights into Canada. It's easy to tweak the numbers to make them fit your particular argument.

I think a big factor in YYZ and YVR's transborder flights is that they are both hubs. AC serves a lot of places that have limited service. For example there are airports in the Midwest that have RJs/Dash 8s to YYZ that have no other international service, so that obviously gives an advantage to YYZ in having the big numbers. The same is true for ORD. LGA makes the list almost exclusively on flights to Canada. SEA does have lots of small service to western Canada on Horizon, but few of the larger planes like what AC operates from YVR.



If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineSLCUT2777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 4050 posts, RR: 11
Reply 24, posted (7 years 12 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 7277 times:

Quoting Pzurita1 (Reply 22):
I could not find the proper source but, if I remember correctly, CUN has more international pax than MEX. CUN is somewhere around 7M international pax (out of a total of 10M during 2004). MEX is around 6.5M international pax (with over 22M total pax during 2004).

This would not surprise me to say the least since so many of the international travelers into CUN are from the US or Canada especially on a winter holiday. It is a VERY popular resort area on the Caribbeans far western rim. But MEX is the busiest overall airport in Mexico, and it is the largest population center in North America.



DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
25 Idlewild : I'm curious. Why is LGA on the list? How many trips to Bermuda and Canada do they have? Are they including biz/gov't jets as well? I'm really shocked
26 Charliejag1 : Guam? What percentage of flights out of Guam are "domestic"? None? I don't know how many airports are on the island, though.
27 Spacecadet : It's measured in passengers. Not in commercial flights. That said, you can't seriously think there are all that many business and government jets fly
28 MCOflyer : MCO gets more passengers than MIA. Check out Orlandoairports.net MCOflyer
29 Thomasphoto60 : Isn't Wikipedia notoriously unreliable? Thomas
30 Jamincan : That may be, but according to the Bureau of Transportation Statistics, it has less international traffic (at least in 2000). If you read my post care
31 Dw9115 : Wikipedia is NOT a reliable source hence why they have been suede for misleading information and multiple out right lies and lost.
32 Post contains images Jamincan : I really don't see how this is relevant since the only thing Wikipedia provided was a link to a what I'm sure most of you would agree is a highly cre
33 AirCanada014 : Transborder flights doesn't consider international. As far as I know International flights consider flying over the ocean, we even consider Hawaii is
34 STT757 : Bermuda, Toronto, Montreal, Nassau, Aruba. It's ranking airports by how many International passengers are handled, not flights.
35 SESGDL : Recent BTS YTD statistics showed that from January to May this year that ATL had moved to #2 by international boardings with MIA back in the #1 spot.
36 Dw9115 : Oh I do not doubt that your info is correct after I went to the bts.gov site and looked it up. But when people look things up on Wikipedia I tend to
37 Thomasphoto60 : Ditto.... I believe that your initial post is very sincere and I am not condemning it, Jamincan, it is as DW 9115 just pointed out, phony links and i
38 Post contains images Kimmykun : More importantly, since when is Guam in North America?
39 MAH4546 : Orlando has no where near the international traffic that MIA has. That is for international passengers carried on US airlines.
40 FlyMIA : Thats great but that has nothing to do with what is being talked about on this topic. Miami has MUCH more International traffic than MCO.
41 Jayce : This is a bit of a grey area. I was always under the impression that an international destination was one outside of the country. As an example, I al
42 Steeler83 : Yeah, I am sure that PHL is much higher than that, considering the large (and growing) transatlantic hub US has there... Throw in some PHL-Asia when
43 Cslusarc : Ranking (000s) By Time Zone Atlantic Time 21 San Juan 2,501 Eastern Time 1 New York Kennedy 18,444 3 Toronto 17,000 4 Miami 16,629 6 Newark 8,794 9 Mo
44 Vega : To illustrate the inaccuracy of the 2000 data as it relates to the present, PHL had 4.1M International Passengers in 2005.
45 Flyboy14295 : DEN has to shuttle more passengers than 2770 in a day. That is really hard to believe that Calgary has more pax than DEN or SLC! But at 2000, it is un
46 Bnamaxx : Not sure about your home airport, but mine (BNA) DOES consider transborder (or anything not to one of the 50 states) to be international. I would thi
47 Post contains links Pzurita1 : Finally, official data for the other North American country: Mexican. Below are the sources for international pax. All data is for 2005 MEX 8,591,797
48 FlyMIA : This is only international passengers, as DEN and espcially SLC dont have much international traffic it makes sense since Calgary has alot of interna
49 SLCUT2777 : Thanks! I'm certain that CUN will be back up this year in that several of the resorts did significant renovations in addition to cleaning up the mess
50 Steeler83 : And the number is still ascending as US continues to add routes and cities to the international network at PHL...
51 SESGDL : Okay that would make more sense. Still quite an increase though. Jeremy
52 AirbusfanYYZ : International Definition: Involving more than one country. Sorry, but I'd say you're incorrect. Cheers, Kaz
53 Flyboy14295 : MIA, I stand corrected. Thanks for the reminder that this is Intl. pax only. Since DEN and SLC are not "coastal" cities, i would now understand why th
54 Post contains links Ginger727 : You should really look at the rankings for 2005 for the busiest airports of entry for overseas arriving passengers clearing customs to see how they st
55 AirCanada014 : thats true but for North America we all consider International as overseas where as traveling to and from US and Canada is Transborder service.
56 Jamincan : That doesn't mean that Transborder isn't also International. The only reason we have this distinction in Canada is because of the significance of the
57 Post contains images SLCUT2777 : The ONLY reason for this pre-clearance procedure is for customs purposes, the same reason we have the border crossings on land across the 49th. If Ca
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