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TOL Recieves Fed Grant For NYC Service  
User currently offlineTys777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 404 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 8 months 5 hours ago) and read 5693 times:

TOL recieved a Fed. grant worth 400,000$ to secure NYC service. Airport has said that they will negogiate with 3 already identified carriers. Grant will be matched by local sources to total almost $1,000,000.

Link to article

I figured that the three carriers would be DL, CO, with Jet Blue possibly being a long shot.

According to a 2004 study done for the port authority, Toledoans make about 94,000 air trips per year to New York. But because of frequent nonstop service, and typically better fares at Detroit Metropolitan-Wayne County Airport, 10 percent or fewer of those trips are made from Toledo Express

I did a fare search for OCT 14-16 and the cheapest fare out of DTW was 183$ while the cheapest out of TOL was 402$. Surely an airline like Jet Blue could survive on a route like this.

Any thoughts?

P.S.
This is my first post on here (been reading forever though)

[Edited 2006-08-25 19:26:28]


Is it bad that I get excited to see even a CRJ overfly? Man, what this place does to you
89 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineWMUPilot From United States of America, joined Jan 2003, 1473 posts, RR: 12
Reply 1, posted (7 years 8 months 4 hours ago) and read 5660 times:

Gosh I hope the hillbillies in our route planning department jump on this faster than a fat kid on a cupcake!

We really need to start expanding more to the west than CMH. The only problem is i'm not sure we have the aircraft available right now to add a new city. Maybe with the closure of the BUR-LAS, MCO flights we could.



JetBlue - Bringing humanity back to air travel
User currently offlineAS739X From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6004 posts, RR: 24
Reply 2, posted (7 years 8 months 4 hours ago) and read 5645 times:

Possibility of AirTran TOL-LGA?


ASLAX



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineTys777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 404 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (7 years 8 months 4 hours ago) and read 5617 times:

Quoting AS739X (Reply 2):
Possibility of AirTran TOL-LGA?

I don't see that happening, Airtran used to fly TOL back when they were a shell of the airline that they are now. If I remember right, they weren't getting the loads that they wanted due to not have the connections that passengers wanted. I believe the route was TOL-ATL.



Is it bad that I get excited to see even a CRJ overfly? Man, what this place does to you
User currently offlineMarkATL From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 539 posts, RR: 8
Reply 4, posted (7 years 8 months 4 hours ago) and read 5596 times:

I hear the Mud Hens have a massive fan base in Queens. This should help.

I suspect CoExp, DL Conex, or AE will be bellying up to the table for this helping of corporate welfare.



"...left my home in Georgia, 'n headed for the "Frisco" Bay...
User currently offlineTAN FLYR From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 1897 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (7 years 8 months 1 hour ago) and read 5509 times:

Quoting MarkATL (Reply 4):
suspect CoExp, DL Conex, or AE will be bellying up to the table for this helping of corporate welfare.

For Sure..what a waste of tax dollars..makes me sick.

It is not as if there are no flights available in a reasonable distance to NYC. This is just local greed to subsidize service that can not exist profitably on it's own merit. ( at most an hour from most anywhere in metro TOL to DTW via either 75/275 or 23/94)

The EAS is another example of this for many communites to have "airline service", when reasonable and affordable service is usually an hour or so drive away. Now if it a community say, Pierre, Sd (and I don't know if they are an EAS airport) that is diffferent.


User currently offlineTys777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 404 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (7 years 8 months ago) and read 5473 times:

Quoting TAN FLYR (Reply 5):
For Sure..what a waste of tax dollars..makes me sick.

It is not as if there are no flights available in a reasonable distance to NYC. This is just local greed to subsidize service that can not exist profitably on it's own merit. ( at most an hour from most anywhere in metro TOL to DTW via either 75/275 or 23/94)

The EAS is another example of this for many communites to have "airline service", when reasonable and affordable service is usually an hour or so drive away. Now if it a community say, Pierre, Sd (and I don't know if they are an EAS airport) that is diffferent.

I agree, it is a waste of tax money b ut when they offer it, why not use it?

An hour to DTW? more like 1 1/2 minimum



Is it bad that I get excited to see even a CRJ overfly? Man, what this place does to you
User currently offlineBillReid From Netherlands, joined Jun 2006, 968 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (7 years 8 months ago) and read 5461 times:

The TOL SCASD grant application was based upon B6 target.
You can assume that they will be looking for B6 to enter and stimulate service.



Some people don't get it. Business is about making MONEY!
User currently offlineTys777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 404 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (7 years 8 months ago) and read 5454 times:

Quoting BillReid (Reply 7):
The TOL SCASD grant application was based upon B6 target.
You can assume that they will be looking for B6 to enter and stimulate service.

Do you have a source for that?

I would like to see B6 be the one to get this and serve TOL
It would allow me to fly from BNA back to my hometown for a decent fare while at the same time avoiding DTW and ATL



Is it bad that I get excited to see even a CRJ overfly? Man, what this place does to you
User currently offlineMarkATL From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 539 posts, RR: 8
Reply 9, posted (7 years 8 months ago) and read 5437 times:

Quoting Tys777 (Reply 6):
I agree, it is a waste of tax money b ut when they offer it, why not use it?

An hour to DTW? more like 1 1/2 minimum

If there was a market for NYC-TOL non-stop service then their would be a flight. Glass capitol of the world or not, TOL is a low level secondary market. I think the people of Toledo could find better uses for their $$$. The two most populated cooridors into TOL are from the north and the east. you only have to go a few miles north before DTW is not that much farther. To the east CLE isn't that far either. I used to go Port Clinton all the time and didn't mind one bit flying into CLE.

I bet the guys who came up with this are frequnt useres of prostitutes....They understand the concept, if you're too pathetic to get it on your own....you have pay for it!  stirthepot 



"...left my home in Georgia, 'n headed for the "Frisco" Bay...
User currently offlineBillReid From Netherlands, joined Jun 2006, 968 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (7 years 8 months ago) and read 5420 times:

Yes the applications were all viewable at the DOT website. I went through each and every application, reviewed them by dollar amount and by state.
Unfortunately that site is now closed because the awards have been issued.

from an air service standpoint B6 will review the market very carefully considering the grant and the support that is included by TOL. I recall the support tolalling well over 1MM$$ from TOL including all the community support.

On the flip side I thought the strangest SCASD award was the to LAWA for Palmdale. Here we had Los Angeles World Airports applying for a grant for a regional flight between two airports they already manage Palmdale and LAX.

Another interesting award was Melbourne FL. They have been looking for additional service for some time with little success. Most airlines see them as too close to SFB and MCO. We'll see, perhaps BRAD D. exDELTA now with SABRE can diliver the goods. Good luck Brad.



Some people don't get it. Business is about making MONEY!
User currently offlineMarkATL From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 539 posts, RR: 8
Reply 11, posted (7 years 8 months ago) and read 5413 times:

Quoting BillReid (Reply 10):
Another interesting award was Melbourne FL. They have been looking for additional service for some time with little success. Most airlines see them as too close to SFB and MCO

Not to mention DAB.



"...left my home in Georgia, 'n headed for the "Frisco" Bay...
User currently offlineBillReid From Netherlands, joined Jun 2006, 968 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 5406 times:

Agreed, but a bit further than SFB/MCO.


Some people don't get it. Business is about making MONEY!
User currently offlineMarkATL From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 539 posts, RR: 8
Reply 13, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 5393 times:

Quoting BillReid (Reply 12):
Agreed, but a bit further than SFB/MCO

I agree, my/our point is that the area is already VERY well served. SFB being so far east of town is quite close. Although at times I think it is the UKs most western airport.



"...left my home in Georgia, 'n headed for the "Frisco" Bay...
User currently offlineFATFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2001, 5772 posts, RR: 15
Reply 14, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 5361 times:

Quoting BillReid (Reply 10):
Unfortunately that site is now closed because the awards have been issued.

The DOT info is still available:
Results:
http://dmses.dot.gov/docimages/pdf97/408502_web.pdf

All applications can still be reviewed and read in this list:
http://dms.dot.gov/search/searchResu...umberValue=23671&searchType=docket

Most people missed the thread on here with all the awards. It posted the day of the arrests in the UK.
http://www.airliners.net/discussions...general_aviation/read.main/2930955



"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
User currently offlineFlyinryan99 From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 1986 posts, RR: 12
Reply 15, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 5290 times:

CO most likely won't go after this especially with them bringing Dash 8s on the TOL-CLE route in the near future.

B6 was the target of this route but haven't been too receptive to the idea but are still listening.

For those saying it's just easier to fly to DTW, that's not the point. The point is all of the Toledo residents using DTW are taking money away from the city/port authority. It may be just as easy to go up to DTW and take a direct flight. Personally (not just because I like TOL but from a pax standpoint), I would rather fly TOL any day over DTW even though I live right inbetween the two airports. I prefer to keep the money in my hometown. That being said, the problem is fares. Fares, fares, fares. It was said up higher that DTW is $183 and TOL is $402...There is too demand from this city, problem is they if can't compete in the fare department, they'll lose every time which is the case right now. That is why the TOL authority went after B6, new name and competive fares. Speaking of B6, how's it going there Brian??

FL won't touch TOL with a 10 foot pole, especially with DTW being so successful. I wouldn't be surprised if FL really tried to go after NK up there in trying to fly some core routes for them...maybe LGA and BOS and LAS. Never again will FL be in TOL.

Ryan

P.s. Most of Toledo's metro population is moving south and west.


User currently offlineDTWAGENT From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 1283 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 5218 times:

If TOL had more flights and advertised their airport more they would have a great thing on their hands. Look at FNT. A few years ago it was just like TOL now it has grown.

I know from my stand point and my clients if they could by pass DTW and go to TOL they would.

If your booking a cruise with air, it is cheeper out of TOL then DTW.

Chuck


User currently offlineMasseyBrown From United States of America, joined Dec 2002, 5216 posts, RR: 7
Reply 17, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 5186 times:

Quoting MarkATL (Reply 9):
I used to go Port Clinton all the time and didn't mind one bit flying into CLE.

So did my family, from Maryland. Didn't you take the Port Clinton oath? ... to keep the place secret?



Consilivm: Cave ne nothi te vexant
User currently offlineOuboy79 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 4482 posts, RR: 22
Reply 18, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 5176 times:

Quoting Tys777 (Reply 3):
I don't see that happening, Airtran used to fly TOL back when they were a shell of the airline that they are now. If I remember right, they weren't getting the loads that they wanted due to not have the connections that passengers wanted. I believe the route was TOL-ATL.

The loads were actually doing great before they left, but it was all low yeild traffic. Owens Corning, Dana, Owens Illinois, and the other major Toledo-based were married to Delta and their SkyMiles. Of course now Delta is shunning them with continued service cuts.

Quoting TAN FLYR (Reply 5):
For Sure..what a waste of tax dollars..makes me sick.

It is not as if there are no flights available in a reasonable distance to NYC. This is just local greed to subsidize service that can not exist profitably on it's own merit. ( at most an hour from most anywhere in metro TOL to DTW via either 75/275 or 23/94)

Please keep in mind what these dollars have done before. Akron Canton is probably the best example. I don't really see how this is local greed? They asked for a measly $400K. Let see how many other towns out there asked for much more for projects like Cessna service to a major city, or for a Co-Op, or to get one RJ on an existing route/service. The key with TOL and markets like it before, the people are there...its just a matter of busting the fares and getting the service in there. Once that happens the people will change their habits.

Quoting MarkATL (Reply 9):
If there was a market for NYC-TOL non-stop service then their would be a flight. Glass capitol of the world or not, TOL is a low level secondary market. I think the people of Toledo could find better uses for their $$$. The two most populated cooridors into TOL are from the north and the east. you only have to go a few miles north before DTW is not that much farther. To the east CLE isn't that far either. I used to go Port Clinton all the time and didn't mind one bit flying into CLE.

Obviously your knowledge of the market and area is severely limited. There is a market for Las Vegas service, but the nonstop isn't there. Why? Costs are too high. Allegient was pulling 80% loads and TOL was their 4th largest city for the first half of the year. Sometimes you need incentives like this to help kick start a turn around. It should also be noted, this is the first time they are really going in and subsidizing the service directly like this. They have done incentives before...but that was mainly by way of free local advertising and reduced airport costs. They have never done a revenue guarantee before. So don't be to hard on this city...they have tried everything else before. Unlike other cities.

As far as the population make up. The majority of the growth is South and West. The old population centers north and east are declining as people migrate west closer to the airport and south into Wood County. At least these are where the higher income residents are going - which probably fly more than a family in the central city.

----

My feelings on this. They will approach Delta, but I hope they stay away. JetBlue is the obvious choice here that would really get the city moving. Continental would be nice, but I think they are happy with the CLE service. American wouldn't be that far out there. I would like to see them use an airline that has the ability to expand to multiple cities over time. This way if the grant is successful and really isn't need (Read: CAK), they can utilize those funds to support the start up of additional cities.



Any opinion/comment posted is that of my own and not that of Southwest Airlines Co.
User currently offlineCMHSRQ From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 989 posts, RR: 4
Reply 19, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 5115 times:

SRQ is an example of how a SCASD grant can turn an airport around. 3 years ago they had declining traffic and only 4 carriers. They got the grant, traffic is up 20% with FL, B6, and AC all new carriers all adding service. The grant was for FL to operate 2 flights to ATL and 1 to BWI. This winter they will operate 9 dailies to 5 different cities. So good luck TOL, just hope that the local population supports the flights and they don't all run off to DL to get the miles.


The voice of moderation
User currently offlineDTW757 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 1528 posts, RR: 3
Reply 20, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 5065 times:

Quoting Tys777 (Reply 6):
An hour to DTW? more like 1 1/2 minimum

HUH? What part of Toledo takes 1 1/2 hours miniumum to DTW? From where I live in Toledo I can be to DTW in under an hour.



721,2,732,3,4,5,G,8,9,741,2,3,4,752,3,762,3,4,772,3,788,D93,5,M80,D10,M11,L10,100,AB6,319,20,21,332,3,388,146,CR2,7,ERJ,
User currently offlineTys777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 404 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 5040 times:

Quoting DTW757 (Reply 20):
What part of Toledo takes 1 1/2 hours miniumum to DTW? From where I live in Toledo I can be to DTW in under an hour.

The southern suburbs always took me around 1 1/2 to get to DTW, give or take 10 min



Is it bad that I get excited to see even a CRJ overfly? Man, what this place does to you
User currently offlineMarkATL From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 539 posts, RR: 8
Reply 22, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 5013 times:

The service will most likely be once a day. Don't look for any carrier to open a new station for this. The only ones going for this pure pork will be an airline that already has an station at TOL. In short, B6 is a loooooooong shot at best.


"...left my home in Georgia, 'n headed for the "Frisco" Bay...
User currently offlineJoeman From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 690 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 4979 times:

Quoting Ouboy79 (Reply 18):
Allegient was pulling 80% loads and TOL was their 4th largest city for the first half of the year.



Quoting Ouboy79 (Reply 18):
I believe the route was TOL-ATL.
The loads were actually doing great before they left, but it was all low yeild traffic

Good loads and can't make money in a market that is obviously there.

Quoting Flyinryan99 (Reply 15):
Fares, fares, fares. It was said up higher that DTW is $183 and TOL is $402.

That was about NYC Service. So, drive to a hub or fly them to a one, soak them with higher fares and all answers are solved. How dumb is this industry these days?


User currently offlineOuboy79 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 4482 posts, RR: 22
Reply 24, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 4958 times:

Quoting MarkATL (Reply 22):
The service will most likely be once a day. Don't look for any carrier to open a new station for this. The only ones going for this pure pork will be an airline that already has an station at TOL. In short, B6 is a loooooooong shot at best.

I would recommend reading the TOL application. It actually does a cost break down on 2-3 daily trips and the expected financial performance. You may find it informative.

Quoting Joeman (Reply 23):
Good loads and can't make money in a market that is obviously there.

Absolutely. That is why American is running 4 flights a day to Chicago and they are perfectly happy. They were going to go to 7 daily at one point...but never went back there. The market is there for more, but they are making a killing on yeilds in the market. Why mess with making a ton of money by increase capacity?



Any opinion/comment posted is that of my own and not that of Southwest Airlines Co.
25 DTW757 : Even if you live in Perrysburg it shouldn't take 1 1/2 hours Start: Perrysburg, Ohio, United States End: Detroit Metropolitan Airport (airport), Romu
26 Post contains images MarkATL : Another thing to look at is IF B6 came the service would be to JFK. By the time you deal with the Van Wyck and the other JFK related issues (distance
27 Ouboy79 : Umm...do you even know what the SCASD program? Or Small Community Air Service Development program. This is for non-EAS markets that need a little hel
28 Flyinryan99 : This is relevant how? And please get with it...the award is for the SCASD as mentioned above not EAS. Once again, this has to do with keeping money i
29 Post contains images MarkATL : Ouch, I'm not even going to defend that then. Sometimes you just gotta admit you're a schmuck. I applaude your clever use using my own words, albeit
30 Post contains images Ouboy79 : No worries. It happens to us all. I can agree on the waste of tax dollars in certain cases. Such as some of the crazy bids such as Cessna service to
31 TAN FLYR : Well, IMHO..EADS/ SCASD..whatever you want to call it in this case. TOL is not a small community nor should it be considered for EAS considering its'
32 Post contains images MarkATL : It's not, but I did have a great time.    Perhaps after reading this throngs of horney rich CEOs will fly to TOL to look at building manufacturing
33 FWAERJ : Oddly enough, I read in the local paper a while back that FWA's catchment area had over 100,000 O&D pax to the NYC area each year, which is slightly m
34 Ouboy79 : So are you also against the success this project has had at CAK and SRQ? Where, lets be honest, the money has already been recouped through taxes gen
35 MarkATL : Fine. Just give back the $400,000 and raise it locally. Maybe you could go to NYC and see if they'll chip in? I'm sure they just as upset about no be
36 Post contains links and images Ouboy79 : http://www.aviationplanning.com/smallcommunity.htm I would recommend reading Boyd's site on the SCASD program. Especially the communities and purpose
37 Ouboy79 : I wanted to point out Fresno, CA really quick...comment from Boyd's site: Fresno, California: The Boyd Group helped the community win a $1 million gra
38 MarkATL : All I read was an add from a consulting firm wanting to get cities to PAY for their services weather or not successful. More tax dollars spent......
39 Milesrich : UA operated, prior to deregulation and going back to the days of Viscounts and DC-6's, nonstops between TOL and EWR for years, as well as nonstops fro
40 Joeman : Hmmmmn. Looks like the market is there, but why service the market when passengers can have the pleasure of being routed through the likes of DTW (ev
41 Ouboy79 : Then what would be the point of offering any O&D markets except at the large hub airports? I mean its almost as if people just throw common sense out
42 Joeman : I support the service. My response was regarding vain large city hub netters that think the world revolves around them.
43 MarkATL : I assume I'm one of those "vain large city hub netters that think the world revolves around them". Yes, I live in Atlanta...so? The catchent area of
44 MarkATL : At 43% O/D Atlant does pull the numbers, enough so that even AA operates p2p service ATL-LGA in comptition to DLs service. I fail to see your point h
45 Joeman : I hope not. With 53% of ATL traffic coming from other destinations, to go to other destinations, why can't Toledo have a lousy flight to NYC unless y
46 Joeman : I meant DTW, but NYC too.
47 MarkATL : Well it's simple....It's not commercially viable without civic welfare payments to cover the costs. I would sure like to live in a place like LA, SF
48 Joeman : I hear you, but my tax dollars have been spent on lots of what I feel is waste. In fact, they've been used to protect DL, apparently a not commerciall
49 Falcon84 : I've never heard that we'll be putting Dash anythings in our fleet in CLE. We have the Beech1900 for Commutair, the Saab 340 for Regions Air, and Com
50 MarkATL : I agree the Bankruptcy laws are way to lax. However, it's the creditiors not the governmnet footing the bill on this (expept the PBGT dumping, whole
51 KALB : "UA operated, prior to deregulation and going back to the days of Viscounts and DC-6's, nonstops between TOL and EWR for years, as well as nonstops fr
52 Joeman : Thanks, I thought UA had TOL-NYC service way back when, didn't realize it was EWR, and had nothing to cite. Although load factors were often in the 4
53 MasseyBrown : I checked the BTS for Toledo data. The airport has declined significantly over the last three years. 555K pax in 2003; 407K pax in the last 12 months
54 Joeman : I wonder if the market itself has declined so much or there's a greater reliance on DTW as a point of origin since its a relatively short drive to an
55 Ouboy79 : Its one of those things...when the service arrives, people will. AirTran took the ATL O&D market from the 50 pax per day range to around 250 a day wh
56 Flyinryan99 : TOL used to have over 60 passengers per day when US flew TOL-PIT. I could post all of the Quarters of history but I'm too lazy.
57 Tys777 : I remember when TOL used to have mainline from US and DL, man were those the good ole days for that airport
58 MasseyBrown : No need, I believe you. Does the potential TOL operator need prices competitive with DTW or prices lower than DTW to get the business back?
59 DTW757 : We've seen so many carriers here in TOL over the years. Allegheny, Delta, Delta Connection, TWA, United, Air Wisconsin, Piedmont, USAir, Frontier, Ai
60 Post contains images Flyinryan99 : My guess is they would need to be fairly competitive not necessarily lower (if American Eagle or Delta, jetBlue may need to be lower to attract more
61 Joeman : CAK has made a comeback despite its close proximity to CLE, just as TOL to DTW. In fact, CAK draws from CLE with fare competition. There's been adver
62 KALB : Back in the '70's and into the 80's EA operated DC-9s and 727-200s into TOL, I think primarily to and from ATL. UA even operated non-stop service to D
63 Tys777 : Don't forget the 747-400 that Quantas flies in a few times a week,
64 Post contains links and images Ouboy79 : They also had a couple flights that went to CMH continuing to CLT. As far as UA...its amazing how quick they tossed the market away... http://www.usa
65 Joeman : Yep, as said earlier, the flights were to DTW and CMH with continuing service to Charlotte and Tampa in early 1966. The DC-8 was a night coach DTW-TO
66 DTW757 : Can you imagine getting on an airplane today in DTW for TPA and have to make stops in TOL and CMH? How well do you think that would go over? The adve
67 Ouboy79 : I always found it interesting to stop in different airports you normally wouldn't go to. Delta ran flight 290 for decades on the ATL-TOL-FWA-ATL turn
68 Joeman : Probably the same as when hubs are closed or sliced. Even back then both DL and EA had nonstop DTW-TPA and itineraries such as these were probably mo
69 TAN FLYR : The Nov. 1979 OAG shows service to STL twice daily. I would think the price could be as much as 20-30 dollars higher than DTW to compensate for the d
70 DTW757 : At one point in the 80's TWA did offer JFK service, I beleive the flight went JFK-TOL-STL, I'm almost positive of that. I don't have a schedule from
71 Post contains links DTW757 : The Toledo Blade ran an editorial today about using DTW versus TOL. http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs...909/OPINION02/609090343/-1/OPINION
72 FlyPNS1 : I think the Toledo Blade is clueless, if they think re-regulation is going to save them. It might get them a few more flights (maybe even mainline), b
73 Xjramper : The toledo Blade is clueless in general. -------------------- I am not going to beat a dead horse here, but I am looking forward to seeing what becom
74 KarlB737 : Xjramper what do you think will spark a change at TOL?
75 Ouboy79 : The Blade really has no clue on what is going on in the industry. They obviously have paid zero attention to cities like CAK, FNT, and others that hav
76 Xjramper : Knowing our Port board, that was a mis-statement. However, this statement was purely "gut feeling". This is the first good thing to happen to Toledo
77 Tys777 : " target=_blank>http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs...INION One thing you need to remember about the Blabe is that they are in love with Carty Finkbe
78 DTW757 : I just saw on 13 ABC that this flight will be operated by Allegiant. I'll look for more details.
79 Flyinryan99 : 13ABC got it wrong...It's going to be Allegiant to PIE. Surprised they got that wrong because they are usually the best ones at reporting the news.
80 TOLtommy : Well if it is indeed Allegiant to PIE, then it'll be the first of two announcements. Hopefully another airline will want to use the grant to start som
81 KALB : "The toledo Blade is clueless in general." But it's "One of America's finest newspapers". Gotta be true since it says so on the Toledo Blade banner (Y
82 Flyinryan99 : I've heard they are in talks but they aren't saying the specific airlines. They're target is definitely JetBlue because it would also bring lower far
83 TOLtommy : If Paul and the board does it right, they really could sell TOL to B6 as the next CAK. The 190 would be perfect for TOL. What I'd really like to see i
84 Post contains images Flyinryan99 : The board is the problem unfortunately. Him and Kris are doing the best they can with the crap they deal with. Preachin to the choir here! I would lo
85 TOLtommy : I think B6 at TOL would reverse the traffic flow and then some. You know Detroiters would drive down, just to try JetBlue out. I thought about a 190 t
86 Tys777 : I would love to see US start back up, I like to think there is the demand from people wanting to travel to the southeastern US and right now the only
87 Post contains links DTW757 : I just looked up on Allegiant's website and they are indeed comfirming the service to be to PIE and not NYC. 13 ABC wanted to jump on the story and go
88 Flyinryan99 : They fixed it. "Tampa flights from Toledo ExpressWTVG-- September 14, 2006 - Allegiant Air will begin offering non-stop flights to Tampa, Florida, out
89 Post contains links TOLtommy : Well its official.... http://www.allegiantair.com/aaNews20060914c.php "The self-proclaimed "Official Airline for Sunshine" will launch the new schedul
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