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AI To Fly New York-BOM Non-Stop From April 2007  
User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 47
Posted (8 years 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 12091 times:

Air-India to fly non-stop to New York from April. Link:
http://www.samachar.com/showurl.htm?...-India~to~fly~non-stop~to~New~York

Quotes:
Air-India would start flying daily non-stop from New York to Mumbai from April, the airline has announced. “Mathur said the non-stop service would begin following the delivery of the state-of-the-art B777-200 LR (Long Range) from February by Boeing.

Mathur said A-I was also looking at three other American cities — Washington D.C., Houston / Dallas and San Francisco — as part of its next phase of expansion plans in US. “These operations would be eventually daily,” he said, adding the exact date of launching these operations was yet to be decided based on the delivery of the planes.

With addition of these three cities and the non-stop flight, the number of A-I flights between US and India would double from 28 to 56 eventually. It is a long way from just 10 flights some three years ago. A-I is also planning to increase the frequency of its Toronto flight from the present five days a week to daily. In the next phase of expansion, A-I is looking to start its service to Vancouver, he said.

While Continental flies between Newark and New Delhi, American operates its services from Chicago to New Delhi. Delta recently announced that it would fly non-stop from New York to Mumbai from November. Though the two non-stop flights of Continental and American are said to be flying to full capacity, an economic analysis, experts feel, is yet to be done.

The duration of the non-stop flight, would be 13 to 14 hours, as against 17-18 hours with a stopover in Europe.

77 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineCHIFLYGUY From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 141 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (8 years 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 12076 times:

Interesting news. What plane is DL planning to use to fly JFK-BOM? I had thought that the reason CO and AA flew to DEL was because of the lack of range of the 772-ER. Is DL actually taking delivery of LR's? How are they planning to fly it?

User currently offlineAvatordon From United States of America, joined May 2006, 239 posts, RR: 4
Reply 2, posted (8 years 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 12053 times:

Will Air India fly from JFK or EWR?

User currently offlineWorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (8 years 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 11998 times:

DL will use the 777-200ER and they expect to be able to fly it nonstop. It will be the longest 777-200ER flight in terms of time. I'm sure it will have no cargo capacity but DL undoubtedly saw AI coming and knew they had to be in the market first or lose everything they have put into India over the past 15 years.

The same thing can be said about AI relative to Kingfisher and the other Indian new entrants.

The 777LR is the ideal plane for the market but you can't wait around for it if you don't have it or you will lose the market. Even if DL takes payload restrictions, it is better than losing the market. It says that travel to India via Europe from the US is quickly coming to an end. Bad news for BA.

[Edited 2006-09-01 02:56:22]

User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 47
Reply 4, posted (8 years 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 11988 times:

Quoting CHIFLYGUY (Reply 1):
Interesting news. What plane is DL planning to use to fly JFK-BOM? I had thought that the reason CO and AA flew to DEL was because of the lack of range of the 772-ER. Is DL actually taking delivery of LR's? How are they planning to fly it?

Delta will use 772ER on JFK-BOM route. I suppose range is not an issue with a reduced payload. The timings are as follows:

Depart JFK at 9:20 p.m. Arrive BOM at 10:10 p.m. Flight Duration 14.5 hours
Depart BOM at 12:10 a.m. Arrive JFK at 6.00 a.m.


User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 47
Reply 5, posted (8 years 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 11972 times:

Quoting Avatordon (Reply 2):
Will Air India fly from JFK or EWR?

It would make more sense from EWR as a large immigrant community from BOM is based in New Jersey.


User currently offlineWorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (8 years 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 11972 times:

As of now, DL is selling the full capacity of the aircraft - they are not planning any payload restrictions.

I think your times might be off.... at one time it was showing on delta.com as 16 1/2 hrs. I suspect DL has the times messed up due to the time changes. They've done it before. It can't be shorter than CO's EWR-DEL.


User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 47
Reply 7, posted (8 years 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 11929 times:

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 6):
think your times might be off.... at one time it was showing on delta.com as 16 1/2 hrs. I suspect DL has the times messed up due to the time changes. They've done it before. It can't be shorter than CO's EWR-DEL.
The timing are correct as per Delta site. The flight duration on return journey is 16 hours 20 minutes.

[Edited 2006-09-01 03:17:48]

User currently offlineJacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 59
Reply 8, posted (8 years 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 11929 times:

SFO would be interesting...there is a massive Indian population in the Bay Area, especially in Sunnyvale, Fremont, San Jose, etc.

I think AI would clean house to SFO..

apropos, this 777-200LR flew nonstop to SFO from BOM.....granted it wasn't full of pax (there were about 45 "important" people on board), but it's was cool to see anyway.. yes 


MyAviation.net photo:
Click here for bigger photo!
Photo © Jacobin777
MyAviation.net photo:
Click here for bigger photo!
Photo © Jacobin777




"Up the Irons!"
User currently offlineWorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (8 years 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 11858 times:

thanks, LAX. There's a glitch w/ delta.com. I'm pulling it up and it's giving me 15.20 in each direction.

User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16866 posts, RR: 51
Reply 10, posted (8 years 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 11709 times:

Quoting Avatordon (Reply 2):
Will Air India fly from JFK or EWR?

Im interested too, AI flies daily 747-400 EWR-CDG-BOM.

AI will do well with Houston and San Francisco, San Francisco needs a nonstop to Bangalore to serve the tech communities.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineBOMboy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 28 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (8 years 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 11699 times:

Now if only AI joined Star Alliance as well.....

User currently offlineBehramjee From Canada, joined Aug 2003, 4784 posts, RR: 43
Reply 12, posted (8 years 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 11604 times:

Currently AI flies to EWR with a B 744 with the routing being AMD-BOM-CDG-EWR. The reason why AMD is part of the routing is due to the EWR area having a huge concentration of Indian Gujratis.

It would be wise therefore for AI to fly 4 weekly AMD-BOM-EWR-BOM-AMD and 3 weekly BOM-EWR-BOM with their B 772LR.


User currently offlineCha747 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 785 posts, RR: 6
Reply 13, posted (8 years 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 11578 times:

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 3):
Bad news for BA.

And Lufthansa, Emirates, KLM, Air France, Austrian, Royal Jordanian, Swiss, and a few others that offer 1-stop service through Europe or the Middle East. Wonderful news for Indian nationals coming from India who won't have to be bothered getting transit visas for the countries that require them.



You land a million planes safely, then you have one little mid-air and you never hear the end of it - Pushing Tin
User currently offlineCopaair737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (8 years 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 11571 times:

Would AI get another 772LR to launch SFO, or will SFO be launched as a by-product of an aircraft being freed up because a NYC flight will go to a 772LR instead of the 744?

-Copa


User currently offlineJaysit From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (8 years 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 11493 times:

Indian nationals who have valid US or Canadian visas don't need EU transit visas anymore.

Plus, remember that having a nonstop JFK-BOM nonstop doesn't serve the interests of those who are in cities not served by a nonstop. It's a lot more convenient to fly nonstop to a European hub from any city in the US served by one of the EU carriers, and then on to India.


User currently offlineHimmat01 From India, joined Dec 2004, 1047 posts, RR: 6
Reply 16, posted (8 years 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 11427 times:

People travelling from MAA, BLR or HYD would still prefer to fly via Europe on LH, AF or BA. They would not like to transit through BOM unless GVK is able to develop it into a world class hub.

AI must real get over it's BOM and DEL fixation. Or else the Govt. should let IT fly non stop from BLR/MAA to the US.



An airplane might disappoint any pilot but it'll never surprise a good one.
User currently offlineJacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 59
Reply 17, posted (8 years 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 11410 times:

Quoting Jaysit (Reply 15):

Plus, remember that having a nonstop JFK-BOM nonstop doesn't serve the interests of those who are in cities not served by a nonstop. It's a lot more convenient to fly nonstop to a European hub from any city in the US served by one of the EU carriers, and then on to India.

I agree..however, I think this route would do well just on O&D alone....also, AA's ORD-DEL doesn't have the best connection time in DEL either but the route is doing very well..

....I've been planning to go back to India via AA to visit some relatives and the 9:35 p.m. arrival time basically has no connecting flights...

a potential (operative word) problem I see is the uncles and aunties not wanting to sit on a plane for such a long period of time...however, given that its not too much more than ORD/EWR-DEL, hopefully it won't be a problem...of course, one never knows with aunties and uncles...

"nah baboo...dont vant to sit in the plane for that long.."  spin 



"Up the Irons!"
User currently offlineNimish From India, joined Feb 2005, 3235 posts, RR: 9
Reply 18, posted (8 years 2 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 11349 times:

So are any schedules available? Would AI have any "Special" seats/pricing for these flights? How would the connectivity at either end be? How is the a/c going to be configured (in terms of F/J/Y or Y+)?

Ever since AI ordered the LR's, this was an obvious/stated route.

I think this announcement is trying to take the attention off the DL's BOM-JFK announcement (and their much earlier start date).

What would make sense now is sharing details about the flight and throwing open bookings (assuming of course that they've done all their homework, unlike PK with their LRs).



Latest Trip Report - GoAir BLR-BOM-BLR
User currently offlineKaran69 From India, joined Oct 2004, 2889 posts, RR: 17
Reply 19, posted (8 years 2 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 11281 times:

Quoting LAXDESI (Thread starter):
Air-India to fly non-stop to New York from April

I said this in one of the earlier Indian Aviation Threads but got a lot of opposition and criticisims from a particular member.

Quoting LAXDESI (Reply 5):
It would make more sense from EWR as a large immigrant community from BOM is based in New Jersey.

Also i think that it will be easier for them to obtain the convinient slot at EWR rather than a slot constrained airport like JFK, but i have a feeling JFK will be chosen in terms of a pure marketing basis. As many a time if a person thinks of an airport in NY he immediately thinks of JFK.

Quoting Behramjee (Reply 12):
It would be wise therefore for AI to fly 4 weekly AMD-BOM-EWR-BOM-AMD and 3 weekly BOM-EWR-BOM with their B 772LR.

I was thinking the same thing if they went to EWR, start it from a A310 in AMD-BOM and conviniently connect it to the 772LR.

Another route that would be very profitable it they decided to do the BOM-JFK nonstop would be BOM-AMD-LHR-EWR, would really have high yields year round.

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 3):
Even if DL takes payload restrictions, it is better than losing the market. It says that travel to India via Europe from the US is quickly coming to an end. Bad news for BA.

I dont think they will have to take heavy payload restrictions atleast on JFK-BOM, considering 14.30 hrs is a pretty normal duration for a 772ER,
i am not to sure about BOM-JFK.

Quoting Cha747 (Reply 13):
And Lufthansa, Emirates, KLM, Air France, Austrian, Royal Jordanian, Swiss, and a few others that offer 1-stop service through Europe or the Middle East

Travel from INdia to US via Europe is nowhere near ending until AI and even 9W realise the potential from secondary cities they is ample opportunity for the likes of BA/EK/SQ etc..

Quoting Cha747 (Reply 13):
Wonderful news for Indian nationals coming from India who won't have to be bothered getting transit visas for the countries that require them.

Indians dont have to have a transit visa if they hold valid travel documents to their onward american destination.

Quoting Copaair737 (Reply 14):
Would AI get another 772LR to launch SFO, or will SFO be launched as a by-product of an aircraft being freed up because a NYC flight will go to a 772LR instead of the 744?

No idea of how SFo will be launched altough more likely than not it will be on a 772LR, and the 744 routes will be maintained despite the launch of the non-stop flights.

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 17):
potential (operative word) problem I see is the uncles and aunties not wanting to sit on a plane for such a long period of time...however, given that its not too much more than ORD/EWR-DEL, hopefully it won't be a problem...of course, one never knows with aunties and uncles...

Mate i hear that AIs new product on the 772LR will be revolutionary , as far as i read on the airliner-india forum the 772LR will be configured in or under 200 seats and specail care is being taken for "old uncles/aunties" who travel in economy class.


Karan


User currently offlineGr8Circle From Canada, joined Dec 2005, 3107 posts, RR: 4
Reply 20, posted (8 years 2 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 11040 times:

AI enjoys a good position as a low cost option on LHR-JFK sector.....so they may just continue to operate the 744 on BOM-LHR-JFK and make the non-stop from EWR - BOM......

But will the outbound flight from BOM - EWR (or JFK, we still don't know...) also be non-stop...?


User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11632 posts, RR: 61
Reply 21, posted (8 years 2 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 10916 times:

I think it is going to become increasingly difficult for airlines like BA, Lufthansa, Air France and Northwest to sell North America-India itineraries to high-value, time-sensitive business travelers now that there is going to be so much nonstop competition between the U.S. and India.

User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5759 posts, RR: 47
Reply 22, posted (8 years 2 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 10904 times:

It seems to me that they will operate two daily flights between JFK and BOM. One that is nonstop and the other flying through LHR on the 744. Is that right?


That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineJaysit From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (8 years 2 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 10851 times:

Quoting Karan69 (Reply 19):
Mate i hear that AIs new product on the 772LR will be revolutionary , as far as i read on the airliner-india forum the 772LR will be configured in or under 200 seats and specail care is being taken for "old uncles/aunties" who travel in economy class.

Revolutionary would mean that they have IFE that works.


User currently offlineMbm3 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 841 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (8 years 2 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 10759 times:
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Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 6):
As of now, DL is selling the full capacity of the aircraft - they are not planning any payload restrictions.

Selling the full capacity of the aircraft does not mean they are accepting cargo freight. I really do not see a 772ER making this trip with a full passenger and cargo load.



Let Me Tell You, Landing A 772ER Is Harder Than It Looks!
25 WorldTraveler : There is already evidence that AA and CO’s nonstops to India are hurting one-stop or connect routings by other carriers over Europe – which expla
26 Sshank : Karan, JFK is very hard to get to for most NYC /Northern NJ people, both in terms of time and expense. For example, if you were to try to get a frien
27 Nimish : Really - wow, that's good for the non-stops (I'm a huge supporter, nothing like being in air 18 hours!)? Worldtraveller - I would be interested to se
28 Post contains images Jacobin777 : Thanks for the info Karan , but under 200 seats, it might make the route a bit uneconomical....QF is having the same problem.....IIRC, they need more
29 Cornish : So how do you explain the success of the likes of Emirates, who are doing rather nicely from building a one-stop change in DXB network ? They've take
30 ATLTraveler : I dont understand why there is never any talk of Non-stops from Atlanta to either Del/Bom. There is a huge indian communtity which utilizes, the Delta
31 Jaysit : Because you can't have nonstops from every city in the US to every city in India. Just because some city has 10 Indian grocery stores doesn't mean th
32 Post contains images Gr8Circle : True. The Indian population in the US is now so large (and so well off ) that it is not possible to cater to all the population centres.....certain s
33 Cornish : Exactly - likewise it could be argued that every city in India with an airport should have a direct flight to the UK. Utterly pointless of course. If
34 Jacobin777 : If you look at EK's model, most of it isn't O&D, but connecting passengers....EK have been taking business from some direct carriers because they off
35 Travelin man : So when does the LAX-BOM/DEL non-stop start?
36 ATLTraveler : or it is possible that Delta does not have the aircraft with the range to make it happen. Atlanta and its suburbs alone have over 100,000 people from
37 Stitch : As Gr8Circle notes, does not AI offer significant lift on the JFK-LHR-India(DEL? BOM?) route? This non-stop might be more complimentary to the existi
38 Post contains images Cornish : you've already answered your question But I think you have misread my post. My post was in answer to the assumption that non-stop is taking over from
39 Cornish : if it really was THAT attractive they'd fly through CDG and make it happen. Do bear in mind that having spoken to AI recently about their potential I
40 Cornish : It's no secret that SFO is right at the very top of Kingfisher's international wishlist to fly out of Bangalore. YVR is another.
41 Travelin man : I think that's a little bit of a different situation than North American travelers (or Indian travelers) bypassing the stop in Europe in favor of dir
42 Cornish : That may well be the case, and if it was me I'd tend to prefer it that way too but where price is a key factor then it may well make all the differen
43 Post contains images Blrsea : Yup, US is not ORD/JFK alone, India isn't just BOM/DEL European and SE Asian airlines will continue to have a big market because of convinient connec
44 Jaysit : Look, in the end its always the cheaper and/or more convenient flight that matters. For instance, I'm going to BOM in November and I considered connec
45 Cornish : My point exactly - if you are footing the bill, that is a BIG saving.
46 Post contains images Jacobin777 : ..the first carrier to fly this route (probably AI) will clean up shop! ummm..actually I didn't.. once again, I didn't.....and you haven't competely
47 Cornish : And for many flying BA business class (especially with the new product), or EK for that matter will still be preferable than flying AI direct between
48 Post contains images Jacobin777 : umm..yes..but I was being rhetorical..... to make it clear, my comment was regarding how big is the market for it...to which I believe it isn't as bi
49 WorldTraveler : The evidence of AA and CO’s success is the recent lower loads on NW (remember we just had a security incident that provided passenger numbers on the
50 PlaneHunter : If there's a nonstop option. Pick a European gateway like MAN or MUC and check how many of EK's African, Asian and ME destinations are served nonstop
51 FlyDreamliner : That route would be huge. Absolutely huge. I assure SFO-BLR would sell well. LAX-BOM would sell well. If you can get a direct flight from the states,
52 Jaysit : Why? The Delhi market is completely different from Bombay, and those on the AA/CO nonstops don't connect to Bombay. As far as your obsession with NW'
53 Gunsontheroof : While these markets are certainly larger, I'm a bit surprised that AI isn't considering SEA for non-stop service considering that Microsoft probably
54 Karan69 : Yes that seems the plan, but it nowhere mentions JFK , it could be EWR, but irrespective of the aiport the jumbo routes will be maintained. HAHA, the
55 VTNYC : You think we might see AI 001/ AI 002 for this?? VT-NYC
56 Karan69 : I am not sure but those flight numbers are maintained for AirIndianOne [ the routes when the Indian PM is on it]---please correct me if i am wrong. K
57 Post contains images Jacobin777 : thanks.. interesting information there...... .... well..I hope AI does well on the routes and expansion...it will be interesting to see what happens
58 Jaysit : Incidentally, what makes you say that loads are low on NW's Mumbai flights? All of NW's rickety DC-10 flights out of BOM are going full over the next
59 Jfk777 : I can't wait ti Air India's 772LR.
60 Texdravid : Like me. It's much more convenient for me to travel via LH thru FRA then it is to transit BOM. Whew! Thank God you said it before me. Time sensitive
61 YULWinterSkies : What is the routing then, because CO's EWR-HKG is longer on great circle... Thx
62 Floridaflyboy : Bad news for NW, too, conidering their service to BOM is via AMS.
63 IAD380 : AI only serves FRA, CDG, LHR, and BHX in Europe. Will AI flights to new destinations in the United States such as IAD, IAH, or SFO stop in other Europ
64 LH450 : Which route will they take on theire flight from New York to India? Is it shortener to fly over the big pond (Atlantic) or will they go west over the
65 Skyguy : I believe JRD Tata passed away in November 1993. Surely he can't still be selecting Air India's amenity kits and premium trimmings for their F/J prod
66 WorldTraveler : You folks can continue to insist that US airlines could continue to serve India via Europe and do fine but I can assure you all of those US operated f
67 Post contains images SafetyDude : I would not be surprised to see AI take a page out of SQ's book about JFK vs. EWR and non-stop vs. one-stop. -Will
68 Panamair : Only if you have direct flights from those US cities to a European connecting point (the SFOs, LAXs, ORDs...) But if you were coming from upstate NY
69 Post contains images Jacobin777 : actaully, EK offers competitive fares, not "dirt cheap" fares as you put it....you don't have to believe me, you can try to make fare comparisons wit
70 Karan69 : Full 5th freedom rights to US and Canadian cities from the UK/Germany and France. Sorry Typo, i obviously meant Ratan Tata. From the Indian-airliners
71 Post contains images PlaneHunter : Then let's see how long it takes until airlines introduce nonstops between e.g. BOS, CLT, CVG, DEN, MIA, MSP, PDX, PHL, SEA and e.g. BLR, CCU, HYD or
72 Cricket : Too much discussion - all that needs to be said is - YES! Finally!
73 74472 : This isn't going to hurt British Airways. I doubt BA will have to reduce it's double daily frequency to DEL and BOM. There is a huge and still growing
74 Post contains images LH450 : Karan69- thank you for this detailed information. So they'll fly over the North Pole and then Russia LH450
75 Post contains links Nimish : For those interested, the full post is available here: (Planned) Flight path for Air India 777s (200LR) - on Airliners-India.net Regarding this whole
76 Post contains images Csavel : But there is an even larger Indian community in Queens, especially Flushing, Jackson Heights, and many wealthier Indians in Long Island, I do think t
77 WorldTraveler : BA will probably fare better than other European carriers because there are so many Indians there.... but they may not be flying 744s. The US has a la
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