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60% Of AR Aircrafts Inoperable.  
User currently offlineLVICS From Argentina, joined Aug 2006, 86 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days ago) and read 7494 times:

According to an article published today in Buenos Aires by Infobae, 20 out of 33 Aerolíneas Argentinas aircrafts are inoperable because of lack of spare parts.
Besides, the article says that AR has not been paying for the leasing of the A340 since last May; so, if there's no payment in the next two weeks, those aircrafts might be seized.
The airline was asked to give their own version, byt they wouldn't answer.

39 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSABE From Argentina, joined Jun 2005, 156 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 7456 times:

That's pretty bad! Can you provide a link, please? I looked in the infobae.com website and couldn't find anything.

[Edited 2006-09-06 01:33:47]


TUS-DFW-EZE... can't wait to visit home again!
User currently offlineLVICS From Argentina, joined Aug 2006, 86 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 7430 times:

I'm afraid I can't. First of all, I'm not sure I would know how to do that even if I find the article on the internet. Anyway, after reading the article in the print edition today I visited www.infobae.com and found nothing at all about it. Strange, isn't it?
After trying again, this is the best I can do: www.infobae.com/baediario/home/php

[Edited 2006-09-06 01:44:50]

User currently offlineMarambio From Argentina, joined Oct 2004, 1160 posts, RR: 26
Reply 3, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 7297 times:

First of all, I didn't find anything on Infobae's website. Second, it's Infobae - you should know that what they write is almost always bullshit, no matter the subject.

All the 732s and 735s are operative, and so are the A310s. The A342s are all flying but LV-ZRA, which is currently grounded and some rumours say may go to Air Plus in Spain. The 747s, well, that's another story... As for the A342s, as far as I know they are not leased but being paid by Aerolíneas en cuotas (forgot the English term for that).

I will try to check this information with people inside Aerolíneas, but I highly doubt it is true.

Saludos,
Marambio



Aerolíneas Argentinas - La Argentina que levanta vuelo.
User currently offlineAntiuser From Italy, joined May 2004, 657 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 7184 times:

Quoting Marambio (Reply 3):
en cuotas (forgot the English term for that)

I believe the term you want is in installments.



Azzurri Campioni del Mondo!
User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Reply 5, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 6924 times:

Quoting LVICS (Thread starter):
According to an article published today in Buenos Aires by Infobae, 20 out of 33 Aerolíneas Argentinas aircrafts are inoperable because of lack of spare parts.

Maybe AR should play cards with RG...

Rgs,


User currently offlineEmbajador3 From Spain, joined Aug 2006, 318 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 6905 times:

AR seems to be in a good financial position. They have almost no competition on their market. Furthermore, the powerful Marsans Group is backing them up.


Flying Together
User currently offlineTBCITDG From Australia, joined Jan 2004, 921 posts, RR: 3
Reply 7, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 6803 times:

Power full Marsans, maybe . . . but if only they did things the right way, who knows where AR would be today. Maybe not so much Marsans, but Mata.

As with Marambino, I beg to doubt the correctness of the article. Although having said that, there are issues regarding spare parts.
There was a promise to the government from the new directors, that there would be a huge investment flow into AR. Shortly after there was the announcement of the A3??.

When will there be Spanish owners that do things the right way?

I don't mean to be harsh, but their track record is not that great. Although one has to give them credit for the 737 upgrades and the introduction of the 744's!


User currently offlineLVICS From Argentina, joined Aug 2006, 86 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 6677 times:

Quoting Marambio (Reply 3):
First of all, I didn't find anything on Infobae's website. Second, it's Infobae - you should know that what they write is almost always bullshit, no matter the subject.

The link I provided after editing my post takes you to the print edition, so I guess it was good yesterday only.
I'm sorry, I didn't "know that what they write is almost always bullshit". Neither I usually read that paper nor have any source to confirm what the article says. The title on the front page caught my eye at the newsstand, I decided I could afford spending AR$ 1,90 to read the story and so I did. After what you said, I don't think I'll ever share something like that here.

[Edited 2006-09-06 14:24:48]

User currently offlineRojo From Spain, joined Sep 2000, 2431 posts, RR: 9
Reply 9, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 6521 times:

Quoting Embajador3 (Reply 6):
AR seems to be in a good financial position. They have almost no competition on their market. Furthermore, the powerful Marsans Group is backing them up.

Having almost no competition on domestic flights does not equal profits. Remember that domestic fares in Argentina have a cap, therefore, AR can not sell above that cap which means that many domestic flights run at a loss. Marsans knows this and has been in talks with the government to increase domestic fares. The government just increased fares by a small percentage to make Marsans invest some money in the airline (new airplanes) but Marsans still wants the government to buy at least 20% of AR. If you add the constant problems with unions and the competition of LAN Argentina, I don't see Marsans backing up AR in the short term...

Quoting TBCITDG (Reply 7):
When will there be Spanish owners that do things the right way?

I would say, when will Spanish owners understand that having an airline in Latin America is risky? It is not the EU...


User currently offlineMarambio From Argentina, joined Oct 2004, 1160 posts, RR: 26
Reply 10, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 6353 times:

Quoting LVICS (Reply 8):

The link I provided after editing my post takes you to the print edition, so I guess it was good yesterday only.
I'm sorry, I didn't "know that what they write is almost always bullshit". Neither I usually read that paper nor have any source to confirm what the article says. The title on the front page caught my eye at the newsstand, I decided I could afford spending AR$ 1,90 to read the story and so I did. After what you said, I don't think I'll ever share something like that here.

I'm sorry. I did not want to sound rude, but this news caught me by surprise and, coming from Infobae I'd rather not believe it. They sometimes are accurate, but most of the time they are biased and not worth reading. Although (sadly) this is starting to apply to most Argentine newspapers...

As I said, I will try to confirm or deny this information with people inside Aerolíneas.

Saludos,
Marambio



Aerolíneas Argentinas - La Argentina que levanta vuelo.
User currently offlineMarambio From Argentina, joined Oct 2004, 1160 posts, RR: 26
Reply 11, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 6301 times:

So, it looks like Aerolíneas is operating with around 70% of its fleet. Maybe a little bit more if we add Austral's planes.

3 744s are operating, out of 3.
0 742s are operating, out of 2.
3 A342s are operating, out of 4.
2 A310s are operating, out of 2.
11 B735s are operating, out of 11.
9 B732s are operating, out of 15.

Austral: 15 airplanes are operating, out of 22.

This is not only due to many airplanes being grounded, but also because there is a huge lack of pilots. Some have just joined the company, but it will take at least 2 to 3 months to normalize all operations.

As for the installments (thanks Antiuser!), it looks like Aerolíneas owes one month, but that's in between the contract's tolerance. The A342s I believe they already paid 60%, and the MDs are 80% paid. It would make no sense for the owner to get those aircraft back after so many years of use, and now that the total is about to be paid.

Saludos,
Marambio



Aerolíneas Argentinas - La Argentina que levanta vuelo.
User currently offlineTBCITDG From Australia, joined Jan 2004, 921 posts, RR: 3
Reply 12, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 5886 times:

Just as I expected Marambino!

I did not think that things could be that bad. Sure they could be better, but not as bad as the paper makes it our to be!

 Smile


User currently offlineLVICS From Argentina, joined Aug 2006, 86 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 5712 times:

I'm really glad those news are not accurate. After reading so many bad things (1 A340 going to Air Plus Comet, New York gone, some aircrafts not flying, etc.) I kind of thought it might be the beginning of a much darker era.

User currently offlineSABE From Argentina, joined Jun 2005, 156 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 4782 times:

Thanks for the info, Marambio!

What I find amazing is that AR finally has more B735s than B732s flying! Yipee!  Smile



TUS-DFW-EZE... can't wait to visit home again!
User currently offlineUSADreamliner From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 4754 times:

Quoting Embajador3 (Reply 6):
AR seems to be in a good financial position. They have almost no competition on their market

Just LAN,AA,IB,CO,DL,LH,AF,AZ,TAM,GOL,MX,UA,BA,Air Madrid.

Oh, yes, on the Patagonian lose money routes, yes, they have no competition, you are right.


usadreamliner


User currently offlineUSADreamliner From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 4698 times:

Quoting Rojo (Reply 9):
I would say, when will Spanish owners understand that having an airline in Latin America is risky?

Not if they do things the right way!


User currently offlineTBCITDG From Australia, joined Jan 2004, 921 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 4516 times:

Rojo:
Both you and I know that the reason why things go bad for Spanish companies managing Latin American carriers is due to nothing more than BAD MANAGEMENT.
I am not going to go through the list of failed attempts or administration, but most Spanish companies came and will continue to come to Latin America to ma a quick buck, irrespective of the legacy they leave behind!


User currently offlineRojo From Spain, joined Sep 2000, 2431 posts, RR: 9
Reply 18, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 4464 times:

Quoting USADreamliner (Reply 16):
Not if they do things the right way!

It is almost impossible to define "the right way", since each individual will have its own definition...

Some spanish companies still don't understand that operating in Latin America requires a lot of lobbying with the government and unions to get things done...

Quoting TBCITDG (Reply 17):
Both you and I know that the reason why things go bad for Spanish companies managing Latin American carriers is due to nothing more than BAD MANAGEMENT.

Agree

Quoting TBCITDG (Reply 17):
am not going to go through the list of failed attempts or administration, but most Spanish companies came and will continue to come to Latin America to ma a quick buck, irrespective of the legacy they leave behind!

Some of them are making a fortune, but have too much risk. Example: BBVA in Mexico. Bancomer accounts for more than 1/3 of its profits and if something happens in Mexico, they will be in serious trouble!!!


User currently offlineAR385 From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 5946 posts, RR: 30
Reply 19, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 4323 times:
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Quoting USADreamliner (Reply 16):
Not if they do things the right way!

Agree 100%

Quoting Rojo (Reply 18):
It is almost impossible to define "the right way", since each individual will have its own definition...

It is my opinion that there is a right way, if you follow it, you'll make profits, if you don't, you'll screw the business. If what you mention is true then why does the MBA exists? Specially Harvard and Darden's which are both a General MBA program.

Quoting TBCITDG (Reply 17):
Rojo:
Both you and I know that the reason why things go bad for Spanish companies managing Latin American carriers is due to nothing more than BAD MANAGEMENT.
I am not going to go through the list of failed attempts or administration,

 checkmark   checkmark   checkmark 



MGGS
User currently offlineRojo From Spain, joined Sep 2000, 2431 posts, RR: 9
Reply 20, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 4160 times:

Quoting AR385 (Reply 19):
It is my opinion that there is a right way, if you follow it, you'll make profits, if you don't, you'll screw the business. If what you mention is true then why does the MBA exists? Specially Harvard and Darden's which are both a General MBA program.

I have many questions about the MBA's... in my opinion they don't give you a recipe to success. I have seen so many MBA graduates fail sending many companies to bankruptcy (specially after the dot-com boom). Others have struggle like the girl in Charge of ZE (Lineas Aereas Azteca). She is the doughter of one of the owners (she is a Harvard MBA graduate) and she still does not know what she is doing...

This is why some CEO fail and others are successful... therefore I don't see a real definition of the right way!!!


User currently offlineLanas From Argentina, joined Aug 2006, 978 posts, RR: 13
Reply 21, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 3971 times:

Regarding spare parts, I understand that one of the problems is the lack of engines, specially for the MDs. There is some overhauling to be done, and I don´t know if Marsans group will put the money to maintain these engines until the situation with the Argentine state stabilizes.

Quoting Rojo (Reply 9):
Remember that domestic fares in Argentina have a cap, therefore, AR can not sell above that cap which means that many domestic flights run at a loss

The ticket fares for domestic flights are supposed to be increased by 5-15% as from next Saturday. It´s true, however, that many frequencies run at a loss.

Quoting Rojo (Reply 20):
I have many questions about the MBA's... in my opinion they don't give you a recipe to success. I have seen so many MBA graduates fail sending many companies to bankruptcy (specially after the dot-com boom). Others have struggle like the girl in Charge of ZE (Lineas Aereas Azteca). She is the doughter of one of the owners (she is a Harvard MBA graduate) and she still does not know what she is doing...

This is why some CEO fail and others are successful... therefore I don't see a real definition of the right way!!!

Let´s not go off-topic, guys.

Cheers!
Lanas.-



"Faithless is he that says farewell when the road darkens." J.R.R. Tolkien
User currently offlineAR385 From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 5946 posts, RR: 30
Reply 22, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 3942 times:
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Quoting Rojo (Reply 20):
I have many questions about the MBA's... in my opinion they don't give you a recipe to success.

No, they don't, but they give you the necessary tools and the way to use them. You will never get a recipe for success, but they give you the elements to make it yourself. You need experience, of course, and common sense, and those don't come along with the MBA. "Lo que natura no da, Salamanca no presta".

I will miss AR's 742's. I grew up "in them" and were my first 747 ride. It would be really nice if AR would donate one of them to the Newberry museum, because it really did mark a new era for AR, and for a lot of people.

Same with the 732. Although the 735 are way much convenient, the 732's did a lot for AR.



MGGS
User currently offlineSkyone From Mexico, joined Feb 2001, 416 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 3853 times:

Quoting AR385 (Reply 19):
It is my opinion that there is a right way, if you follow it, you'll make profits, if you don't, you'll screw the business. If what you mention is true then why does the MBA exists? Specially Harvard and Darden's which are both a General MBA program.

Not always. If not, why did Sandy Weill became the CEO of Citibank without one and not his assistant who had an MBA from Harvard and why did he retire and put his lawyer as CEO instead of his portege that had one. MBA´s exist because it is a good way of making money for schools and on the other end they do work sometimes to help people bakcfire their careers or change them completely. But remember Enron and Harvard MBAs. So the MBA doesn´t make you a superhero that imediately can put a business into profits. It is the person that counts and just the person.


User currently offlineJfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8092 posts, RR: 7
Reply 24, posted (7 years 7 months 2 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 3836 times:
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While its sad to see the 742 go, the 744 is an interim step until say 2015. I hope AR buys 787's or A350's and expands their route map. I would say, operate to your destination NONSTOP. JFK, CDG, London or other European cities should be flown nonstop. Flights to Madrid should not have a larger separate airplane like the 744, I know AR fllies 2 Jumbos most days to MAD, maybe AR should fly to MAD 3 or four times daily with a 787. AR should have 20 787.

25 Post contains images MD11junkie : The cap will increase by 5-15%, my friend. The cap is still there. This "fare increase" doesn't really solve anything. Right on, my friend! Both mode
26 Viasa : Are you sure about that. My informations says that LV-ZRA is returned to the lessor (Airbus Asset Management) and would go to Air Plus Comet.
27 Post contains images EZEIZA : Hola Gaston! This is great news you are giving! I thought the A340 going to Air Plus was a done deal?? saludos
28 USADreamliner : My parents are returning from EZE next sunday and the flight AR1110 (A342) was cancelled because of "Technical problems" ( ten days before the flight!
29 Post contains images MD11junkie : If your "information" is Skyliner, it's wrong. AR officials have told me that ZRA will not leave AR... and it's engines will not leave FRA... (people
30 TBCITDG : According to another page, Mr Mata has a sold off 30% of his stake in Air Plus sister company of AR. The chunk of this has been bought by Pascual and
31 LVICS : If you think I overreacted, please accept my apologies. Anyway, I think Marambio was a bit harsh and there was no need for that. I just posted some n
32 Luisde8cd : There goes Hugo's widebody... maybe he cancelled the deal in order to get some "nice" IL-96's just like his lover, Fidel. Saludos desde Caracas, Luis
33 USADreamliner : One question. If Marsans decided to retire from Aerolineas. What will happen to the A330 order? they will get any? Because, the order was made by Mars
34 Post contains links and images LVZXV : The only aircraft in the AR-AU fleet I know to be out of service for unscheduled reasons are: -A342 LV-ZRA (@ EZE) -B742s LV-MLR, OEP (@ EZE) -M81 LV-
35 Lima : Hi I was last week departing EZE and saw a 747-200 of AR parked at the unused runway. It was dark so was not able to check if it was MLO, but most lik
36 Post contains images MD11junkie : Hola Sebastián, Was that plane in the old "vincha" livery? If it was, then it was MLO as it's the ONLY 742 to be in the old colors. Otherwise, it co
37 Argentina : Hi, What Sebastián saw was LV-MLO. Apart from this, LV-OEP is being prepared for a test flight after receiving the engines from sister LV-OPA (just a
38 Post contains links and images Lanas : I thought MLO was parked at Chivatos. Former EC-JJG with Air Plus Comet. View Large View MediumPhoto © Óscar Laborda Sánchez - Iberian Spotters
39 NicolasRubio : It was... Actually it was parked at RWY 05 together with LV-LIV, LV-JMX and LV-JMW, then in Chivatos with those three chanchas and now in RWY 05 agai
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