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Cancellation Charge For No Show  
User currently offlineKdm From New Zealand, joined Feb 2006, 115 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 7 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 8392 times:

Do airlines actually charge the "no show" charge for not turning up for a flight. In the past on three occasions I have not take a return leg of a long distant flight for different reasons. I have never cancelled the return flight (although I probably should have out of courtesy)

Recently I have had to cancel 2 return flights with SQ and they told me that I would have been charged a cancellation fee of something like $250US if I did a no show. Not sure how they would take the money, or if they allowed to. Anyone know?

50 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineHikesWithEyes From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 816 posts, RR: 7
Reply 1, posted (7 years 7 months 1 week 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 8363 times:

Quoting Kdm (Thread starter):
I have never cancelled the return flight (although I probably should have out of courtesy)

If you ever find yourself complaining about airfares, then remember that.



First, benzene in my Perrier, and now this!
User currently offlineLincoln From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 3887 posts, RR: 8
Reply 2, posted (7 years 7 months 1 week 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 8342 times:

Quoting HikesWithEyes (Reply 1):
If you ever find yourself complaining about airfares, then remember that.

Or if the OP ever finds himself complaining about airline overbooking policies...



CO Is My Airline of Choice || Baggage Claim is an airline's last chance to disappoint a customer || Next flts in profile
User currently offlineKdm From New Zealand, joined Feb 2006, 115 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (7 years 7 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 8291 times:

yes, wasn't expecting sympathy, but then wasn't expecting a whinge in return. I am in the process of cancelling several return legs of flights with SQ, so I have learnt it should be done.

My question was also prompted by fact that return tickets are often much cheaper than one way tickets, so it is not common for people to by a return ticket for a one way trip, hence the question of do airlines charge cancellation fees, and do people go through the hassle of cancelling the return leg?


User currently offlineLitz From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1753 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (7 years 7 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 8255 times:
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The best thing to do is not cancel the ticket ... instead, cancel that portion of the itinerary, eat the change-fee cost, and use the balance to book another flight.

The change-fee will always be less and the airline would rather have you on a flight, somewhere, somewhen, then not at all.

Most US airlines will let you change flights for $50, and cancel/rebook for $100.

- litz


User currently offlineLeskova From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 6075 posts, RR: 70
Reply 5, posted (7 years 7 months 1 week 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 8196 times:

Quoting Litz (Reply 4):
The best thing to do is not cancel the ticket ... instead, cancel that portion of the itinerary, eat the change-fee cost, and use the balance to book another flight.

As long as the fare permits changes, that's usually a good idea.

Unfortunately, the fees are not as low as they are in the US in most of the rest of the world...  Sad

Quoting Kdm (Thread starter):
Do airlines actually charge the "no show" charge for not turning up for a flight.

In fact, they do - but there's often a misunderstanding about how they charge it. This is not a charge that you pay in addition to the fare you've already paid (for example if you've got a nonref ticket, you'll not be charged a noshow fee on top of that).

What does happen is if you cancel before the flight, you pay the cancellation fee; some airlines then have a separate fee that they charge in case of noshows, instead of the cancellation fee, which you pay instead of the cancellation fee if you cancel after having noshow'ed on your booked flight.

Most airlines don't even have separate cancellation/noshow fees any longer - most simply have cancellation fees that are charged whenever you cancel, regardless of before or after the time/date of the first flight.

The only real difference is whether you've already flown a segment of your ticket - because as soon as you have, it'll usually be nonrefundable (with the obvious exception of full fares and some, but very few, lower fares).



Smile - it confuses people!
User currently offlineAJMIA From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 729 posts, RR: 15
Reply 6, posted (7 years 7 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 8096 times:

On most AA fares if you no show the flight you will loose the value of the remaining flight coupons. It happens automatically. When the flight is put into PDC a message is sent to Sabre and all the noshow E-tickets are changed from OK to NOGO. You need to have a pretty good reason to have the status changed back to OK.

If you call and cancel your flight before the departure.... even only one minute before the departure you will maintain the value of your flight coupon and you will only need to pay any applicable fare difference or change fees to change it in the future.

This is done to encourage people to cancel in advance so we have an opportunity to reuse their seat.

AJMIA



Lady it's a jet... not a kite.
User currently offlineGeorgiaAME From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 927 posts, RR: 6
Reply 7, posted (7 years 7 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 8083 times:

This is really a politically incorrect thing to say, but for your own self interest, you should not be courteous by informing the airline. By doing so, you are advising them that you are in violation of the contract that exists between the two of you. You can lose you FF miles, you can at that point be charged a higher rate that might exist between point A and point B. By being impolite, you can a) open a seat for a standby passenger, b) keep your miles, c) get lost in the computerized records which are so overwhelmed it wouldn't pay for them to search you out, and d) probably save yourself some money which you can spend on the beleaguered airline next time around.

Living in a high priced hub, I resent being hit with a "sale" fare between Point Atlanta and my point B destination, when I know I can book my return through Atlanta on to Fort Lauderdale, and invariably save $50-100 by not using the onward leg. This makes no economic sense whatsoever, but I figure if the airlines are paying mega bucks to people to program computers to screw me because I live near Hartsfield, two can play the game. Just don't check your luggage.



"Trust, but verify!" An old Russian proverb, quoted often by a modern American hero
User currently offlineAccess-Air From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 1939 posts, RR: 14
Reply 8, posted (7 years 7 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 8056 times:

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 7):
Living in a high priced hub, I resent being hit with a "sale" fare between Point Atlanta and my point B destination, when I know I can book my return through Atlanta on to Fort Lauderdale, and invariably save $50-100 by not using the onward leg. This makes no economic sense whatsoever, but I figure if the airlines are paying mega bucks to people to program computers to screw me because I live near Hartsfield, two can play the game.

This is something that is called Hidden City ticketing and if you ever get caught, you can either have your tickets cancelled or the applicable fare collected.....Or Both.

I actually think that the "Use it or Lose" it rule is a good one....It makes people become responsible for keeping track of their reservations....Its simple..If you know you wont be flying call your travel agent, or the airline or however you booked it and CANCEL......Most airlines will make your NONREFUNDABLE tickets convert to ZERO Value if you No-Show....I think its a good lesson!!!

I know that some Doctor's Offices employe the same practice....If you dont cancel your Doctor's appointment and NO SHOW, the enforceably bill you for the appointment anyway....It may not seem fair but they are holding a time slot open for YOU and if you just dont show up, Why should they lose money?
Or worse they could have accomodated someone else.....

So remember when you buy a NON Refundable ticket if you arent going, cancel your reservations or you may never see your money again...

Access-Air

p.s. Northwest Airlines is a bit more restrictive than most of the airlines...they require that after you cancel your tickets that you must reschedule your new trip within the 90 days after your cancellation for your new trip, or your ticket will have ZERO value!!!!

[Edited 2006-09-16 17:14:00]


Remember, Wherever you go, there you are!!!!
User currently offlineKdm From New Zealand, joined Feb 2006, 115 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (7 years 7 months 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 7882 times:

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 7):
This is really a politically incorrect thing to say, but for your own self interest, you should not be courteous by informing the airline

I do like this approuch. Also makes sense. The flights I haven't turned up for have been with ANZ, JAL and Virgin.

With ANZ I had to go from Auckland to Gisborne, to Wellington to Nelson and back to Auckland. This is possible via 4 one way tickets but ANZ suggested I by 4 pairs or return tickets and only use one segment. I did a now show for the return leg of each segment and saved myself 50 percent of the airfare as one way tickets are so expensive.

With Virgin I was stuck in LA and had to get back to London, I was waitlisted on ANZ and confirmed to fly 4 days later. A one way ticket was $1000US but Virgin sold my a return for $399US and agin told me not to take the return flight, so I did a no show.

Lastly with JAL my family and I had such terrible service on our Singapore/Tokyo/London flight such that when work asked me to stay in London for another few days I said I would if they paid for a direct one way flight London/Singapore for me and the family. They agreed I did a no show for the JAL return flights. I have little sympathy for JAL as they were so rude on the flight I swore I would never fly them again (and haven't)


User currently offlineAJMIA From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 729 posts, RR: 15
Reply 10, posted (7 years 7 months 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 7798 times:

Quoting Kdm (Reply 9):
With Virgin I was stuck in LA and had to get back to London, I was waitlisted on ANZ and confirmed to fly 4 days later. A one way ticket was $1000US but Virgin sold my a return for $399US and agin told me not to take the return flight, so I did a no show.

If you are going to do a "no show" on the return and you don't care about, can't or don't intend to use the return flight you really don't need to bother to call and cancel your reservation. The value will be lost to you anyway. Yield management at the airline is pretty good at setting the overbooking level to account for no shows.

If you intend to use the value of that flight coupon at a later time you had better take the time to call.

There is no rule that says you must travel round trip on a round trip ticket. If you take your outbound flight and your plans change nobody can force you to take the return flight... you just loose your money.

Hidden city ticketing is not much of a problem anymore. It is very easy to catch with electronic tickets. Unused VCR flight segments or segments used out of order stick out like a sore thumb.

Before E tickets, agencies in Miami would sell F class tickets MIA-LAX routed from Central American or the Caribbean; KIN-MIA-LAX or GUA-MIA-LAX. The full fare F fare from these countries were cheaper than the full Y MIA-LAX fare. On the paper ticket the agency would simply pull off the unused first flight coupon and send the passenger on their way.

AJMIA



Lady it's a jet... not a kite.
User currently offlineB777-700 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 7648 times:

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 7):
This is really a politically incorrect thing to say, but for your own self interest, you should not be courteous by informing the airline.

It's not being courteous to the airline, it's being courteous to the next passenger what wants to buy a seat.

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 7):
By doing so, you are advising them that you are in violation of the contract that exists between the two of you.

So? Same rules and fees apply even if you don't.

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 7):
You can lose you FF miles, you can at that point be charged a higher rate that might exist between point A and point B.

Um, you wouldn't get FF miles if you don't fly either way, so what's you point? Also, you have to pay any difference in fare whether you cancel in advance or not. You clearly don't know what you're talking about.

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 7):
By being impolite, you can a) open a seat for a standby passenger

I'm sure those employees that you 'love' so much thank you for that!

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 7):
get lost in the computerized records which are so overwhelmed it wouldn't pay for them to search you out

Do you think so?

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 7):
Living in a high priced hub,

You live in Atlanta, it's NOT a high priced hub. More misinformation from you.

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 7):
I resent being hit with a "sale" fare between Point Atlanta and my point B destination, when I know I can book my return through Atlanta on to Fort Lauderdale, and invariably save $50-100 by not using the onward leg. This makes no economic sense whatsoever, but I figure if the airlines are paying mega bucks to people to program computers to screw me because I live near Hartsfield, two can play the game. Just don't check your luggage

That's hidden city ticketing, and it's illegal, like it or not. The airlines (and I know for a fact the one you hate in ATL) have software in place to catch people doing this. You might get away with it for a while, but they can and will bill you for the difference later.

I'm not expecting you to respond, as usual you just come on here and post your garbage and run away.


User currently offlineJGPH1A From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 7621 times:

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 7):
c) get lost in the computerized records which are so overwhelmed it wouldn't pay for them to search you out,

Don't worry, they'll find you - that's really easy these days. If you NOSHO, the DCS system will flag your booking as Nosho, and Revenue Integrity applications with cancel any onward itinerary segments. If you are a frequent flyer and do this little trick a little too often, they'll penalise you.

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 11):
That's hidden city ticketing, and it's illegal, like it or not.

It's not actually against the law - the airlines just don't like it and have set up very expensive and very sophisticated systems to track agencies and passengers that do it, and where such booking activity is identified, the booking can be cancelled.


User currently offlineAIR757200 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 1579 posts, RR: 7
Reply 13, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 7599 times:

Quoting AJMIA (Reply 6):
On most AA fares if you no show the flight you will loose the value of the remaining flight coupons. It happens automatically. When the flight is put into PDC a message is sent to Sabre and all the noshow E-tickets are changed from OK to NOGO. You need to have a pretty good reason to have the status changed back to OK.

NOGO status change occurs later on, I believe (that night of when you missed your flight)-- at midnight central time; so if you're planning on being late for your scheduled flight and get to the airport later; the coupon will still be OK. You're right though, you better have a darn good reason to have the status changed to OK.


User currently offlineGeorgiaAME From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 927 posts, RR: 6
Reply 14, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 7581 times:

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 11):
I'm not expecting you to respond, as usual you just come on here and post your garbage

Please, don't force yourself to continue reading...

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 11):
it's being courteous to the next passenger what wants to buy a seat.

I am shocked, shocked to learn that "overbooking" does not exist. Well, actually, there is one airline which does not overbook. Apparently my nemesis (look it up), thinks that particular airline can cure cancer also. Alas, they no longer fly out of Atlanta, complements of my favorite airline based here.

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 11):
you have to pay any difference in fare whether you cancel in advance or not

Right...

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 11):
Atlanta, it's NOT a high priced hub

Delta, mid week, 3 weeks from now:
SFO/ATL rt $278
SFO/Fll via ATL both directions: $197

You do the open jaw arithmetic. For everything else, there is MasterCard.
Sorry bud, but no dice.

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 11):
That's hidden city ticketing, and it's illegal

Hidden ticketing, absolutely; illegal, hardly. Violation of the "contract" with the airline, no question, it is. Unethical, it would depend on your ethicist. A form of sport for certain frequent fliers, Absolutely!

As I've said, it the airlines themselves that have chosen to play by Byzantine rules, cancel underbooked flights in violation of the "contract", bump passengers when they overbook, overprice a market because they can get away with it. Well, two can play the game. I said "can", not must or should.

Now have a good day
 Smile



"Trust, but verify!" An old Russian proverb, quoted often by a modern American hero
User currently offlineB777-700 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 7573 times:

Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 12):
It's not actually against the law - the airlines just don't like it and have set up very expensive and very sophisticated systems to track agencies and passengers that do it, and where such booking activity is identified, the booking can be cancelled.

Well, technically it is illegal. After it gets to a point where a passenger does it so much, the software can catch them, and the airlines can sue the passenger...and then it's either pay up or be blacklisted.


User currently offlineJGPH1A From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 7549 times:

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 15):
Well, technically it is illegal. After it gets to a point where a passenger does it so much, the software can catch them, and the airlines can sue the passenger...and then it's either pay up or be blacklisted.

Yes they can blacklist, and they may even be able to sue. But the practise is not illegal - there is no state or Federal law being breached here. Purchasing a service and not using it is not illegal. If there's a two-for-one sale and you only use one of the items purchased, they're not going to lock you up.


User currently offlineB777-700 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 7528 times:

Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 16):
Purchasing a service and not using it is not illegal. If there's a two-for-one sale and you only use one of the items purchased, they're not going to lock you up.

While that's true, hidden city tkting is akin to stealing. Will they prosecute if you do it one, twice...five times? Prolly not. If you have a history tho, and get caught, the airlines can sue for lost revenue...and they'll win too.


User currently offlineGQfluffy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 7502 times:

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 14):
SFO/ATL rt $278
SFO/Fll via ATL both directions: $197

Waaah. Cry like a baby. Come live here in Montana. Cheapest way to get out of here, other then working for the airlines, is about $500. Your price quotes are, in my not so humble opinion, cheaper then hell, and obviously show SOME competition on that route...

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 14):
Hidden ticketing, absolutely; illegal, hardly. Violation of the "contract" with the airline, no question, it is. Unethical, it would depend on your ethicist. A form of sport for certain frequent fliers, Absolutely!

And you wonder why airlines are in the financial situation they are. One of these times you'll get caught, and when you come on here complaining, I'm sure people will flame the crap out of you.


User currently offlineSupa7E7 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 7470 times:

Yes it's sort of like renting a movie but not returning it. Not such a big deal, but eventually they will come for you. You enter into a contract and breach it. This is risky for a consumer to do, and over time the legal liabilities from doing it may reach a large amt of money.

This all boils down to the pricing strategy of airlines. Why on earth are 1way tickets more expensive? Because they are worth more to customers. 1way tickets are desirable for BUSINESS travellers who need flexibility and otherwise might fly by private jet. The airlines provide flexibility which is a killer value and they expect to be paid the asking price for that flexibility. It's in the contract.

Same goes for Saturday night stays. Of course only tourists enjoy those tickets, and that is why they are cheap! It's called market segmentation and it is a proven method to extract the maximum currency from the market by offering products tailored for all groups of customers. Much like how the Gap owns Banana Republic and Old Navy. Do you go into Banana Republic and complain it costs more than Old Navy? They are different products and for you to excange price tags between the stores would be unethical.

But just to be clear, I say the airlines offer increased FLEXIBILITY for more money... not a better seat or service. This flexibility is worth a ton of money to business (and some leisure) customers. Last minute / 1way airline tickets are cheap compared to private jets, the other mainstay of business travel.


User currently offlineB777-700 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 7424 times:

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 14):
Please, don't force yourself to continue reading...

Oh but I will! People like you are what's wrong w/ this forum. You post unsubstantiated BS and opinions a fact. You're anti-airline, save that crap for flyertalk.

Plus it's great fun making you look like an arrogant blowhard.

Then again, you do a great job yourself.

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 14):
I am shocked, shocked to learn that "overbooking" does not exist. Well, actually, there is one airline which does not overbook. Apparently my nemesis (look it up), thinks that particular airline can cure cancer also. Alas, they no longer fly out of Atlanta, complements of my favorite airline based here.

No, compliments of their own mistake. Jetblue has no one to blame but themselves for their ATL debacle. Go read the hundreds of posts about this issue before bringing it up again.

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 14):
Quoting B777-700 (Reply 11):
Atlanta, it's NOT a high priced hub

Delta, mid week, 3 weeks from now:
SFO/ATL rt $278
SFO/Fll via ATL both directions: $197

You do the open jaw arithmetic. For everything else, there is MasterCard.
Sorry bud, but no dice.

You think THAT'S high priced?!?! Hell, even the proper $278 fare is a steal!

But since you're Mr. Know-it-all, I'm sure you realize why fares are that way, right? I'm not going to explain it to you.

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 14):
Hidden ticketing, absolutely; illegal, hardly. Violation of the "contract" with the airline, no question, it is. Unethical, it would depend on your ethicist. A form of sport for certain frequent fliers, Absolutely!

Prosecutable? Absolutely! Big grin

Do it enough and you'll get caught, it's inevitable.

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 14):
As I've said, it the airlines themselves that have chosen to play by Byzantine rules

According to whom, exactly?

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 14):
cancel underbooked flights in violation of the "contract",

No airline cancels flight just because it's 'underbooked'. That would be disastrous from an operational standpoint alone. It simply doesn't happen, but it's a common perception from people like you.

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 14):
bump passengers when they overbook

Nothing wrong with that.

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 14):
overprice a market because they can get away with it.

Supply and demand.

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 14):
Well, two can play the game. I said "can", not must or should.

I'm sure all the employees who have taken a pay cut so you can have your ridiculously low fares appreciate it.

One less flight attendant to stand in the isle and toss your salad for you while you sip your ice wine.  Yeah sure


User currently offlineJGPH1A From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 7385 times:

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 17):
While that's true, hidden city tkting is akin to stealing. Will they prosecute if you do it one, twice...five times? Prolly not. If you have a history tho, and get caught, the airlines can sue for lost revenue...and they'll win too.

It's not stealing. The airline offered a specific service consisting of transport over 2 or more legs. You paid the ticket price they asked. You then used only the transport over one of the legs. There is no legal or contractual obligation to use all of the service purchased. If the airline's pricing is so Byzantine that it is in fact cheaper to buy 2 services than just 1, but you only need 1, it's not the consumer's error. There's only loss of revenue because of the airline's bizarre policies - and in fact they've lost no revenue, they sold something, you paid the asking price, end of.

Quoting Supa7E7 (Reply 19):
Yes it's sort of like renting a movie but not returning it. Not such a big deal, but eventually they will come for you.

No it's not - not returning a rental movie is theft. This is akin to renting 3 DVD's for the price of 2 and only watching 2 of them. Blockbuster really couldn't care.


User currently offlineB777-700 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 7363 times:

Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 21):
It's not stealing.

Yes it is. Let's look at Georgie boy's example...

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 14):
Delta, mid week, 3 weeks from now:
SFO/ATL rt $278
SFO/Fll via ATL both directions: $197

He lives in Atlanta. He could buy SFO-ATL for $278. Or he could buy SFO-ATL-FLL for $197 and just get off in ATL. In effect, he just stole $81.

You can call it Byzantine, or any other fancy name you want, but it is what it is for various reasons, and yes, it is illegal ticketing, and yes, they airlines will catch you eventually, and no, you can't use anything you said as a defense.

Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 21):
There's only loss of revenue because of the airline's bizarre policies - and in fact they've lost no revenue, they sold something, you paid the asking price, end of.

No, you didn't. You paid for and entered into a contract for SFO-FLL, the price for SFO-ATL is higher.

Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 21):
No it's not - not returning a rental movie is theft. This is akin to renting 3 DVD's for the price of 2 and only watching 2 of them.

...and keeping the third.  Yeah sure

Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 21):
Blockbuster really couldn't care.

The airlines do, trust me on that.


User currently offlinePhollingsworth From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2004, 825 posts, RR: 5
Reply 23, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 7332 times:

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 22):
He lives in Atlanta. He could buy SFO-ATL for $278. Or he could buy SFO-ATL-FLL for $197 and just get off in ATL. In effect, he just stole $81.

How is it stealing, what asset was taken from the airline which denied further use (which is why copyright violations cannot be stealing but may still be illegal)? Also please cite a specific section of the CFR, UCS, Georgia or California code which makes the practice illegal. The airline can prohibit the behavior in the contract of carriage, and penalize the customer for the behavior but the fact of the matter is that they actually come out ahead if you do not board the last leg (it costs them less to fly that flight).


User currently offlineB777-700 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 7304 times:

Quoting Phollingsworth (Reply 23):
How is it stealing

How can you see that it's not? He's not paying what the airline is charging for that 'product'. End of story.

Quoting Phollingsworth (Reply 23):
The airline can prohibit the behavior in the contract of carriage, and penalize the customer for the behavior but the fact of the matter is that they actually come out ahead if you do not board the last leg (it costs them less to fly that flight).

Doesn't work like that, sorry.


25 JGPH1A : Yes he is. The airline charged him a certain amount for travel SFO-ATL and ATL-FLL. He paid what they asked. The airline said, " If you buy travel fr
26 B777-700 : Please show me in any fare rules where it is the pax right to do that...lol It's illegal tkting, end of story. He purchased a fare valid only SFO-FLL
27 Phollingsworth : It is still not stealing, there was a concentual transaction. If it is actually illegal it would fall under something such as fraud since it would in
28 B777-700 : Right, from SFO-FLL, not SFO-ATL. It is. He agree to buy a tkt at a lower fare valid only for SFO-FLL. Illegal tkting is not literally against the la
29 Phollingsworth : I have always said it was a breach of contract. The problem is in assessing damages. You say that the airlines can sue and will win; please cite a ca
30 Cumulus : If in doubt, ring your credit card company (the one you used to book with)saying it's been pinched. They then re-issue another with another with a com
31 Supa7E7 : That is an interesting analogy. Let's make it a movie theater. Say they sell 1 movie for $10 or a doubleheader for $30. Real movie fanatics have to p
32 GeorgiaAME : Fantastic! You guys have made my day. -700, the only thing missing in your arguments is not calling me a Nazi. That tends to be the last line when you
33 AIR757200 : Careful, it depends on the actual fare calucation line to determine the "specific fare value". While an E-Ticket may indicate two coupons for each se
34 Post contains images JGPH1A : Thanks for that - although I'm supposed to know all about it (I sell Airline IT), fares/pricing/ticketing are still a fairly closed book to me - I kn
35 B777-700 : Well, it is a pretty simple and logical concept. I'm sorry you can't (or refuse to) understand it. Go back and read reply #30
36 Post contains images AIR757200 : This is when I call the tariff department... haha
37 Lincoln : Usually a fair number of the PFCs, taxes, etc. are added on to the base fare while the itinerary is being booked, so I don't find it hard to beleive
38 PHLBOS : You are correct; FL (which also has its main hub in ATL) competes w/DL on both of those routes.
39 Post contains images B777-700 : God bless you! I havent had the time to find Delta's policy, but I've read it before and it's almost word for word the same as CO's. This SHOULD put
40 JGPH1A : All that Lincoln's excellent post shows is that the airlines don't like it, and reserve the right to take legal action. It doesn't make the use of Hi
41 Post contains images B777-700 : Well, the airlines will win any court case, so you can describe it however you like. Maybe not...What makes it morally wrong is you do it at the expe
42 JGPH1A : Has anyone actually ever been taken to court over this ? In a civil or criminal case ? I'd be interested to know what the outcome was. How is the con
43 Phollingsworth : This could be read in an interesting way that could be quite expansive. If I am traveling between Atlanta and Cincinnati, but I purchase a ticket fro
44 Phollingsworth : Quick question, do you work in an airline legal department? If not how do you know this is the case? In the general sense airlines loose court cases
45 Lincoln : I'll be the first to say that I don't know with respect to individual passengers; I do know that when travel agencies were more prevelent it was not
46 EA CO AS : As was said earlier, then you have absolutely no right to complain in any way about airline fares and/or ticketing policies as they're the way they a
47 JGPH1A : It would have been an Agency Debit Memo (ADM) - an MCO is something quite different.
48 Supa7E7 : Flexible airline travel is a high value product. It's very expensive, because it's very valuable. Many people pay the high business fares. If not, yo
49 Post contains links Lincoln : Sorry, I didn't include the "Definitions" section (rule 1) of the contract of carriage: "Destination means the ultimate point of the Passenger's jour
50 B777-700 : Hahaha I like how you put that! Anyway, this stuff is pretty rock solid. You don't get to become an airline w/out keeping on top of these things...
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