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JetBlue San-Iad, Why Not San-Bos?  
User currently offlineHockey55dude From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 213 posts, RR: 2
Posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 4268 times:

The thing I am wondering about is why did Jetblue choose to do San-Iad instead of doing San-Bos. Going to Dulles United has about 5 flights a day while going Boston AA has 1 flight a day. I'm just wondering why B6 would choose IAD before BOS.

-Hockey55dude

34 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSan747 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 4942 posts, RR: 12
Reply 1, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 4245 times:

I heard a SAN-BOS flight is in the works... Though I don't know why they chose IAD first... Probably to just to give it some LCC competition...


Scotty doesn't know...
User currently offlineJetBlueNYFL From United States of America, joined May 2006, 274 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 4237 times:

I was thinking that today as well! I would think maybe it has to do with demand? Although I can't imagine IAD having so much more demand to SAN than BOS.

Maybe it has to do with at the time IAD-SAN started, there was no IAD-JFK shuttle flights on jetBlue. Customers could fly BOS-JFK-SAN on jetBlue, but from IAD, jetBlue's customers could not get to SAN even with a connection. I might be wrong but maybe that coupled with demand has to do with it. I know IAD-SMF was dropped due to low loads - they don't serve BOS-SMF...a similar comparison.



jetBlue...Bringing Humanity Back To Air Travel!
User currently offlineCoronado990 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 1597 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 4226 times:

Think Government Defence contracts.


Uncle SAN at your service!
User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6742 posts, RR: 32
Reply 4, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 4214 times:

Quoting JetBlueNYFL (Reply 2):
Although I can't imagine IAD having so much more demand to SAN than BOS.

Actually, WAS has significantly higher demand to SAN than BOS. WAS-SAN averaged 1,092 daily passengers in the first quarter of this year, while BOS-SAN averaged 603 -- meaning that WAS-SAN traffic was over 80% higher. The WAS-SAN yield of 10.35 cents was also 12% higher than the BOS-SAN yield of 9.21 cents. It's actually unsurprising given that there's a lot of government traffic between Washington and San Diego.


User currently offlineSan747 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 4942 posts, RR: 12
Reply 5, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 4201 times:

What's surprising to me is that there is no widebody service on SAN-IAD... You'd think at least one of the daily 757s could be changed to a 767... just like SAN-JFK...


Scotty doesn't know...
User currently offlineSANFan From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 5400 posts, RR: 12
Reply 6, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 4153 times:

Another important factor entered into B6's announcement (on 1/18/2005) of SAN-IAD service (to begin on 5/03/2005): remember Indi Air (DH)? They announced on 2/07/2005 that they would begin SAN-IAD on 4/14/2005. Coincidence? I think not!

However, there have been rumors here on A.net for over a year that B6 was going to start SAN-BOS "soon", usually mentioned in conjunction with AA dropping the route (in order to start SAN-MIA.) None of that has yet happened.

I'm glad AA has NOT dropped it but I think another cx flying n/s on the route would be successful and probably help generate even more traffic.

I do agree with Scott and Coronado that SAN-WAS is a very popular military/government/business market that used to belong exclusively to UA but I am very glad to see a competitor flying n/s there. I've noticed that B6 is moving their flight to evening from the current morning departure time -- no more plaid-tail RON in SAN any more...

SAN-BOS is a perfect example of "connecting-the-dots" that I would love to see JetBlue doing more of these days. Anyone out there from B6 want to start any more rumors??? ...or educated guesses?

One last thought: I wonder how a SAN-DCA n/s would do if someone applied for that authority. I think SAN is probably the biggest city in the West that doesn't have such service. I have no idea what the situation is these days with the Reagan-exemption (limited slots to only certain cities and all are currently being used?) but I bet someone out there does.

bb


User currently offlineJetBluefan1 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2977 posts, RR: 14
Reply 7, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 4149 times:

I definitely think that this will be announced within the next year. JetBlue should be focussing on more connecting the dots in 2007, and this route seems ripe for picking. I'm sure it's high on the list.

As a side note, the SAN-IAD flights perform very well.

JetBluefan1



Most people on a.net hate JetBlue. Get used to it.
User currently offlineGalapagapop From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 910 posts, RR: 4
Reply 8, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 4130 times:

I thought SAN-BOS was stretching it in the range department..........

User currently offlineSANFan From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 5400 posts, RR: 12
Reply 9, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 4130 times:

Hey JBf1, do you know the reason behind the switch I spoke of above (B6 moving the SAN-IAD a.m. departure to a red-eye in early 2007?) I wonder if it's to try to improve loads or to better utilize a/c; I certainly realize that B6 likes red-eyes from the Left Coast -- and for good reason -- but that morning departure was a great attempt to get a good portion of the corporate/business market, in addition to leisure pax. (I would love to see B6 join AA and DL in the SAN-JFK morning market as well.)

One thing is certain: no matter when JetBlue schedules their departure to IAD, there will be a UA right on its tail! Thanks for your insight on this subject.

bb


User currently offlineSKYYBLUE From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 4099 times:

Quoting JetBluefan1 (Reply 7):
JetBlue should be focussing on more connecting the dots in 2007

I think you are right on with your prediction. Probably about half the amount of new stations we opened in 06 with a bigger focus on connecting the dots. I'm personally hoping for a BOS-MSY announcement soon!


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32691 posts, RR: 72
Reply 11, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 3973 times:

Quoting SANFan (Reply 6):

However, there have been rumors here on A.net for over a year that B6 was going to start SAN-BOS "soon", usually mentioned in conjunction with AA dropping the route (in order to start SAN-MIA.) None of that has yet happened.

AA hasn't dropped it because, surprisingly, jetBlue hasn't started it yet. If B6 announces BOS-SAN, AA will likely drop it. AA doesn't want much overlap with jetBlue's route map, and they have de-emphazied Boston.



a.
User currently offlineBicoastal From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 3931 times:

Quoting San747 (Reply 5):
What's surprising to me is that there is no widebody service on SAN-IAD... You'd think at least one of the daily 757s could be changed to a 767... just like SAN-JFK...

United, with a hub at Dulles, is the only airline that could feasibly fly a widebody SAN-IAD. However, if United flew a 767 in to SAN, they'd likely have to sacrifice the use of one of their other gates to make it fit. United's five gates are well used throughout the day and I doubt they could spare one to squeeze in the size of a 767 to the limited gate space. You'd likely see United add a narrow body frequency to SAN-IAD before it ever flies another widebody to SAN.

Quoting Hockey55dude (Thread starter):
United has about 5 flights a day

United has three SAN-IAD flights; one 757 and 2 A320s (in some months another 757 is swapped for an A320). They are usually packed.

[Edited 2006-09-27 18:00:46]

User currently offlineCoronado990 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 1597 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 3858 times:

Quoting SANFan (Reply 6):
I've noticed that B6 is moving their flight to evening from the current morning departure time -- no more plaid-tail RON in SAN any more...

That's playing with fire. I thought B6 set this sked up to avoid going up against our 11:30p departure curfew here at SAN. A flight arriving at 9:36p and departing at 10:35p is a good way of making sure the IAD flight will always be screwed up if the incoming aircraft from JFK is even slightly late.

If it is, then you've got to ferry a plane down from LGB leaving an unscheduled RON here anyway until the curfew lifts where they can ferry a plane back up to LGB the next morning. Most airlines that schedule red-eyes out of here have planes that arrive around 6-7pm before being utilized as a red-eye. I hear the fine has been raised departing after 11:30p. If departing after curfew happens too many times, they will kindly be asked to leave.

Maybe they can utilize NAS North Island (NZY) like the sports charters do after 11:30pm.  bigthumbsup .



Uncle SAN at your service!
User currently offlineB752OS From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 1322 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 3831 times:

Quoting ScottB (Reply 4):
Actually, WAS has significantly higher demand to SAN than BOS. WAS-SAN averaged 1,092 daily passengers in the first quarter of this year, while BOS-SAN averaged 603 -- meaning that WAS-SAN traffic was over 80% higher. The WAS-SAN yield of 10.35 cents was also 12% higher than the BOS-SAN yield of 9.21 cents. It's actually unsurprising given that there's a lot of government traffic between Washington and San Diego.

I am just wondering if you are including both DCA and IAD in that WAS area.

I also believe that considering UA has a hub at IAD, that is one of the reasons they offer 3 daily flights between IAD-SAN.




I am surprised that B6 has not started BOS-MSY. Considering AA never re-started the seasonal route....B6 could add it as a nice fit into their expanding operation out of BOS.

[Edited 2006-09-27 19:04:57]

User currently offlinePanAm747 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 4242 posts, RR: 8
Reply 15, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 3795 times:

Quote:
What's surprising to me is that there is no widebody service on SAN-IAD... You'd think at least one of the daily 757s could be changed to a 767... just like SAN-JFK..

I agree, but I think the reason has to do more with frequency than capacity. When going for business travellers (as SAN-IAD certainly does), more options is the key.

Quote:
United, with a hub at Dulles, is the only airline that could feasibly fly a widebody SAN-IAD. However, if United flew a 767 in to SAN, they'd likely have to sacrifice the use of one of their other gates to make it fit. United's five gates are well used throughout the day and I doubt they could spare one to squeeze in the size of a 767 to the limited gate space. You'd likely see United add a narrow body frequency to SAN-IAD before it ever flies another widebody to SAN.

 bigthumbsup 



Pan Am:The World's Most Experienced Airline - P(oor) S(ailor's) A(irline): San Diego's Hometown Airline-Catch Our Smile!
User currently offlineJetBluefan1 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2977 posts, RR: 14
Reply 16, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 3699 times:

Quoting SANFan (Reply 9):
Hey JBf1, do you know the reason behind the switch I spoke of above (B6 moving the SAN-IAD a.m. departure to a red-eye in early 2007?) I wonder if it's to try to improve loads or to better utilize a/c; I certainly realize that B6 likes red-eyes from the Left Coast -- and for good reason -- but that morning departure was a great attempt to get a good portion of the corporate/business market, in addition to leisure pax. (I would love to see B6 join AA and DL in the SAN-JFK morning market as well.)

I wasn't aware of the change in schedules. It definitely seems peculiar since the daytime flight does very well. It probably has something to do with aircraft utilization though. (See: BUR-MCO) However, I'm sure JetBlue has done its research and is recognizing that the crowd which regularly flies this route won't mind the change...but that remains to be seen.

JetBluefan1



Most people on a.net hate JetBlue. Get used to it.
User currently offlineJetBlueAtJFK From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 1687 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 3677 times:

Quoting SANFan (Reply 9):
(I would love to see B6 join AA and DL in the SAN-JFK morning market as well.)

They've served JFK-SAN for a long time. What do you mean by your statement.

B6jfk airplane 



When You Know jetBlue, You Know Better
User currently offlinePanAm747 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 4242 posts, RR: 8
Reply 18, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 3649 times:

Quote:
I would love to see B6 join AA and DL in the SAN-JFK morning market as well.



Quote:
They've served JFK-SAN for a long time. What do you mean by your statement?

B6 does not have an early morning SAN-JFK flight. The first leaves at 12:30 PM, the second at 2:30 PM, and the red-eye departs at 9:55 PM.

Only the IAD flight is a RON aircraft.



Pan Am:The World's Most Experienced Airline - P(oor) S(ailor's) A(irline): San Diego's Hometown Airline-Catch Our Smile!
User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26414 posts, RR: 75
Reply 19, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 3643 times:

Quoting San747 (Reply 5):
What's surprising to me is that there is no widebody service on SAN-IAD... You'd think at least one of the daily 757s could be changed to a 767... just like SAN-JFK...

United's number of domestic configured 763ERs basically allows their Hawai'i service and some intra-hub flying and nothing else.

Quoting Galapagapop (Reply 8):
I thought SAN-BOS was stretching it in the range department..........

It is actually marginally shorter than BOS-LGB.



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineTango-Bravo From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 3805 posts, RR: 29
Reply 20, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 3593 times:

Quoting San747 (Reply 1):
Probably to just to give it some LCC competition...

Do you actually believe that this might be the actual reason jetBlue decided on IAD-SAN over BOS-SAN???


User currently offlineSANFan From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 5400 posts, RR: 12
Reply 21, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 3583 times:

I just got on line again. Thanx PA747 for clarifying that for B6jfk.

Yes, I've always wondered why B6 never got into the early morning SAN departure thing. I figured it was a/c utilization and maybe even trying to avoid head-to-head competition w/ AA. Then they added the SAN-IAD flt in that very time period, going head-to-head w/ UA, plus having 3 JFK flights but still none in that prime 6:30-8:30 morning stretch.

Oh well, I do look forward to seeing B6 add a few things to SAN's schedule in 2007, hopefully including BOS and SOMETHING to Florida!

Thanks all for your input.

bb


User currently offlineSan747 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 4942 posts, RR: 12
Reply 22, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 3532 times:

Quoting Tango-Bravo (Reply 20):

Do you actually believe that this might be the actual reason jetBlue decided on IAD-SAN over BOS-SAN???

I was just sort of throwing it out there as a possibility, because as you may notice in that very same reply I made:

Quoting San747 (Reply 1):
I don't know why they chose IAD first...



Scotty doesn't know...
User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26414 posts, RR: 75
Reply 23, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 3524 times:

Quoting B752OS (Reply 14):
Considering AA never re-started the seasonal route....

The talk is that AA's MSY-BOS will be returning and should be year-round this time.



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineB752OS From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 1322 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (7 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 3516 times:

Quoting N1120A (Reply 23):
The talk is that AA's MSY-BOS will be returning and should be year-round this time.

That would be nice for both cities. Aside from PDX, SMF, AUS, New Orleans is a missing link from Boston.



It has been mentioned in these threads for almost 2 years that AA is going to cancel the BOS-SAN flight in favor of MIA-SAN but it has not happened. The Boston-California market is one of the biggest on the east coast, I'd imagine top 3 or 4 so if that were to happen....even though it has yet to happen, I think B6 would jump on it right away.


25 SANFan : To further my thinking about SAN-BOS, I realize it is NOT a huge market (like SAN to either JFK or WAS) but it intrigues me that the general feeling h
26 JetBluefan1 : AUS has 1x on B6. JetBluefan1
27 B752OS : Well the BOS-SEA market is around the same size as BOS-SAN and in that market you have 2 airlines offering daily non-stop flights, AS and B6. AS also
28 Bicoastal : Get in line. Gates are hard to come by in San Diego when most airlines want them.
29 SANFan : Hey BC, yeah, 3 or 4 years for the major expansion (~10 more gates), right? That's why I'm encouraging JetBlue to start NOW. (Maybe you know better th
30 Post contains images Bicoastal : Nebulous? Uh, try talking to American Airlines about nebulous. AA has those gates well utilized and I doubt they'll let Jet Blue borrow them. Time fo
31 MAH4546 : As far as I have heard, it's not coming back for now. I wouldn't rule it out, but I think you will see B6 before AA on the route. AA hasn't dropped B
32 Post contains images Hockey55dude : Thanks i wasn't sure how many flights they had.
33 Boeing7E7 : Yup. Lack of gate space. This is also why operations are basically flat at Lindbergh right now. Gate size. SAN needs more widebody gates, particularl
34 MSYtristar : Rumor here in MSY is that it will be back in December along with (possibly) the 2nd LGA nonstop. That comes from an AA shift manager here, so take it
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