Bruce From United States, joined May 1999, 4951 posts, RR: 28 Posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 623 times:
A small story I read today about an AA md-80 jet having to land due to smoke in cockpit at Bryce Canyon Airport in Utah - a small strip! They landed safely but aren't sure how to get the jet out of there. The video we showed looked funny seeing the (big) md-80 on the taxiway surrounded by little Cessnas & Pipers & G.A. aircraft.
How can a loaded MD80 land on a short runway but not be able to take off, unloaded? It seems to me that the landing would be the hard part & it would be easy to take off with a minimal load, right??
Bruce Leibowitz - Green Bay, WI (GRB/KGRB) - Canon 20D/100-400L IS lens
Trvlr From United States, joined Feb 2000, 4428 posts, RR: 35 Reply 1, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 530 times:
I heard the Bryce Canyon airstrip was over 7000 feet long. If it was, the only restrictions may come from the height of the airport then (Bryce Canyon National Park is 4-5000 above sea level)
Wilcharl From United States, joined Jun 2000, 1157 posts, RR: 1 Reply 3, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 501 times:
7400 x 75 ft. is the offical runway dimensions and the alt is 7500 feet.. any mad dawg guys out there that could run the numbers and see if it could be ferried out with min fuel no pax etc
DesertJets From United States, joined Feb 2000, 6935 posts, RR: 29 Reply 5, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 495 times:
An MD-80 can take off in that field length... DCA and LGA are 6800 and 7000 feet repsectively. However at 7000+ feet in altitude that is going to be tight. I suppose an early departure with minimal fuel it could be ferried to SLC (the closest major airport I believe) and have the tanks topped off to return to DFW.
Stop drop and roll will not save you in hell. --- seen on a church marque in rural Virginia
24291 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 6, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 485 times:
Hi folks,
There's lots more to take into account than length. As Trvlr pointed out, altitude plays a role, but there are other factors that must be taken into account, particularly terrain/obstruction clearance and runway gradient and condition, etc, not to mention ground facilities and the like needed to get the aircraft ready for departure.
In this situation, AA would have their ops people get the data on it before authorizing a crew to take off. Under certain circumstances they may even need a contingency team out there.
DesertJets From United States, joined Feb 2000, 6935 posts, RR: 29 Reply 7, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 467 times:
I looked at some photographs of the airport in question and terrain does not appear to be an immediate issue off of either end of the runway. I am 99% sure they could get it out of there and ferry it to a more suitable airport.
What happens if they can't get it out safely? Write it off?
Stop drop and roll will not save you in hell. --- seen on a church marque in rural Virginia
LordOfTheFlys From United States, joined Sep 2000, 79 posts, RR: 0 Reply 8, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 447 times:
It will be on the 10 pm news tonight in Utah, I live in Salt Lake. From what I have heard they took all the chairs out, and just about anything not part of the plane itself. I guess they can get a waiver from the FAA on the fuel reserve requirements to free up more weight.
Same thing happened a while back to a 737 (I think). It landed at Salt lake #2. A very small non-controlled airport about 7 miles South-West of Salt Lake Int. Apparently the pilots confused #2 with SL Int. The runway their is about 5860'x100'.
Fqtv From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2000, 151 posts, RR: 0 Reply 9, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 434 times:
Do any of you see this changing AA's policy on smoke-in-cockpit emergency landings? Will pilots be told to fly a little further to get to an airport that the plane can easily leave again, or will the (somewhat new) rule to land as soon as possible stick?
Cheers, fqtv
Bruce From United States, joined May 1999, 4951 posts, RR: 28 Reply 10, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 431 times:
Well, they might make it but there sure wouldn't be any room for error! They'll need a very experienced pilot because I don't think they can abort - no room to spare!
Bruce Leibowitz - Green Bay, WI (GRB/KGRB) - Canon 20D/100-400L IS lens
AAR90 From United States, joined Jan 2000, 3013 posts, RR: 50 Reply 11, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 418 times:
Departure will be a piece of cake. 7000 feet is way more than enough at even highest certified elevations (8000'). Hard part is turning acft around in only 75' wide runway.
Will pilots be told to fly a little further? Not hardly. Safety, not expense is the single consideration.
*NO CARRIER* -- A Naval Aviator's worst nightmare!
Wilcharl From United States, joined Jun 2000, 1157 posts, RR: 1 Reply 13, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 403 times:
What about the other concerns logisticly, You have to defuel it. I noticed there was someone that sold jet-a on the field so that may or may not be a problem . You have to truck over 100 seats back to DFW , not to mention fix what caused the smoke. I notcied the runway is only rated for 3,000 lbs per wheel up there.. Im sure the FAA has no choice but to waive that. If it was outside the window does anyone think AA would over power the engines and then tear them down or would parting it out be a better option?
Zartan From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 15, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 384 times:
I was on a 747 that had to emergency land somewhere in Ohio due to a passenger that had a stroke and fell out of her seat en route. We landed fine and everything, but couldn't take off for hours because there was no tug big enough to push us back from the gate. We had to wait several hours which they drove one down the freeway from a UPS facility in another city.
That was an odd experience. Once they got the tug there, we pushed back fine and flew right out.
So sometimes it's not the runway that's the problem, as mentioned above, its the auxiliary equipment and the rest of the situation.
LordOfTheFlys From United States, joined Sep 2000, 79 posts, RR: 0 Reply 16, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 369 times:
The news reported it as taking off earlier today. The fact that they took off mid-day makes me think they were not too worried about the aircraft having enough runway. If AA felt the A/C was in jeopardy of not getting off in time they would have waited for the temperature to be at its lowest, and if needed be, wait for a strong headwind.
Timz From United States, joined Sep 1999, 5390 posts, RR: 6 Reply 19, posted (9 years 2 months 16 hours ago) and read 272 times:
I was surprised to read that the MD80 was not certified for airports above 8000 ft MSL. Can they get a waiver (or something) to fly into Quito or La Paz? Are other jets certified this low?
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